Well I guess BH that with things going so bad with the Party in power they Need something especially when their lover boy Rove is now been look at for possible indictment after all.

And we all know that Bush leave in a bubble and for him only good news are the only news, so everybody else is a traitor for not following his lead.

Missinformation and propaganda is not new for the party in power. . . they are good at it and they are good at manipulating the gullible and trusting of their followers.

But making Americans turn into each other . . . so openly and deliberated I found it irresponsible.

Or perhaps this will aid more so the administration can take action against American citizens that can become a treat to each other and national security for no supporting the president views.

You people are really living in a dream world...

...President Bush is doing the right thing, its true that American leaders like Howard Dean are WRONG to say things like, "the idea we can win this war is just wrong". Because the fact is we are winning the war, but the democrats are trying to trick the American public into thinking that we are losing...

...even fellow Democrats are telling Howard Dean to "shut up".



-- Boat

[edit on 12-12-2005 by Boatphone]

About the worst possible thing Howard Dean and Kerry could have done at this point in history is what they already did.

To further belittle our American military men and women, and give the terrorist opposition in Iraq a glimmer of hope is despicable. You speak about the GOP splitting this nation? I would rather vote for someone supposedly splitting this country then a person that would willfully do the above.

Dislike the man in the White House... thats fine. Endanger American lives to feed your need to attack the man in the White House... That is just sick.

[edit on 12-12-2005 by LostSailor]

Well, I gues those Repos are calling me every name in their book because of my point of view. I knew when this war started that is was all based on lies. Saddam HAD wmds back in the 1980s, but those were given to him by W's daddy so Soddam Insane could fight the Iranians. Only thing W is doing is looking for those weapons that Saddam didn't use that were given to him. W is making his daddy proud looking for something that Big George gave Saddam.

Originally posted by LostSailor
To further belittle our American military men and women, and give the terrorist opposition in Iraq a glimmer of hope is despicable.

I have seen no indication that Dean or Kerry belittled the troops.

p.s. The 'terrorists' in Iraq already have a glimmer of hope. They already have a boatload of hope. They already have resolve, they already KNOW that they will NOT quit until the US is gone from Iraq. They're already freely willing to give their lives and the lives of their families for their cause. Do you really think they give a rat's bottom what Kerry or Dean have to say?

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I have seen no indication that Dean or Kerry belittled the troops.

Look harder...

"And there is no reason, Bob, that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the – of – the historical customs, religious customs," Kerry said Sunday. "Whether you like it or not ... Iraqis should be doing that." - John Kerry

The soldiers that signed up to serve their country shouldn't even be there I guess... Must make them feel real good heh?

The "idea that we're going to win the war in Iraq is an idea which is just plain wrong," - Howard Dean

That must be great for the soldiers to hear... All those soldiers dying for a pointless cause.

"I think we need a strategic redeployment over a period of two years," Dean said. "Bring the 80,000 National Guard and reserve troops home immediately. They don't belong in a conflict like this anyway. We ought to have a redeployment to Afghanistan of 20,000 troops, we don't have enough troops to do the job there and it's a place where we are welcome. And we need a force in the Middle East, not in Iraq but in a friendly neighboring country to fight (terrorist leader Abu Musab) Zarqawi, who came to Iraq after this invasion. We've got to get the target off the backs of American troops." - Howard Dean

Unfortunately, Howard Dean and others of his ilk don't understand the basic facts about the terrorists. We can't get the target off the backs of American troops, no matter where they are. And we can't get the target off the backs of all of the rest of the Americans and all the rest of the world's "infidels." We need to leave our troops where they are and let them kill Zarqawi and his thugs right there in Iraq.

[edit on 14-12-2005 by LostSailor]

First of all, our soldiers know very well what is going on, they are not in the dark.

And as for the "Terrorist" they have been around for a long time and they will be around long after Bush gets out of power.

So much for the war on terror, nothing more than an excused to invade another country.

Originally posted by marg6043
First of all, our soldiers know very well what is going on, they are not in the dark.

You are right... they know more then most of the people on these forums.

And as for the "Terrorist" they have been around for a long time and they will be around long after Bush gets out of power.

Oh yeah... they will always be around... But when Bush gets done they will be less then half as powerful as they were. Also, they will think twice before messing with the U.S.

So much for the war on terror, nothing more than an excused to invade another country.

Quit beating a dead horse... Or do some research.

Originally posted by LostSailor

Originally posted by marg6043
First of all, our soldiers know very well what is going on, they are not in the dark.

You are right... they know more then most of the people on these forums.

And as for the "Terrorist" they have been around for a long time and they will be around long after Bush gets out of power.

Oh yeah... they will always be around... But when Bush gets done they will be less then half as powerful as they were. Also, they will think twice before messing with the U.S.

So much for the war on terror, nothing more than an excused to invade another country.

Quit beating a dead horse... Or do some research.

I bet you that most of the people on this forum know about the same as what a U.S. soldier knows what's going on. When Bush gets done "fighting" the terrorists, he's gonna be living with a lot more money than what he already has now. Him and Cheney are both profitting from this war, and we know it. As for the terrorists being weaker, it could happen, but it could also fill them with an even stronger resolve to kill westerners. I've done my research, and it's astounding.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

The gauntlet is being thrown down. Pick your side. Either support this war or be called a name. It's a tough choice, I know.

I HATE it when people call me names. Makes me feel left out. Unpopular. Unappreciated. I just can't take it. I'd rather breathe radioactive dust and watch other people die.


Not.

The war in Iraq is NOT about fighting terror. It IS about making Bush's personal friends and supporters incredibly rich.

ALL the servicemen and women dying in Iraq are dying for the GREED of Bush and his friends.

The greatest thing we could do for our troops and the Iraqi people is to get the heck out of there.

Saddam had wmds because daddy Bush gave them to him. Saddam invaded Kuwait because he was told by the US that the US would not interfere in an Arab vs. Arab conflict.

The Bush family manufactured the situation in Iraq and should be the ones who are over there taking the heat. NOT the sons and daughters of the working poor in America.

It is the American way. The rich people start wars and the poor die in them.

Notice that I did not mention Republicans or Democrats in this reply.

Originally posted by LostSailor

"And there is no reason, Bob, that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the – of – the historical customs, religious customs," Kerry said Sunday. "Whether you like it or not ... Iraqis should be doing that." - John Kerry

The soldiers that signed up to serve their country shouldn't even be there I guess... Must make them feel real good heh?

If you're going to 'guess' what he meant, then I doubt you're right. Read the statement. Iraqis should be policing their country, not American soldiers... I don't see how that 'belittles' the soldiers.

Originally posted by LostSailor

The "idea that we're going to win the war in Iraq is an idea which is just plain wrong," - Howard Dean

That must be great for the soldiers to hear... All those soldiers dying for a pointless cause.

I agree they're dying for a pointless cause. And I agree with Dean that this war cannot be won. Still don't see how that belittles the soldiers. It's a hard truth. This war isn't worth fighting.

Originally posted by LostSailor
We can't get the target off the backs of American troops, no matter where they are.

WHAT??? How can you belittle the troops like that??? How do you think they're going to feel to read that we can't save them from the terrorists no matter where they are?!?!?!

The war wagged in the middle east is a war of ideologies, Bush and his fight v. evil.

Wars that has been wagged on religious ideologies are never won by any side.

This wars are as old as the world itself.

To said that the war in Iraq is to be won, is just a way to make Americans think that the President has control over a fantasy.

People forgot the real reasons for Bush going into Iraq the original purpose that was supposed to be honorable and good has been put aside for a purpose of following a crusade against other people with different believes.

The insurgency and terrorist in Iraq are not longer the foreign forces that the Bush administration has been trying to sell.

It worked in the beginning but now is not just foreigners but Iraqi people that are not only fighting their fellow Iraqis from others groups but also fighting against of what US has become in their country and in their lands.

Occupation

``

back when the vietnam war was first becoming an issue,
the administration(s) used the phrases "America- Love it or leave it"

and; this is... My Country - right or wrong

sorta like what President Bush is selling now, in trying to rally support
for the Iraq & the War-on-Terror (WonT)
..and for his & the republican party poll ratings before the 2006 elections.

I agree, ROVE will indeed create something to 'revive' BUSH's declining popularity.

And, if anyone can and will do it; it will be Rove.
He is ruthless, heartless, and his capacity for deception and deviant behavior willl surely show it's salf again.


How much longer do we have to deal with Bush in the WH?


And, how far into the 'hole' will he put us?

Be Afraid, Be Very Afraid...........................

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I agree they're dying for a pointless cause.

Freedom is a pointless cause? I think many Iraqi's would disagree.

-- Boat

What's wrong with propaganda?

I don't personally see the problem in using biased information to gain a military advantage, it's just psy-ops.

I think everyone here should read the Ann Coulter book Treason: Liberal Treachery in the Cold War and Today. It was very enlightening and maybe some people on this board could do with such a good explanation as to why their political leanings are not particularly patriotic or even smart.

Whoever said Iraqis should be policing their own country should be slapped silly with a wet salmon because they have no grasp of reality. How are Iraqis supposed to set up a police force or armed force of their own while they are constantly attacked by crazy, murderers? Our boys need to be there to stabilise the situation so that the Iraqis can eventually take care of themselves and so that the country doesn't slide into the cesspit of religous fanatcism.

The liberals seem to be using the technique of propaganda themselves but not for the positive morale purposes of Bush but for the belittlement of our courageous men and women around the world. And don't even think of calling me a chickenhawk as I am not old enough to join the military.

Deny the slander, deny liberalism

Originally posted by fatcat2
The liberals seem to be using the technique of propaganda themselves but not for the positive morale purposes of Bush but for the belittlement of our courageous men and women around the world.

So... your answer is yes, then?

There's nothing wrong with propaganda per se. But when it's used to further divide an already divided nation and to slander anyone with a different opinion, it's less than effective for the overall purpose.

We should not be at war with each other. We should be able to disagree respectfully.

More than ever this country (the US) needs to find common ground and come together as a nation to move forward, not further divide the political parties by calling gradeschool names.

Originally posted by fatcat2
What's wrong with propaganda?

Whoever said Iraqis should be policing their own country should be slapped silly with a wet salmon because they have no grasp of reality.

Do you really know what is going on in Iraq or just what the administration tells you because you probably have no clue as the cultural, historical and social behavior of the groups of people that make the tribes that are called the Iraqi people.

How are Iraqis supposed to set up a police force or armed force of their own while they are constantly attacked by crazy, murderers?

The problems is that the once oppress tribal groups call "Shiites" has been given majority rule with the help of the US.

Now retributions against the once oppressor the "Sunnis" are in their agenda.

AT the same time the police killings and attack on the Shiites are done by the same people that feels the Shiites are taking retribution against them.

But remember Iraq was liberated and no all Sunnis were enemies but now they have become the enemy.

Insurgents and Terrorist are the same people that opposed the "Invasion" they are no only feed as "foreigners" but they are also Iraqis.

Iraqis of different groups are now fighting each other for border control of territories in Iraq do to respective Islamic definition of their law.

Yes our boys are now in the middle of the Iraqi civil war and guess what they are becoming targets in both side of the fight.

Religion will be Islam with your approval or not. Saddam was not Islamic follower he was a tyrant but he keep the religious groups and their leaders on hold.

Now they are free and now you see what is going on in Iraq.

Iraq will be an Islamic state, because the majority in Iraq practice Islamic law.


Denied ignorance the Pandora box has been open in Iraq and now is not way to close it.