When you pick a party you only become part of the real problem

Political parties the way I see it are one of the reasons why the US is going to the crapper. The whole party thing altogether is nothing but bickering and coniving. Nothing gets done. More time and money is spent on things than important things actually getting done.

All I read is backlash on dems do this or reps to that. If it wasn't for the dems we could of had this and so on. Well you know what? If we didn't have either party to continue this crap than we could actually make some damn progress. A bunch of whiners and babies and they are supposed to run this country...lol.

I tend to agree that most of our politicans seem to not have the best interests of the citizens at heart.

It's not just a national problem, either. Her in Michigan, the republican legislature has decided to not go along with the dems bills even if they are good bills. Governor Granholm, a democrat, is in waaaay over her head and often has that deer-in-the-headlights look. While thses two parties battle amongst themselves, MIchigan's economy--one of the worst in the nation--continues to flounder.

Michigan has a Canadian for a governor. Not sure I like that, but there's nothing in the Constitution forbidding it that I know of.

At any rate--that's a major reason why I am no longer a member of either "major" party. It's a monopoly. And it's a huge, unfunny joke on America. [Psst--DontTreadOnMe--I'm a Detroit native and I lived in Oak Park and Ferndale.]

I'm an ex-Democrat and an ex-Republican. I had voted Democrat up until 2000 because my parents did and because at the time I was a union member and they urge you to vote pro-labor, which is typically Democrat. I voted Republican from 2002-2004 when I realized what the Democrat platform was. In 2004 I voted Constitution Party because I'm sick of the two-party system--especially since neither party gives a rat's behind about America.


[edit on 11/6/2005 by Amethyst]

The two party system in the US exists specifically to prevent the people from truly expressing their will and to keep power consolidated.

The reason that it seems that there aren't any legitimate choices in most elections is because there really aren't. The candidates from both parties have to bend to the will of those who hold power over the parties simply in order to get on the ballot. They have to demonstrate that their true allegiance is to the power structure, or they aren't even allowed to run.

Beyond the fact that it's easiest to maintain control over only two choices, the two party system also serves to draw all issues as entirely monochromatic-- we are given two choices, and each side views everyone else as either "with 'em or against 'em." That narrows the available viewpoints and maximizes the contention between the people, which only benefits the powers-that-be. Machiavelli pointed out centuries ago that the surest way for a politician to operate in his own interests with no repercussions is to make certain that the people spend all their time at each other's throats. So long as we view each other as the enemy, then the politicians and their patrons (the true enemies of all of us) can continue to do essentially as they wish.

It is indeed us against them, but us and them are not the Republicans and the Democrats-- us and them are the people and the power-mongers.

BINGO!!!

I refuse to fall for the two-party trap. That's why I keep saying, EVERYONE vote third party.

Wouldn't that make the Reps and Dems have a fit. Because if the majority voted third party, and a "major" party candidate got in, that would wake up the sheeple really quick! (I know that it would depend on how many "third" parties there were...I'm just trying to oversimplify here.)

So why is it that there are so many people that fall into these two major parties? It's obvious that everything is about what either party wants or needs and not for the benefit of the people.

I had a neighbor who was a rep. and she would listen to no other views but those of rep's. I asked her if a good candidate for democrat who would do wonders for the country or a republican who straight out told us he would push the nuclear button who would she vote for....and guess what? The freaking republican....I couldn't believe it.

Absolutely.

Short of armed revolution, the ONLY way that we can possibly counter the hegemony of the established power structure is to elect politicians from third parties. The "choices" that we are currently given aren't really choices at all. Voting for either a Democrat or a Republican is nothing more than deciding by whom one prefers to be raped.

And that's of course why third parties are marginalized whenever and however possible. That's why third parties aren't even allowed to take part in the carefully scripted and organized presidential "debates." The last thing in the world that the powers-that-be want is for a candidate to actually talk about issues in a way that demonstrates the innate duplicity of both parties, and to have an audience when they do so.

Their power depends on not only controlling the views of their supporters, but controlling the views of their opponents. A fine example is the battle over Bush and the war in Iraq. His supporters reflexively parrot the propaganda that he's a fine and honorable man who's taken a stand against tyranny and is fighting for the freedom of the Iraqi people, and his opponents reflexively parrot the propaganda that he's a dim-witted, alcoholic Fundie who's serving the interests of his Big Oil buddies, and neither viewpoint is actually true. But by making certain that there's not only a ready made rationale for support, but a ready-made rationale for opposition, the powers-that-be make certain that as few people as possible ever really question anything.

Third parties are our only viable hope.

So the question is: How do we get the brainwashed majority to leave their parties and choose/vote for the better candidate?

Why people pick political parties to become part of the problem, it actually has to do with conditioning

Some may call it Brainwashing but I prefer Conditioning years of being told that we have a Democracy and that under our constitution we get to Select a candidate of our choice to become our president.

While emphasizing that we Get to Select a candidate the emphasis on We the people is forgotten.

We are given two candidates because we only have two main parties and third parties doesn't have a chance that is the conditioning.

Because years of being told that your vote counts we most follow Parties Ideologies and make a choice.

No even once We the people have given a choice as to get rid of the main two parties and start clean from scratch.

Because the conditioning will stop us from doing just that.

The reason is obvious our Conditioning is so good that we fall for the choices given to us and we are happy when one of them win and is our choice.

The truth is that neither of the two main choices of our only two main parties are really our choices but the choices of the power behind the political parties.

So when we get to vote for the only two obvious choices . . . you are right we are only contributing to the problem and perpetuating the conditioning.

Only when We the people make a stand and reclaim our country is just going to be all the same.

First, turn off your TV.

Second, take your kids out of public school. Public education is the primary source of early conditioning. It's not for nothing that the federal government, through the "no child left behind" act, has usurped all control over the curriculum of public schools. The point is not, nor has it ever been, to ensure that kids receive a quality education-- it's to ensure that kids are indoctrinated in the specific manner in which the powers-that-be desire.

Third, and arguably most important-- THINK. Don't EVER believe what you're told. Stop and think about things, question and wonder and ponder and analyze. The odds are that if something seems to not quite make sense, it's because somebody is lying somewhere. If you can figure out who's lying and why, you'll be that much closer to the real truth.

And when you do see some of the ugly truths behind the comforting lies that politicians tell us, pass them on to as many people as possible. Only by working together can we the people ever take our nation back from the power-drunk scum who have stolen it from us.

To get the power away from the two parties would require the majority of the voters to voice their anger. The problem is that the majority of the voters are dem or rep and seem happy with the way things are running even though they whine and blame. When can we have a real choice that is not made for us?

We've seen it on this thread already-- voters aren't happy. They've been indoctrinated into believing that they only have two choices. They say that voting for a third party is "throwing your vote away." They glibly pronounce that third parties will never stand a chance-- that they can't compete-- that a third party candidate can never win.

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Too many people don't think they have any other choice, or that making another choice would be a waste. So long as they continue to believe that, they'll continue to be right.

Every single person who's not happy with either of the two choices they're given by the main parties should, without exception, vote for a third party candidate. The lesser of two evils simply isn't enough. Less bad is NOT the same thing as good, or even okay. It's still bad.

What greater waste of a vote could there ever be than voting for a bad candidate that one KNOWS is a bad candidate, simply because the other candidate seems worse?

I tend to be very conservative in my views. However in the last couple of elections I have become aware that the Republicans are not conservative at all..they are liberal. It is just that they are Repubican Liberal.
In otherwords they too are not quite what is advertised and definitely dont have the public intrest in mind on many issues. They have someones intrests in mind but not the public.
I believe the this is one of the big secrets of politics which the public should never come to understand while they are kept on this tredmill of this team or that team mentality. Its so sickening it has become like rooting for a sports team. Pitiful!!
I have also come to understand that politics is one of the few buisnesses where one can advertise a product and not deliver...and people dont think much about it ...its sort of normal. Any legitimate buisness that did not produce the product advertised would soon be out of buisness ..and politics is a buisness. In buisness if I sell canned peaches ...I'd better not put pears in the cans or I will soon go out of buisness. Not so with politics. It is one of the few buisnesses where you can put something else in the can and still remain in buisness....even get back in office. People need to be aware of this line of thought when they go into a voting booth...republican and democrat....or third party for that matter. This is not a concept that political commentators will teach you or even give you as much as a clue so that you think the reigning partys are the cats meow.
Third partys tend often to be a instrument of the other partys to bleed votes away from the competition ..if not they are often hijacked by political maneuvering close to the election and thier votes taken. One must be smart and informed here...watch closely for this.
More Americans are begining to sense this about our political process,vocalizing it, and are thinking of ways around it. I would suggest something locally at first. Then with careful thought how to bring it up to a state level...then national. However...be very careful...the major partys even on a local level are seeking out these grass roots movements for hijacking. They want no competition that they do not control...politics tends to be very dirty buisness outside the public view. Much of this is hidden...occult. concealed.

One more thing about power in politics.. Here in Virginia..locally we have something on the law books which was fought against... tooth and nail in the state capital..and that is a practice called " initiative referendum and recall."
I believe in some states this is called voting referendum. This is a power in the hands of the public which politicians hate. It is the ability of the public to put referendums on the ballot and have them voted on by the public and they become law.
The horrible danger to the body politic of this pubic power is that when the pubic wants a law passed that favors the public they can vote it into law..they now have a means of by passing the professional politician when they dont perform correctly. This is a horrible ..horrible threat to the body politic.
The first time this was done as I recall was in California with some fellow named Howard Jarvis and Proposition 13. The state politicians wouldnt do what the public wanted and the public found a way to bypass them. NOt all states and localitys can do this ..but some can...the point is that this is a threat to the body politic who feels that they have a mandate to run things their way ..for the party not the public.
During and after Proposition 13 the news media lied and concealed the true nature of the measures...that the public could now bypass thier politicians if they are disatisfied with them. Never was the pubilc to have posession of this knowlege. Only faith in the two party system. This is how they conceal and hide what they do. The media is part of it ..thier boot lackeys.

Thanks,
Orangetom

That's deliberate. They promise things that they CAN'T deliver, then, when they don't deliver them, it's 'not their fault.'

It all starts when they run for class president in elementary school on a platform of longer recesses, no homework and better food in the cafeteria...



There have already been cases wherein the legislature of a particular state in which a ballot initiative has just passed immediately passes legislation that effectively negates the results of the initiative. There will be more. Soon, they'll be a waste of time and energy, because the politicians will continue to do as their patrons demand, not only regardless of what we say, but regardless of for what we vote.

I'm glad I don't live in Michigan, always wanted to live there.

Thank god Texas has Rick 'How does my hair look' Perry. I think the guy spends most the time looking in the mirror and the rest at people's reactions of him, like when he sits behind home plate at Astros games. (He not an Astros fan)

In Houston when Rita was about to (not) hit, Bill White sent out a message to every household saying 'Stay home if you haven't already left, your car is a death trap'. Thank you Bill, I'll be sure to stay in my 'death trap' home. Better to die at home than on the road, right?

A few months back one of the state legislators tried to get a bill to pass (and I think he did it) that outlawed dirty cheerleader dancing. Basicaly, HS cheerleaders cannot gyrate the hips at any more than a 1/3 circular motion within a 1 second variable, may not have their legs spread out further than a 70 degree angle while jumping, definitely cannot bend over at the hips more than a 15 degree decline, etc, etc,...

My state has gone south....