J. Edgar Hoover mentions Roswell Disc

The MJ-12 papers include the following mention of a recovered disk in Louisiana --

1953 at least 10 more crashed alien disks were recovered along with 26 dead and 4 live aliens. Of the 10, 4 were found in Arizona, 2 in Texas, 1 in New Mexico, 1 in Louisiana, 1 in Montana, and 1 in South Africa.

However, that recovery occured after the date of the Ladd/Tolson memo (1947), so Hoover could not have been referring to the crashed alien disk that Bob Lazar alleges was recovered in Louisiana. Nevertheless, I found another document that suggests that Louisiana is, most likely, where Hoover was referring to.

In the FOIA documents on the FBI website I located a teletype message dated July 7, 1947 that confirms that the Army recovered a disk in Shreveport, La on that date. That may have been the reason for Hoover's comment on the memo he reviewed just a week later.

While it's perfectly conceivable that this irked Hoover because he may have felt that the FBI should have had access to evidence, despite it being hoax, to see it it contained clues as to the perpetrator of the hoax. Looking at it from the perspective of a law enforcement-minded individual, this makes sense. He's looking for someone to catch, not aliens.

It's odd, however, that he chose to refer to it as "the La incident", rather than refer to Shreveport or that it was a hoax, but not completely surprising. I'm still not completely sold on this interpretation, but reading through the FOIA documents chronologically shows that there were a great many hoaxes going on at the time -- it had probably become a curiosity in pop culture and everyone was playing the UFO gag on each other. Hoover didn't seem to have much sense of humor about such things.

It's also interesting that this memo occured at exactly the time of the Roswell incident. Had UFO pranks become such a fascination that the actual crash of a disk at Roswell was so easily dismissed as just another prank? Or was the mindset at the time that that recovery of such a disk was inevitable, leaving an indelible mark on history that falsely suggests that a disk was actually recovered when, in reality, an overzealous Army officer released that famous statement?

Originally posted by Centrist

1953 at least 10 more crashed alien disks were recovered along with 26 dead and 4 live aliens. Of the 10, 4 were found in Arizona, 2 in Texas, 1 in New Mexico, 1 in Louisiana, 1 in Montana, and 1 in South Africa.

Incredible, all these flying disc crashing, and I thought they would be an advanced race... or something like that...

By the way, I like your Churchill qoute!

According to William Cooper, the reason behind so many disks crashing was because they were defensless against radar, which somehow affected their aircraft causing them to malfunction. He said that once the government figured this out they starting aiming it at them, intentionally destroying their craft.

Originally posted by StarChild
According to William Cooper, the reason behind so many disks crashing was because they were defensless against radar, which somehow affected their aircraft causing them to malfunction. He said that once the government figured this out they starting aiming it at them, intentionally destroying their craft.

Now that is an interesting conclusion!

I've been browsing the pages and found a follow-up memo to the one talked about here. In this memo, Hoovers words are typed and placed in quotes. The memo discusses the Air Force's agreement to Hovver's terms.

foia.fbi.gov...

The memo can be found on page 38 of the link.

EDIT:

Also, there is another memo that talks about the army recovering a flying disc in Hollywood. This disk was said to be about 20 inches around with a radio antennae sticking out the top of it. It was said by the army to be impossible to fly under its own power. Could this be the 'la disc' Hoover said was not released to the FBI?

After reading through the first page of the UFO files, it would seem that many 'discs' were found, but most seem to be radio controlled and very terrestrial.

I wouldn't get too excited, and I would say that in this context, Hoover did not mean an alien craft at all in his writting, but possibly this radio-controlled mini-disc.

[edit on 26-1-2006 by Enrikez]

"The memo can be found on page 38 of the link. " == Enrikez

Also note the typed version can be considered confirmation that the La. reference
is for abbreviating of the State. These documents are incredible "context" references for
the times in question. I have been wading thru them for over six months and I always pick up
something new. For instance, the routing stamp at the top right of your page 38 reference.
I also missed the insite into General Schulgen's personal opinion in the bottom paragraph of
that page last time thru. If it were needed it simply would help put another nail into the coffin of the
old Schulgen Memo Hoax.

For those that have not done so yet, the total pdf file size for ALL 16 archives is 89,400 Kb.
Thats a LOT of reading material. And also a LOT of hoaxes out there in those days.

(edit to correct Kb size)

[edit on 27-1-2006 by nightwing]

FWIW, I believe the disc Centrist refers to can be found on page 4 of the above linked pdf file. It isn't anything extraterrestrial, according to the document at least--similar to the one found in Hollywood.

Also, page 5 of the above document has the Roswell incident; it seems they're going with the weather balloon/MOGUL argument prelude there.

Maybe Hoover is just talking about the Army "grabbing" some Hoaxed disk and not letting the FBI see it.

Is it just coincidence that Hoover o.k.'s an operation to spy on the Army?

www.airforcehistory.hq.af.mil...

During the late 1940s, the Army began testing captured, German V-2 missiles at White Sands, New Mexico. The question was asked of General Watson, "What's the Army doing at White Sands?" Since the question came from a high level, he decided to find out. To gather the information, General Watson decided to see what information could be obtained using electronic surveillance. After getting his plan approved by J. Edgar Hoover, the Federal Bureau of Investigation director, and General Nathan Twining, the Air Force Chief of Staff, General Watson put a crew in a hotel in Alamogordo, New Mexico, near the White Sands missile range to spy on the Army. This was the start of electronics intelligence (ELINT) as a concerted effort in the Air Force.

With regards to the hand written note of hoover, there is something that has been missed. "The 1945 SA Crash" The letter is not L, but S. Hoover may be referring to the crash near San Antonio New Mexico in 1945, where the army recovered the craft, and left it setting on the "low boy" ungarded, long enough for the two boys to rip off some parts. Please check this out on: Wendelle Stevens website, go to utube aztec file#23. Also google Reme Baca, Jose Padilla 1945 ufo encounter San Antonio New Mexico

Thanks

Originally posted by William One Sac
Excellent find.

It really gives food for thought. Who knew what? I am sure that the information is much more compartmentalized today than it was 50 years ago.

Agree 100%

I believe it was Porter Goss who recently said the govt over-classifies far too much information. I think high level government leadership on the UFO issue
still existed during the Truman/Eisenhower administrations, but the security protocols today are such that UFO programs are virtually shadow entities with no accountability. They likely operate under a corporate profit motive instead of high govt ideals.

Can't believe I didn't use this to bolster my Roswell or Battle of LA threads...I know I must have seen it, as I read those documents till I was blue in the face, hehe... Good pointing it out!

However, there is also another FBI FOIA document that bolsters the Mogul explanation, though it's highly possible it's planted disinfo. Look for other FBI docs in that same area of the site around the same date. They don't call it Mogul, but the document does describe a RAWIN target in shape and configuration, such as used in Mogul. It's completely inconsistent though, with other accounts, including the military's, so that's why it's high on my "suspected disinfo" list.

In any case, the doc you reference certainly points to the FBI being out of the loop when it came to this subject, and Hoover not being happy about it....