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Is the US really hated more now than before?

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posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 11:46 AM
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Originally posted by Dronetek
bander paul: You know that both Osama and zarqawi stated that they hated US freedom. I mean, they used those exact words. just sayin.


In UBL's tape to the people of America, he states that he does not hate their way of freedom;

"Security is an important foundation of human life, and free people do not squander their security, contrary to Bush's claims that we hate freedom. Let him tell us why we did not attack Sweden, for example."

"It is known that those who hate freedom do not possess proud souls like those of the 19, may God rest their souls. We fight you because we are free and because we want freedom for our nation. When you squander our security, we squander yours."

Source

"The al-Qaeda leader likens the Bush administration to Arab regimes, saying both are characterised by "hubris, arrogance, greed and unlawful acquisition of money".
He tries to appropriate the language of the Bush administration, dismissing Mr Bush's regular claims that al-Qaeda militants "hate freedom"."

Source

Also guessing he speaks for Al Zarqawi there too.




posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 12:00 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan
Oh geeeeeeze ... that's right ...... our 'awful' foreign policy.


allafrica.com...

Guess we should take our BILLIONS and BILLIONS in foreign aid,
and the other BILLIONS upon BILLIONS given by American through
charities and keep it all!

I triple dog dare everyone to read this article
allafrica.com...
then try to say that America's government towards
the rest of the world sucks. If you still say it, then
you just WANT to mindlessly hate America.

I don't recall you being hated throughout Africa. Nor do I remember Africa being "the rest of the world", which is a pretty insulting notion.

Considering France:




posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 12:31 PM
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Yes I think it is so. Having lived there at one time you could not give me a house down there, I would not live there again. Bush has seriously messed things up. But mind you to what part do we each, as human beings, play a part in this whole ugly thing...



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 01:54 PM
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I think it is irrelevant the argument that, because only 30% of americans support Bush policy, then "not all americans are on the same level". They are on the same level at least in the way they benefit from the fruits of war (national security now and cheaper stable supply of oil later).

I am a very tolerant person in all respects, but the more I see the less I would feel comfortable dealing with america or americans, except from a position of strength. How do I know the "good" americans from the "bad"?

What you have to understand, is that the war is not merely the thought of an evil elite; it is the end product of american culture, the daily bread of american life. To be an american is to be at war with everyone else.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:02 PM
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Originally posted by ArchAngel
We are destroying, killing, raping, robbing, and torturing
in Iraq just like Saddam did, and maybe worse.


Got any reliable stats to back that tripe up with ArchAngel?
Nope. Didn't think so.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:07 PM
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Originally posted by jagzz
It is the fact that the U.S purposely chose to defy the UN and go ahead with the war in iraq, thus rendering the UN as useless as it is powerless to do what it is there for.


No jagzz ... America didn't cause the UN to be powerless and useless.
The UN itself caused that. The whole world saw how useful
the
UN was in Rwanda and Somolia. The whole world saw how useful the
UN has been to the people of Iraq as they were slaughtered by
Saddam. The UN itself is to blame for it's own state in the world.
Personal responsibility goes for organizations as well as people.

Hey ... wanna' talk about why no one likes the UN? How about the
fact that the Security Council, France and Germany most exactly,
were up to their eyeballs in gaining illegal billions from Saddam ...
billions that were to go to the Iraqi people but Saddam stole it
and the UN Security Council looked the other way because they
were having their pockets lines with stolen billions in $$$$.

The UN has only itself to blame for it's status in the world.
Not America.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:09 PM
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Originally posted by jagzz
but dont act like people are jealous of your country,
that is just plain ignorant


When people are jealous they usually can't see it.
When people are jealous and they do see it, they won't admit it.
The world is jealous. Those that aren't jealous hate America
because they believe the crap spewed forth by those that ARE
jealous.

It all still boils down to jealousy - even if you can't see it -
even if you can't admit it.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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Originally posted by LA_Maximus
-Europe has lost their way.....churches are empty and the Mosques are full. Of course they HATE us. We're Still a Christian nation and Christians are now hated more than the Muslims....that tells me the world has GONE INSANE!



Churches are empty how is that a bad thing ?
Who exacty hates Christians apart from islamic extremists ?
Its going to take the Islamic world longer to free itself from organised religion.

One things for sure Im glad that not all Americans have the "everybody hates us" view of the world.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan
It all still boils down to jealousy - even if you can't see it -
even if you can't admit it.

If you can't imagine a reason besides jealousy, you aren't worth being talked to. You are just another one of the 300 million american jackasses that think they are the center of the universe.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:29 PM
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Flyersfan, I want a detailed account of exactly what the world is jealous of you for. If you fail to submit this account, it will be seen as an admission that you really are the simpleton we perceive you to be.

You make the claim, back it up. Then we will see what you have that the rest of us are so totally jealous of.

Get to work.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:37 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

When people are jealous they usually can't see it.
When people are jealous and they do see it, they won't admit it.
The world is jealous. Those that aren't jealous hate America
because they believe the crap spewed forth by those that ARE
jealous.

It all still boils down to jealousy - even if you can't see it -
even if you can't admit it.


That is why america is hated... the arrogance you display drives people to hate, you are not superior to ANY other country when it comes to ethics and morals, you are just a tiny bit above Saddam the person you killed 100 thousand innocent people to capture.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 03:33 PM
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That is why america is hated... the arrogance you display drives people to hate, you are not superior to ANY other country when it comes to ethics and morals, you are just a tiny bit above Saddam the person you killed 100 thousand innocent people to capture.


What is arrogance? Is saying we are the world only superpower arrogant? Nope, its fact.
Also, care to back up that 100 thousand death BS?



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 03:39 PM
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Originally posted by cargo
Keep up the BS Maximus, it's all you're good at.


Personal insults huh?

Ive argued with you before cargo and you've always resorted to insults. Thats ok, it tells me your arguement is outta gas and headin for the side of the road.

Flyers-Fan is one of the few in here who has common-sense....we conservatives are Hated because we still have pride in America......thats right Pride!!! Im not ashamed of our American ancestors and I don't "boo-hoo" whenever I hear the plight of the Indians....I don't always second-guess what coulda or shoulda been done. I am always looking forward.

Thats what separates us from the leftest's that Hate America so Much....they always look backwards, wondering what we've done so wrong that makes the world Hate us so.

We conservatives don't wring our hands wondering why the world hates us, because we KNOW the most of the world is totally screwed up! Their the ones that need fix'n....not us.

Maximu§



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by LA_Maximus
Im not ashamed of our American ancestors and I don't "boo-hoo" whenever I hear the plight of the Indians....I don't always second-guess what coulda or shoulda been done. I am always looking forward.



In the context of that line of thinking, I suppose that it doesn't matter how we get what we want as long as we get it.

The end thereby justifies the means and to Hades with whomever we trample in our determination to get it.

There is another maxim...he who ignores history is bound to repeat it.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 04:36 PM
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Originally posted by masqua
In the context of that line of thinking, I suppose that it doesn't matter how we get what we want as long as we get it.

The end thereby justifies the means and to Hades with whomever we trample in our determination to get it.

There is another maxim...he who ignores history is bound to repeat it.


Look, please don't mis-understand me. Im aware the American Indians got a bad deal and the Black Slaves also had it bad, but I don't beat myself up about it.

We've made mistakes, but we learn and move on...like any other country or person. America has done so much good in this world, yet so many focus on our mistakes rather than our accomplishments.

Maximu§



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 04:45 PM
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Originally posted by LA_Maximus

We've made mistakes, but we learn and move on...like any other country or person. America has done so much good in this world, yet so many focus on our mistakes rather than our accomplishments.

Maximu§



Learning and moving on is exactly right and as it should be... and I agree hat beating ourselves up about it amounts to flaggelism and has no purpose.

Also, you're right...America has done much good in the world. The country is a shining example for freedom.

But...we should never be slow to correct our wrongs, if possible and furthermore, it is right to not repeat the mistakes of the past.

thanks for your thoughtful reply...



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 06:43 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
What is arrogance? Is saying we are the world only superpower arrogant? Nope, its fact.
Also, care to back up that 100 thousand death BS?


There are plenty of references if you care to look for yourself.

www.informationclearinghouse.info...

Some say more than 100K have died, and a few say a bit less with the average around 150K.

Would you care to back up your denialist ignorance with a lower figure from a reputable source?



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 07:00 PM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by ArchAngel
We are destroying, killing, raping, robbing, and torturing
in Iraq just like Saddam did, and maybe worse.


Got any reliable stats to back that tripe up with ArchAngel?
Nope. Didn't think so.


Just look at Falujah for an example of the destruction, anyone keeping count can say that tens if not hundreds of thousands have been killed, many sources claiming rampant raping by US soldiers, and pictures and confessions of torture as standard treatment of detainees.

But of course you would deny any source that made those claims even if it comes from the US Media, and Government, just in nicer terms.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 11:37 PM
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America is a great place and one of my favorite countries in the world. Like everywhere it has it's pros and cons, most people understand this and don't hold any of Americas perceived shortcomings against them. What i think is really behind this recent increase in anti-americanism is obviously the war in Iraq. Regardless of whether it's righteous or not war produces extreme reactions from people and some of those reactions are negitive. Another factor is the US has become increasingly isolationist politically while still wanting to be the world police, if authority does not come with the consent of the majority of people who are under that rule (the world) than many will be against it. Other things like the refusal to sign the Kyoto protocol is also an issue with many nations who do have concerns about global warming. Last but not least is the American state of mind that increasingly sees the rest of the world as a threat or enemy rather than opportunities or allies and this kind of thinking creates enemies where there was once none.

[edit on 19-11-2005 by Trent]



posted on Nov, 20 2005 @ 01:53 AM
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Originally posted by xman_in_blackx
What is Bush Jr. doing that previous Presidents were not?


Very little different that I can see. In the case with Iraq, it was too blatant a lie along with other mitigating circumstances. Around the world people already felt sympathy towards Iraqis from the reports about what has occurred as a result of the long-standing sanctions and of course from having to go through two recent wars. A third war just seemed a bit like overkill to many people, ya know? You also have total media saturation in the world today and the internet allows for alternative information distribution and communications.

A better informed world population coupled with the sympathy of the plight of Iraqis was just too much to take. Add in years of continued violence and chaos in Iraq and you get what you see today. Also all the secret dententions, tortures, and murders. And this is just outrage at the information that slipped through the USA intelligence's grip on the situation.

Other USA Presidents just didn't have to deal with a knowing world population as Bush does today.

[edit on 20-11-2005 by heelstone]



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