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BJJ and Muay Thai vs all others

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posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 09:10 AM
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I have a martial arts conspiracy. I practice BJJ (vale tudo) and Muay Thai. After I got hurt and can't run anymore, I found that in the UFC and other ring events, that what was being taught in the traditional schools was not effective in one on one combat. Since the other styles didn't work in single mode combative sports, what are they good for besides as an exercise? We all see the movie guys doing this kick or that or this standing joint lock or that. I haven't used any of what I've learned in a conflict, for which I am glad, but wonder how effective the other styles would be compared to the real deal on the street fighting you would find in say a mugging. No granted I know the history of the Gracies in Brasil and the tournaments they held to see what worked. But am asking for concensus on whether your style worked for you. I have always heard the "black belt" getting his butt handed to him on the street stories, but have also personally seen a brown belt 13 y/o lay a kid out at the bus stop when I was a kid. Thoughts?




posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 11:41 AM
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In My opinion,

It's not the quality of the teachings, but the quality of the student. It all comes down to coordination, retention, application of knowledge, the ability to re-act quickly, and above all improvise based upon what you know successfully.

Not everyone is created or conditioned equally in this respect.

Proper conditioning and practice can help someone overcome their nature, however some people are born with above and below average predispostion to be good at something, just like anyone else.

Thanks,

-ADHD

[edit on 5-12-2005 by ADHDsux4me]



posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 12:16 PM
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Originally posted by ADHDsux4me
In My opinion,

It's not the quality of the teachings, but the quality of the student. It all comes down to coordination, retention, application of knowledge, the ability to re-act quickly, and above all improvise based upon what you know successfully.

Not everyone is created or conditioned equally in this respect.

Proper conditioning and practice can help someone overcome their nature, however some people are born with above and below average predispostion to be good at something, just like anyone else.

Thanks,

-ADHD

[edit on 5-12-2005 by ADHDsux4me]


Generally speaking I think you are right. I cannot get into some positions easily because I have bad joints due to surgery. I can excel in other areas that are good though and others find it hard to counter them. I guess what I am saying is you are right.




posted on Dec, 5 2005 @ 01:07 PM
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What do you consider a traditional school? Most martial arts schools in America are not even remotely traditional.
American martial arts schools are littered with Mc Dojo's. Most hand out black belts in one or two years. The same with the American military martial arts, they hand out black belts within a year...... In most styles a black belt is a symbolic earning. It does not mean they can kick your #$#$, it just means they know there art very well. So now what is traditional in other countries is Americanized in America lol..... Americans need things fast and they do skip the traditional part..

I have seen the early videos of the Gracies, they did capitalize there style against other styles of the American type. Meaning they where not fighting against the real deal. For example had they tried against someone like Mas Oyama the founder of kyokushin karate, Mas would probably put up a good fight and maybe take there heads off lol... may look like a UFC fight
. Not only that Mas was the first to do what the Gracies are doing now, and that is he took on all kinds of challengers back in the 50's to gain more students.. his fights where won very quickly. Mas did kill a man with one single blow to the head in a self-defense situation.. Mas Oyama martial art was rooted in tradition, for example he would isolated himself in the mountains to take on mother nature as did past famous samurai's.....

The Gracies are rooted in tradition, this is a good martial art school, that takes more than 5-6 years to become a black belt, maybe even more than that depending on the instructor, And is proven in self-defense...... Most of the self-defense they teach is the same techniques used in other styles, self-defense is a universal thing.

Now which system is superior, how to become a champion ‘no-holds-barred’ fighter? This does not rely on one particular style, it relies on how much time you invested in strengthening the mind and body with exercises, and most of all your physical well being.


Its not really about which system is superior.


what are they good for besides as an exercise?
martial arts are designed to strengthen the mind and body, exercises is the foundation of most styles.



I have always heard the "black belt" getting his butt handed to him on the street stories, but have also personally seen a brown belt 13 y/o lay a kid out at the bus stop when I was a kid. Thoughts?
Mc dojo story here lol........... It really does not matter what belt you are in a street fight...

]





[edit on 5-12-2005 by XPhiles]



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 10:27 AM
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Originally posted by XPhiles
What do you consider a traditional school? Most martial arts schools in America are not even remotely traditional.
American martial arts schools are littered with Mc Dojo's. Most hand out black belts in one or two years. The same with the American military martial arts, they hand out black belts within a year...... In most styles a black belt is a symbolic earning. It does not mean they can kick your #$#$, it just means they know there art very well. So now what is traditional in other countries is Americanized in America lol..... Americans need things fast and they do skip the traditional part..

I have seen the early videos of the Gracies, they did capitalize there style against other styles of the American type. Meaning they where not fighting against the real deal. For example had they tried against someone like Mas Oyama the founder of kyokushin karate, Mas would probably put up a good fight and maybe take there heads off lol... may look like a UFC fight
. Not only that Mas was the first to do what the Gracies are doing now, and that is he took on all kinds of challengers back in the 50's to gain more students.. his fights where won very quickly. Mas did kill a man with one single blow to the head in a self-defense situation.. Mas Oyama martial art was rooted in tradition, for example he would isolated himself in the mountains to take on mother nature as did past famous samurai's.....

The Gracies are rooted in tradition, this is a good martial art school, that takes more than 5-6 years to become a black belt, maybe even more than that depending on the instructor, And is proven in self-defense...... Most of the self-defense they teach is the same techniques used in other styles, self-defense is a universal thing.

Now which system is superior, how to become a champion ‘no-holds-barred’ fighter? This does not rely on one particular style, it relies on how much time you invested in strengthening the mind and body with exercises, and most of all your physical well being.


Its not really about which system is superior.


what are they good for besides as an exercise?
martial arts are designed to strengthen the mind and body, exercises is the foundation of most styles.



I have always heard the "black belt" getting his butt handed to him on the street stories, but have also personally seen a brown belt 13 y/o lay a kid out at the bus stop when I was a kid. Thoughts?
Mc dojo story here lol........... It really does not matter what belt you are in a street fight...

]





[edit on 5-12-2005 by XPhiles]


McDojo's...classic! I almost fell of my chair to that one. I have started to train again and am doing pilates because my core muscles need work. I think that it may help me in other areas as well. Do you guys think that perhaps the traditional guys could hold up against current guys that fight the circuit? I will be training under LLoyd Irvin at the new year and wanted to get a grip on other peoples styles etc. I would have gone to a "martial arts forum" but the thing is they immediately nuke you if you even mention MMA in most cases, been there got the hat.



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