Originally posted by billybob
don't get it wrong.
nothing FALLS faster than the acceleration of gravity. if it is observed going downward faster than that, it is being pushed.
i believe, what you are referring to, is that it fell at the rate of gravity in a VACUUM, ie. zero air resistance(and obviously, zero building resistance)? that is the rate that rick siegel measures in 911eyewitness.

Yeah, that's what I should've said. Thanks =)

Did you start counting the fall time from when the collapse first started? i.e. the "kink" in the penthouse roof?

If so, what was your total time for that?





[edit on 8-4-2006 by HowardRoark]

That makes absolutely no difference. The roof of the building was descending at free fall speed.

The fact that another part of the building collapsed beforehand does not explain how the roof met absolutely no resistance as it fell. There would've had to have been some resistance from the STEEL and CONCRETE as the global collapse ran its course, unless explosives took care of those things before they had a chance to offer resistance to the fall.

Silverstien said he pulled it. so we secretly just know it was demolished and by that crook.
question is whats he on about giving orders to pull, who is he giving orders to?

Originally posted by Valhall

Originally posted by AdamJ

Its interesting that the floor should give way at the same time all the way around, is that normal when buildings collapse?

Yes, it is absolutely possible and very logical. Looking at the impact points of the building, a significant portion of the support structure was missing after the plane hit. The remaining support structure on the damaged floors had taken on added loading. Once the heat from the burning jet fuel softened some number ...

That all sounds real good I must say, but I'm still curious how 2WTC managed to tip over first but then keep going straight down through its core instead of sciences "the path of least resistance". I'm still undecided on much of this, and your explaination is quite plausible to expalin the beginning of the collapse, but what about the tipping 2WTC? Has that topic been fully covered in its own thread here? If anyone has a link I'd appreciate it.

Also, is there a full and focused thermite thread (I couldnt find one in the index)?





About Rick, it seems like the treatment of him was rather harsh. I could be wrong but I cant actually see what he said to judge. From the quotes I seen I couldnt see what was so worthy of total dismemberment. "If we get enough support to do the next DVD you will have that evidence too." doesn't seem like profit mongering, and it's entirely likely that 95% of the people that have seen it havent paid a dime (including myself). I blogged about it awhile back, and he personally gave me permission to post up multiple links for everyone watch his video for free. It would seem fair to allow him to continue to post (it appears he got quite a warning shot), and it seems unfair that he cant defend (or incriminate) himself about the issues of his video.

Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by ihatescifi
I'd like to know how the government so amzingly cut the sound of explosions from coutless news feeds ...

Not saying they did, but it wouldn't be that hard to do really. Explosions are in the low requency range while crowd noise is mid to high. Cut out the lows and you could easily mask the explosions. Also if you are listening to them on a TV you don't get a lot of low end response from those speakers.
Also take into consideration placement of the camera/microphone etc...
Anyway most of the news clips don't show those few minutes before the towers fell did they?

Interesting. Somewhere in here I think someone mentioned how cameras close to Ground Zero didnt even pick up much of the audio from the roar of the collapse.

If there are no bomb sounds on the call then it's most likely not from the towers because there were a lot of firemen who heard explosions from the street as well.

Just like the 911 cell phone calls from 30,000 feet, it's likely COINTELPRO.

Look at the dog and pony show for Moussaoui. No mention of Coleen Rowley who went public with info about her investigation that got killed in order to keep the evil doer's plot under wraps until after 9/11.

Just like David Shipper's whistleblower evidence ignored by Attorney General Ashcroft prior to 9/11.

The Cointelpro teams had to create a series of 911 phone calls. The Flight 93 dramatizations are complete fabrications including seat numbers when the passenger lists didn't even list any Arab names.

The real 911 calls were the firemen's radio communications saying that the fires were isolated pockets that could be knocked down with two hose lines only minutes before the South Tower exploded with a mini-nuke.

Little did they realize that transmission probably was their death sentence as putting the fires out would spoil the demolition fireworks.

Smith likes to pretend that a pancake is somewhere other than complete fantasy, but the trauma based mind control inflicted on the public through the televised media is starting to wear off and when people look at the towers now they see an implosion.

1010 WINS reporters caught on tape by Rick Siegel tell it like it was, a banana unpeeling, firework explosion of cloud.

The 911eyewitness DVD alone has enough evidence to convict the evil doers in court and that's why it got pulled from Wikipedia and is getting its Google cache blacked out manually from within their database.

The days are numbered for tricky Dick and Rummy Don.

Originally posted by Buffy
If there are no bomb sounds on the call then it's most likely not from the towers because there were a lot of firemen who heard explosions from the street as well.

It is from the Tower, the 105th floor of WTC2 in fact. If you listen you will hear him state that clearly. You also hear the tower collapse at the end as he screams.

Just like the 911 cell phone calls from 30,000 feet, it's likely COINTELPRO.

There's not much anyone can say to that, apart from it's funny how any information that does not support a conspiracy theory and maybe even discredit's some of them is COINTELPRO. Of course anyone who dares to present such information is COINTELPRO too!

The Cointelpro teams had to create a series of 911 phone calls. The Flight 93 dramatizations are complete fabrications including seat numbers when the passenger lists didn't even list any Arab names.

The case is still going on, you could travel to where it's happening and tell the families of those involved that they don't exist and are a fabrication as they enter/leave the court building.
The passenger manifests would have listed Arab names, the lists published by the press are of the victims, most if not all clearly state that the names are of course in addition to the terrorists. This is one of the worst pieces of so called 'evidence' the Truth Movement keeps trying to put forward.

The real 911 calls were the firemen's radio communications saying that the fires were isolated pockets that could be knocked down with two hose lines only minutes before the South Tower exploded with a mini-nuke.

Mini Nuke? OK... Anyway back to 9/11, the fireman had reached the first affected floor of damage. The logic behind your reasoning that there were only '2 small pockets of fire' in the entire building makes as much sense as saying there was no fire at all because, say, floor 21 was unaffected..

Little did they realize that transmission probably was their death sentence as putting the fires out would spoil the demolition fireworks.

See above

The 911eyewitness DVD alone has enough evidence to convict the evil doers in court and that's why it got pulled from Wikipedia and is getting its Google cache blacked out manually from within their database.

Actually if you looked at the cached page and understand HTML/PHP, you will see that there was an error in the scripting on the page. You can still see the text by click dragging over it. If it was censored there would be no cached page at all.

The days are numbered for tricky Dick and Rummy Don.

Quite possibly, but's it's not going to be brought about by flimsy, warped 'evidence'.

[edit on 13-4-2006 by AgentSmith]

Whew - what a ride! I've been reading the whole thread while I wait for part 1 of the video to download. Fascinating.

I'm particularly impressed with Valhall: if I'm reading this right, she actually changed her mind about this after seeing the video. Having read her posts propping up the jet fuel heating/pancake collapse - involving some serious calculation - she's got a lot invested in that theory and to abandon it publicly takes some serious guts.

As for Agent Smith, it's been interesting watching his posts. The man seems to be connected! Hobnobbing with astronauts? Did you ask Armstrong about being buzzed by a UFO on the moon? That's a persistent rumour I've heard from many, many sources, not just the internet but from people I've met who were ex-USAF and -SAC.

It is intriguing that when Smith's ego was pricked somewhat by being called stupid, he went into a little tizzy about being a child prodigy... and passing a test for the MoD (UK Ministry of Defence). Verrrry interrresting... and of course fuel for those who would like to portray him as a debunker.

As for Howard Roark, I'm leaning towards him being disinfo, frankly. JMO from his approach.

It was fascinating what happened to the thread when Valhall caved, though.

I like: people who change their views when confronted with evidence they find persuasive; and people who argue their corner.

I don't like so much: the fact that Eyewitness' posts were removed so we can't see them; and the fact that moderators - reviewing this thread will show up whom I mean - seem to be able to get away with sarcasm, insults and unpleasantness in a way that us ever so 'umble folks can't.

JMO; I saw the day's events unfold on CNN, and I thought right from the start that the towers were demolished and that the hijackers' names were released WAY too early to be plausible. Since then there's just been far too much dodginess to ignore. I don't have a favourite theory though I am leaning towards an Operation Northwoods scenario. I mean, the guy who was piloting the plane that was supposed to crash into the Pentagon used to WORK at the Pentagon? Running exercises about hijacked planes crashing into the Pentagon? "Retiring" to become an airline pilot and then drawing the short straw, being hijacked.... nuh-uh. Come OFF it.

But it is interesting watching certain people on this forum trying to prop up the official fairytale, and watching the progress of debate on threads. There'll be a flurry of enthusiasm and then the debunkers (oops! critical thinkers, sorry - let's try to remember that they only exist on one side of the fence) will weigh in... and then there'll be a huge and ever-more-unpleasant debate, often featuring debunkers working in pairs. Then things will usually fizzle out... often with the debunkers having just exhausted (but not persuaded) their opponents. And the debunkers often work one angle really hard but ignore everything else: for me, it's the totality of the pieces that add up. You can get a pretty good idea of the overall picture even if some pieces of the jigsaw are missing.

Anyway, thanks for the links.

Oh, Agent Smith: about the COINTELPRO thing - the fact that there were 'cellphone calls' when it seems to have been impossible to use cellphones on the planes would be, to me, prima facie evidence of COINTELPRO/PSYOPS involvement. It's therefore not such a stretch to think that the audio you refer to may have been redacted or even confected.

[edit on 13-4-2006 by rich23]

Uh? The phone call I posted was from the 105th Floor of WTC 2 and released as evidence in court yesterday.

In responce to the no cell phone calls from the planes. It has been said that they either used on board phones or that the cell phone calls actually could have been made. I think I had an arguement with Zaphod (I think it was him/her) and he/she convinced me that it was possible. Just wanted to throw that out there.

I thought about what people are saying about the WTC explosion that the airplanes wasn't the cause of destruction that sent the twin towers down but the use of demolition would be true. Those victums that died were nothing but pawns in the human game of chess played by the secrect government. what better way to recruit young men and women to joined the armed forces that were at a all time low. Of couse americans who can't see behind the lies that stares at them are going to jump up pump their fist in patriotism to stand up for a country they beleive is the target of terrorist attacks. The entire 911 was stage so certain companies who design military weapons can benefits from a billion dollar defense contract. Its all about power ruling with an armored fist. The question is who is calling the shots?

Hi AS -

Uh? The phone call I posted was from the 105th Floor of WTC 2 and released as evidence in court yesterday.

And that means it's DEFINITELY not faked, right? (My apologies to ANYONE who reads this who might be offended. I admit I haven't even heard it myself - I have a lot to look at.)

I think you're being, perhaps, a little disingenuous here. There's enough dodgy stuff around that I'm inclined to look at ANYTHING - particularly connected with the Moussaoui show trial - as being at least potentially faked. The fact that it can be used in court as evidence has no bearing on its ultimate source.

All we can do is take the pieces of information we come across and construct a narrative that makes sense of the world as we find it. The more predictive the narrative, and the more data it handles, the better it is. My narrative suggests to me that this whole thing was very much a false-flag PSYOP on, primarily, the American people to get them to roll over for the loss of their liberties and to get them involved in what is now being referred to as "The Long War" by the military. This narrative also suggests to me that the chances of the US being involved in a military strike in Iran sometime before the end of the year (I'm being conservative) are good, despite all the stuff about trying to find a diplomatic solution: and it also wouldn't surprise me if there were some other "terrorist" event scheduled to keep people off-balance and frightened. Just like the anthrax attacks (remember them?) kept the ball rolling just after 9/11. And THEY turned out to emanate from Fort Detrick, Maryland, if you recall.

Originally posted by noslenwerd
Sorry if this has been covered recently...

But does anyone have a link to the movie? The torrent file linked before is bad

Get it on Google video.