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Project Serpo: Postings by "Anonymous" -- Breaking news?

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posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 01:50 PM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan
(Shawnna, to your earlier question: this was from Washington DC).


Best, Bill


Thank you VERY much, Bill! Glad you're still hanging in there! I, for one, am patiently waiting for whatever may come next. Your open, honest response to some of the harsher posters here who seem to have jumped to their own conclusions is admirable!


[edit on 12-1-2006 by Shawnna]




posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 02:43 PM
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Bill, again thanx you for your patience with us, kindly look at my questions below and thanx for all the previous answers. Must be frustrating to you as well being only a "willing" messenger.


Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Actually, I have that question myself. As with many lists, there is an active minority and a larger, slightly more silent majority. Some people have never said what they think, but have just been asking questions and adding value in various ways. So I'm currently conducting a poll asking them what they consider to be the % accuracy of the claims, and what is their personal favored hypothesis. Best wishes, Bill

Q1. What was your poll results?


Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Within this group, remember that "Anonymous" is actually three people (85%, 13% and 2%). Victor knows the addresses (but not identities) of the 85% and 13%, but the 2% is a "ghost" with a "dia.mil" address which automatically erases itself each time. We understand that this is a standard computer-generated system for sending untraceable one-way messages.
and

Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Anon doesn't always respond to questions, as you've already guessed... although he always might. He's away now till 2 January, when Victor will send him a whole raft of stuff to consider. I'm wary of overloading him. Best, Bill


Q2) It's 10 days since 2 Jan....do I understand it correctly, Victor gets info from three sources (?), does Victor poses his questions to the two known email addresses or only to the 85% contributor?

Q3. The 2% contributing "ghost", how does Victor know he/she/they are part of the Anonymous group? If not, does Victor check with chief Anon that the "ghosts" contribution is authentic?


Originally posted by Bill Ryan I'm not convinced anyone else does either, on Victor's list, which has a fair number of astrophysicists on board.
Best, Bill


Q4. Do you perhaps know if some of the other "Victor's list" members are (new?) members here on ATS and are contributing here?


Originally posted by Bill Ryan
We are told that the "DIA-6" have a superior who is overseeing this all. Forgive me for being enigmatic (and I can't enlarge on this) but we do have evidence that this person does actually exist inasmuch as a problematic situation arose in which he said, through Anonymous through Victor, that he would intervene on our behalf. The situation was indeed handled completely with no other action being required.


Q5. Is it possible to elaborate a bit on this statement by yourself, please - I am a bit confused as to what you are actually saying here.

Q6. What chance do we have to get Victor to answer our ATS questions directly, here? Can you ask him please? :
:



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 02:58 PM
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Originally posted by Centrist
Also, once you get to know Victor, you'll find that he's a journalist.


[Emphasis added.]


Thank you.

I didn't know that (and was about to query Mr. Ryan for more details...).


Perhaps my instincts weren't that far off, afterall?


Do we know anything about how Victor could have become "Anon"'s "trusted journalist"?

And forgive me if I missed this somewhere, but how did "Anon" get on Victor's list in the first place?


Any knowledge?


Regards,

Serpentime

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Serpentime]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 03:31 PM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan
The Ebens did have their name for their planet: Sieu. We're told that came from EBE–1.


This information orginates from "Exempt from Disclosure". I'm not sure that everyone here has read the book, but I sense some confusion starting to set in...


To the best of my understanding, the planet Mr. Doty described (featured on the Serpo.org "Consistencies" page) is not Sieu...

According to the account, EBE-1 allegedly did identify his home world as "Sieu", the fourth planet orbiting Zeta 2 Reticuli.

But the being Mr. Doty claimed to have viewed on closed-circuit television (3/5/1983), was a different individual altogether, who identified his planet as the third world orbiting Zeta 1 Reticuli.


If I am correct, Zeta "One-Ret-Three" is the 'Serpo-similar' world we are all envisioning.


If Mr. Doty is correct, "Sieu" is a second planet entirely...



Serpentime




[edit on 12-1-2006 by Serpentime]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:01 PM
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Originally posted by Serpentime

Do we know anything about how Victor could have become "Anon"'s "trusted journalist"?


I understand the he "lurked" on Victor's list for a few months before (and I don't know much about this part) contacting Victor about his story.


And forgive me if I missed this somewhere, but how did "Anon" get on Victor's list in the first place?


I've wondered that myself.

Bill? Any insight?



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:27 PM
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Originally posted by rdube02
Bill,

I sent an email to the email link listed on the Serpo site with this question, but haven't received a response from you. I was pleased to discover that you are responding to questions here in this forum, so I'd like to post my question to you here:

I've been following this story since late November and agree with what many here have said - this is an interesting tale.

My question is this, and will require speculation on your part somewhat I guess, but wouldn't you think that if the government was interested in finally disclosing a project of this nature, that top government officials would provide interviews with leading news organizations and just lay out the entire story to the American public? Or wouldn't the president give a national address and provide a sense of national unity to an issue like this - saying something to the American people that maybe the time has come where the country is ready to come to terms with what we know about the universe and our neighbors?

All of this is based on the assumption that the government does feel we are now ready to know this information and is providing this disclosure at this time. The method of providing piecemeal information over the course of months, on a web page - information that gets disseminated by essentially just the UFO community, most of which are already considered "loonies" by the population at large (sorry - hope no one takes offense to that) - seems illogical, immature, and just plain silly....

Maybe I'm being naive here - I can accept that - but I would think if the government wanted true disclosure or wanted to get a sense of how the public would respond to pieces of this story - they would release pieces of this story to the news media and then watch for a NATIONAL reaction - not just a reaction in the much smaller UFO/Alien investigative community.

I'm not saying I don't believe the story - I love the story. I love the idea of 12 military/scientists exploring an alien planet in the mid 60's and I actually am hoping that it is true and eventually makes it into the media for full disclosure. But I find the method of disclosure small-minded and silly at the moment... What's you're take on this?

With best Regards,
-rdube02



Hi, rdube02 –

My apologies for not having yet answered your message to the website contact form. I've had 761 messages so far, and am quite a long way behind in answering them.

You ask: if the government was interested in finally disclosing a project of this nature, that top government officials would provide interviews with leading news organizations and just lay out the entire story to the American public? Or wouldn't the president give a national address and provide a sense of national unity to an issue like this - saying something to the American people that maybe the time has come where the country is ready to come to terms with what we know about the universe and our neighbors?

I don't think it's as simple as that, I'm afraid:

1) It's generally accepted among researchers that there are different factions within the USG intelligence community... some of whom favour disclosure and some who don't;

2) Many researchers would argue (in my view correctly) that the President doesn't really run the show, and is much more of a "puppet" figure.

Bearing that in mind, the idea of the President suddenly deciding to call a news conference to put the record straight becomes a little more unlikely. Remember Jimmy Carter, who had a personal interest in UFOs and who promised, before he was elected, that he would release UFO data to the public? When in office, that never happened. The issue was not in his control.

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:29 PM
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Has anyone seen Victor's list. I would like to see it. How many names are on it?



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:30 PM
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Originally posted by Centrist

Originally posted by Serpentime

Do we know anything about how Victor could have become "Anon"'s "trusted journalist"?


I understand the he "lurked" on Victor's list for a few months before (and I don't know much about this part) contacting Victor about his story.


And forgive me if I missed this somewhere, but how did "Anon" get on Victor's list in the first place?


I've wondered that myself.

Bill? Any insight?


Can't add any more, I'm afraid... that's all I know myself.

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by Serpentime

Originally posted by Bill Ryan
The Ebens did have their name for their planet: Sieu. We're told that came from EBE–1.


This information orginates from "Exempt from Disclosure". I'm not sure that everyone here has read the book, but I sense some confusion starting to set in...

To the best of my understanding, the planet Mr. Doty described (featured on the Serpo.org "Consistencies" page) is not Sieu...

According to the account, EBE-1 allegedly did identify his home world as "Sieu", the fourth planet orbiting Zeta 2 Reticuli.

But the being Mr. Doty claimed to have viewed on closed-circuit television (3/5/1983), was a different individual altogether, who identified his planet as the third world orbiting Zeta 1 Reticuli.

If I am correct, Zeta "One-Ret-Three" is the 'Serpo-similar' world we are all envisioning.

If Mr. Doty is correct, "Sieu" is a second planet entirely...


Hi, Serpentime – your points are all taken. But one of the problems is that there are similarities between Anon's account and the EBE–2 interview, reported EBE–1 data, etc – but there are also components which don't exactly match. So it's a little hard to know (in my view) whether they're referring to the same planet... or not.

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 04:45 PM
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Originally posted by Centrist
Also, once you get to know Victor, you'll find that he's a journalist.


Victor was initially trained in journalism and PR, but has been a LA-based English teacher for many years now. But those who have seen his posts to his list, which have a fairly distinctive style, will see that his journalism training still shines through.

Best, Bill

[edit on 12-1-2006 by Bill Ryan]



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 05:00 PM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan

Hi, Serpentime – your points are all taken. But one of the problems is that there are similarities between Anon's account and the EBE–2 interview, reported EBE–1 data, etc – but there are also components which don't exactly match. So it's a little hard to know (in my view) whether they're referring to the same planet... or not.



I understand.

The name "Sieu" originated from Doty, and I just wanted to clarify Doty's statements for those here who were not aware...


[And I do wish we knew more about the nature of "Anon" and Victor's aquaintance... (Thanks, Centrist.)]



Serpentime



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 05:05 PM
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Originally posted by Bill Ryan


Victor was initially trained in journalism and PR, but has been a LA-based English teacher for many years now.


Ohhh...

I get it now.


Thanks for clearing that up.



Serpentime



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by Jeddyhi
Has anyone seen Victor's list. I would like to see it. How many names are on it?


I've seen a list from pre-november which only contained a few dozen names, but this figure has now gone up to over 220.



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by jgbjgb

Q1. What was your poll results?

Very varied. Opinion of proportion of truth varied from 0% to 100%. Basically there were two clusters: one cluster which was 0–25%, and another (exactly balancing) cluster which was 75%–100%. The mean was almost exactly 50%... which actually means nothing at all: like having your head in the oven and your feet in the fridge and claiming that you're at the perfect temperature.

The only thing to conclude is that there was not enough data for people to conclude anything logically and that people's feelings and intuitions were being called into play to make their judgments for them. (Nothing wrong with that, except that we're still short of proof enough with which to go to the NY Times.)



Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Within this group, remember that "Anonymous" is actually three people (85%, 13% and 2%). Victor knows the addresses (but not identities) of the 85% and 13%, but the 2% is a "ghost" with a "dia.mil" address which automatically erases itself each time. We understand that this is a standard computer-generated system for sending untraceable one-way messages.
and

Originally posted by Bill Ryan
Anon doesn't always respond to questions, as you've already guessed... although he always might. He's away now till 2 January, when Victor will send him a whole raft of stuff to consider. I'm wary of overloading him. Best, Bill


Q2) It's 10 days since 2 Jan....do I understand it correctly, Victor gets info from three sources (?), does Victor poses his questions to the two known email addresses or only to the 85% contributor?

This is a very good question. Yes, I believe Victor poses his questions to the "85%" Anonymous.


Q3. The 2% contributing "ghost", how does Victor know he/she/they are part of the Anonymous group? If not, does Victor check with chief Anon that the "ghosts" contribution is authentic?

Another very good question. I can only presume that Victor is assuming that the kind of data presented by the 2% ghost is of such a nature that it declares itself to be the real deal. But I don't know which components of data in the posts come from which of the three sources.

Q4. Do you perhaps know if some of the other "Victor's list" members are (new?) members here on ATS and are contributing here?

If there are members of Victor's list here on ATS, it's probably best that they decide themselves whether to reveal themselves or not rather than my doing that for them.



Originally posted by Bill Ryan
We are told that the "DIA-6" have a superior who is overseeing this all. Forgive me for being enigmatic (and I can't enlarge on this) but we do have evidence that this person does actually exist inasmuch as a problematic situation arose in which he said, through Anonymous through Victor, that he would intervene on our behalf. The situation was indeed handled completely with no other action being required.


Q5. Is it possible to elaborate a bit on this statement by yourself, please - I am a bit confused as to what you are actually saying here.

The "threat" I alluded to seemed to have been handled by Anon's superior... it went away without our doing anything about it, after Anon had promised to get it handled.

Q6. What chance do we have to get Victor to answer our ATS questions directly, here? Can you ask him please? :
:

I suspect this would be highly unlikely. You'd be welcome to ask him yourself...!

Best, Bill



posted on Jan, 12 2006 @ 05:28 PM
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The point about 2 factions within the USG Intel community 'fighting' over disclosure seems to be one of the more interesing aspects of this story to me.

(Not that visits to Alien worlds doesn't).

How do we know that this battle over disclosure is actually happening?

Is "Anon" the only source for this? Do respected UFOlogists on Victors list have corroborating information from parties *unrelated* to the SERPO story about this split. (Other than R. Doty that is, once a disinfo guy, always an unreliable source IMO).

The reason I find this aspect most interesting is that one thing recent mainstream media stories about the NSA spying have displayed is that when parties within these agencies decide to leak stuff it doesn't seem *that* hard for them to do so, at least when they themselves don't consider the information they are leaking to be damaging to national security.

Which leaves us with another question, if factions exist which *still* don't want disclosure to happen then does it not suggest, that if such a split is true, then there is at least a possibility that there *is* still a national security aspect to this that we're missing, and if so what is it?

BTW: Thanks Bill, fascinating story whatever it may or not lead to.

Anglo.



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 01:23 AM
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About the problems with time keeping the team had.


Space and Time are inversely proportional. Hence the term Space-Time.

This means that the faster you move the slower time moves. This is Eienstien's reletivity.


Every planet in the universe moves at differnt speeds reletive to absolute zero.


From these facts we can say that every planet has its own "Planetary Time"

Also if this planet in question has a very eliptical orbit then time would go faster as the planet moves away from the suns and then time would speed up as the planet moves in to the sun on its orbit. But this is a very small change in time due to the speeds of orbiting planets. But the change is still there.


Maybe this difference of Space-time, from thier planet to ours caused this problem.



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 02:16 AM
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Bill Ryan, do you have questions for us, the masses? I'd love to take a crack (and I'm sure others) Digging, into your very own questions about the situation.



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 10:21 AM
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Xare:

That's 'relative to the observer'...

A person on a speeding spaceship (nearing the speed of light) would not notice any changes within the space ship, wristwatch still ticks away just like always. If they looked outside of their spaceship, it would seem that the people on Earth were a blur of activity, moving at a highly accelerated rate.

The people on Earth wristwatches would still be ticking away just like always, but if they look into the spaceship, it would seem that time had slowed to almost a standstill...

Both groups cannot notice any measurable differences in time, it is only when they compare it to something relative to them (something outside their space/time frame) that discrepancies arise...

rock on
twj

[edit on 13-1-2006 by torbjon]



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by anglodragon

Which leaves us with another question, if factions exist which *still* don't want disclosure to happen then does it not suggest, that if such a split is true, then there is at least a possibility that there *is* still a national security aspect to this that we're missing, and if so what is it?

BTW: Thanks Bill, fascinating story whatever it may or not lead to.

Anglo.


------------------------------

Thanks Anglo - that's the first question that entered my mind after reading Bill's great response. I can absolutely imagine the reality of two factions developing over time within the intel community regarding disclosure/non-disclosure. However, from what we've seen with the most recent intel leaks regarding Ms. Plume's CIA work - when someone wants to leak information, the information gets leaked - to the NATIONAL news media - not some website or even to some small independant news organization.

The reason I have some slight distrust for this story is the method they are using to disclose information. Maybe the president is out of the loop - that's believable. However if the intel group who wants disclosure is now moving forward with disclosure - I would think they would leak the information to the national media - not some website.

However - you bring up an excellent point Anglo. The issue of national security. Intentional leaks can be criminal if they affect national security (whatever the definition truly is of "national security" is debateable though). But, my answer to that would be that Anon and fellow intel people involved in this have obviously already decided to release the information to a website - so the issue of national security must already have been decided. So why are they hiding from the media? Why not just leak the information directly to the media - why all of these theatrics with a small-scale website? It just doesn't make sense to me...

Thanks Bill for your time, and for your thoughtful comments. You seem to me to be truly on the up-and-up here, and I know we all appreciate the work you are putting into this. Hopefully you (and maybe even "Victor", whoever he/she is) are not having a fast one pulled over on you with this story.

I know there are MANY of us looking forward to the next installment with a cautious open mind and a healthy critical eye, and particularly looking forward to the photos - which will go a long way in proving the authenticity of these claims.

Best Regards,
rdubeo2



posted on Jan, 13 2006 @ 11:28 AM
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Originally posted by torbjon
Xare:

That's 'relative to the observer'...

[edit on 13-1-2006 by torbjon]


Actually Xare is right. The more massive a planet is, the more it will twist and bend space. Which effects time. The faster a planet spins and the faster a planet orbits... also effects time realtive to our earth time. Therefore time on different planets in different solar systems, or even planets within our own solar system.... do differ in relative time... although while on the planet it would feel as if the time is passing the same as it did here on Earth.

[edit on 13-1-2006 by dgoodpasture]

[edit on 13-1-2006 by dgoodpasture]



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