Project Serpo: Postings by "Anonymous" -- Breaking news?

Bill

So Victor was going to answer your question about the 2% guy by reading through the same stuff (13,000 words on the SERPO site) that the rest of us can read. And he was going to be able to pick the straw stick of text that the 2% guy wrote that Victor incorporated into a Anon post ?

So without the aid of back ups to the emails Victor knows which of the three or four Anon contributors sent which bits of data that he combined together in each of the general Anon posts.

You made a specific remark a little while ago about even though Anon has not given anymore news to Victor that he was still around. When was the last time you thought he was still actively interacting with the Victor List ??

Waaaay back on page 60 something there were calls for the pictures that were supposedly being formatted.

Where are they?

20 pages later and no advance?

Originally posted by Anon
Somehow, I never knew this information, but a meeting date was set for April 1964 near Alamogordo New Mexico. The Aliens landed and retrieved the bodies of their dead comrades. Information was exchanged.

This led me to search for any UFO sightings that may have happened in 1964. I then came across the Socorro sighting which is about 132 miles from Alamogordo, New Mexico
View story here

I then found this interesting piece of information that directly relates to the events surrounding the Serpo story:

Holloman Air Force Base:
Location: Approximately 15 km. southwest of Alamogordo, New Mexico.

Description: This air base is a well known testing site for experimental aircraft. It is also near where the first A-bomb was tested. On April 25, 1964 (12 hours after the famous Soccoro, New Mexico, UFO landing), a UFO (escorted by 2 others that remained in the air) landed at this base. Three aliens got out of the craft and talked with base officials. This story was confirmed by Richard C. Doty (possible pseudonym), a retired counterintelligence officer with the Air Force's Office of Special Investigations (OSI).

SOURCE

I thought this may be of some interest to those who are waiting patiently.

Thanks for the response Bill.

Someone might want to edit the site to make it a little more clear who is doing the speaking.
And hopefully Anonymous will break his period of silence for us soon.

You are truly a giant among men for putting up with me and my accusations earlier in the thread.

Thanks again.



[edit on 19-1-2006 by KDX175DUEX]

if i remember right, the holloman incident is the inspiration for the Movie close encounters of the third kind...which in turn is loosely based on the serpo incident -- they're all tied together story-wise....although how true any of it is, is still up in the air.

I think in these 80+ pages this must have been discussed, but if these documents have been automatically declassified since it was closed 25 years ago - assuming all of the conditions that you described were met for this declassification - isn't the easy solution to submit a Freedom of Info request and there's the proof?

Actually, no one's asked much about the declassification process described in the article. Here's the quick version...

First, anyone who wants to know a reason why I have been following this story, here's is a post on made last month discussing why disclosure could be legally possible now. It leaves the door open, anyway. You might want to read the following summary first, then go back and read the original post.

Summary -- automatic declassification

All documents are subject to automatic declassification on the 25th anniversary of the date it was classified.

Within the 180 days prior to the declassification of the document, the head of the agency that classified the documents must make a request to "exempt" the document from automatic declassification, if the agency head believes that the documents should remain classified in their entirety.

Unless someone who has standing to contest the agency head's recommendation makes a protest, then top-ranking National Security Council official decides whether to accept the agency head's recommendation. I would suspect that they do this rather routinely.

Here's the interesting tie-in to Serpo...

Certain people have the right, under EO12598 and the DOD non-disclosure agreement to make a formal protest against the agency head's recommendation asserting that certain documents should not remain classified. Among those people are the officer that originally classified the document his superiors, and on up the chain of command.

Lets assume that the "DIA-6" (just to make them sound spookier) are each authors of a part of the debriefing manual (or were their superiors). These guys would have the legal right to contest the continued classification of these documents. They are allowed to challenge the agency head and have a hearing on the matter.

Maybe anon's group was doing this and thought they had the support to get the manual declassified? Who knows... but Anon said that the report was closed in 1980. That means that last year was the 25th anniversary of the classification of the report.


Maybe it means nothing. Maybe not. Maybe Anon was told to stop what he was doing while the hearing panel made a decision. Maybe one of Anon's colleagues is on that panel?

We really don't know. This is all purely hypothetical... but certainly an interesting coincidence.

I was just reading the consistencies page from Serpo.org and found a strange inconsistency within the first section which is taken from Robert Collins "Exempt from Disclosure" which in someways is supposed to back up the Serpo story

Quote: EBE-2 sat in a chair across the table from two civilians and the AF Colonel. I did not know the identity of the three. LANL-1 came into the room and sat next to me. I listened while the three asked EBE-2 a series of questions pertaining to its home planet. First question was about the temperature, climate and weather. EBE-2 responded in perfect English but sounded like a machine generated voice. Very hard to explain but it was either coming from a device that EBE-2 had in front of him or from something in its body.

In the above section he says he listened as EBE-2 was questioned, yet in the section below which is only a few paragraphs down he says

Quote: The interesting part of this interview was that I didn't hear any questions being asked by the three humans sitting across from EBE-2. Either the questions were already given to EBE-2 or the three humans were "thinking the questions" and EBE-2 would respond in English.

I Realise this doesn't add anything to wether the Serpo story is true or not but it was on the consistencies page and thought I would point it out!

Originally posted by robertfenix
So Victor was going to answer your question about the 2% guy by reading through the same stuff (13,000 words on the SERPO site) that the rest of us can read. And he was going to be able to pick the straw stick of text that the 2% guy wrote that Victor incorporated into a Anon post ?

So without the aid of back ups to the emails Victor knows which of the three or four Anon contributors sent which bits of data that he combined together in each of the general Anon posts.

Hi, robertfenix –

Yes, he was offering (rather reluctantly, and I understand why!) to go through the text recalling and noting, if he could, which bits came from where.

You made a specific remark a little while ago about even though Anon has not given anymore news to Victor that he was still around. When was the last time you thought he was still actively interacting with the Victor List ??

Good question. I have no idea, and Victor hasn't said. There's no reason to believe that he's left the list, although I'm sure he'd always be passive, and never active. I'd imagine, unless he's left the country or is in some way incapacitated, he'd still be monitoring the list to see what's being said and by whom. (He should join this Forum! He'd find out more here about what people were thinking and feeling than anywhere else.)

Best, Bill

Re the Soccoro, NM landing.

According to that UFO-lore story, the saucer (complete with apparent chemical rocket thrusters for landing) touched down in a road, and a NM police officer saw it and even saw some EBEs get out for a while.

According to the story on www.serpo.org, the Ebens first made an "off course" landing the first time and then landed in the proper spot on Holloman AFB.

So was that UFO-lore "sighting" the incorrect landing?

EBE1: Where the hell are we anyway?

EBE2: Looks like the official middle of bumfrack nowhere, on this bumfrack nowhere planet. Hey there's some aboriginal native dude way over there. He has those same mirrored eye-plates that those ground-car soldiers seem to be wearing.

EBE1: Is it carnivorous?

EBE2: They grunt all tough and cr*p, but really they're just more like scavengers of processed pre-dead meat. Don't worry, most of the natives aren't very swift, both body and in the head. Only a tiny fraction of them know how to do basic quantum mechanics and nuclear physics if you can believe it. The sort of smart ones made those nasty uranium bombs, but then they had give them to their barbarian warlords.

EBE1: Great Flying Spaghetti Monster. How did we ever get assigned this s**tty of s**t gig, hauling some freaking monkeys who think they're the s**tty s**t s**t because a couple of them figured out like sixth-grade fission, after 5000 years.

EBE2: Gee, so the Navy Recruiter lied to you too, hmm? Said you'd be commanding great galactic starships, ambassador duty to Coruscant? Yeah, I got the same spiel too. You shoulda listened to your pod-momma.

EBE1: Yeah I miss her. Hey, the navicomputer is beeping. It translated an aborignal message; we're in the wrong place.

EBE2: OK that explains it. Let's blow this pop stand. It's scorching here. I could really use an icy cold Romulan Ale right now.

Originally posted by Centrist

Maybe anon's group was doing this and thought they had the support to get the manual declassified? Who knows... but Anon said that the report was closed in 1980. That means that last year was the 25th anniversary of the classification of the report.

Maybe it means nothing. Maybe not. Maybe Anon was told to stop what he was doing while the hearing panel made a decision. Maybe one of Anon's colleagues is on that panel?

We really don't know. This is all purely hypothetical... but certainly an interesting coincidence.

Centrist - thanks for responding to my question. I'm glad you did summarize though because I think at this point it's good for everyone to think about this - about the fact that there may be an ongoing battle to declassify this project.

However you didn't really answer my question. How do we know whether or not the project is already declassified unless someone submits a FOIA request? My question was, do you know if anyone has made such a request and if so, who did and were there any results back... Just because a project is declassified doesn't really make it public until someone requests the documents and makes those records public info, correct? Couldn't this 3000 page manual be sitting somewhere completely declassified already, just waiting for that request to be made...??

-rdube02

[edit on 19-1-2006 by rdube02]

there's only one way to find out, where to we start to see if it is declassified? thats a good question wether it is or isn't.

Originally posted by rdube02
How do we know whether or not the project is already declassified unless someone submits a FOIA request?
...

Couldn't this 3000 page manual be sitting somewhere completely declassified already, just waiting for that request to be made...??

If the manual was declassified and Anon had the documents, I'd imagine that he'd be sending around PDF's of the whole thing. One possible theory is that anon gets the information from the manual via a contact that has access to it due to the declassification protest. His contact may be relaying him the "pages" via telephone or in some other manner in a manner that reflects what was not "blacked out" on the page he believed had been, or actually has been, declassified.

If the documents have already been declassified, the DIA may make that fact known to the public, given that there will be public interest in the case. They may not, either. So yes, a FOIA request will be the only way to get them actually located and released.

I am not aware that any such request has been acted upon. I didn't file one with the DIA. If no one else claims to have, I suppose I could file one.

EDIT: I did file a FOIA request with the NSA in early December, not DIA though.




[edit on 19-1-2006 by Centrist]

Originally posted by Centrist
If the documents have already been declassified, the DIA may make that fact known to the public, given that there will be public interest in the case. They may not, either. So yes, a FOIA request will be the only way to get them actually located and released.

I am not aware that any such request has been acted upon. I didn't file one with the DIA. If no one else claims to have, I suppose I could file one.

I just want to note quickly, that while I believe firmly at least someone should file a FOIA request to at least determine if there are any documents related to a Project Serpo, or any other keywords particular to this project - I don't think a multitude of people should do it (we've got to remember the number of people reading this thread.) If too many people do it - I suppose it could set off a fire internally at the DIA, and if they are truly in the middle of a declassification battle internally - a flood of FOIA requests could potentially destroy the chances of disclosure?

Especially if Anon was attempting to release this info before the declassification was finalized...a flood of FOIA requests could get him in hot water and we might definitely never hear from him again... However I can't see how a single person, who has some experience with the process, making such a request would really raise any flags...

Centrist - if you have experience with the process, I would definitely nominate you to submit the request... Throughout this you've been neither a skeptic nor a 100% believer - so I'd trust what information you report finding.

-rdube02

Centrist...let me know about the FOIA request for the documents..if you cant do it or dont want to let me know and I'LL do it !(just u2u me to let me know...ok?)

I cannot stress enough that letting this thread disintergrate into in-fighting is very very bad !! then the DIA have done their job...dont give into it !

personally I think I am getting ready to ignore a certain poster.

Mr Ryan I applaud you and your conviction in this matter..you show true class and bravery for stepping into the frying pan because the UFO world is a lonely and barren place to be when you have info that the DIA love to rip apart.

Centrist..once again your on top of your game....I hope that someday fate will allow us to meet.


[edit on 19-1-2006 by Alpha Grey]

whoa people hold your horses... only thing that can be done is to wait for the statements on that website to be backed up by most prefferably the photos...

either way it was a great read



at the beginning of this disscusion someone mentioned that its impossible to post as anonymous on the net nowadays... check your knowledge on linux!

Since no one said that they put a request in yet, I just e-mailed a FOIA request to the DIA on the following key words:

Project Serpo
Final Report 80HQD893-020
The Zeta Reticuli Exchange Program

For anyone else who wants to try, their e-mail address for requests is [email protected], and there is a link on their FOIA website:

www.dia.mil...

I requested any documents that are recently declassified to be sent in PDF format, or hardcopies mailed to my address. I will post any reply I get.

I don't think a flood of requests would keep them from giving it out, because they have to release it by law. For anyone not familiar with FOIA, here is a link.

en.wikipedia.org...

Cheers.

from Mot either way it was a great read..

MoT you are so right.....this is by far the BEST forum and BEST thread I have ever been part of.......I would not trade this for the world.

[edit on 19-1-2006 by Alpha Grey]

Originally posted by Alpha Grey
Centrist...let me know about the FOIA request for the documents..if you cant do it or dont want to let me know and I'LL do it !(just u2u me to let me know...ok?)

I cannot stress enough that letting this thread disintergrate into in-fighting is very very bad !! then the DIA have done their job...dont give into it !

personally I think I am getting ready to ignore a certain poster.

Mr Ryan I applaud you and your conviction in this matter..you show true class and bravery for stepping into the frying pan because the UFO world is a lonely and barren place to be when you have info that the DIA love to rip apart.


[edit on 19-1-2006 by Alpha Grey]

Agreed and echoed. If neither of you have the bandwidth to execute, I can certainly facilitate as well...

K

Originally posted by Hal9000
Since no one said that they put a request in yet, I just e-mailed a FOIA request to the DIA on the following key words:

Project Serpo
Final Report 80HQD893-020
The Zeta Reticuli Exchange Program

For anyone else who wants to try, their e-mail address for requests is [email protected], and there is a link on their FOIA website:

When I made the suggestion to submit a FOIA - the point was to be discreet. Yes, you are correct, if the project is declassified by law they have to provide the documents - but if we actually do have inside information right now about a CLASSIFIED project - what do you think they are going to do to the person who leaked it? What do you think is going to happen to Anon? And guess what is going to happen to our information - it'll be gone for the foreseeable future. At least until they do decide to declassify it - if ever.

The POINT was to discreetly check if it was declassified without raising any flags if it ISN'T declassified.

Please everyone - do NOT start flooding them with emailed FOIA requests.

We need to be methodical about this - that was my point with my initial suggestion...

Good lord...

-rdube02

Originally posted by rdube02

Originally posted by Hal9000
Since no one said that they put a request in yet, I just e-mailed a FOIA request to the DIA on the following key words:

Project Serpo
Final Report 80HQD893-020
The Zeta Reticuli Exchange Program

For anyone else who wants to try, their e-mail address for requests is [email protected], and there is a link on their FOIA website:

When I made the suggestion to submit a FOIA - the point was to be discreet. Yes, you are correct, if the project is declassified by law they have to provide the documents - but if we actually do have inside information right now about a CLASSIFIED project - what do you think they are going to do to the person who leaked it? What do you think is going to happen to Anon? And guess what is going to happen to our information - it'll be gone for the foreseeable future. At least until they do decide to declassify it - if ever.

The POINT was to discreetly check if it was declassified without raising any flags if it ISN'T declassified.

Please everyone - do NOT start flooding them with emailed FOIA requests.

We need to be methodical about this - that was my point with my initial suggestion...

Good lord...

-rdube02

look at this man, theres a website with the serpo story on it....hundreds of hundreds of people have already read this story...even DIA personel (for entertainment or not) if they knew it was something "classfied" being leaked action would of been taken months ago. Numerous people Submitting a request..for possible Declassified material is just cause in this situation because, the story is all over the place anyway and wouldn't make a difference if people submitted or not..classified or Declassfied....but, hey it doesn't hurt to try and ask to see if it is declassfied...you never know, lol. Disclosure might be just an email away