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Bird Flu: New Study On High Fatality Rate Cause Released

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posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 02:10 PM
In a just released study of the bird flu, scientists may have stumbled across the reason the bird flu is so deadly. The report cites the possible indicated cause of the high death rate in bird flu victims to be an immune system overreaction.


The H5N1 virus caused proteins known as cytokines to rush to infected lung tissue

These cytokines are the normal immune systems reponse to infection. However they seem to overreact to the H5N1 flu virus. The particluar type of cytokine is a protien identified in the study as IP-10.

linkWe demonstrated that patients with H5N1 disease had unusually high serum levels of IP-10 (interferon-gamma-inducible protein-10).

So, thanks to this new study, it appears that we now known the reason why this H5N1 flu is more deadly than the average flu. This new information about the possible cause of the high mortality rate leads to a new idea on how to reduce the death rate of the bird flu.

If the immune system over reaction can somehow be suppresed, then the critial factor causing death can possibly be mitigated. How can the immune overreaction be suppressed?

More specifically how can the cytokines be suppressed?

[edit on 12-11-2005 by makeitso]

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 02:16 PM
Two teenage boys who took the antiviral drug Tamiflu exhibited abnormal behavior that led to their deaths, with one jumping in front of an oncoming truck last year and the other falling from the ninth floor of a building earlier this year, health ministry and other sources said Saturday.

The drug in Japan carries a note listing impaired consciousness, abnormal behaviors, hallucination and other psychological and neurological symptoms as possible serious side effects. The ministry is considering making a fresh warning about them, following its decision to increase the stockpile of the drug amid growing fears about a possible pandemic of a new type of influenza as bird flu deaths rise across Asia.

I was just about to start this one. This is scary, or are THEY trying to scare us more?

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 02:21 PM
OOOps, sorry. I thought this thread was about this

Disregard No hijacking intended here.

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 02:22 PM
No problem DG,

Judging from the new study, taking the flu antivirus Tamiflu will not be as critical in saving your life as something that will suppress the immune system over reaction.

My research stumbled accross one cheap, very common, easy to get, readily available product that will quickly suppress the immune system. Specifically it will suppress cytokines.


Dont freak out. I am not promoting this self fix, merely pointing out that a quick search of cytokine suppression lead me to this information. Multiple research papers show that THC suppresses the immune cytokines.


THC has profound immunosuppressive effects on the immune function.

Studies demonstrated that pretreatment of macrophages with THC "resulted in dose-dependent inhibition in their ability to prevent virus replication in target HSV2.

Indeed, recent studies have demonstrated that "THC directly inhibits the expression of cytokine-induced NO in macrophages"(Baldwin 1611).

THC suppresses Cytotoxic T lymphoctyes (CTL) from lysing within infected cells.

THC affected cytokine production, particularly of chemokines and IL-10, in human T, B, NK and myeloid cells
marijuana use has a broader range of effects on AMs including suppression of phagocytosis, inhibition of bacterial and tumor cell killing and a reduction in their ability to produce inflammatory cytokines.

Journal of Immunology

Tetrahydrocannabinol Treatment Suppresses Immunity.

These results suggested that THC injection suppressed the cytokine environment promoting Th1 immunity.

There are many other links to research indicating that Marijuana effectivly suppresses these cytokine.

I urge you to do your own research.

[edit on 12-11-2005 by makeitso]

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 02:30 PM
AH the cytokine

Actually there is on going research to see if CVVH (continuous veno-venous hemodialysis) is effective at removing these pesky little buggers.

One such study: Cytokine removal during continuous renal replacement therapy: an ex vivo comparison of convection and diffusion. said no. another such study said yes: Renal replacement therapy with high-cutoff hemofilters: Impact of convection and diffusion on cytokine clearances and protein status.

If you are interested in CVVH aka CRRT more information can be found here:
The author is one of our MCP's or medical control physicians that runs our transports. I also am certified to run these machines ;

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 10:05 PM
This "immune system overreaction" describes an allergic and inflammatory response typical of allergic asthma - and common in prion-related diseases. Much research over the past few years has looked at appropriate treatment. FYI - certain antihistamines are known to inhibit prion replication and multiplication. Here's a quick and dirty overview:

Cytokines in Allergic Disease

Cytokines regulate immune responses.

Partners Asthma Center

Allergic asthma is an inflammatory disease of the airways characterized by eosinophilic inflammation and airway hyper-reactivity. Cytokines and chemokines specific for Th2-type inflammation predominate in asthma and in animal models of this disease. The role of Th1-type inflammatory mediators in asthma remains controversial. IFN-gamma-inducible protein 10 (IP-10; CXCL10) is an IFN-gamma-inducible chemokine that preferentially attracts activated Th1 lymphocytes. IP-10 is up-regulated in the airways of asthmatics, but its function in asthma is unclear. To investigate the role of IP-10 in allergic airway disease, we examined the expression of IP-10 in a murine model of asthma and the effects of overexpression and deletion of IP-10 in this model using IP-10-transgenic and IP-10-deficient mice. Our experiments demonstrate that IP-10 is up-regulated in the lung after allergen challenge. Mice that overexpress IP-10 in the lung exhibited significantly increased airway hyperreactivity, eosinophilia, IL-4 levels, and CD8(+) lymphocyte recruitment compared with wild-type controls. In addition, there was an increase in the percentage of IL-4-secreting T lymphocytes in the lungs of IP-10-transgenic mice. In contrast, mice deficient in IP-10 demonstrated the opposite results compared with wild-type controls, with a significant reduction in these measures of Th2-type allergic airway inflammation. Our results demonstrate that IP-10, a Th1-type chemokine, is up-regulated in allergic pulmonary inflammation and that this contributes to the airway hyperreactivity and Th2-type inflammation seen in this model of asthma.

Medoff, B. D., A. Sauty, et al. (2002). "IFN-gamma-inducible protein 10 (CXCL10) contributes to airway hyperreactivity and airway inflammation in a mouse model of asthma." J Immunol 168(10): 5278-86.

2001: While capable of inhibiting histamine and LTC(4) release by human basophils, desloratadine is more effective at targeting the signals regulating IL-4 and IL-13 generation in these cells. This inhibitory effect on cytokine generation provides additional evidence that this antihistamine exerts anti-inflammatory properties.

2004: Monomeric Recombinant TCR Ligand Reduces Relapse Rate and Severity of Experimental Autoimmune Encephalomyelitis in SJL/J Mice through Cytokine Switch

May, 2005:Herbal Extract inhibits TH1 cytokines and promotes TH2 cytokines in vitro.

NOTE: Above references are listed in PubMed.

Good catch. It's interesting to consider bird flu as a virulent form of asthma...

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 10:48 PM
This interesting so If I am very sensitive to allergies I could have a negative result from the bird flu?

I have taken shot therapy for allergies before and the shots has taken care of my allergy problem but render me susceptible to other side effects like hives.

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 11:00 PM

Originally posted by marg6043

I have taken shot therapy for allergies before and the shots has taken care of my allergy problem but render me susceptible to other side effects like hives.

marg - please, do NOT get a flu shot as allergy shot therapy.

...H5N1 triggers a specific reaction in the lungs involving cytokines and myofibroblasts - it hits the stem cells. I have ranted on about this before, so I won't again. Except to say - DO NOT TAKE TAMIFLU - take antihistamines, use tea tree oil to inhale and to disinfect the air, use "Lo Han Quo" as a sweetener or tea - and cook lots with curry and sage. My $0.02.


posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 11:05 PM
Oh, I don't even take flu shots during winter, I am not about to start now, having hives is not funny they are very uncomfortable.

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 11:11 PM
Great Work soficrow! It sure looks like you are spot on about the antihistamine!

So it would seem that H5N1 is just your average flu, except it can overstimulate your autoimmune system into killing you.



It wont stop the flu, but it will stop the overraction in the immune system. You'll be sick but you won't die from it.

It seems simple, cheap and easy to acquire. I dont think that the supplies of antihistamines will run out anytime soon.

Great work.

posted on Nov, 12 2005 @ 11:36 PM
Anyone know precisely which antihistamines to recommend? Personally I find that pseudoephedrine HCl and chlorphenimine maleate (not sure of the spelling of that one) help a lot.

The ultimate antihistamines though, AFAIK, are vitamin C and alfalfa, both of which I take religiously anyhow.

posted on Nov, 13 2005 @ 01:29 AM

Please let me say that the article is the first with this information, and needs to be studied further to verify its findings and firm up the proposition that the autoimmune overreaction is the definitive culprit.

Also, I was not thinking of over the counter antihistamines. From what I have read, they may help, but they may not be enough.

The incubation period is approx 1-4 days. Then comes the onset of symptoms. It's my understanding that 1 - 3 days after the onset of symptoms, you die of respiratory failure.

Over the counter antihistamines may help suppress the autoimmune response. But it seems to me that the autoimmune response is so massive and comes on so quick, that you will be in the hospital by the time you figure out what you have. And by this time, you will need a major dose of antihistamine. Thus my thoughts were along the lines of hospital introduced doses of antihistamines.

In H5N1 cases, the incubation time has mostly been from 2 to 4 days but has stretched to 8 days, the WHO report says.

Initial symptoms are more likely to include diarrhea in avian flu than in ordinary flu, the report says. The problem can appear up to a week before any respiratory symptoms. That feature, combined with the detection of viral RNA in stool samples, suggests that the virus grows in the gastrointestinal tract.

Lower respiratory tract symptoms such as shortness of breath appear early in the course of the illness.

The report also discusses the "severe" lung injury found in autopsies of H5N1 victims, whose lungs become choked with debris resulting from the body's intense response to the infection.

The authors say the body's innate immune response to the virus, involving heavy release of proteins that trigger inflammation, may contribute to the severity of the disease.

posted on Nov, 13 2005 @ 09:08 AM
makeitso - great responses. Thanks. ...FYI - this is NOT the first report regarding the immune response - immune system involvement in prion-related diseases has been tracked for ages. Will try to see what I can pull up from my files.

In the meantime - Oops. Forgot to include an important reference in my post above.

As in bird flu - Lungs of patients who die from hantavirus cardiopulmonary syndrome (HCPS) exhibit cytokine-producing mononuclear infiltrates and pronounced pulmonary inflammation. This article provides a 2004 update on using bone marrow derived stem cells to provide correctly folded protein in healthy stem cells for transplant, to cure hantavirus and similar diseases.

A molecular biologist might describe the allergic asthma response found in bird flu and hantavirus this way, "A disease-causing misfolded protein, or prion, takes over normal stem cell proteins, turns them into replicas of itself, and so, creates mutated stem cells."

The real significance of new diseases like bird flu and hantavirus is they provide clear evidence that infectious prions now are transmitted by the respiratory route.

Stem cell therapy is very effective in treating prion-related diseases like bird flu and hantavirus. Its main drawback is economic: it treats disease at the source, cures it, and prevents it from spreading through the body to create other chronic disease and secondary symptoms affecting different organs or body systems. So stem cell therapy is not nearly as profitable to industry as drug therapies - it destroys the pharmaceutical market by curing underlying disease, and preventing the appearance of chronic secondary symptoms.

If stem cell therapy were widely available and covered by insurance, it would a) destroy the drug industry, and b) interfere with current population reduction and control measures.


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