Who here doesnt believe in Aliens?!

Im not disputing the fact there might be intelligent life outside the universe okay guys? Im very open minded but ive had it with people believing too much into this.

I use to believe & read all this s.hit about alien abduction and stuff YES even shapeshifting elites! but i dont think so anymore, I believe in abduction but not from freakin aliens!!! I stopped reading this BS long ago.

People that are being abducted are being mind controlled from CIA agents or whatever there called. Deluding the victims that there being abducted by GOODIE aliens what a bunch of crock, Yes the govenment have such advanced tech they could do anything and control however they want. Radiowaves micro beams, torture the victims! rituals! Hypnosis !!! sex slaves!!!

They understand every little bit of the brain its creppy what they are doing to us now. People are being brainwashed everyday, the world is being taught to be a bunch of ignorants so they cant even think for themselves anymore. CRAP!

And shapeshifting presidents? no there not reptiles just doing somes.hit to the victim into believing that there actually aliens, so when they remember some of the events and speak out sound like a bunch of lunatics so no one will believe anything they say and cast them out as mental patients. Its just a way to discredit the victim. Yah know? over the rainbow!

And UFO's? they exist because the govenment has them, they have the technology and are built from humans, all this from aliens is just away to contaminat the real story here. At the same time im not disputing the fact intelligent beings can build high tech craft too. I can believe in aliens but not the ones that are so called abducting, thats a lie and there agents.

Sure people are entitled what they want to believe but i hope you think twice into whats real or not next time when your reading some of the BS stuff thats out there. Its just my opinion but i hope you try to understand.

And if you want to read about this, it has every info available about Monarch mind-control programming. very good website!!!! www.whale.to...

I want to share something barely do i ever look up this but days when im reading too much stuff about secret societies, magic, satanists, wizard of oz, rituals, mind control & new world order sh.it trying to understand the creepy reality that exists i cant sleep properly and i had a nightmare a week ago, it was short like 5 minutes! Was a first time and i was so freaked out, when i got really scared i knew i was dreaming and tryed to wake myself up, second time i woke up in shock and stayed up the whole night.

No the dream doesnt mean anything but i think i need to stop reading into this stuff. Horror movies use to be my favourite genre but now i cant even watch these types of movies anymore, i tend to think about the subject i just watched or read. Im very faint hearted person but sometimes im still curious & check even tho im scared pathetic aint it? Does anyone else experience this type of thing sometimes or is it just me?

Hey, nice goin' trying to debunk it all at once. One problem though, it doesn't even BEGIN to describe what a lot, LOT, of people has seen/gone through. The news that are on this site isn't the reason we're here, it's the experience we had that is. And if you don't look into each persons experience that explains why they tend to believe something you do not, you don't have a say. Although I admit this board seems to be mostly conspiracy nuts and some morons, I'm beginning to think that this is some sort of complement for being forced into atheism.

i do beleve there are aliens and do beleve they have been here and are possible working with goverments. and the US probably does have very very advanced tech that aliens helped them with. but some of what is out there is BS like the reptillian president crap and all that is just a little nuts and alot of that prophet stuff predicting the future is BS none of that stuff ever fits 100 percent is always very vague.

kiMMii, so to be more precise, instead of "Who here doesn't believe in Aliens?!", based on what you wrote, what you really want to know is "Who here doesn't believe aliens are abducting people on Earth and that it's really corrupt people in the US government?"

I believe that there are alien civilizations on countless planets in our galaxy and the Universe. After doing quite a bit of research, I lean towards the belief that aliens aren't abducting people on Earth. I lean towards the belief that the descriptions of cold, indifferent Greys are really black ops military units using holographic disguises. These operations are made to instill fear in the population about aliens and after the victims publicize their experiences, the mainstream public will ridicule such stories and shy away from the topic of UFOs and aliens.

kiMMii, if you'd like, check out www.disclosureproject.org... and Dr. Steven Greer. Might give you another insight into the subject (if you're not sick of it).

I have an alien living down the street from me.

He is from Nicaragua. I don't know if he is illegal or not, but he is kinda strange.

I'm an alien.

An alien resident in the US (on a green card, thankyouverymuch)

As for me, I don't believe in Aliens visiting the earth and abducting/anal probing various and sundry bystanders. I do, however, believe that there is a very high probability, statistically, that there is some other form of sentient life in the Universe, and probably even in this galaxy. If SETI keeps on churning, there's even a good probabilty that we might discover evidence of them.

But it defies logic to believe that Little Green Men or whatever are coming and abducting people. Why would they do that? If we somehow discovered an alien civilization... wow, our perspectives about our place in the Universe, etc, would be fundamentally altered (Copernicus, anyone?), and the culture shock would be, to make a horrendous understatement, utterly ridiculous. But it would be exciting! I hope we would be wise enough as a species to openly make communication, not pick up people at random and conduct strange medical experiments. Some of you might argue that they're doing that to invade us. If you were able to cross the galaxy, using some kind of unknown technology of immense power, moving through space and time like a hot knife through butter... they could probably kill us all without too much effort. Think boiling oil on an ant nest.

All the reports of abductions? Groupthink. From X-Files to the old movies with guys wearing tin foil suits... it's pervaded our culture. Heck, even Jimmy Carter saw a UFO. It was actually venus. Strange lights in the sky? Aircraft in formation, possibly even by the government to test out psychological warfare. Probably Roswell too... what would scare the Soviets more than to believe that a UFO had crashed in the desert, granting the US access to Mysterious Millitary Technology?

Anyways, that's just my 2 cents. Take with a grain of salt, as always.

KIMMII- I don't believe, I know. I am tired of disinformation and being called a kook and being told that part of my career doesn't exist. It's real, so deal with it!

It all depends what you buy into. Some people buy into the theory of mass government conspiracies, alien wars and takeovers, and all that.

Personally, I believe in aliens, time travel, and a number of "psychic" stuff. I do not believe in vast governmet conspiracies (though I do believe in minor ones). I do not believe in shape-shifting aliens, nor a hostile takeover. I do not believe in the Masons, the New World Order, or that Invisible Ninjas Rule The World.

But other people do believe these things, and these forums exist for them to discuss it. This is not a forum for ranting.

And do you want to know what I really think of the government?

It's a loosely stitced together body with its head chopped off, and is rapidly losing blood.

Do you think the President knows what's going on? Do you think ANYBODY knows everything that's going on? The secrets are so deep, so compartamentalized, that it looks like everything is natural. The people who are conspircing to keep Bush in power... they got no clue about Area 51... and those people have no clue about Alien Abductions... and those people have no clue about corporate lies and scams to ruthlessly save money.

In the end, everyone thinks their lie is just a minor part of business as usual. Like I said, loosely stitched together with its head chopped off, rapidly losing blood.

Why would you "believe" in anything? Just consider the facts.

Why would you "believe" in anything? Just consider the facts.

Because in many things we don't have all the facts, and we have to make due with what we know so far. Much of science is bassed on beliefs, which is why proofs are so hard to come by. For example, we have no proof that electrons are in specific places at specific times. And how on earth do we know that electrons only follow a PROBABILTY of being in specific places at specific times?

It's all theory. Theory we choose to believe because it fits in with other theories. There is no actual proof besides this.

Many people here are atheists, or agnostics - but that doesn't matter - that's what they believe. Based on the facts, that's their assumption. Based on the facts, I choose to believe in an entity greater than ours. Belief is fundamental to our human experience.

In my belief, those things that I stated that I believe, do exist. But my beliefs are not written in stone. They have not been handed down to me from god. They are subject to change, like a kite in the wind. Maybe one day I won't believe in those things, but in something else. In any case, I believe what I believe, and I believe that the facts cannot tell us everything there is to know about ourselves and the universe.

Yarium there's a good amount of math and experimentation to back up theories.

Many people here are atheists, or agnostics - but that doesn't matter - that's what they believe.

I'm an atheist because I choose not to blindly believe in something that doesn't make sense.

Belief is fundamental to our human experience.

Please elaborate.

In my belief, those things that I stated that I believe, do exist. But my beliefs are not written in stone. They have not been handed down to me from god. They are subject to change, like a kite in the wind. Maybe one day I won't believe in those things, but in something else. In any case, I believe what I believe, and I believe that the facts cannot tell us everything there is to know about ourselves and the universe.

If your you feel your beliefs could change then why do you proclaim them to be truth? Don't you think that's rather dangerous?

Do you recognise what the U.S. has done based on their belief?

1 + 1 = 2. Thats a truth and it will never change. If someone gave me a mathematics equation to solve, and I say "I believe its answer to be like this" without even attempting to solve it using logic then my belief is only a speculation.

We don't come to conclusions based on speculation.

Oh yes, solarstone, there are a good amount of evidence to back up those theories - which is why we believe them. I believe them, as do you, that is not in question. My point there was that we still place belief in them because it's as far as we know they still hold to be correct. They could be totally different!

For example, take Quantum Tunnelling. For AS FOR AS I KNOW when I slam my hand down on a table, it will stop when I hit the table. But, because of quantum mechanics, there's a minute possibility that my hand will pass straight through solid matter! This could happen because, by an amazingly improbable event, all the electrons in the table and my hand were aligned JUST RIGHT, and the electromagnetic force for a time didn't matter because of this. It's how the Tunnelling Microscope works (photons pass through solid matter, and some return, eventually giving us a picture).

So what we believe, and what is, may sometimes be mildly different - perhaps only cosmetically different, but different it is.

As for my beliefs, I did not say they were the truth, that they were ultimate. To believe oneself to be perfect and correct, that is a great folly, and yes, it is one that the US government has fallen into. They went into Iraq for completely unjust reasons, they've allowed torture simply because it wasn't on their soil, they set up trade agreements which don't benefit both countries equally (canadian softwood lumber trade, and Alberta beef), and the list goes on and on. Back in the Cold War, they had the essential equivilant of Communist Witch Trials - horrible things.

No, I do not believe that what I say is truth. I believe in the search for truth. If to you that means math and science and 1+1=2, then so be it. To me, it is in part that, but it is also something else. It is the questions of the soul. That is quite ultimate. And if the soul EXISTS, shouldn't there be some proof of it? I search for that as well. And I find things solarstone, I find things. Theories mostly, but also experiences and effects. Science tells us that the universe is 4-dimensional, curving in a way we can't even see. What if our soul is 4th dimensional? What if it is a very REAL thing - not a flismy piece of energy - but a living thing in its own right connected to us through a dimensional barrier. It tries to guide us, but we are still human, still bound by needs and wants and 3-dimensional physical sciences, and so it fails.

Now here's a brain tickler. What if there isn't god? If the soul were 4-dimensional, and the 4th dimension is time, could it not travel through time? It's the only way I can explain things that happen to me (have a dream of the future, then the dream happens, and then I change what happens - this occured to me just yesterday at a Secret Santa meeting of mine). And if our soul is 4-d, when we die, reincarnation is not only possible, but you could reincarnate as anybody, from any part of existance. In a way, you could be my soul either in the future, or in the past. And if that is true - then this universe exists for our soul alone - for all soul is all souls. And if our souls is all souls, would that not mean that we ourselves are god? Maybe we are. Maybe we aren't. Won't know until I die - and even then I'm pretty sure the afterlife will be very much like life - full of questions, and very few answers.

That's my philosophy solarstone - not to answer, but to QUESTION. The answers change, but the questions - they stick. We laugh at things like "If a tree falls in a forest, does it make a sound" and the Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy's quote "The answer to life, the universe, and everything is 42 - but what's the question?". Perhaps it's the question that's important, the question that drives us. Once you understand this, you see that all answers are just different paths - and all paths merge and diverge and lead you back to where you started.

Take the next step from deny ignorace...
Question Everything

Originally posted by Yarium
Oh yes, solarstone, there are a good amount of evidence to back up those theories - which is why we believe them. I believe them, as do you, that is not in question. My point there was that we still place belief in them because it's as far as we know they still hold to be correct. They could be totally different!

I dont believe i'm an athiest, I know I am. I am realy questioning our use of the word "belief". There's nothing in this world I believe. I either know or otherwise explore that which I don't understand.

Originally posted by Yarium
For example, take Quantum Tunnelling. For AS FOR AS I KNOW when I slam my hand down on a table, it will stop when I hit the table. But, because of quantum mechanics, there's a minute possibility that my hand will pass straight through solid matter! This could happen because, by an amazingly improbable event, all the electrons in the table and my hand were aligned JUST RIGHT, and the electromagnetic force for a time didn't matter because of this. It's how the Tunnelling Microscope works (photons pass through solid matter, and some return, eventually giving us a picture).

Yes an interesting theory and something the scientist are working on solving.

Originally posted by Yarium
So what we believe, and what is, may sometimes be mildly different - perhaps only cosmetically different, but different it is.

Yes of course. But we must always look out for "what is".

Originally posted by Yarium
As for my beliefs, I did not say they were the truth, that they were ultimate. To believe oneself to be perfect and correct, that is a great folly, and yes, it is one that the US government has fallen into. They went into Iraq for completely unjust reasons, they've allowed torture simply because it wasn't on their soil, they set up trade agreements which don't benefit both countries equally (canadian softwood lumber trade, and Alberta beef), and the list goes on and on. Back in the Cold War, they had the essential equivilant of Communist Witch Trials - horrible things.

What is your definition of belief? To the best of my knowledge it means to accept something as the truth without conclusive proof. I will never do this, even if it requires billions of years of investigation to prove. Maybe one day we will know the truth about the Bible when we have the technology to move back in time. Until then we don't know. Its just an idea.

Originally posted by Yarium
No, I do not believe that what I say is truth. I believe in the search for truth. If to you that means math and science and 1+1=2, then so be it. To me, it is in part that, but it is also something else. It is the questions of the soul. That is quite ultimate. And if the soul EXISTS, shouldn't there be some proof of it? I search for that as well. And I find things solarstone, I find things. Theories mostly, but also experiences and effects. Science tells us that the universe is 4-dimensional, curving in a way we can't even see. What if our soul is 4th dimensional? What if it is a very REAL thing - not a flismy piece of energy - but a living thing in its own right connected to us through a dimensional barrier. It tries to guide us, but we are still human, still bound by needs and wants and 3-dimensional physical sciences, and so it fails.

When "Science tells us that the universe is 4-dimensional, curving in a way we can't even see" we CAN see parts of it in the mathematics and science. But of course there's still no conlusive proof. Its just a theory. An idea. And something we can never rely on until we can prove.

Our "soul" could also be part of some "4-dimension". But why on earth would you believe it? Why not just investigate? Again i'm questioning to use of the dirty "B" word. Why can't we just substitute it for the word "interested". So instead of believing you would just be interested in the theory. That way you don't "lock" yourself onto something, rather you only explore.

Originally posted by Yarium
Now here's a brain tickler. What if there isn't god? If the soul were 4-dimensional, and the 4th dimension is time, could it not travel through time? It's the only way I can explain things that happen to me (have a dream of the future, then the dream happens, and then I change what happens - this occured to me just yesterday at a Secret Santa meeting of mine). And if our soul is 4-d, when we die, reincarnation is not only possible, but you could reincarnate as anybody, from any part of existance. In a way, you could be my soul either in the future, or in the past. And if that is true - then this universe exists for our soul alone - for all soul is all souls. And if our souls is all souls, would that not mean that we ourselves are god? Maybe we are. Maybe we aren't. Won't know until I die - and even then I'm pretty sure the afterlife will be very much like life - full of questions, and very few answers.

I've have dreams that come true as well. In fact I remember telling my cousin after he told me he had a dream about fireworks, that he should watch out for fireworks during the day. low and behold that night there were fireworks!
Yes often dreams may, quite literally, present visions of the future.

Could it be a coincidense? It could!

You could also say "But it happens so often that it just doesn't make sense that it was "only" a coincidence."
Yes I understand the frustration and that's why I look for answers to. There are several ways to explore this matter. Meditation, Math and Science. As far as I know belief never solved anything.

Originally posted by Yarium
That's my philosophy solarstone - not to answer, but to QUESTION. The answers change, but the questions - they stick. We laugh at things like "If a tree falls in a forest, does it make a sound" and the Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy's quote "The answer to life, the universe, and everything is 42 - but what's the question?". Perhaps it's the question that's important, the question that drives us. Once you understand this, you see that all answers are just different paths - and all paths merge and diverge and lead you back to where you started.

Take the next step from deny ignorace...
Question Everything

Hmm, well answers never lead us back to where we started. Answers give us knowledge and understanding. They make us wise. Therefore we become "greater" than we were before.

Something to think about

I really don't know what to believe. Based on what's accepted as common knowledge it's highly unlikely. But if one sees the universe as being one of an infinity(aka, many worlds, and even hinted by string theory, if I'm not mistaken), many with different laws some that may allow for travel to this one, things get all fuzzy. Given such, it may seem even innevitable that a lot of weird things will simply take place.

The "B" Word

Well solarstone, it definitely appears that our understanding of the word "belief" is different. For you, belief is precise, and unchangeable. It's a "locked course" as you said. I see belief as a viewpoint, an option, and possibility, a road with many turns. Our views on belief are very different then, but bring us back to the same points. Only in my case I've taken it to become an observant spiritual, and you've taken it to become strictly an observer.

For you, belief is to accept something as true without conclusive proof. For me that is the same. I do accept things without conclusive proof. I accept that you exist. I have nothing conclusive that says otherwise. Your responding to me tells me that you consider me to exist as well - but you have no proof I exist. You believe me to exist (at the very least, as an imagine in your mind - whether this image has a soul, consciousness, or is an elaborate simulation, you do not know).

For me, I am willing to chalk some things up to belief because there's too many things that I can't answer on conclusive proof alone. However, it is not a bad thing to have belief like this - so long as that belief isn't blinding or binding.

And belief does solve things. Let's pretend CSI were real. Without belief, they would likely get no where on some cases. Circumstancial evidence (things that point to things, but which aren't conclusive) are used to obtain warrants so that the CSI team can investigate a person's property. Without belief that this person had done something wrong, if they only went with conclusive proof, they would need to be able to prove that the person was involved with the crime before obtaining the warrant - and thus they would either not need a warrant (they would already try to convict him), or they would never get a warrant, and thus fail the case.

If Darwin had not believed that the species he observed during his voyages were not in some way related to each other through the mechanism of evolution, would he ever have written the Origin of Species? What he presented wasn't proof, it wasn't conclusive, and it still isn't conclusive - but there are small proofs that aim in the direction of evolution, and many other theories based on the theory of evolution which work lend weight that the theory of evolution also works.

If Einstein had not believed that there was something more to gravity than just mass and attraction, would he ever have made general relativity? The proof seemed insurmountable. You drop a ball, it falls to the ground. Obviously it is attracted to the ground. Add in some deductions about thermodynamics, and you got the theory of gravity as by Newton. But Einstein said, nope, in fact the mass bends this wierd thing called space-time, and other pieces of mass fall into these space-time distortions to give the illusion of gravity. When I throw a baseball straight forward, it's actually going perfectly straight, but it hits the ground because space-time has distorted it in such a way that the ground is what's now straight in front of it. If Einstein didn't believe this, he wouldn't have researched it, and wouldn't have found out the amazing theory that we now work with for all universal models.

And as for answers never leading us back to where we started, and thus are greater than questions, what happens when the answer is prooved wrong? Are you not back where you started? And have you not lost ground because you wasted time giving absolute belief to that answer? A question may lead you back to where you started, but it will bring you closer to TRUTH.

Perhaps that's what this is all about.

Belief need not be absolute. Just because I believe something does not mean that I am blind to all or any other possibilities. Belief is the way I view things, and like the view from a moving car, the view changes as I continue down the road.

Originally posted by sexymon
KIMMII- I don't believe, I know. I am tired of disinformation and being called a kook and being told that part of my career doesn't exist. It's real, so deal with it!

If you know what you say you know and if you have a security clearance, should you even be telling people that you know anything?

I don't understand why people come on hear and say stuff like,

"All that alien stuff is rubbish, its really the US government abducting you and doing painfull experiments, theres nothing to worry about and its not even worth talking about because if you believe in aliens you are crazy. The government have also owned those UFOs since the 1930s and have covered it up for 70 years......"

One alien race visiting earth to look us over OK, maybe even two, but seriously all those races and their associated slave or servent races? Nah, sorry, I have a real problem associating a little out of the way solar system in a little out of the way galaxcy with Grand Central Station..
Or I could be wrong (would hardly be the first time:duh.

Originally posted by Spreadthetruth
I don't understand why people come on hear and say stuff like,

"All that alien stuff is rubbish, its really the US government abducting you and doing painfull experiments, theres nothing to worry about and its not even worth talking about because if you believe in aliens you are crazy. The government have also owned those UFOs since the 1930s and have covered it up for 70 years......"

It is people like that...that don't want to know the truth...