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How to control People

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posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 06:16 PM
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Slimjazz, you don't have to do any experiments, just look at all the money "selfactualization" gurus, "life coaches" and "prosperity now" or "only we can save your soul" churches keep raking in without actually delivering.

People put faith and hope in these sorts of promises even when their friends and loved ones warn them against such paths then blame themselves when they don't get the pay off and try another, doomed to fail, "system" in the hope that the lie, well sold to us, that, "you can do/be/get whatever you put your mind to" will come true for them.

Already 'generation Y' people, who have had the biggest dose of this lie, are recognized as suffering emotional and mental health problems to the point of suicide but they keep selling the lie all the more. Maybe it is population control as well....




posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 01:49 AM
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so then tell me this...starting with children...what is the best way to educate children to think for themselves and not be controled...just like I'd never want any kind of unrighteous dominion opposed upon myself or children...how can I teach them say the importance of being respectfully obedient to their parents, while thinking for themselves and aware of the world around them...the real one not sold on TV and taught in public schools...?

This is not an exclusive parenting question, it has to do with control because while I don't want to raise paranoid social outcasts, I do want to raise children who think for themselves and recognize the control-especially the mind-emotional control that begins with childhood TV programing/comercials.

I am serious

I was drawn to this thread because I've been witnessing very very scary mind control and emotional conditioning in children's programing...there is this huge hidden agenda and when I try to talk to toehrs about this...well you know...it's like trying to ask them to ponder tha fact our presidents always seem to come from secret socieites...lol...

Of course I'm just paranoid...and I'm going to do my children more harm than good if I don't let them wacth education shows and if I try to let them but educate them myself that there is a certain agenda...then I'm going to mess them up psychologically and doom them to mental illness or social isolation

For instance if you ask my son what comercials are REALLY for he'll answer "for tricking you" and if you probe further, and ask "tricking you, why?" he will think andanswer "to gt you to buy their stuff?" and why would they do that? "to get you to give them your money" and there are many more reasons than that and various reason they want you to spend your money and be a consuer for which they are grooming preschoolers to be...

O am I teaching him to be aware of hidden agendas, or am I grooming him to be paranoid? Thats why I ask here...because every person-parent or not-I know IRL says I'm going to "scare" my kids by talking of such "hypothetica" "conspiracy theroies" but holy hell you should see what is going on in the world of contrling and molding the minds of pershoolers...but no one (I know of) does

...because either they don't undertstand/recognize it...or they don't even know what their kids are watching...the contect of the shows they use as babysitters or the comericals that sell to these young kids minds...

[edit on 29-11-2005 by think2much]



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 02:40 AM
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I liked the article on the original link. Very informative and I like the style that it maintained throughout. Thanks for the link I will be sure to save it in my favorites! Please note: I added that exclamation point for sarcastic reasons, but I actually did add it to my favorites.


I think it is a straightforward observation of life. It is hard to argue, however, not impossible and therefore not a tautology. I think is is simply a "bird's eye veiw", or rather un-biased veiw of the world. It assumes people agree with it, because it is not an argument.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 03:55 AM
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Originally posted by think2much
For instance if you ask my son what comercials are REALLY for he'll answer "for tricking you" and if you probe further, and ask "tricking you, why?" he will think andanswer "to gt you to buy their stuff?" and why would they do that? "to get you to give them your money" and there are many more reasons than that and various reason they want you to spend your money and be a consuer for which they are grooming preschoolers to be...

O am I teaching him to be aware of hidden agendas, or am I grooming him to be paranoid? Thats why I ask here...because every person-parent or not-I know IRL says I'm going to "scare" my kids by talking of such "hypothetica" "conspiracy theroies" but holy hell you should see what is going on in the world of contrling and molding the minds of pershoolers...but no one (I know of) does

...because either they don't undertstand/recognize it...or they don't even know what their kids are watching...the contect of the shows they use as babysitters or the comericals that sell to these young kids minds...

[edit on 29-11-2005 by think2much]


Thats not paranoia though thats just the truth, there is a difference. Its not a conspiracy that adverts are there to get your cash, anyone who thinks it is, is pretty stupid and naieve about the world.
Children dont take things as seriously as parents, they will be fine without alot of brainwashing about secret societies and things like that. Brainwashing is never a good idea especially at a young age.
Sounds like your son knows the deal but he' will turn into a normal adult just like anyone else and eventualy have his own opinion.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 06:40 AM
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Is race tension a type of control mechanisim? maybe it is? who knows think of it, centuries ago, the Greeks, studied with the Egyptians, the europeans, with the phonecians, arabs, what have you, what changed? Who changed it?


Bless



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 12:22 PM
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Thats not paranoia though thats just the truth, there is a difference. Its not a conspiracy that adverts are there to get your cash, anyone who thinks it is, is pretty stupid and naieve about the world.



Well yeah Adam J-thats why I use that example though because it is an obvious accepted fact -advertising is to get the dollar...duh-(though you'd be surprised at the amount of advertising a kid comes in contact with in 30 minutes of tv watching!)

....BUT because I am considered a "conspiracy theorist" by many of my family and friends/peers on "other issues" some people think that I'm going to somehow doom my children by my "extreme paranoia" and they'd use the fact I've taught him not to trust "comercials and everything he sees on tv" as "proof" I'm screwing them up or something-when all I want is him to learn to think for himself and not be drawn in by every freakin ad he sees!!

I would never want my children to have a scarey view of the world some evil sinister place or brainwash them in anyway about anything mind you...

However to share the real point that inspired my question, there is an obvious-to-me agenda in ALOT of children programing. Not the advertisements, mind you which I can reduce by choosing PBS, but still be it PBS or Nick Jr or some other children's network, there is often a very subtle message I see clearly and clearly do not approve of.

They are all geared towards the "Im Ok, you're OK" philosophy, which you'd think -great. Teach them to feel good about themselves and not to judge others and embrace their differences...rGood, right?

...there is constant talk/skits/stories/animations/lessons/teaching of how it's ok to have red curly hair when everyone else does not...or ok if you were born different than others, or OK if you have to wear leg braces, are in a wheel chair etc...the message is "we're all the same on the inside" and other differences don't matter, and even all family units are different a mom and a Dad is not what makes a family, a child and any caregiver or set of caregivers equals a family and embace all our differences....blah blah blah-viva la difference!

Ok, fine-whatever-I'm all for that

...but there is this huge undertone (as I'll call it) that drags the watcher away subconsciously with another message...which is all done in a way of expressing that "while it's ok to look different, and been born different, have physical challenges, and need various aparatus for every day life and come from various backgounds and home environments...it's all ok...everyone will accept you just the way you are and embrace all of your differences....

...AS LONG AS YOU THINK LIKE THEM/BEHAVE LIKE THEM-EVERYONE ELSE

The message is often so clear that it's ok to look different, be different in physical abilities, etc....but as long as you think like everyone else you will ALWAYS fit in

...because differences in looks and abilities are what makes us so great...but differences in thinking and opinion...well, thats the only thing thats NOT OK, that is BAD, that is WRONG, and will leave you lonely and isolated...we can all be equal and exactly alike brought together by the common bond of thinking/believing/acting as a group-and then your individual differences or flaws will never be noticed or always be tolerated or even appreciated.

Thinking differently from the group, thus behaving differently, is the only thing that isn't tolerated...so be who you are and who you were born as etc and don't judge others on the outside....and as long as you think and behave like everyone else you'll always be accepted and loved and everything is coming up roses :-)

blech

like I said, I am not good at expressing things, but I have an acute awareness about even the most subtle of messages...look at the correspondence between crusader and orangetom-I pick it all up and know more than they could ever know I know because I could never express it-I'm cursed....

(especially on some of those topics-literally I'm damned in communicating)

Anyway I just like to observe and absorb anyway...

But my point is I don't miss nearly as much as one might think, and I see much more than most, or more than most realize, and while I am not a fantatic about anything, I do want my kids to know it is PARAMOUNT in life to NOT be CONTROLED by or in their thought or swayed by popular opinion and always THINK FOR THEMSELVES...

but here is the worst part...it is the beneficial "educational" shows that I consistanly see this subtle agenda pushed....my kids are better off watching something mindless like scooby doo than something "educational" - b/c scooby doo teaches nothing, and better nothing than some type of anti-freethinking BS!

and yet it's also these shows-the "educational" ones- that go least monitored by parents! They figure it's educational-it has to be good...or it's PBS there are no comercials and it's educational...bonus! but it's not that easy....

...and they have no idea of what I'm talking about because they don't watch or pay attention anyway...but worse is the almost usually agree with the agenda....that thinking like everyone else is a GOOD idea!

They are busy keeping up with the Joneses even comaparing kids in daycare/preschool ...they are grooming their kids themselves to "fit-in" ...and then I realize I am very alone in objecting to this agenda-as even parents have their own type of "my kid must fit in" objective and they go to great lengths and measures to make sure they do...so it's like they've bought into the same propaganda...actually many of them live it themselves...thinking as a herd that their kids too must fit in or else they as adults wont fit in with the other parents in society...

it's like stepford parenting-and gotta tell ya-it scares the hell out of me!

Anyway, I do want my kids to ""fit in" enough to be sociable and be happy and able to "play the games" necessary in society/life and be productive and successful etc...

but not at the cost of their freaking own will and freedom of thought

Ya know? I want them in control of their thoughts and their destiny-their future-their minds

and I'm not sure how to do it

And if there are agendas targeting my children in their freakin preschool years, I feel I too should counter some of it with teaching them to think for themselves-and the concept of thinking independantly as an accompishment...

...of course while NOT alarming them or trying to uncover/explain any consipracies for them-LOL-I want to find a healthy way to make sure they know , even on the inside, it's ok to question what they are being taught...ALWAYS and BY ANYONE ...and to think about what message they are recieving...even beyond what is being outwardly presented sometimes (Ok, this opne for my schoolaged sons)

But because my kids are in public school and I am not their teacher, 8 hours of their day soemone else is feeding their brain...so yeah, my preschoolers....I can turn off the TV, but I'm not about to ban my kids from TV entirely, and I do try to be selective and when I see the subliminal or subtle messages I don't approve of in children't programing I turn it off, turn the channel, (scooby doo, anyone?) or try to ask my children what they think of that to see if they are picking anything up from it...like what is the message and is their a flip side to it?

but what else can I do...without being over the top, you know? Just be aware and monitor TV and what is being taught in class I suppose... ah and hang out with a few deep thinkers on govt control/mind control and hope I pick up things beneficial along the way...

but I'm still scared as hell for my kids-but I'd never let them know it-like I said, I'm trying to counter brainwashing not add to the confusion or do any brainwashing of my own



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 12:59 PM
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Well thats understandable and normal.

I think they'll be fine. Doubtless they will make up their own mind.
I think as long as you fit in and you are happy with who you are, your kids will likely be as well.
They have you to look after them and you are clearly doing that.

The agenda is there into adult programs as well, in the uk we have soaps, im not sure how popular they might be in the us, kinda baywatch type things. But they have a very clear social programming message.
I dare you to watch one of the hollywood action blockbuster by one of the 'great' directors, and not see the brainwashing.
Not all of them but a vast majority of them follow the same script and have the same very, very obvious programming effects.

I think the conform and fit in agenda is part of American society, you cannot really avoid it if you live there. Its the same in most nationalities probably.
As you are observant you may have noticed unlike most americans probably that your society is not going too well at the moment. Lots of crime, prison population, teenage pregnancies, drug usage, gangs, etc. Figures are getting worse not better
There are other parts of the country or even the world where these problems are lesser in there extent.

As long as you have different opinions on things they will pick that up off you as they grow up, just dont try and force it thats my opinion, as that will only have negative effects.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 01:33 PM
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Yeah Adam, I know you're probably right it just really pisses me off. I think since becoming a parent and living for them and because of my kids in some sense-I am just so protective of them-and their minds.

Like you cite that crap they're always pushing in movies-yeah we all can see that and it rolls off for the most part (lets hope) but I worry about kids and I was honestly surprised to see these messages on children's programs...it shook me up thinking I can't even trust educational shows not to have a freakin agenda!

but of course my family's apathy in comparrison is so what-who cares if they are like everyone else...better than being outcasts.

now mind you...my family jokes of my paranoia, when I propose such scenerios and I don't mind but otherwise I'm as seemingly normal as anyone else...sometimes I play dumb just to see where peaople really are and stand...and am scrared of what I find! LOL But I'm no conspiracy chicken little-just concerned



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 01:36 PM
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your concerns are not without foundation. I think you are on to something.

You dont want your kids to be a xerox copy of what they see in thier peer group or on some advertisement from television. Stamped out ..no individuality while decieving themselves by "Im ok your ok".

They should not be ignorant of the world but just not totally a part of it..especially inside where it really counts.

I believe this is what you are getting at with your concerns.

I dont know how many children you have but choose your investment in them carefully. Many a parent has lost thier children to the world and world system...wholesale and to thier regret. When they get on this drug it is difficult to get them off of it..it has a way of appealing to the ego very strongly. Sometimes later in life they get enough of this world and reverse course when they finally catch on. Sometimes not . This is why I say ..choose your investment carefully and wisely.


Thanks,
Orangetom



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 02:09 PM
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I agree your opinions are correct, im certainly not disagreeing with any of them.

The question is what can you do and the answer is, i think, from thinking about it alot, not very much.



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 02:40 PM
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intresting article on eugenics and control

www.radioliberty.com...



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 03:23 PM
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This is one of the reasons I'm so pro-fulltime, hands on parenting. T.V., movies, 'youth' radio and 'soft porn' magazines are out in the world of their friends so they will be subjected to drip fed propaganda but 'mentioning' 'tricks' you notice when you watch and read WITH them, from an early age, being there to pick 'receptive' times to raise a 'relevent' issue in 'context', does arm them for the future. They will fall for bits of it along the way but when they hit that higher education stage of discussing 'the meaning of life', they will remember and recognize the 'tricks' you showed them that are used to control their thinking. Something no teenager wants to be accussed of is, not being 'individual'.

For instance, one of my kids went through the, "Everything is evil to you" ribbing stage, to which I'd counter, "Not everything but it pays to know what's not right." In this rebellious, 'I know everything', age, he got into rap and hip-hop, but it was the God and Bible believing artists that made sence to him and earned his respect. Now in his twenties he still likes to point out lines of truth and justice to me, a 'manly' way of letting me know he 'gets it' and is greatfull.

If I had 'banned' everything 'evil' the novelty of it when they got out in the world on their own would have held more attaction but by letting them compare the effects of 'unquestioning following' and the methods used to achieve it, with a loving, INVOLVED home life that discussed trends, fashions and the reasons and methods used to sell them, they've grown to regularly point out methods of manipulation that disgust them, from stuff in the news to public transport systems that keep the rich from being 'bothered' by the poor.

When your teenage daughter can go to two 'formals' in outfits that from hair to shoes cost less the the other girls makeup and get baggered for fashion tips, you know your kid's pretty safe.

Three out of three, they arn't dissimilar to Huey from The Boondocks comic strip, exept they have a riotous sence of humour, hope and enjoy and seek out their fellow siblings company. We didn't scare them with paranoid propaganda but rather laughed at all the nonsence out there.

As to the, "I'm o.k., you're o.k.", "you can be/do/get whatever you set your mind to", curse of generation 'Y', at an intro. to year 12 lecture, the winner of Australian Idol, who didn't even make the first cut her first two attemps, was held up as an example of being able to achieve whatever you put your mind to. My kid stood up and pointed out the other 25.000 who didn't and never would make it because they can't sing. That finding what you could do and doing it well is better than going nuts from years of being a failure at something you never had the talent for. She was proud to tell us that she actually got in trouble at school, something that never happens to her, and why. We were proud she spoke out to help de-stress her overstressed school mates.

[edit on 29-11-2005 by suzy ryan]



posted on Nov, 29 2005 @ 04:02 PM
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Though the font and background of Crusaders link to, Popullation control and Eugenics, above, is hard on the eyes to read, I do recomend folk give it their time and deep concideration.

[edit on 29-11-2005 by suzy ryan]



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 02:05 PM
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Very intresting article about population control. I have read several articles on this subject of population control over the years ...most outlining UN involvement and mentioning peoples names going back into the 1930s.
This womans name ...Margarete Sanger keeps showing up along with others as prominent movers in this population control program.

I am currently reading a book on the evangelist Billy Graham. It is a very informative book as it mentions alot of peoples names who were instrumental in his movement and rise to popularity. Among those names was Margarete Sanger on population control.

The figures I am hearing is that in a world population of about 7 to 8 billion the plans are to get the population down below 2 billion. If these figures are incorrect ..someone please bring me up to date on this. The matter at issue is how this will be accomplished.

I bookmarked that article and will save it for future reference. Thanks.

Orangetom



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 03:59 PM
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When I was heavily involved in animal breeding it was hard not to notice how much time, money and effort was put into the science of reproduction and disease that ultimately had little, no or a negative benifit to the industry but added to the 'science' that eugenisists use to promote their world view.

The, money in, money out, maths just didn't add up which lead me, in the search for understanding, to come across a number of people who still activly promote eugenics. "Ugly" people with ugly ideas and alot of political power.



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 04:31 PM
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Originally posted by orangetom1999
Very intresting article about population control. I have read several articles on this subject of population control over the years ...most outlining UN involvement and mentioning peoples names going back into the 1930s.
This womans name ...Margarete Sanger keeps showing up along with others as prominent movers in this population control program.

I am currently reading a book on the evangelist Billy Graham. It is a very informative book as it mentions alot of peoples names who were instrumental in his movement and rise to popularity. Among those names was Margarete Sanger on population control.

The figures I am hearing is that in a world population of about 7 to 8 billion the plans are to get the population down below 2 billion. If these figures are incorrect ..someone please bring me up to date on this. The matter at issue is how this will be accomplished.

I bookmarked that article and will save it for future reference. Thanks.

Orangetom






Well, the fact ofn the matter they could only try to, control population growth, have you ever heard about Henry kissinger 1975? report? on Population control, esp in 3rd world countries?



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 05:17 PM
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Distraction also works- like Angelina and the whole "witch-weirdo rich girl thing", or as we call it here in the states "Gossip" or "Celebrity News", hence the reason they need to exsist in the US at all. I know, I know, I know, I'm the last person who should say that from the book by JOHN SKORUPSKI called "Symbol and Theory". Also it's in "The Art of War" and "The Prince" as "nobels, actors, artistians, and minstrials"- need I say more.



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 05:20 PM
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Originally posted by think2much
so then tell me this...starting with children...what is the best way to educate children to think for themselves and not be controled...just like I'd never want any kind of unrighteous dominion opposed upon myself or children...how can I teach them say the importance of being respectfully obedient to their parents, while thinking for themselves and aware of the world around them...the real one not sold on TV and taught in public schools...?

This is not an exclusive parenting question, it has to do with control because while I don't want to raise paranoid social outcasts, I do want to raise children who think for themselves and recognize the control-especially the mind-emotional control that begins with childhood TV programing/comercials.

I am serious

I was drawn to this thread because I've been witnessing very very scary mind control and emotional conditioning in children's programing...there is this huge hidden agenda and when I try to talk to toehrs about this...well you know...it's like trying to ask them to ponder tha fact our presidents always seem to come from secret socieites...lol...

Of course I'm just paranoid...and I'm going to do my children more harm than good if I don't let them wacth education shows and if I try to let them but educate them myself that there is a certain agenda...then I'm going to mess them up psychologically and doom them to mental illness or social isolation

For instance if you ask my son what comercials are REALLY for he'll answer "for tricking you" and if you probe further, and ask "tricking you, why?" he will think andanswer "to gt you to buy their stuff?" and why would they do that? "to get you to give them your money" and there are many more reasons than that and various reason they want you to spend your money and be a consuer for which they are grooming preschoolers to be...

O am I teaching him to be aware of hidden agendas, or am I grooming him to be paranoid? Thats why I ask here...because every person-parent or not-I know IRL says I'm going to "scare" my kids by talking of such "hypothetica" "conspiracy theroies" but holy hell you should see what is going on in the world of contrling and molding the minds of pershoolers...but no one (I know of) does

...because either they don't undertstand/recognize it...or they don't even know what their kids are watching...the contect of the shows they use as babysitters or the comericals that sell to these young kids minds...

[edit on 29-11-2005 by think2much]


If you have cable, just put it on parental control by content or channel, you no No Cartoon Network etc., Because I've "Gracing" children's shows, so it's easier to handle kids at work(grocer), and I've been noticing that too. They have this "Must be on Bandwagon=individualist kinda theme" for kids these days. It's freaky.
-Even on some disney shows, since that and PBS(in the states) is as good as it will get for little kids. Sorry.



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 05:24 PM
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Stuff they don't tell you about Celebrity life:Note: I posted this on 2 BSB board sites.

Here's some articles I found on the net, their not CT stuff, so don't worry a bout the sites. I think these articles can make everyone here, understand how stuff works. Feel free to post on other boards if you want to.
www.findarticles.com... meltdowns(how and why they meltdown like they do)

www.psychologytoday.com...- Celebrity obesseion by people, normfans, stalkers, and pyschos. LOL- I can name like a million fan fics about this subject and the first one.

www.findarticles.com...- Celebrity Creation by Psychology Today(a psychotyrpheist Cosmo mag!)

www.sharelynx.net...- An article By David Giles( makes you wonder if he knows Rupert?)LOL


Everything you wanted to know about the best public distraction tool since fictional enemies.


[edit on 11/30/05 by bsbfan1]



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 06:41 PM
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I am just not attracted to celebrity news..or perhapsed it is because I think there is something very wrong with what they think is celebrity or worthy of fame.

Somehow I dont think Hollywood...is a good example or standard for how the rest of us should live our lives. Nashville either for all that matter..or the whole music industry would be more accurate.
Mind you now...I am aware that all of Hollywood and Nashville are not like this..I just disapprove of what the pulp magazines and tabloids hold up for us to adore. Just not intrested in this type of puppet string. I have real problems in my life..I dont need this extra baggage and then pay for this as a required standard of living.
As I stated in earlier posts...it amazes me ..and it shouldnt do so ...as to how many people today try to describe some part of their lives or morality by some movie line or scene they have seen. They have no real life experiences outside of television and movies. No thanks. Im not intrested in Hollywood or Music...gods. Not intrested in this type of control.

Thanks,
Orangetom



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