POLITICS: House to Vote on Troop Pullout

The House of Representatives will tonight determine if we pull American troops immediately. From the looks of it, with the Republicans, holding the sway, I don't think The Democrats will get their wish anytime soon.



The majority of America, and probably the world will like to see the us troops and the other troops currently occupying Iraq to pullout as quickly as possible if it can be done in the morning that move will be welcome with open arms. It's up to us to see the results of this vote.


[edit on 18-11-2005 by Nerdling]

[edit on 19-11-2005 by Nerdling]

This is the perfect troop withdrawl strategy for Bush.

He gets to stay completely out of the equation. He isn't even in the country. The Republicans and Democrats of Congress decide in a straight vote whether to withdraw troops or not.

Bush is hands off, he can "respect the decision of Congress".

The Democratic turnout looks strong in the chamber. I'm just not sure about this one.

I'm watching it now. I posted this elsewhere, and will post it here:

The GOP has substituted the Murtha bill with one of their own calling for withdrawl in a deliberate attempt to pre-empt the debates Murtha called for, in the style of the Fulbright hearings. This is sickening. Debates are live on C-Span now. (5:20 EST). The GOP bill, unlike the Murtha bill, provides for no protection of the troops or consideration of when and how to withdrawl. It's a pastiche of the Murtha bill designed to be so unappealing and so provacative that no one would vote for it. This insults Murtha's position, whom the GOP claims to have such respect for. As one speaker pointed out, the GOP bill is likely to be used by terror groups as proof of our lack of resolve- and all as part of a cheap political move by the GOP.

This, ladies and gentlemen, is how the GOP views the safety of our people and troops abroad. As a political game. If they wanted to vote on the Murtha bill, they should have voted on the Murtha bill, but they fear a debate and wanted their own bill to fail so they wouldn't have to contend with the Murtha bill.

This is without a doubt one of the saddest days I've seen politically since the Iraq occupation began, and it marks a new low for the GOP.

[edit on 18-11-2005 by koji_K]

[edit on 18-11-2005 by koji_K]

Well, what can he possibly lose? What can he possibly gain? Nothing! absolutely nothing! He's heavily damaged . and all is left is debt, dust, dead, injured, and seriously wonded GOP

Crusader, I don't know any Americans who want the troops simply "pulled out", and I don't know of any thinking, lucid Americans who have any concept of the Middle Eastern way of thinking who want this kind of folly being conducted in the House, or Senate, or Oval Ofiice. It'll only bolster morale of those who'll attack the troops and further inflame the situation.

"It is the sense of the house that US forces in Iraq should be withdrawn immediately"

Thats what they're eventually going to vote on.

You are saying that the House is going to vote on "sense"?

They should vote yes; they need all the sense they can get.

The vote to allow debate and voting on the resolution passed. 6 Republican defectors, Dems went straight party line.

I guess we'll find out within the next few hours.

You can watch the debate live on C-SPAN Here: LINK

Wasn't Murtha proposing a redeployment of troops to nations that border Iraq rather than a general pullout?

Originally posted by Flinx
Wasn't Murtha proposing a redeployment of troops to nations that border Iraq rather than a general pullout?

Well thats the duzey. The Democrats haven't proposed anything tonight. This "pullout" was proposed by a Republican Representative. It's an extreme pull out of all US Forces back to US bases proper.

I say get the troops out and now.

I have my idiot box on C-Span right now. Listening to Murtha.

Originally posted by Nerdling

Originally posted by Flinx
Wasn't Murtha proposing a redeployment of troops to nations that border Iraq rather than a general pullout?

Well thats the duzey. The Democrats haven't proposed anything tonight. This "pullout" was proposed by a Republican Representative. It's an extreme pull out of all US Forces back to US bases proper.

So when Democrats don't vote this silly, twisted version of Murtha's idea, the Republicans will be able to say "Look, you didn't vote for pullout...so stop criticizing the war!" Wow, that's just..... *shakes head*

[edit on 11/18/2005 by Flinx]

This is a brilliant political move by republicans in a situation that should not be political. The dems tried to pull a "Kerry" manuever by having this war vet come out and espouse the cut and run policy thinking because he was a veteran he would be politically untouchable. A foolish ploy on their part. Now by forcing the dems to go on record as pro-victory or pro-retreat they have them between a rock and hard place. Their minority left wing base is anti-military, pro-retreat, However this is an obviously minority national opinion. It will be interesting to see what happens.

Originally posted by Flinx
Wow, that's just.....

...Par for the course.

Even if they did vote for this, wouldn't it have to get through the Senate and a possible presidential veto to have anything come of it?

Is it likely that anything at all would happen with this even if the House passes it?

So, isn't all the excitement much ado about nothing?

It doesnt matter who votes for what.

There will be a troop 'reduction', just prior to elections,
but there will never be complete troop 'pullout'.

Not ever.

Originally posted by Apoc
This is a brilliant political move by republicans in a situation that should not be political. The dems tried to pull a "Kerry" manuever by having this war vet come out and espouse the cut and run policy thinking because he was a veteran he would be politically untouchable. A foolish ploy on their part. Now by forcing the dems to go on record as pro-victory or pro-retreat they have them between a rock and hard place. Their minority left wing base is anti-military, pro-retreat, However this is an obviously minority national opinion. It will be interesting to see what happens.

Actually, Murtha's position was not "cut and run," it was "let's have a serious debate over an exit strategy." It called for debates, over-the-horizon deployment regarding Iraq, and funding for troop exits. The GOP bill provided for none of these things, it truly was "cut and run." They pre-empted a chance to have a serious examination of how best to achieve a positive outcome in Iraq, and forced a vote on a non-issue, wasting time, resources, and opportunity just so they could gain political points.

The great thing about this is that everyone will be put on official record: who supports the troops, who supports cut-n-run, and who supports a thought out strategy for a timely withdrawal or downsizing.

This will prove interesting, if not entertaining.







seekerof

Originally posted by Seekerof
The great thing about this is that everyone will be put on official record: who supports the troops, who supports cut-n-run, and who supports a thought out strategy for a timely withdrawal or downsizing.

I think it's who supports the war vs. who doesn't support the war.

Which side supports the troops is debateable, and "cut-n-run" is republican spin for "withdrawal".

Originally posted by Flinx
So when Democrats don't vote this silly, twisted version of Murtha's idea, the Republicans will be able to say "Look, you didn't vote for pullout...so stop criticizing the war!" Wow, that's just..... *shakes head*

Bingo! We have a winner. And the sword has two edges. If the Democrats vote yes to pull the troops out now, then they look like cowards to their voters. Their best bet is to be in the bathroom all night and claim they were tied up somewhere.

Congressman Murtha lit this fuse with his resolution. I just don't think he expected the Republicans to pull out the heavy weapons today. Did you hear when Rep. Jean Schmidt (R-Ohio) said she had a phone call with a Marine Colonel today?

He (Marine colonel) asked me to send Congress a message - stay the course. He also asked me to send Congressman Murtha a message - that cowards cut and run, Marines never do,''

Man! It was like British Parliament! I haven't heard such a ruckus in Congress in a while. Now were getting some good debate. Rep. Marty Meehan (D-Mass) ran across the chamber floor and yelled back "You guys are pathetic. Pathetic". Wow! The gloves are off in Congress tonight. This beats any Tyson fight. Wish I could be there to see the fun first hand.

Bottom line. Democrats just had the boom lowered on them.

[edit on 18-11-2005 by dbates]