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Project Serpo: Postings by "Anonymous" -- Breaking news?

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posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 07:28 AM
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Bill Ryan, you may have missed my earlier post with all the excitement, so I will repost my questions.

Why don't the other people that know about Project Serpo give more information? Paul McGovern gave an impressive amount of information, as well as Gene L., which was posted along with Anon’s original post. Have they already told all they know about it?

If they also knew so much about this project, why hasn't this story been made public before? Maybe it has, but did not gain notoriety until Anon started posting, but I would expect that if others knew about this story, it would have appeared on a website or a book long before Anon started posting.

Regards.




posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 07:34 AM
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Originally posted by ethanmallory
As i said before

"the cat is dead"


Not if it's Schrodinger's cat, it's not!




[edit on 18-1-2006 by Bill Ryan]



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 07:50 AM
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Originally posted by RiotComing

Originally posted by pharolitosWhat I find intriguing (assuming I read correctly) is the fact that Victor supposedly communicates with his sources using WebTV, has mentioned that emails are deleted automatically every 90 days or so right?

But if operating out of Cali, he's most likely using MS's WebTV (aka: msn tv) and they clearly state users receive over 2gb of storage to save emails, photos, etc...
www.webtv.com...

Not sure why he would say that emails get deleted, possible he's not using msntv or it's incorrectly configured...or maybe an excuse to why he can't provide them as proof.

Just a thought


Yes, this was one aspect of Bill's recent ATS podcast (great interview by the way) I found disturbing. It's so simple..surely I am missing some of the wider picture. Emails via Victor's WebTV are deleted within 96 hours. Email attachments (such as photos) are unable to be received. Well this kills the Serpo story right there. Perhaps Anonymous had all the pics ready to send, ready to go - only to be blocked by the WebTV email settings! That would be an absolute tragedy if that were the case. If I were Victor, I'd rush off to the nearest department store and get a cheap Dell, at least for the sake of saving and downloading these precious emails. If this happens to be the story of the century, surely it's worth it just to buy a half-decent pc to do the job?! Or is this just too simple and I'm missing something here? I for one surely wouldn't persist in messing around with a half-assed 'web tv' if such a hot potato fell into my hands!

Hi, RiotComing (like the name: very appropriate!)

I made sure Victor had supplied Anon with the website FTP details so that any images could be uploaded directly to the server (and anonymously, too). There would be lots of other ways round this... maildrops, intermediaries, etc. Not beyond the wit of man.

The problem is that either Anon himself was led to believe that the photos would be available, and then this turned out not to be the case (a neat way to discredit him), he's genuinely being obstructed and hassled by anti-disclosure insiders... or it's all a set-up.

The thing I'd like to ask YWNM (and any other diehard skeptic) is if this is disinformation, why promise the photos knowing they'd never appear? That alone is likely to discredit the story in the eyes of many. And disinformation is meant to be believed. That's why I predicted in my letter to Salla that if this is disinformation, then the photos WILL appear.

Re Victor's Web TV, a number of us have strongly recommended to Victor that he change his system. One person even offered to buy him a modern PC and all mod cons.

Victor is not very computer-literate (and will cheerfully admit this). For all I know, he may not know the capabilities of his own Web TV system. He's also a little resistant to change as many non-technical people are but I would imagine he's taking the points to heart. He's referred to it in private e-mails to me as his "lame-ass" Web TV, which won't even let him open and read Word attachments.

There's never been so much high-profile discussion of Web TV before!


Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 07:53 AM
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Originally posted by XL5
Hey Bill Ryan, do you think you could get anonymous to release any technical details about bismuth and how it can be made to do strange stuff (not just float in a magnetic field)? I have seen enough about bismuth to believe it can make anti-grav effects and before I go out and buy the stuff I want to know how good my chances are.

I think if any strange unknown effect was disclosed even if its not useful, it could prove somethings really going on, since it could be tested over and over. Personally, I feel disclosure with no new ET visits or new tech would not matter anyway since theres nothing you could really use, other then to say "told you so".

Yes, I know about Bismuth. But I don't think I can "get" Anonymous to do anything!

Best, Bill

[edit on 18-1-2006 by Bill Ryan]



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:17 AM
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Bill, you said "when this is a disinformation campaign, why does he promise to show pictures, when he knows, they do not exist".

Well, when you follow the whole story you might recognize, the "point" with the pictures showed up the first time, when they first people started to calling the whole think a fake, hoax (whatever).

The pictures (which we might never will see) are just a appetizer, a cliffhanger to keep the people busy, busy enough to work on the hype. Like currently, here in this forum on thread page 79.

I advise you that we all should "let the cat die". Even if the story is true, do you expect to see pictures when the discussion is hot and "they" searching for the source?

Again... people.. please

Let the cat die!



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:19 AM
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Hey people, it's 2006 and so far there has not been anymore postings on serpo.org. Does anyone else find this strange? What's up with the pics that were suppose to be posted too?

Another disappearing trick? I hope not, I hate it when you don't see the ending to a film.. so this applies here too.. let's see where this is going - hopefully it's not gone. Titor left us with so much to discuss, but this one is kinda getting dry without anymore info.

There is plenty of time between now and 2012... so let's go annonymous.. let's get posting.


[edit on 18-1-2006 by pkrska]



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:21 AM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan
The problem is that either Anon himself was led to believe that the photos would be available, and then this turned out not to be the case (a neat way to discredit him), he's genuinely being obstructed and hassled by anti-disclosure insiders... or it's all a set-up.
Best, Bill


Bill,

First, I would like to mention quickly that I believe I speak for the majority of us when I say thank you for the time and effort you are putting in working with us in this forum to evaluate and analyse this information.

I'll try to make this question quick because there are tons of postings on here and I don't want this question to get lost - I'd really like an answer to this one from you.

You mentioned a few posts back that some articles are planned by you, and I think Victor, in UFO magazine. And I think you mentioned that Victor is a journalist, correct? This raised a bright red "ALERT" flag in my mind concerning this entire episode. In my mind, if a "UFO Researcher" wants to help elevate their career, name recognition, or standing in the UFO/ET community - hypothetically they could try to create a frenzy over such a story as this, and then end it half-way through, dead in the water, just as it is now... And then, in the following months, imagine the speculation and discussions that would take place... Imagine the demand for writings, speakings, etc... from the few who had personal inside (somewhat) information. A lot of us would go from never hearing of Bill Ryan (at least those of us who don't read the periodicals on a daily basis - maybe you have been published already) - to knowing your name and who you are.

Please understand, I have great respect for the kind responses and the intelligence (not to mention great journalistic work) that you have shown here. I'm just asking you to make a case here for why you really don't stand to gain anything from this story. Because sadly, if it really does fall dead in the water at this point, and you & Victor go on to write articles and/or books, and do talks, etc.... it will reflect very very poorly on the validity of this story and on the integrity of both of you...

Again, this isn't meant as an attack, at this point I have great respect for you and what you are doing here - I'd just like a little reassurance from you on some of your history here, how you got involved, and why you have nothing to gain from this...

Thanks - I look forward to hearing your response to this...

Sincerely
rdube02



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:24 AM
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Originally posted by Hal9000
Bill Ryan, you may have missed my earlier post with all the excitement, so I will repost my questions.

Why don't the other people that know about Project Serpo give more information? Paul McGovern gave an impressive amount of information, as well as Gene L., which was posted along with Anon's original post. Have they already told all they know about it?

If they also knew so much about this project, why hasn't this story been made public before? Maybe it has, but did not gain notoriety until Anon started posting, but I would expect that if others knew about this story, it would have appeared on a website or a book long before Anon started posting.

Regards.

Sorry, Hal9000 I think this is the second time I've stood you up. It wasn't intentional!

There are persuasive reasons to believe that Paul McGovern and Gene Loscowski know a lot about Project Serpo. Paul in particular has said more about it in private e-mails to smaller cc groups which weren't intended for public sharing.

I and others have asked him specific questions but often he doesn't reply. As I understand, he's elderly and because his name is real and known (unlike Anonymous) he is clearly vulnerable. It's as if he can say so much, but then has to clam up for a while.

Again, we don't know the context in which these guys are operating. It's all consistent with a choreographed release program, with more coming out bit by bit, and with a number of people involved and fully aware of the plan. THIS is what keeps me here. If this is part of something big which is due to happen in 2006, I want to be right there in the audience.

As we know, there have been persistent low-key rumors of such an exchange program for many years. The fact that Anonymous, Paul and Gene all came out of the woodwork at the same time seems to me to mean that that was organized and planned. Maybe prior to now was judged not to be the time.. maybe now the world is ready.

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:25 AM
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edit: Thanks Bill for the reply, I posted this before I saw it. After reviewing the post from nightmare, and working toward solidifying my own theory, I think there could be an explanation for the old rumors. Maybe you can comment on the following idea.

I think it is obvious that yourworstnightmare has first hand knowledge of how disinformation is used, and I found their post quite intriguing, and hopefully we hear more from them, but I also see a few holes in it also. I also see how this information could be valuable, but the means it is obtained is highly unethical. Basically, what YWNM is telling us is that our tax dollars are being spent to pull the wool over our eyes. I know this is not that hard to believe, given recent events with the current administration. This type of thing happens all the time.

So I say, if we are paying for it, we may as well get our money's worth, right?


I just highly doubt an operation like this would get past any kind of oversight, so I find it hard to believe the entire disinfo story. I guess that is why I am still curious about Serpo. It could be as Skeptic Overlord said, maybe Anon was fooled by the story back in the 60's, has kept quiet all this time, then starts to tell what he thinks is a true story. It does smack of science fiction nomenclature of that era, along with names similar to those used in comic books. So maybe Anon's boss caught wind of his posts, and pulled him aside, and said "Um, by the way, that old story wasn't true.". And so now we don't hear from him again. I would believe that the story was made up along with documents created, and was made accessible to new DIA agents and they were told it was a true story. It may have been used to test people's integrity back in that era. If they keep their mouth shut then they passed the test.

Just some thoughts.

[edit on 1/18/2006 by Hal9000]



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:35 AM
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Originally posted by Centrist
I don't believe that Victor gave his permission, nor do I think that anyone on the list did. I can also say that I've been communicating regularly with Victor throughout the day on something unrelated to this thread and he never mentioned it.


Centrist - one question for you... Since you are the one who opened up this thread, and brought the fact of the website into this forum - I've been watching your responses closely. I do want to say that in many respects I've agreed with your opinions on this and in your analysis of the information.

However, in your recent posting, you mentioned that you've been communicating regularly with Victor throughout the day...which set off yet another red "flag" in my mind concerning this hyped-up story. If you have personal communications with Victor (one source of some of the information on the Serpo website), AND you are the one who initiated this entire thread - which is approaching 90+ pages in a few days or so....

What is your place in this whole thing? How much are you involved? The important question, I'd really appreciate if you would answer is this - How did you first become aware of the website?

Again, I appreciate your postings - you are one of those on here who seem to have their head screwed on right...I'm just trying to validate who all the true players are here... There's a lot of hype going on here, and when things get hot, it's always good to step back and take a look at the people in the crowd who were the first ones to arrive...and ask the important question - where did they come from and why?

Thanks - look forward to your response.

-rdube02



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 08:59 AM
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Originally posted by rdube02

Originally posted by Bill Ryan
The problem is that either Anon himself was led to believe that the photos would be available, and then this turned out not to be the case (a neat way to discredit him), he's genuinely being obstructed and hassled by anti-disclosure insiders... or it's all a set-up.
Best, Bill

Bill,

First, I would like to mention quickly that I believe I speak for the majority of us when I say thank you for the time and effort you are putting in working with us in this forum to evaluate and analyse this information.

I'll try to make this question quick because there are tons of postings on here and I don't want this question to get lost - I'd really like an answer to this one from you.

You mentioned a few posts back that some articles are planned by you, and I think Victor, in UFO magazine. And I think you mentioned that Victor is a journalist, correct? This raised a bright red "ALERT" flag in my mind concerning this entire episode. In my mind, if a "UFO Researcher" wants to help elevate their career, name recognition, or standing in the UFO/ET community - hypothetically they could try to create a frenzy over such a story as this, and then end it half-way through, dead in the water, just as it is now... And then, in the following months, imagine the speculation and discussions that would take place... Imagine the demand for writings, speakings, etc... from the few who had personal inside (somewhat) information. A lot of us would go from never hearing of Bill Ryan (at least those of us who don't read the periodicals on a daily basis - maybe you have been published already) - to knowing your name and who you are.

Please understand, I have great respect for the kind responses and the intelligence (not to mention great journalistic work) that you have shown here. I'm just asking you to make a case here for why you really don't stand to gain anything from this story. Because sadly, if it really does fall dead in the water at this point, and you & Victor go on to write articles and/or books, and do talks, etc.... it will reflect very very poorly on the validity of this story and on the integrity of both of you...

Again, this isn't meant as an attack, at this point I have great respect for you and what you are doing here - I'd just like a little reassurance from you on some of your history here, how you got involved, and why you have nothing to gain from this...

Thanks - I look forward to hearing your response to this...

Sincerely
rdube02

Thanks, rdube02 I appreciate your question and the way you put it. I'll answer it all as best I can.

When I got involved by creating the website in mid-November, I never imagined for a moment I'd be speaking on radio shows, writing articles, speaking at a conference (and, btw, at the conference, I'll have a film crew following me around for a major documentary)... and answering questions like this in the most prestigious discussion forum of its kind. I was just trying to help out.

None of the above opportunities have been sought out by myself. In every case I was contacted with a request, rather than vice versa. My purpose in agreeing to everything (including the invitation to join this forum) was to help spread the story in as intelligent and clear a way as possible. That's my commitment. If this is about disclosure either now or later this year, whatever role the Serpo story may play in that I want to help enable it to happen.

I've not received a penny from any of this not even expenses of any kind. I fund the website myself ($50 per month) and there's no payment for the article in UFO Magazine that I'm aware of. I'm pretty tired and have been operating on five hours sleep a night for several weeks now. But that's not a complaint I'm choosing to do this.

It's impacted on my life in major ways, as you might imagine, but I've also made new friends, learned a huge amount, had some new experiences, and believe I'm helping make the world a better place. All that makes it well worth while. And if all this oils the wheels of full disclosure, then I'll be proud to have been a small part of that.

I'm an idealist and have been al my life. I'm a mountaineer, and am used to taking controlled risks and thinking quickly on my feet in tricky situations. I also work with people and am used to handling groups, and I've also done some writing. I'm reasonably bright and have a background in science. I've been interested in UFOs and the paranormal all my life (and have had some intriguing experiences of my own) and so what's happening here is for me a kind of culmination of this, an unplanned opportunity to bring what skills I have to bear on an important problem for the benefit of all... if I can.

My feeling is that we can't lose... even if the Serpo story is disinformation (which, don't forget, does not mean a hoax it means it's partly but not entirely true). We'll all have learned a lot more, and there will have been many benefits along the way... including, as I mentioned, the possibilty of helping pave the way for full disclosure later.

The question of money is a moot one. It's certainly not why I'm doing this. If some rich benefactor offered to fund my work, I'd not turn it down because that'd help me pay the bills and work on this full-time, and I think I'm doing a reasonable job. But I have no commercial agenda.

If I ever did write a book, it'd only be because I enjoy writing and I'd rather trust myself to do it than anyone else... although I'm well aware of how people would cry foul if it were to be perceived that I was in any way taking financial advantage of my role. Meanwhile, now and as always in my life, I'm assuming that it'll all work out okay somehow... it usually does.


Best, Bill

[edit on 18-1-2006 by Bill Ryan]



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:11 AM
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Bill Ryan

Thanks for your valuable input here. I have been following this since page 1, and am still intrigued!

I am just wondering where we are as of now....have you had any reply from the retired Col?

Has Victor heard from any of the significant players? Have you or anyone else connected to this had any new threats against your selves?

Some members bring up good points here, ie, the webtv and the loss of all the original anon mails. I suggest you ask Victor to send all further correspondence to yourself as backup.

Anyway, I will give this as long as it takes to prove or disprove this, keep up the good work folks!



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:20 AM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan

Originally posted by ethanmallory
As i said before

"the cat is dead"


Not if it's Schrodinger's cat, it's not!


Hi guys,

well if the cat is dead?? We have only another eight lives worth to enjoy of this fantastic story (true or otherwise). ;-]*

I have thoroughly enjoyed the material Bill has brought to the table and can only applaud him on the size of his balls and for getting them out and showing the world. I hope the faith that Bill has put in Victor and Anon. is repaid and he gets his just rewards whether this is proved fake or not. Afterall the mistake to make would be to bury this story for fear of reprisal or ridicule, so hats off to you Bill!

yourworstnightmare makes many obvious but valid points, but for me he fails to be convincing for one reason alone; should the powers that be want to convince us that this whole story is pure and utter fabrication they would do so surreptitiously.

Manipulation or confrontation? Seems to me that if they had been reading posts and keeping up to speed with ATS member's take on Serpo they would see a more than healthy level of skepticism; so why the ham-fisted threatening overtures?? Maybe, just maybe, its not Bill's leaking of the story to the world and ATS that is under attack but ATS itself. Wouldn't be the first time disgruntled or jealous parties have attepted to gatecrash 'the party'. No-one should be allowed to stifle debate and for that reason alone I find yourworstnightmare's behaviour and post quite reprehensible.

I'm delighted to have Serpo linked with my favourite two sci-fi movies of all-time; Close Encounters of the Third Kind got me into the whole Alien debate and Contact was the perfect follow up to CE3. Maybe we are seeing the birth of the next step in a possible trilogy, afterall best ones always come in threes.

So for me, true or not, please keep it coming Bill (contact willing).

Best Wishes

J



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan
I'm an idealist and have been al my life. I'm a mountaineer, and am used to taking controlled risks and thinking quickly on my feet in tricky situations. I also work with people and am used to handling groups, and I've also done some writing. I'm reasonably bright and have a background in science. I've been interested in UFOs and the paranormal all my life (and have had some intriguing experiences of my own) and so what's happening here is for me a kind of culmination of this, an unplanned opportunity to bring what skills I have to bear on an important problem for the benefit of all... if I can.
[edit on 18-1-2006 by Bill Ryan]


Bill - thanks for the great response. I does show a lot about you. I am a fellow mountaineer as well, and you are absolutely showing here in the forum the kind of dedication and persistance you have to have in mountaineering. Kudos to you there.

My major concern wasn't so much the financial aspect, as the fame that can come along with being involved with a hyped up story like this. Many writers in the UFO field almost tend to try to one-up eachother with the stories they "uncover", in order to gain more notariety than the next guy. You said you have background in science, so does that mean your "day job" is in science and not in journalism or writing?

By the way - $50/month seems high for web hosting... I pay something like $129/yr... You might want to shop around... *laugh* Just to help you out - I use webmasters.com - in case you wanted to save a little cash...

It's more the notariety thing that bothers me about all of this...although I have yet to see anything from you that warrents distrust to this point, so I back your work 100% and should disclosure happen as soon as 2006 - we'll all be better off for it, and it will absolutely be in large part to the work you have done here. So thank you for that.

Sincerely,
rdube02



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:31 AM
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Not sure if this has been asked yet, and I'm not going through 79 damn thread's to find out!


Anyway's... If all this is true, why hasn't the government shut down the site and had you silenced? Is the government allowing this release of information? If so, why have you get the information and release rather then them making an official statement on national television? If it isn't being allowed, has any threat's been made against you? Anything out of the ordinary going on?

Really seem's odd to me that the government wanted to keep this a secret but is allowing you to release this information.



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by Produkt

Anyway's... If all this is true, why hasn't the government shut down the site and had you silenced?

Really seem's odd to me that the government wanted to keep this a secret but is allowing you to release this information.


My take on this is that anything the gov would do, like silence any of the players or take down the website would only serve to lend more validity to the information on the site.

I hope we see pics...maybe the gov is waiting to see what pics are released before taking action, I mean, if they are genuine, then I have a feeling they won't last long in the public domain.



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 09:50 AM
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Yes, but as noted on the site, the exchange people were closely watched till death. So wouldn't you assume anyone associated with the project would be just as closely watched as well? I mean... it's a big story, important if true. If the government wanted to keep it secret, they would have been watching everyone associated witht the project and I would guess would've found out about this website before anyone of us. Shutting it down before it sunk into people's memories.

I remember seeing once when we were just starting to find out about extra solar planet's. I saw one university site's listing's showed a planet around zeta reticuli, the next day it was gone. Haven't ever seen any other mention of it since, I've asked around, no one else has seen it. I just can't find it again. I didn't think at the time to download the site to my hard drive. But I do know what I saw.



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 10:03 AM
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Its all ready over..

The DIA hits are because the project name is real.

The "data" is all wrong though

The whole scope of what the project really is, is completely false.

Serpo.org is not a Goverment creation or attempt at Disinformation, while at the same time it is disinformation, just was not created or funded by the Goverment.

You will not see the pictures.

There are 4 people really behind the creation of "PROJECT SERPO, the EBEN's"

The Goverment is interested in finding the leak of the project name or determining if it was just coincidence. Thus the multiple reviews and gleaning of posts to determine if any classified information has been leaked that could compromise the "project".

It fits the hype model to discuss the "secret pictures" and then to not have them, resulting in this ferver over what happened. Who is Anon, why is he not posting.

You all have verified this model.



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by celticniall

Originally posted by Produkt

Anyway's... If all this is true, why hasn't the government shut down the site and had you silenced?

Really seem's odd to me that the government wanted to keep this a secret but is allowing you to release this information.


My take on this is that anything the gov would do, like silence any of the players or take down the website would only serve to lend more validity to the information on the site.

I hope we see pics...maybe the gov is waiting to see what pics are released before taking action, I mean, if they are genuine, then I have a feeling they won't last long in the public domain.

The other take on this is that I may be doing just what someone hoped would happen. They may have left the ball there to see if anyone would pick it up and run with it. That would help them see the level of public interest/ enthusiasm/skepticism, and then help them make further decisions about where to go next.

That hypothesis depends on it being an orchestrated release, of course. It could be that, it could be a lone maverick who is being helped and encouraged (by some but not by others), or it could be an extremely clever disinfo campaign.

The possibility of the Powers that Be taking action against me was what made me decide to hide in the open. As Phil Schneider said, if I commit suicide, it'll be murder. I have no intention of doing anything other than keeping going... you heard it here first.

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 18 2006 @ 10:08 AM
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Originally posted by robertfenix
There are 4 people really behind the creation of "PROJECT SERPO, the EBEN's"

Hi, robertfenix I'm not sure what you're saying here. Who are the four people?

Best, Bill




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