I'm so fed up with hearing about what the CIA, & Military Intel. is doing to these terrorist. When the CIA cuts one of their heads off in front of a camera... Then i'll think about being outraged. Until then.... I personally think the Cowards deserve what they get.

LoL, I was talking to my grandfather about this and he told me he got harder treatment at school by his teachers, then what the terrorist are getting by the CIA. And I have to say, he does have a pint.

"he does have a pint."
Well now that clears that up cause after a pint of whiskey i start talking bout back in the vietnam.......


Anyways how about getting nailed into a cross and stabbed with a neddles all over your body and then pouring clorox bleach on the wounds and then start the hammering torture-where you take their hand and slowly smash the finger from top to bottom and then going on slowly breaking the hand up the arm....burn their feet with a small flame until all the skins melted and then finally have them suffer until almost dead and then just force a grenade in their mouth and pull the pin. This scenerio would we worse than the cia has done that we know of.

Originally posted by call1
I'm so fed up with hearing about what the CIA, & Military Intel. is doing to these terrorist. When the CIA cuts one of their heads off in front of a camera... Then i'll think about being outraged. Until then.... I personally think the Cowards deserve what they get.

Well if you really believe that terrorists actually did that then I'd agree with you.
BUT have you actualy looked at the vids of those events?
About as real as terrorists flying planes into the WTC buildings
Or santa coming down your chimney...

Originally posted by watch_the_rocks
Also, Ive read about some sort of 'sensory-deprivation' tank, where they undress you, oil you down, and stick you in a big water tank. Apparently, you can't see, hear, feel or smell anything at all, and your brain desprately tries to create anything to keep you sane. Any more info on this, anyone?

this was taken from the tom clancy book "kardinal of the kremlin." i've never heard of anything like this real-world.

Originally posted by Vajrayana
A source for watch_the_rocks thread.

"They would not let you rest, day or night. Stand up, sit down, stand up, sit down. Don't sleep. Don't lie on the floor," one prisoner said through a translator. The detainees were also forced to listen to rap artist Eminem's "Slim Shady" album. The music was so foreign to them it made them frantic, sources said.

Contacted after the completion of the ABC News investigation, CIA officials would neither confirm nor deny the accounts. They simply declined to comment.

The CIA sources described a list of six "Enhanced Interrogation Techniques" instituted in mid-March 2002 and used, they said, on a dozen top al Qaeda targets incarcerated in isolation at secret locations on military bases in regions from Asia to Eastern Europe. According to the sources, only a handful of CIA interrogators are trained and authorized to use the techniques:

1.The Attention Grab: The interrogator forcefully grabs the shirt front of the prisoner and shakes him.

2.Attention Slap: An open-handed slap aimed at causing pain and triggering fear.

3.The Belly Slap: A hard open-handed slap to the stomach. The aim is to cause pain, but not internal injury. Doctors consulted advised against using a punch, which could cause lasting internal damage.

4.Long Time Standing: This technique is described as among the most effective. Prisoners are forced to stand, handcuffed and with their feet shackled to an eye bolt in the floor for more than 40 hours. Exhaustion and sleep deprivation are effective in yielding confessions.

5.The Cold Cell: The prisoner is left to stand naked in a cell kept near 50 degrees. Throughout the time in the cell the prisoner is doused with cold water.

6.Water Boarding: The prisoner is bound to an inclined board, feet raised and head slightly below the feet. Cellophane is wrapped over the prisoner's face and water is poured over him. Unavoidably, the gag reflex kicks in and a terrifying fear of drowning leads to almost instant pleas to bring the treatment to a halt.

i take it not many of you have been in the military. numbers 1,2, and 3 are standard for all branches, and 4, 5 and 6, along with many other techniques, are used during survival training for pilots and special forces. its called breaking them down in order to build them back up the way you want them.

so, if its ok to treat our own men and women in this fashion in order to get them ready for the rigors of real world combat, why is it so horrible to use these same tactics in order to extract information from prisoners?

its seems to me that the liberal media is calling any treatment that extracts information from prisoners torture. maybe they should spend a few days in a turkish prison or chinese detention camp before they decide that these kinds of practices should be included under the description of torture.

[edit on 20-11-2005 by snafu7700]

[edit on 20-11-2005 by snafu7700]

Originally posted by ANOK
Have you ever been to any of these nations you claim are worse than our prison camps? There's about 200 of them youknow?
People always assume, or just convince themselves, that what we do can't be any worse than what "they" do.

Like I said, my uncle was CIA, and he would have been the guy implementing/overseeing these "tortures".

As he said, perhaps the most effective way of extracting information was to do nothing but plant the idea that the prisoners would be shipped to nations like Jordan and Saudi Arabia if they didn't talk. After doing this far in advance, they would bring in some one with a Jordanian accent to "pick out prisoners". From what he told me, it seemed that these people would do just about anything including tell everything they know in order to stay in US prisons. I think that would indicate which prisons the actual prisoners prefered.

His thoughts were that the US, while it made life very uncomfortable for it's prisoners, did not come close to the cruelty of most other nations he worked with. That was his proffesional opinion based on actual field experience, unlike you and I who are simply speculating.

I pointed out that sleep deprivation is the general practice of CIA interigators, while coupled with other methods which hasten the effects. Making someone extremely hot/cold and not allowing them to sleep is not on the same level as electricuting, whipping, etc. It's just not.

yes, i've heard over and over again from spook buddies that just the threat of being handed over to other nations will sometimes get detainees talking. again, we treat them no worse than we treat our own in training (especially marines...they get the hell beat out of them).

Originally posted by ludaChris
Anok, do you not believe the terrorist have beheaded any of these people and that it is just a falsity? Take a look at these news links I found on google.

I guess you haven't seen the threads here on ATS at the time of the be-headings huh? They were exposed as fakes quite well as far as I'm concerned.

Why have they stopped if it WAS terrorists? Think about it.

The government will go to any length to fullfill their agenda.

Thanx for the links, but sorry....no soup for you!

Originally posted by ANOK

I guess you haven't seen the threads here on ATS at the time of the be-headings huh? They were exposed as fakes quite well as far as I'm concerned.

Why have they stopped if it WAS terrorists? Think about it.

The government will go to any length to fullfill their agenda.

Thanx for the links, but sorry....no soup for you!

ok soup nazi, could you post some links to your proofs for those of us who werent around during that debate?

Originally posted by snafu7700
ok soup nazi, could you post some links to your proofs for those of us who werent around during that debate?

I didn't say there were any proofs. Just a lot of evidence that points IMHO to fake. Do a search of ATS threads if you want to look, I don't have the time to do that for you. NEXT!

...Soup Nazi

Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by snafu7700
ok soup nazi, could you post some links to your proofs for those of us who werent around during that debate?

I didn't say there were any proofs.

were these not your words?

They were exposed as fakes quite well as far as I'm concerned.

if they were exposed as fakes, then you must have some proof of that, right?

Originally posted by Wisdumb
"he does have a pint."
Well now that clears that up cause after a pint of whiskey i start talking bout back in the vietnam.......

I knew a guy like that. Funny thing was that he never went to Vietnam.

The fact is that either we inflict pain on them or they do it to us, there isn't really any room for diplomacy anymore, if there ever was in the first place. The CIA is going to take it in the media for intelligence failures or abusive treatment, so they might as well choose the one that yeilds some results.

Originally posted by snafu7700
if they were exposed as fakes, then you must have some proof of that, right?

NO, didn't you read "As far as I'm concerned"? Or "In MY Opinion"? Do I need proof to have an opinion? Jeez!

Look at the vids yourself, if you think they're are reall then you're not looking hard enough! IN MY OPINION! (and many other peoples, who pay attention)

[edit on 21/11/2005 by ANOK]

Alright then, will you post those threads that 'pretty much' expose them as fakes? Id like to take a look over them. Thanks.

Originally posted by ludaChris
Alright then, will you post those threads that 'pretty much' expose them as fakes? Id like to take a look over them. Thanks.

Hey man don't put words in my mouth, I didn't say "pretty much" I said IMO. And IMO it wasn't "pretty much".

You know how to use the ATS search function, no?

This if off topic, so my last coment on be-headings.....

[edit on 21/11/2005 by ANOK]

You are right, you didnt say pretty much. Sorry bout that, I woke up just a bit ago, its very early and Im still very tired. Tend to read the words quicker than I comprehend. But you did say there were posts about them.

Anok: I guess you haven't seen the threads here on ATS at the time of the be-headings huh? They were exposed as fakes quite well as far as I'm concerned.

It would be much appreciated if you would post the thread you are refering to.

This thread begs the question - are we talking about interrogation or simply torture? Torture is carried out by some factions as a punishment, or simply for a bit of fun.

Beatings, burning, cutting, electrocuting etc are all well and good, but they have been shown to extract poor quality information. To quote Reservoir Dogs, you beat him often enough and he'll confess to starting the Chicago fire, but that doesn't make it so. A physically tortured prisoner is more likely to say what he thinks you want to hear, just to stop the torture.

Sensory deprivation and other such methods have been shown to break down or degrade an individuals psychological resolve, making them more likely to reveal higher quality information. These individuals can be left in such a state that they will convince themselves that the information they hold is of little importance, and are therefore more likely to tell the truth when questioned.

Edited due to mong spelling

[edit on 21-11-2005 by PaddyInf]

[edit on 21-11-2005 by PaddyInf]

Thanks for the links Shire