Muslim's Urged to kill Westerners.

My only wish is that people like this were locked up with all contact severed from the outside world. The longer these people get to spread their ideas the greater the damage. If only someone would direct the western media to stop broadcasting stories like this. It does nothing but boost the cycle of hate.

Still terrorism is far too lucrative for western politicians at the moment. Fear is such a powerfull weapon and while there are Islamic nutjobs out there, IM more likely to be killed next time I cross the roads. In a way thats why I laugh at these guys. They think they can win. They never will.

I have to agree with enslaved, while people (mainly right-wing politicians/evangelical christian leaders) focus on the ONE terrorist group whereever, that says something about killing westeners, while blatantly ignoring the overwhelmingy disgusting racist figures you guys have in US, im not pretending that we in britain are perfect, we have the BNP and NF, but guys, WAKE UP AND LISTEN TO THE FACTS!

Originally posted by noisy_brit_kid
I have to agree with enslaved, while people (mainly right-wing politicians/evangelical christian leaders) focus on the ONE terrorist group whereever, that says something about killing westeners, while blatantly ignoring the overwhelmingy disgusting racist figures you guys have in US, im not pretending that we in britain are perfect, we have the BNP and NF, but guys, WAKE UP AND LISTEN TO THE FACTS!

I hope you realise that Terrorists are among other things Racists of the worse kind ?

Listen to these facts, Iraq was just given the chance of Freedom and Democracy but instead it's people decided to vote in a Theocracy that plan's to instill Sharia law.
Under Sharia law if you dont grovel to Mohammed five times a day you can expect to pay 50pc tax and be treated as the underclass, if your so hungry that you steal an apple because you are starving, you wont get deported to Australia, you will have your hand cut off. If your wife annoys you its your right to beat her about.I could rave but you probably know all this.

Now ask your self what promotes racism, Democracy or religous fundamentalism.

I hope you realise that Terrorists are among other things Racists of the worse kind ?

Listen to these facts, Iraq was just given the chance of Freedom and Democracy but instead it's people decided to vote in a Theocracy that plan's to instill Sharia law.

Now ask your self what promotes racism, Democracy or religous fundamentalism.

Shock and awe promotes racism. Its a great way to win people over but I digress.

If the Iraqis want theocracy then let them have it because that is the democratic process! Or is it only democracy and freedom when its in American and western interests? Anyway I wouldn't fret. The Kurds/Sunnis won't accept a Shia theocracy, it will be civil war because you may think they hate infidels, but this is nothing compared to the animosity between Shia and Sunni.

Yes terrorists can be raicists if that is their motivation. Usually it is political, but there are plenty of raicists who do terrible things which are just as bad as terrorists. Look at Hitler. Never read a history textbook which labels him as terrorist but what he did make Osama and his chums look like nice people and he had nothing to do with Islam!

Originally posted by enslaved83

I hope you realise that Terrorists are among other things Racists of the worse kind ?

Listen to these facts, Iraq was just given the chance of Freedom and Democracy but instead it's people decided to vote in a Theocracy that plan's to instill Sharia law.

Now ask your self what promotes racism, Democracy or religous fundamentalism.

Shock and awe promotes racism. Its a great way to win people over but I digress.

If the Iraqis want theocracy then let them have it because that is the democratic process! Or is it only democracy and freedom when its in American and western interests? Anyway I wouldn't fret. The Kurds/Sunnis won't accept a Shia theocracy, it will be civil war because you may think they hate infidels, but this is nothing compared to the animosity between Shia and Sunni.

Yes terrorists can be raicists if that is their motivation. Usually it is political, but there are plenty of raicists who do terrible things which are just as bad as terrorists. Look at Hitler. Never read a history textbook which labels him as terrorist but what he did make Osama and his chums look like nice people and he had nothing to do with Islam!

So by your own admission you go prove to yourself that Terrorist's under the guise of Islam are in fact not religious activists but usually political activists.

And that brings the question should Islam in the west be relabled a Political movement so to remove its seeming impunity as a religous establishment ? or maybe that Islam in the west should be forced to accept(and perhaps its leaders required to sign a treaty) that religion is religion and politics are politics and your nation will remain secular!

So by your own admission you go prove to yourself that Terrorist's under the guise of Islam are in fact not religious activists but usually political activists.

And that brings the question should Islam in the west be relabled a Political movement so to remove its seeming impunity as a religous establishment ? or maybe that Islam in the west should be forced to accept(and perhaps its leaders required to sign a treaty) that religion is religion and politics are politics and your nation will remain secular!

The problem with Islam is that it is both a political theory and a religion all in one. The Koran doesn't just deal with how you should live your life, it deals with law and society as well. The two are inseperable for (some) Muslims and hence the clash of cultures.

As for you second point I hardly think a treaty is going to work and if we are going to get Muslims to sign it then we ought to get Christian parties to sign it as well. I totaly agree, religion and law should be seperate. Together they are an awful combination but if you are going to crack down on Islam then you must also do the same with other religions. There are after all Christian political parties who draw their inspiration from the bible and in some ways they are just as bad as any Islamic party.

Ho about this "westerners urged to kill Muslims"

Originally posted by vincere7
Ho about this "westerners urged to kill Muslims"

lol, I like it! Though I can only begin to imagine the uproar thiswould cause in the Muslim world, besides. Bush s doing a good enough job anyway. Nah Im just kidding, I recognise the merits of Iraq but there are a lot of things still to fix and the whole situation just doesn't sit right with me. Im on the side of the US. For all of our sakes they need to win this.

Originally posted by enslaved83
Im on the side of the US. For all of our sakes they need to win this.

As an American I don't know how an American could not be on the side of America. I disagree with the tactics used by the Bush administration, but this was necessary for controlling the commodities - thats what makes it wrong, war for commodity. Lets not pretend, this is a war against Muslim ideology and all Muslims who will fight for that ideology, this won't be advertised. Fundamental Muslims are the new commies and when Mecca decided to fly planes into our buildings they became the enemy. I have no love lost as I know personally that most Muslims will never voice that they agree with America suffering. The culture is different and the Quran teaches a Muslim to smile and speak softly while killing a non-believer.

[edit on 22-12-2005 by vincere7]

Quran teaches a Muslim to smile and speak softly while killing a non-believer

either back up your comments or stop spouting such ignorant rubbish.
I am so fed up with reading these type of comments. Do you know how i feel, personally, when i read all this "muslims are evil" crap?
Do you know how i feel when i see my beautiful children and then read things on here about how muslims should be killed/converted/kicked out.

Anyone who has read other posts of mine, know that i dont agree with how Islam is being practised today. But even in that disagreement, i still dont see the majority being terrorists.
And to be honest, it hurts....and you know something....when you guys read of ONE idiotic "muslim" saying stupid things, you know its just one guy. But when i have to read here, day in day out, about how muslims are trying to take over the world (please, i barely have enough energy to go to the corner shops), or how they are evil, how they are barbaric,...when i read people quoting the Quran out of context, or speaking of things which they clearly have NO knowledge of......it does hurt.

But thats nothing, i agree....but you know what?....i am really beginnning to feel like an outcast in this world, and as other nations can tell you (nations to whom it has happened before)....its not a nice feeling.

Originally posted by geek101

Quran teaches a Muslim to smile and speak softly while killing a non-believer

either back up your comments or stop spouting such ignorant rubbish.
I am so fed up with reading these type of comments. Do you know how i feel, personally, when i read all this "muslims are evil" crap?
Do you know how i feel when i see my beautiful children and then read things on here about how muslims should be killed/converted/kicked out.

Anyone who has read other posts of mine, know that i dont agree with how Islam is being practised today. But even in that disagreement, i still dont see the majority being terrorists.
And to be honest, it hurts....and you know something....when you guys read of ONE idiotic "muslim" saying stupid things, you know its just one guy. But when i have to read here, day in day out, about how muslims are trying to take over the world (please, i barely have enough energy to go to the corner shops), or how they are evil, how they are barbaric,...when i read people quoting the Quran out of context, or speaking of things which they clearly have NO knowledge of......it does hurt.

But thats nothing, i agree....but you know what?....i am really beginnning to feel like an outcast in this world, and as other nations can tell you (nations to whom it has happened before)....its not a nice feeling.

Why don't the Leader's of Islam come forth and condemn the actions publicly and make it known that these murderors wont be going to Party with Mohammed but will be banished to the bowels of hell?

Why don't the Leaders of Islam come forth and deny that the Ultimate goal of Islam is a Calpihate?

Why did the founder of CAIR (the largest Muslim rights group in the USA) say this?
Omar M. Ahmad founder of CAIR said:
"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant" he said. "The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America , and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth," he said.

You tell us how we get up in arms about ONE Muslim saying Idiotic things, its is not one, but thousands and theres thousands more involved in terrorist organisations just waiting to go to Mohammeds virgin party.

Why have the People of Iraq decided to vote in a party that intends to introduce Sharia law ?

I see few peaceful things about Islam, i see its leaders sitting silently, i have never ever seen a community event inviting all faiths/cutures to attend that is organised by/under the banner of Islam.

Does you local Mosque run event's involving the community ? or only its members ?

And you still wonder why some of us have troubles trusting Islam ?

I beleive the religion of Islam is incapable of seperating from its political ambitions, if im wrong tell me why ?

Lastly i feel regret for the way you have been forced to feel in todays world, the world it seems has been changed forever but is constantly evolving, remember YOU can make a difference, and you seem to be blessed with the abilty to view things with a moderate mind.

i wont bother replying to the rest of the topic replys as its just full of bull***** and anti muslim prop

NumberCruncher there is no such thing as a muslim leader
we have Imans and so forth who lead prays and teach future generations of muslims

but unlike Christains we dont have a central figure in which all muslims look to!

and if some people get their heads out of their As* they will have seen on the news how muslim groups around the world have condemed terrorist attacks.

my personal view i dont see why i should have to justify myself or my belief to others because they are to narrow minded to know the true meaning just happy to take things out of contents

so think what you lot like
just like the Muslm extremists you lot are just a minority so THANK GOD

Bodrul said "NumberCruncher there is no such thing as a muslim leader
we have Imans and so forth who lead prays and teach future generations of muslims

but unlike Christains we dont have a central figure in which all muslims look to! "


Well there lays the problem, your organisation lacks the chain of command, a billion people "loosely " strung together being taught individual Imans interpretations of the Quran.

Just imagine if the US military was divided into 10,000 platoons and there seargents had to answer to no body, just armed with the constitution and interpreting it as they will.

Dangerous dangerous dangerous.

comparing 1.3 billion people to a miliatry command structure kind of sucks

Well there lays the problem, your organisation lacks the chain of command, a billion people "loosely " strung together being taught individual Imans interpretations of the Quran.

there is only one interpretation of the Quran which is taught to muslims
maybe its diffrent in diffrent sects like cathlics and procitenst and so forth

but if you look or go to any mosque all the teachings are the same and tought the same way (i have been to several in the UK and bangladesh)
and i come from a line of imans and hafiz (fathers side)

its only in a fraction of islamic schools have radicals u nderming things and those are mostly in pakistan and in some places in the middle east.

Originally posted by bodrul
comparing 1.3 billion people to a miliatry command structure kind of sucks

1.3 billlion people who have shown to be able to form into groups and work well on thier own.

Bodrul said "there is only one interpretation of the Quran which is taught to muslims "


In this case im sure the satndard edition Quran must be on the internet, can you link it please, i wont be able to tell the difference.

And also as you have stated each Mosque is seperate with its own leader and know head guy like Christian Churches, so how did the thousands of Mosques get together to accept this one Interpretation ?

Well it seems the last two poster's are unable/unwilling to answer my query's.

Is there anyone here who practices the Faith or supports the political motivation of Islam that can answer the questions ive posted above ?

Originally posted by NumberCruncher
Bodrul said "NumberCruncher there is no such thing as a muslim leader
we have Imans and so forth who lead prays and teach future generations of muslims

but unlike Christains we dont have a central figure in which all muslims look to! "


Well there lays the problem, your organisation lacks the chain of command, a billion people "loosely " strung together being taught individual Imans interpretations of the Quran.

Just imagine if the US military was divided into 10,000 platoons and there seargents had to answer to no body, just armed with the constitution and interpreting it as they will.

Dangerous dangerous dangerous.

All Imams eventually visit Mecca just as almost every muslim does and there as far as I know is where they get their Qu'rans to copy it in their countries and give it out or atleast order it from there.

You could visit this site Islam Online It has Islamic sholars running it, you can ask about anything related to Islam there and they will answer you in full detail whenever possible. Its the most resourcefull Islamic site on the internet that I know of.

Thanks for your reply, im now going to pound them with questions ... like this ...

Does the Religion of Islam aspire to a world wide Islamic Caliphate ?

How is the Infidel treated in the Calipahte ?

Do people who claim to be Muslim's and murder innocent people in terrorist attacks get to rot in the bowels of hell ?

Has the "accepted" version of the Quran been modified to fit the current world ?

Why doesnt Islam have high ranking Imam's going from mosque to Mosque checking that they are teaching are correct interpretations ?

Feel free to answer those if you like


Edit: went to ask my questions and got this .....

"Dear visitors, Due to a technical problem which caused us to receive over 160 questions, we will unfortunately be unable to receive any more questions until the end of December 2005. You may submit your questions on January 1, 2006 at 10:00 GMT. In the meantime, you can browse through our index or through our search engine. Thank you for your interest in Ask About Islam. We apologize for any inconvenience."



[edit on 033131p://07123 by NumberCruncher]

Well Im no Muslim but you number cruncher seem to have some serious issues with the religion as a whole. I personally believe you have nothing to fear from Islam and need to stop worrying about everything you read in the media.

I am from a small town with no "ethnic" population so to speak (although we did have some excellent curry houses, but I digress) and I now live in Manchester. When I went to University in Manchester (UMIST) it was a big shock for me.

It is a widely respected international instituation for technology and thus is completely mutli-ethnic. You have Muslims, Christains, Hindus and other faiths all living in harmony. There were Iranians, Pakistanis, Thai, Chinese, Indians, Africans, Norwegians all getting along nicely with no bs and no hatred. No BNP and no hardline Islamic parties.

I in fact lived with a Pakistani Girl in the first year who's father was an Iman and though she had some strict beliefs, it was nothing worse than some of my Catholic friends. We got along fine for the entire time I lived with her and I believe it was an eye opening experiance for both of us.

Does the Religion of Islam aspire to a world wide Islamic Caliphate ?

All religions are expansionist if you think about it. Look at the Christian Church for example. A religion needs to constantly grow or it stagnates. Islam is the same in that sense.

How is the Infidel treated in the Calipahte ?

If you read about the history of the Ottoman empire, the last time when such a thing existed you will find many examples of Christians and Jews getting treated very well in the Calipahte. Yes you will also find less encouraging examples but let us not forget this was the middle ages. Long story short the good outweighed the bad so long as you were loyal to the Ottomans.

Do people who claim to be Muslim's and murder innocent people in terrorist attacks get to rot in the bowels of hell ?

Yes they do. The Islamic council of Britain has condemned every terrorist attack affecting the UK regarding Islamic millitants. Trouble is the media doesn't make to big a deal out of mainstream Islamic opinion. By concentrating on the extreme version of Islam it distorts peoples views of the religion without giving a balanced idea of what it is all about. There have been countless Islamic peace marches that I know of which were all given limited coverage. Compare this to ammount of coverage one backward Imam will get when he says "all the jews must die" for example. The media practically falls over backwards.

You should also note on the last Haj there was a big speech by high ranking Imans condeming terrorism.

You should also note the Islamic council of Spain has issued a Fatwa against Osama Bin Laden calling him a murderer and a terrorist.

Has the "accepted" version of the Quran been modified to fit the current world ?

Yes. There are plently of Islamic countries in the far east which are very religious and very prosperous. Islam can go hand in hand with the modern world. At the same time there are also many Islamic countries which are poor and somewhat backward but they have been this way for thousands of years. Change takes time.

Why doesnt Islam have high ranking Imam's going from mosque to Mosque checking that they are teaching are correct interpretations ?

Religion is based around an interpretation of an idea and is a very personal thing. One could also ask why isn't there people going around Christain Churches checking that everyone conforms to the same teachings? Truth is there are many interpretations of the bible: Catholic, Protestant, Morman, Evangelist and the list goes on......



[edit on 23-12-2005 by enslaved83]