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DaVinci Code

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posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 05:26 PM
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While there is a plethora of sources out there that either support or debase the fiction that is presented in a historical manner in this novel - many of them have support from special interests. I am interested in what the readers of ATS have to say about what is a possible truth and what is BS in this novel.




posted on Nov, 18 2005 @ 09:03 PM
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most of it is BS. Actually, Dan Brown has discovered how a mediocre writer can dominate the best seller list - be offensive.

Was Christ a man? Of course He was. That was the plan. He felt pain, doubt, joy, sorrow, heat, cold, hunger, thirst...everything that you and I experience, He did. He became human for us and to redeem us our sins. Did he feel love? Of course! Lust? Although the bible doesn't speak of this, lust is a very human emotion.

Did he get married in those 'lost years'? I don't know. Did he have children? I doubt it. The bible is rife with allusions that Christ was very aware of the role He had to play. Would he subject a wife and children to this pain?

Opus Dei is hardly the twisted group he presents. The Priory of Scion? Not a chance. The problem is that far too many anti-church people use his fiction as fact. Those who are ignorant or gullible are likely to take his 'history' as truth. Secularists love the book and trot it out constantly to attack the church with Brown's fabrications

Unfortunately, people haven't learned to look at the spine of a book. If they did, maybe they would understand that fiction is NOT TRUE.

At least he going to stop picking on the church in his next book. I feel sorry for the Masons.....



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 07:00 AM
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why is it that If one book openly sold as FICTION can generate this much
discussion and invigoration of the publishing industry, (there must be 10
or more books "debunking" this work of fiction), if indeed there is not some
"basis in fact" that some are trying to keep hidden?

How can a work thats only reason for being is to debunk a work of fiction
be openly advertised as "NON-FICTION?" Is it because these missives
eminate from church leaders and not from fiction writers. church leaders i
might add with alot of letters after their names most ending with PhD .
And everyone knows that PhD really stands for " PILED HIGHER and DEEPER"
and always followes B.S (Bull ****) and M.S. (MORE ****)



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 11:49 AM
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Originally posted by shantyman


Unfortunately, people haven't learned to look at the spine of a book. If they did, maybe they would understand that fiction is NOT TRUE.



The exact same could be said about the bible or any other holy book for that matter which is thousands of years old.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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I recently saw a documentary on the Discovery channel, presented by Tony Robinson, which effectively rubbished the premise on which the book is based.

Apparently this secret organisation which is mentioned at the start of the book was in fact a joke played by three French conmen in the 1960s, one of whom admitted the hoax recently.

Once this fact is known, it is impossible to take the book seriously.



posted on Nov, 19 2005 @ 07:08 PM
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Yes it is fiction. But the themes that Brown uses have been floating around as heretical religious rumors for hundreds of years. Why is it so popular? Because it touches on religion and the main characters in the christian religion that many hold dear to their hearts. It also touches on the conspiracy issues that make this site so popular.



posted on Nov, 20 2005 @ 12:05 AM
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Originally posted by Englishman_in_Spain

Apparently this secret organisation which is mentioned at the start of the book was in fact a joke played by three French conmen in the 1960s, one of whom admitted the hoax recently.

Once this fact is known, it is impossible to take the book seriously.


Unfortunately it isn't that simple. The supposed true story about Pierre Plantard and the forged "Prieure Documents" is strange at best involving figures as important and sensational as Charles de Gaulle and Klaus Barbie. Plantard's confession can hardly be taken as open and shut valid if he was in fact a con man. I believe he was a con man and that much of his material was forged and planted in the Paris Bibliotheque National, although the mechanism of such a scheme if you think about it is rather fantastic. It all only makes the mystery bigger and more complicated rather than simple to dismiss and put away.

Who would expect the puzzle and riddle laden Priory of Sion issue to continue to unravel into further levels of misdirection, sleight of hand and encryption? Anyone familiar with the term Ludibrium? It's a Latin term meaning a plaything or something trivial. It also refers to a type of artificial dramatic allegory utilized to project esoteric conceptions into larger social consciousness. Major hermetic figure Johann Valentin Andreae, the supposed author of "The Chemical Wedding of Christian Rosenkreutz" used the term to describe the Rosicrucians.

No matter how we accept Plantard's material and claims, it does not change much of the larger material at issue in the "Holy Blood, Holy Grail" phenomenon. People are primarily fixated on the sensational issue surrounding Jesus and Mary Magdalene, but this is just an expression of concepts that have been a part of certain segments of Christian philosophy since its conception. The JC/MM relationship really is just an inclusion of elements of the Christ myth culled from its myriad of progenitors (Osiris/Mythris/Attis/etc.). That these concepts are a parcel of gnostic/hermetic/alchemical philosophy is a fact apparent through easy research of materials available well before HBHG was published. That heretical concepts such as these would need to be hidden from mass conception is understandable through any lesson on medieval history.

Plantard's exposure also doesn't affect the apparently hermetic/esoteric proclivities of many of the figures named as Grand Masters of the PoS. The St.Clair family is certainly involved in Rosicrucian matters through the Jacobite cause. Nicolas Flamel was a legendary alchemist said to have possessed the Philosopher's Stone. That Botticelli and Da Vinci were well versed in these matters is apparent through examination of their work. The same is true of Victor Hugo, Claude Debussy and Jean Cocteau. Robert Fludd is another important alchemist. The aforementioned Johann Valentin Andrea is also listed as a GM. Isaac Newton devoted more time and study to alchemy then any other subject. That he was conversant in Hermetic principles is apparent in his writings. Is the list meant to be read as literal or is it in some way allegorical and meant to send researchers into many different interassociated areas of study and discovery? How are we to tell when the puzzle stops if we stop digging at the most shallow level?

There have been numerous organizations that have called themselves the Order of Sion or some variation, such as the Order of Notre Dame of Sion founded in 1079 and headquartered in the Abbey of Mt. Sion. As is almost always the case with this topic, the relationship between these organizations with one another (and with the Knights Templar, the Chroniclers of Pope Sylvester II, the Rosicrucians and the Freemasons) is ambiguous but compelling. I urge everyone interested in the topic to research it yourselves and draw your own conclusions. The case is far from open and shut.



posted on Nov, 20 2005 @ 01:17 AM
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Originally posted by Sparkie the Wondersnail
Yes it is fiction. But the themes that Brown uses have been floating around as heretical religious rumors for hundreds of years. Why is it so popular? Because it touches on religion and the main characters in the christian religion that many hold dear to their hearts. It also touches on the conspiracy issues that make this site so popular.


I think Sparkie hit it right on the head! The rub between The Church and European Royalty always been that the Kings and Queens ALSO claimed Divine Privilege.

I find it odd though, that with all the people who want desparately to keep religion under a hot spotlight, the theory of European Royalty all descending from Jesus would become (once again) so darn popular.

Uh, I think one way to solve this puzzle is to simply ASK whoever is in charge of recording the Kings bloodline. Pick a country, it doesn't matter. If their bloodline runs back to Jesus, I think they might scream it from the roof tops of the nearest cathedral!

[edit on 20-11-2005 by Toelint]



[edit on 20-11-2005 by Toelint]



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 09:07 AM
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Originally posted by jagzz

Originally posted by shantyman


Unfortunately, people haven't learned to look at the spine of a book. If they did, maybe they would understand that fiction is NOT TRUE.



The exact same could be said about the bible or any other holy book for that matter which is thousands of years old.



hmmmmm - I don't see 'fiction' on my bible. 1/6 of the world's population are Christian. Islam is right behind, and there are a significant number of Jews. A large proportion of the world's people hold the Old Testament and the New Testament as sacred texts. Now we all might be wrong, but that is our belief - it's this thing called faith. I don't have any problem with people who don't believe what I believe. I do have a problem with this concept that there is some sort of status attached to those who are abusive of other people and their beliefs. Like Dan Brown. Like you.



posted on Nov, 25 2005 @ 06:58 AM
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I do have a problem with this concept that there is some sort of status attached to those who are abusive of other people and their beliefs. Like Dan Brown. Like you.


But you see there is a "status" assigned to these people. the same as there is
to rabid fundamentalists like falwell ( of teletubby fame) and other more LOCAL
fame.

a thing to remember is that ALL myth and legend has a basis in fact. some where, some time some kernal of fact. even the bible.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 11:18 AM
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Originally posted by shantyman
most of it is BS. Actually, Dan Brown has discovered how a mediocre writer can dominate the best seller list - be offensive.
How can you say that? The book may be fiction, but it's still a really good book.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 11:35 AM
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Originally posted by sos8ball

Originally posted by shantyman
most of it is BS. Actually, Dan Brown has discovered how a mediocre writer can dominate the best seller list - be offensive.
How can you say that? The book may be fiction, but it's still a really good book.


it's actually a very ordinary book at best. the first few chapters make so many references to his earlier book about the same character that it reads like an advertisment. the religous aspect of the book is why it is still on the best seller list. the promotion of it as a book based on fact, thereby implying that the code is real and that the ending (I won't say a thing about it) might actually be true is why it was so popular.

the thread still getting notice after all this time is proof positive that people actually believe that it might be true.

Brown is a fair writer at best. his stories are predictable. my wife and I read the code on a long flight. we had two copies of the book and we got bored with the story so we started guessing which way the story would go, chapter by chapter, page by page. we were almost never wrong.

If you want to read a book that is what the da vinci code could have been, in the hands of more skilled authors, check out The Rule of Four.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 01:18 PM
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Originally posted by Englishman_in_Spain
I recently saw a documentary on the Discovery channel, presented by Tony Robinson, which effectively rubbished the premise on which the book is based.

Apparently this secret organisation which is mentioned at the start of the book was in fact a joke played by three French conmen in the 1960s, one of whom admitted the hoax recently.

Once this fact is known, it is impossible to take the book seriously.


If I may correct you here Pierre Plantard did NOT admit it was a hoax. What he did was admit in court that he wasn't a claiment to the Merovingian bloodline as he had done previously.

Also his partner The Marquis de Cherisey could NOT have written the parchments as he didn't know how to decode them correctly.

The book that tells all is the best seller from 1982 and reprinted with two extra chapters and recently re-released with extra photographs in hardback is:

The Holy blood and the Holy grail

[edit on 7/12/05 by roscoe]



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 04:23 PM
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In the programme that I saw, it was indeed admitted that the 'secret organisation' was actually a hoax.

Sorry to disappoint you matey.

[edit on 7-12-2005 by Englishman_in_Spain]



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 05:26 PM
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Originally posted by Englishman_in_Spain
In the programme that I saw, it was indeed admitted that the 'secret organisation' was actually a hoax.

Sorry to disappoint you matey.

[edit on 7-12-2005 by Englishman_in_Spain]


You're not disappointing me, I saw the programme too. I tried to get on the webchat afterwards without success. What I wanted to do was to pick them up on several points.

The Priory of Sion IS a genuine organisation. They had been registered in 1956. A researcher for Henry Lincoln had learned that Jean Cochteau had changed the society in 1955 and ordered members of the ORDER OF SION to go public. The move caused a schism amongst some members. They were to be no longer a secret society, Cochteau ordered them to go public.

This programme was badly researched as this fact was mentioned in the book The Messianic Legacy.

There is documentary evidence that a society called THE ORDER OF SION existed and was given a papal bull in 1099.

That was not the only thing wrong with the programme either.



posted on Feb, 24 2006 @ 06:59 PM
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I have a wild thing to say and not sure where to put it but in it's own way it fits here...

I have had a recurring dream for several months (this has happened before with other dreams)...not much to it but it is very very frightening to me.

Anyhow I am standing on what I think is a sidewalk and in front of me at arms length are steele walls held together by huge rivets. I cannot turm my head in any direction but I get the impression that I am surrounded by these steel walled and riveted "buildings". And...that's it. I mean there is nothing more to it. Once and only once was there anything different...I was able to reach forward and touch one of the rivets in front of me. It was bigger than my hand.

Now, I have never seen any building(s) like what I am dreaming and have NO idea why I keep dreaming this. As I said I am afraid of this dream.

A friend sent me a package of booksa month or so ago - mostly political books but, they had added a couple Dan Brown books including Da Vinci Code. About a third of the way through the Da Vinci Code the man/woman characters are in front of a building and they describe it...steele walls and rivets...exactly the way it is in my dream. The building in the book is a Swiss bank in France.

Is it possible I am having some sort of premonition? The Da Vinci movie open in the US in May but opens the Cannes Film Festival in FRANCE in March....



posted on Feb, 24 2006 @ 08:07 PM
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I haven't gotten to the Davinci Code yet, but I heard of the movie. And right now I am reading the book Angels and Demons, which is the one before the Davinci Code. Well I think that the book has a lot of fact in it. But I can not point that uot right now.



posted on Feb, 25 2006 @ 08:08 AM
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I am still trying to figure out why it is still a best seller. Are people buying the book to burn it? Not really a good way to do it


Dan Brown has made millions off of this book by creating a contravesy and in his own words has said everything in it is true, even tho countless scholars (even those of agnostic belief) and Religious leaders have proven it is bunk. It takes a few assumptions and takes advatages of readers naivity to create a fictitious story taht has a kernal of truth imbedded in it.

FYI, Mary Magaline really only has a connection to the prostitute that Jesus stopped from getting stoned in Catholic Dogma, which is really what the whole book tries to discredit.



posted on Feb, 25 2006 @ 08:46 AM
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Thank Allah he only wrote a book and did not DRAW this other prophet. When it hits the big screen we might have "Muslim Matinees"



posted on Feb, 25 2006 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by Cicada
Ludibrium.......


Excellent, well-rounded post Cicada.


//

For me, the Da Vinci Code is another example of a valid point of conspiracy research being used as a kernel of truth in a fictional story, which is brought to the mainstream - in doing so, the myths and untruths of the fictional story of intertwined with any truth, and thus any real research into this truth is made all the more difficult because of a number of attitudes:

1. The 'throw the baby out with the bath-water' people who understand it as a work of fiction, and decide the entire idea that the story is based on is also fictional.

2. The 'mis-information followers' who take the book/movie literally, and follow threads of research from ideas in the fictional story that miss the point of the original truth entirely.

Anyone interested in researching the Prior of Sion, the Merovingians or the conspiracies of Christianity in general have a few more hurdles put in front of them, because of the jumble of fact and fiction, which can crystalise a kind of 'official line' in the public consciousness (this idea can also be put forth for other areas of conspiracy research too, such as the media's official story for 9/11 and the 'War on Terror').

Much like after the popularity of the X-Files, anyone interested in UFOlogy was told "you've been watching too much of the X-Files, mate
" -- Anyone interested in the history of Christianity and these European Bloodlines (etc) have to combat the crystalised image of these subjects that have been created by the book/movie's mass popularity.

I would not be surprised if this was intentional.



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