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Why is my religion wrong?

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posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 03:37 PM
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Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher

By reacting, we choose to take of their negative instead of giving of our positive. And that, also, is selfishness and 'sin.'


By choosing to take their negative, we have reacted sinfully. By giving our positive we are playing God by imposing our will upon them, not accepting their will. You choose not to make yourself an extension of their will because of fear. Do not become an extension of their ego, but of their true nature, not the fear that defines them. What is more powerfully being demonstrated by mankind, fear or truth? Fear of Truth.

I don't see how 'giving our positive' is the same as imposing our will upon them?

I guess maybe there are two kinds of ways to love: the kind that 'gives'--this kind minds it own business and does not judge or expect return on the love given, and the kind that 'takes--this kind meddles and the motive of the love is not to build up another but build up one's self. The latter kind manifests in those do-gooders whose idea of helping someone out is giving them advice and suggesting ways to alter their actions and thoughts, more like their own--in order to improve the situation according to what their own situation is. It is, as you say, becoming an extension of their own ego and adding to the fear factor in general, by using their own means of manipulating their fear into something that appears to be otherwise...

But what I meant was the first kind--and that, to me, is, as you say, becoming an extension of their true nature. I feel that at the heart of every human soul, love is the true and pure nature.


Why permit them to make you feel obligated to counter in measure to them?

I'm not--I don't feel obligated to love anyone...I just see that as what is right action for me. Neither do I do it in an effort to 'counter' but instead to fill a hole. Not in a way that puts me into them, but more in the sense of filling a void.


Instead of answering with a positive, use their own accepted logic to debunk their own accepted logic. For how else can we "kill" the ego without harming them? It is the most difficult task to convince them that when they choose to, not only do they lose very little, but in effect they will be themselves, just themselves amplified, free of fear and a will to serve truth.

Why should I use their logic? It's illogical, from my perspective, if they are using their fear as you describe. There is no true logic to fear, and probably not to love, either. These are energies, and the thoughts that form from them are not logical ordered acts of cognition.

As well--we cannot kill another's ego. That is a personal task. Trying to kill an ego might very result in breaking their spirit, instead. That is worse than murdering their body, IMO. We can provide frank, unadulterated views and information that brings all things to a bare naked state for a moment....hopefully those moments will provide food for thought later, but that's about all we can do. And of course, the truth often hurts, and love doesn't always appear as what it is, when delivered on a platter of blunt candid cold turkey--but love is truth, as you say, also.


Stop labelling God and God's theology in a word. God sees no boundries, and words are boundries.

And by the same token, stop telling me what God is to me as defined by you. :shk: If you dig what I'm saying and the attitude I say it with...


I realize love is a word, and I understand what you say about boundaries. Nevertheless, there is no escape for humans when it comes to words and discussions about God. Love the word is a word, but love the truth is boundless and the only thing suitable to indicate that is by using the word that describes it.


How can communication evolve when fear confines the methods of communication we have.

Slowly, but surely, just as everything else.



there is a method of communication available only to those not dominated by fear.

Yeah, but how many people are going to be in that conversation, provided they can all somehow get together?


And how does that promote unity and decrease division of the human spirit en masse?


That's an exclusive idea and so it is selfish and no better than any other religion that's already been named.




posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 04:05 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

Why should I use their logic? It's illogical, from my perspective.... .


Why do you not possess the love and empathy for your respective faith to know that anything that does exist can not exist seperate from at least 1 universally undeniable truth?

It is their logic that binds them.

It is their logic that will free them.

You logic is also flawed if your logic does not permit you to fully comprehend their logic.

But, when you understand their logic . . . .

They will have no choice to percieve you as a threat, because they are afraid of the unknown.

Fear binds them.

Your love for their ignorance will set them free.

In the end if they are fear at the core of their Ego (Conscious mind) you assume they will be:

Fear fears love.

When in fact they will be:

Fear loves love.

Love always loves truth.

Truth always loves love.

Therefore:
When fear loves love and truth loves love and love love's fear, then hate is proven uneccesary and fear's justification for existance also falls away.

Then your conscious mind that operates at a speed of approximately 2,000 biths of information a second is opened up to your subconscious that operates at a speed of approximately 400,000,000,000 biths of information a second.

think of it.

You may currently only be aware of 2,000 biths of information per second which is your brain integrating only 2,000 biths of info per second, when you could be experiencing 400,000,000,000 biths of information per second.

Currently you may only be consciously experiencing .000000000038% of what you are really experiencing.

And like every angel and every messenger of God has said:

"Be not afraid".



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 04:09 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38


there is a method of communication available only to those not dominated by fear.

Yeah, but how many people are going to be in that conversation, provided they can all somehow get together?


Better question would be how many people aren't listening to the conversation, but are participating in it?



Why do people fight relentlessly to maintain the ability to fear? And what good comes from fear?

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 04:29 PM
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Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
Better question would be how many people aren't listening to the conversation, but are participating in it?


Why would a question without meaning be better? If one does not listen, one is not participating in a conversation, but rather is participating in a speech.



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 10:30 PM
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Esoteric Teacher and queen annie you two should kiss and agree to disagree! Seems like you two have been arguing for weeks!
So I say Peace to you both...

Tis the season....

I think people should'nt argue so much so close to the holidays!



posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Esoteric Teacher and queen annie you two should kiss and agree to disagree! Seems like you two have been arguing for weeks!
So I say Peace to you both...

Do you mean this thread is that tiresome? Or are you referring to elsewhere, additional arguing? I didn't think we ever had until today....

I'm confused.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 09:25 AM
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Arguing is how people controlled by fear decipher a conversation. It is just a dialogue.


Edited to add:

A dialogue between my love and her truth, and her love and my truth.


God is the epitome of communication. Since any faith and any religion promote communication, God is there. Communication is key. Key to the Kingdom of Heaven.


[edit on 7-12-2005 by Esoteric Teacher]



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 10:20 AM
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I don't understand the whole religion thing. I understand "idols" and following celebrities. But I believe there's a god and that what most people in the world(outside of treatment of young women like myself) is okay. I just don't believe we shouldn't kill the innocence of a city, just because the powerful in politics say so, just for thier own fourtunes, that's destroyed many civilizations in history, and then there's how one sacrifies(a goat or some little bird, that's okay by me.), but sacrificing a child in any way is disusting, and even through the American media doesn't cover it. Ohio, especially metro-columbus has had an increase in satanic ritual homocides in the last 3 or 4 months. THERE ACTUALLY BEING REPORTED BY LOCAL NEWS! ALSO A LARGE INCREASE IN MISSING CHILDREN! Maybe MS13 has something to do with that?



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 11:37 AM
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esoteric brings up a good point about fear

aren't most religions either based on fear of the unknown or fear of retribution?

example
greeks feared lightning, so they said it was the work of zeus

religions like christianity and islam use fear of damnation (though in islam it's only until you have been punished for all of your sins, so most people only get a small taste of hell, and hitler, stalin, bin laden etc will be there for a really long time)



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:00 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
esoteric brings up a good point about fear

aren't most religions either based on fear of the unknown or fear of retribution?


No doubt. Good observation. I think they are directly driven by the biggest equalizing fear shared by all of humanity.

Death.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:01 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
aren't most religions either based on fear of the unknown or fear of retribution?


I would say so.

And I would agree with queenannie, it is the fear of death.

Having a belief structure which easily comforts those fears, is the reason many people align themselves with a particular belief structure.


example
greeks feared lightning, so they said it was the work of zeus


How do you know that the concept of Zeus was built upon the fear of lightning?


religions like christianity and islam use fear of damnation (though in islam it's only until you have been punished for all of your sins


Some denominations of Christianity, like Gnostic Christianity, do not have a concept of eternal damnation.

It would also be wise not to stereotype a whole religion, based on the doctrine of some of its adherents. Believe it or not, there are some Christians who practice Christianity not out of fear, but out of love.

Inverencial Peace,
Akashic


[edit on 7/12/2005 by AkashicWanderer]



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:25 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
esoteric brings up a good point about fear

aren't most religions either based on fear of the unknown or fear of retribution?


Thank you, but my point is based entirely on observation, I assure you.

Retribution is a good point madnessinmysoul brings up.

Retribution is still nothing but the fear of the consequences.

And fear of the consequences is still FEAR.

The angel that provides fear as an answer to fear must also believe you can fight fire with fire.

"Be not afraid"



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:26 PM
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Why is my religion wrong?

Fear is why your religion is wrong.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 01:17 PM
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i just wanted to get to the heart of fear dictating the majority of religious decisions. i did not convert to buddhism to gain security, i did it so that i could learn to be less selfish. i just don't like it when i hurt another by taking my needs above theirs.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:04 PM
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Originally posted by LoneGunMan
Esoteric Teacher and queen annie you two should kiss and agree to disagree!


But we respect eachother too much to disagree with eachother. We already know we agree with eachother, now we are acting upon our agreement to the covenant. The process of understanding eachother is not necessarily dissagreeing with eachother.

queen annie,
I'm all puckered up!
you for not


Thanks for being you, I wouldn't have you any other way. And if you were any other way, I wouldn't know how to take you.

You are great.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:06 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i just don't like it when i hurt another by taking my needs above theirs.


It hurts all of us to do this, whether we are doing it, recieving it, or nowhere near where it happened. Something does connect us all. I'm glad for that.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:10 PM
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Originally posted by AkashicWanderer

And I would agree with queenannie, it is the fear of death.


Huh. What if God was afraid of death? Probably cause God to create mortality in order to manifest the fear that must be delt with, if the fear of death could not be resolved within God's own mind.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
a counter saying that of the over 150,000 people that died today the
majority will go to hell, THIS is why many evangelicals anger me.


Good catch! I HATE those allegedly Christian sites. Everyone is
going to hell who doesn't worship God exactly as they think He should
be worshipped.
UGH. You said that THIS is why
evangelicals anger you? Well, let me add to that ... this is why
a few evangelicals manage to anger MOST of the world!
Stupid statements like that about most going to hell who die
that day ... and they think they are persecuted because they are right.
It's the error in judgement and their attitude.



[edit on 12/7/2005 by FlyersFan]



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
Huh. What if God was afraid of death? Probably cause God to create mortality in order to manifest the fear that must be delt with, if the fear of death could not be resolved within God's own mind.


thought provoking to say the least...



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 05:35 PM
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Maybe the Universe, from the smallest sub-atomic particle to these things; massive things are simply the answer to an unfathomably complicated question that an omnipotent/omniscient etc. deity asked himself one endless day in eternity while he was bored?

Or maybe I have too many weird friends



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