Why are we the only civilization?

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posted on Sep, 23 2003 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by nyeff
I think scientists have a hard admitting they may be wrong. They scoffed at the idea that dinosaurs may have evolved into birds. They scoff at the idea the the Sphinks maybe older than we believed. They have spent so many years believing things are a certain way,they can believe nothing else.

Yeah, sometimes scientists can be just as dogmatic as any fundamentalist religion...

Even according to archeologists own estimates, they claim that there was a period of human history that shows no evidence of social or technological change for over 500,000 years. That's a *lot* of time for "no changes" to have taken place...Especially when you consider that we "modern" humans have gone from Broadswords to ICBM's in just a few hundred years.

It's also a lot of time for a civilization to rise, fall & rot into obscurity. After all, except for plastics, there's not a heck of a lot that we can maufacture today that would last half-a-million years for future archeologists to dig up. I think a lot of people tend to underestimate how long a half-a-million years actually *is*.




posted on Sep, 24 2003 @ 04:08 PM
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Gazrok -
how do you explain the discovery of ancient skeletons that have had brain surgery performed? or that have been struck by what looks like projectile weapons?
or the remnants of a foundry near mongolia? or primitive batteries? or obviously machined metal objects imbedded inside coal and rocks? and as was mentioned before, there are multiple sites around the world, like 5 or 7, with abnormally high levels of radiation in the ground. there's only one source of extreme radiation poisoning.


onward and upward



posted on Sep, 24 2003 @ 04:20 PM
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BS,

hey I like that name!

officially astronomers as little as 10 years ago were saying that there are no other known planets in the universe outside of our solar system.

now when I asked academics how that could be when even a child would find it logical to believe that indeed there was their response always was: there is no imperical proof thus we cannot believe it.

Oh!

well they didn't know what caused disease until they invented the microscope. They couldn't see far in space until they had the Hubble telescope.

So tell me, how do they know what is burried 1000 feet down there anyways? Consider, ice ages, floods, asteroid impacts, major fires, earthquakes and nuclear wars and their effects.

One of my favourite sci-fi series (a great topic for a thread by the way), was the planet of the apes series. You remember when the apes were shocked to find that their view of the world was all wrong. We are the apes man.



posted on Sep, 24 2003 @ 06:22 PM
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Why should people in general be so nieve as to think that strip mining, ecological waste and destroying everything around as being the only way technology can go? Just as evolution has branched many highly sophistacated animals, surely the mind can branch out along many different paths of technology?
Archeologists have discovered many crystal objects with "no obvious value". Todays scientists are "discovering" that they can imprint information on crystals similiar to computer usage. Ancient and primitive people have always known crystals harbour and change energy.
Another example of a different route would be the Ice Age man discovered in the glacier. He had acupuncture marks, carried medicinals; not bad for a primative! Oh... that's right... acupuncture and herbs have started becoming mainstream...
Okay, how about this: Our planet is full of erosion. As many people have stated, earthquakes, rainstorms, mudslides, volcanoes... everything takes away. Since New York sits along a fault line, what would be left if a 'quake happens there? Rubble. Maybe the land will shift abit, bringing the waterline closer. Give a good 1000 years... the concrete would have turned to powder or mere pebbles/ rocks. The metal would have rusted, broken down to its bases. People would have rotted away, along with books. Future explorers... if they excavated under the layers of rubble... would simply find (if there was no fire or nuclear electric plant fallout) "intersting plastic fragments, probably used for skinning animals" (there is a zoo there, so New Yorkers may have hunted elephants).
Now, when I stated that mankind would forget the advanced past, it seems to me that others automatically asume this civilization must by world-wide. Why? The Americas weren't officially discovered until 1492... ntarctica later than that, most of the Pacific Islands WAY after that. People are assuming that lands don't sink, mountians could never have been below water. Anyway, let me elaborate my "forget" statement.
Does an electrician know how to build a hydro-generator? Could a customer service operator tell you how to build a fiber optic network? Could *gasp* an Internet user build functioning modems or cable connections?
Could an auto mechanic build an airplane? That one... maybe. But only if they had the tools, the resources, and the need to do it. If a world-wide catastrophy happened, what resources would people have? Electricity (if they used it) would be gone. Try as they may, it might not come up... especially if the catastrophy was an earthquake or meltdown. Gas would be gone (again, if they used it)... the pumps wouldn't work. Communications, with the exception of walkie talkies, would also be gone... or stretched out until the last batter was stolen or looted.
Looting would be grand scale! When frightened, do people go "hey, we're civilized. Let's get together and discuss what has happened, form a committee to resolve how to..."? No. We go back to our basic natures. Survival.
People may carry books and photos with them. Some of us would maybe even teach our children about how we lived. But honestly... how long would you carry your library with you before you realized you could carry a simple but needed shelter, or extra food, or your own frightened child?
We would try to live the best we can, by our ways. We would use guns to hunt, but what when there are no more bullets? We would use first-aid kits... until it was empty. We would have to discover again how to use bows and stones, herbs and other natural remedies. Our children will grow up seeing this, become better at it.
Our children would be the stone age (okay, maybe our grandchildren)... but they will still remember we had flying machines, a magic that could light the world making it day whenever we wanted. THEIR children would be told those stories, and so on and so on.
Eventually, they will be like us, having "evolved" again from stone through bronze, from steam to nuclear. They will hear and read about the old legends of gods that walked among men, bringing lightning from the heavens, flying between the planets. There would be no trace of this... everything was destroyed; earthquake, fire, meltdown, a great flood, whatever. Because the landscape has changed, there would be no obvious place to start to find "us". Granted, there might be a monument or two, dedicated to so god-figure (the Washington Monument or Lincoln Memorial... boy if those don't look like temples), but our children's children... would they just write them off as temples, or as an unexplained site (like Teotihuacan)? Or maybe, if California breaks apart from American, or England sinks, would those be another Atlantis or Mu?
People forget. If a comet hit the world right now, could we rebuild? I for one would think no. Our decendants might, but not us. I just hope they won't treat us in the same manner we treat our ancestors.



posted on Oct, 23 2003 @ 08:03 PM
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great points soothsayer...and the biggest of all being the fact that people today assume a highly advanced culture would of had to have been advanced in the same way as we are. Wh? Our advancement is unnatural, however much I love my PC. I think high civilization with an alternate form of science to have been much more likely that another bunch of people like us......



posted on Oct, 23 2003 @ 11:32 PM
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garzok...
bullsnot...

you are the weakest links goodbye...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 09:29 AM
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I know this topic has been closed more or less, and that people thing Garzok and Bullsnot were the weakest link.

What if it however turns out you both have just a piece of the puzzle?

The party which won, won because there is no arguing about the existence of the buildings. They said that the civilisation which would have build those buildings, and where written down and later concerned as myths and religions, could have been destroyed by a world catostraphe.

What however if Garzok and Bullsnot could have used the same arguments which you used, against you? Why should you probably think, you are talking of the Gods as the civilisation which could be gone under, they where the ones with the mighty weapons, with the airplanes, which build the buildings etc.

The same writings which you use however also say that the Gods stil live, that there civilisation didn't died, that they helped Jesus just 2.000 years ago.

You may explain to me why all the religions say that the Gods are still alive and helped Jesus just 2.000 years ago... while you say that they came back to a technological zero level...

Or do Garzok and Bullsnot have also a bit the truth in their hands when they say that is almost impossible that it was really an earthy civilisation... and you have both a piece of the puzzle which just has to be put together...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 10:10 AM
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I believe the text he refers to is the "Mahabharata"

heres a related site


www.nexusmagazine.com...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 11:50 AM
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because the "god"(supposed) of physicality (satan) has lost at most of his attempts to have us by his side, and he figured maybe if i make the world ignorant and tell them what i want them to know that they will be subserviant and serve only me (the flesh) well he was gravely wrong regardless of how much disinformation one puts out people revel in the ability to make choices, and by limiting these choices people revel in the ability to rebel...
so he has lost before and he will continue loosing untill those who trully follow him end up like the grays with no reproductive organs and technology used for the bidding of its master, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha....
untill the father returns and banishes those to a firey pit(sun?) wanna worship it why not be in it, ha ha ha ha ...

so we are not the only civilization that has been played tricks on and we probably wont be the last, but those that don't outlast will have for themselves their greatest time with him and his minions(souless i might add) spacefaring for someone else...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 12:04 PM
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Originally posted by bigsage
because the "god"(supposed) of physicality (satan) has lost at most of his attempts to have us by his side, and he figured maybe if i make the world ignorant and tell them what i want them to know that they will be subserviant and serve only me (the flesh) well he was gravely wrong regardless of how much disinformation one puts out people revel in the ability to make choices, and by limiting these choices people revel in the ability to rebel...

so he has lost before and he will continue loosing untill those who trully follow him end up like the grays with no reproductive organs and technology used for the bidding of its master,


I think that people would pray that Satan helped them against the God which is so very good and nice. Satan didn't lose because evil loses always from good, he lost because not everyone wanted to die, because that would happen if they didn't follow the orders of the ow so nice God. Or didn't the 1/3th of the Angels had a reason to go with Satan (Lucifer - Bringer of light).

Satan didn't want power, because he knew he was going to lose and it would cost his live, perhaps he knew that the true God would let the people die by the Apocalyps, that the true God just wants to produce a race which obeys his will and doesn't take the persons which don't evolve just as fast (just read the Gospel of Thomas).

Perhaps Satan was the only help for the Egyptians in their battle against the God of Mozes, which let the whole Egyptian army drown.

Perhaps Satan just knew what the real intentions of the God was, and he (and the others) couldn't aprove it, because it is lacking all respect to live.

Perhaps we will see it in the year 2012, lets see how happy we will be with the God which we honoured so gladly for his Goodness.

Ps. I don't think I have to answer to the idea that they literally meant the sun, with tens of thousands of pages written it doesn't seems very likely to me, also because there are more religions which claim the same...

[Edited on 3-11-2003 by LeenBekkemaa]



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 12:35 PM
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when you say true you say it as though men are naturally false?
is this the case?

or are men told to be false for the benefit of an infrastructure, for if all were true then all would be equal and if all were to be in such states in an infrastructure then it would be difficult to impose ones will uppon another, right?

the problems i see i dont attribute to the persons facing them i look at myself do you...
do you really look at your contribution to the problems persons are facing today, yet if you are caught up in the rapture i can see how you would overlook issues and judge the next man for his issues...

dont get me wrong i live with my sacrifices but do you?
do you impose on others your sacrifices?



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 12:45 PM
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the problems i see i dont attribute to the persons facing them i look at myself do you...
do you really look at your contribution to the problems persons are facing today, yet if you are caught up in the rapture i can see how you would overlook issues and judge the next man for his issues...

dont get me wrong i live with my sacrifices but do you?
do you impose on others your sacrifices?
-------------------------------------------------------------

I am trying to save menkind, although you would probably don't think so. God is however very clear, and that's perhaps not the clearity as you see in your religion.

Perhaps a person understands that God doesn't like persons who follow, but like the persons who think, who are one of a thousand, and two out of ten thousand, perhaps the God made it very clear that we have to be ready for him as a rebble to come, that he will let the Apocalyps happen if there aren't those kind of persons among us...

Perhaps some persons give sacrifices which do seem stupid in your eye's well perhaps it could be just that the instinct of 2 million years is still taken over, not realising the real threat, because the instinct didn't face such threats before...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 12:56 PM
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the only person who can save a man is himself not you or any other being...
for that one man has a connection with the father of creation...

now if you are here to provide assistince with that spiritual journey then that different but wait you just said your trying to save humanity, from what?...

this battle between you and i will not stop, and i know who my opponent is so i know what side of the field you play...
just because your avatar is that of abraham does not mean you are of divinity, divinity comes form within not from others views about your beliefs...

any questions comments or concerns...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:00 PM
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i never mentioned my status regarding religion/ you did...

i never mentioned rebelious actions/ you did...

and i care not of odds/ you do...

sounds like a man who moves with fear in his heart not faith, wanna repent and spill the beans?...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:09 PM
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I don't have the feeling that this discussion will lead us anywhere, so I think it is better to stop, if you don't I will.

Ps. I believe you when you say you think you know persons like me, but remember "the end is where the beginning is".



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:21 PM
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And here I thought I was just asking about lost civilizations...

Never imagined it'd lead to a religious debate...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:23 PM
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i know myself and knowing myself i know what you are capable of...

very big difference...



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:28 PM
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Bigsage you are giving people a stamp on their abilities, do you have the feeling that that's fair?

And Soothsayer, I hope it isn't such a big problem, I could stop if you want to, because I understand this is not were the topic is meant for. I am new here, so I don't know yet all the rules etc.



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:32 PM
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Seriously, it's okay... more points for me, anyway.



posted on Nov, 3 2003 @ 01:34 PM
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and love...

but certainly not self imposed will, people are free to choose what they want to believe the father will love them regardless...

but your "living god"/seraphim/lizard being will want retributionand not from me, so deal with it, i have made no deals with the devil...





 
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