Everybody ready to bust out the champagne for the 2000 mark?

Originally posted by DiRtYDeViL
How do we know his views, he's dead? If there is a heaven or hell or after life he is probably madder then hell knowing he died for nothing. Not even for America’s security or defending the constitution but for a bunch of republican crooks.

'

Now Dirty, please dont allow me to lose any respect for you before you have had a chance to gain any. Your reply here has basicaly told me you have read nothing of this case. Please do some homework before making such comments. If I had the time, I would post the resources for you, but I dont so you will need to do the work yourself.

Look up Cindy Sheehan and read a little bit, read from both sides. Then respond.

I have read about her. Just not Rush lumbaughs version sorry.

Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by nb25



hey ANOK,
America- love it or leave it.
how dare you bad mouth a just and noble mission. 2,000 dead is a lot......but we can't leave now and give terrorism fuel buddy, soon as we do we will get hit again. and we have to protect the Iraqis from zarqawi and al qadea. i don't see you serving in Iraq do I.

Obviously you haven't read too many of my posts here have you?

And who's badmouthing? Could you please explain that to me?

I was in the first Gulf War thankyou, served six years in the military. What have you done?

This is what I got for my service, along with osteoporosis, chronic fatigue syndrome, unexplainable joint pain and muscle pain, crippling back pain, depression, anxiety, and that's just the short list.
What have YOU done???

For your reading pleasure:
desert-storm.com...

[edit on 26/10/2005 by ANOK]

first of all........thank you for your service. Sounds like you have gulf war syndrome.

next, i am not some lazy fat guy sitting behind a computer. I am 5'8 and 140lbs. What have I done......well obviously they don't let a 16 year old American on the battlefield now do they? what do i plan to do? serve my country by using my welding skills. Welding the humvees back together after suicide bombings or car bombs......word is it pays $20 an hour. welp off to be brainwashed by the propaganda machine.

[edit on 26-10-2005 by nb25]

Originally posted by nb25
well obviously they don't let a 16 year old....

Well that explains it now doesn't it? Your attitude I mean.

When you grow up a little bit and get some life experience then come back and we'll have a chat. Until then please have some respect for those of us who have put our lives on the line. You have no right to give me attitude, keep your uninformed immature attitude to yourself and go do some homework or something. Particularly about what being is PATRIOT is really all about, to get you going it doesn't mean blindly excepting everything you are told by the powers that be. "Love it or leave it" would you have said the same thing if you were a German in the 1940's. Think about that.

Welding humvies for $20 an hour eh? Sounds like you're sure as hell helping yourself Jack. Again if you're not willing to put your life on the line, you have no right to make stupid comments about those that have.

"OSAMA BIN LADEN RECRUITS POOR MUSLIMS TO DIE FOR A RADICAL CAUSE....BUT IS NEVER WILLING TO TAKE THAT RIDE HIMSELF."~ PRES. GEORGE W BUSH

I just love that quote lol...From a man who went AWOL...Maybe it should read like this;

"George Bush recruits poor Americans to die for a radical cause...But is never willing to take that ride himself."~And we know THAT is a fact, don't we?

[edit on 26/10/2005 by ANOK]

oh i will put my life on the line......don't get me wrong.........see this is what i am talking about.....veterans claiming that todays generation is rap hip hop punks. personally i listen to country (george jones) and I respect my vets. my dad was in the air force, and my grandpa a vietnam vet. so don't say i won't defend my country.......i know something about duty honor and courage.

Originally posted by nb25
see this is what i am talking about.....veterans claiming that todays generation is rap hip hop punks.

Hey man don't put words in my mouth, I never made that claim. But it looks in this case that the hat fits though.
And actually I'll take rap and punk over country any day...lol You think listening to country makes you a true patriot American?

You know during WWII a lot of 16 year olds lied about their age so they could go fight against the fascist threat. How much do YOU really care? $20 an hours worth?

it ain't about the money........and i couldn't lie today to enlist...soon as i did they would need to see id......don't worry I have talked to the Natl. Guard at my school...and they are supposed to call on march 16 2006....when i am 17.

ha ha listening to rap makes you a patriotic american or listening to country makes you a patriotic american.......i never said that so ditto to you...don't put words in my mouth.......i was just making a generalization pal.
by the way.......that is a disgrace to the statue of liberty in your avatar.

[edit on 26-10-2005 by nb25]

[edit on 26-10-2005 by nb25]

Originally posted by ANOK
I just love that quote lol...From a man who went AWOL...

Wait! He went AWOL? I thought the campaign smear tactics were over now that Kerry lost the election. I don't believe I ever saw any proof other than the forged CBS documents, that the President was AWOL during his National Guard service. I'll stand corrected if there is actually evidence to prove otherwise, but I haven't seen it.

The 2000 mark is just another toy for the press to play with. Death 2000 is not any more important than death 23, or 164. They all count. If the press wants a real story why don't the focus on a real problem that kills over 1000 Americans every single month. DWI. Why hasn't anyone mentioned death 2000 this year in the DWI arena? The answer is that it's just not an issue they can use to swing a political axe.

ABC News
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration reported a 2 percent decrease in fatal crashes in 2004 involving at least a driver or a motorcycle rider with an illegal blood-alcohol level of 0.08 percent or higher. The government said 12,874 motorists died under those circumstances in 2004, compared with 13,096 in 2003.

Originally posted by skippytjc
That’s just it Biker, we all want to feel sorry for her loss. But she has ruined it.

Speak for yourself. There are as many people (if not more) who respect her and think she's great for what she's doing.

By the way, bikereddie, she has always been against the war. It was only after Casey died in April that she AND HER HUSBAND founded Gold Star Families for Peace and she became more active. It was only in August of this year when she went to Bush's ranch in Crawford that people began to know who she is.

He loved what he did and died doing it.

That's an assumption. Cindy Sheehan has said that he hated the war and did not support Bush, but went out of duty. That's different than love.

Cindy's very actions drag what her son believed in through the mud. It’s a direct slap in his face, and that’s what sicken me so about Cindy Sheehan.

That's your opinion. You think she's muddy, but plenty of people think she's squeaky clean. You don't know her son.

You know what? Other grieving families of this war despise her and protest Cindy's actions. They hate her for it.

You know what? Other grieving families of this war respect her and support Cindy's actions. They love her for it.

Why can’t she grieve in privacy and respect her son’s belief enough to shut her trap?

I hope your son never dies, but you can believe that if he does, I would jump on anyone who tried to dictate to you how you should grieve or for how long. If anyone attacked you for your greif or the way you chose to express it, I'd get your back. Just so you know.

On the contrary to what many of you said about Cindy just using her dead soldier son to further her opinions on war, I believe that Cindy does care for her dead son and is doing what is right which is to bring the troops home. From what I understand there has been reports that Cindy was distant to her dead son and has her own agenda but doesn't a mother's love stays no matter what? So I don't believe she is being self-fish and just using her dead son's name right?

Anyways, even if she is using her dead son's name, isn't she doing it for the benefit of America which is to withdraw the troops and stop further bloodshed to an almost pointless war in the Middle East? The mission in Iraq and Afghanistan is over, so beat it.

I know some of you would blast me with the terrorism, noble cause and liberation etc stuffs and I'll rebutt them all. Terrorism? Nah. Unless you see the Middle East as the terror paradise of the world. Noble cause? Maybe. Oh no! Now you're exploiting dead Arabs. Liberation? Of course, Saddam's down. Together with hundreds and thousands of dead Iraqis.

Originally posted by dbates
If the press wants a real story why don't the focus on a real problem that kills over 1000 Americans every single month.

I don't give a damn about what the press has to say. This is not about the press, it's about your fellow countrymen who you claim to care about.
All you care about is winning, no matter what the cost is.
Who gives a damn about DWI, nobody is forced to drink and drive. How can you even compare the two? That's worse than the WWII comparison.

What about the 10,000 dead since Gulf War one? What about the thousands sick from being used as guinea pigs?

You're all focusing on the 2000 dead like that's a reason to hate those that appose this stupid war.

Were you there putting your life on the line?
Those of us that did will be paying for that for the rest of our lives.
Where is this support you all claim to be giving now?

You guys are really digging deep to justify your beliefs. Easy to support something when it's not your ass on the line, your ass that's gonna be sick for the rest of your comfortable lives. Come and stand in my shoes for awhile and you'll change your mind real fast!

And back to your DUI analogy. If Cindy Sheehan was the mother of a guy who was killed by a drunk driver instead of in an illegal war, would you still be against her? Think about that.

So bush didn't go AWOL huh?
For your reading pleasure;
www.awolbush.com...
www.straightdope.com...
"After the November election Bush returned to Texas, but apparently didn't notify his old Texas guard unit for quite a while, if ever. The Boston Globe initially reported that he started putting in some serious duty time in May, June, and July of 1973 to make up for what he'd missed. But according to a piece in the New Republic, there's no evidence Bush did even that. Whatever the case, even though his superiors knew he'd blown off his duties, they never disciplined him."

And that was just from a quick search, I'm sure you'll find more on bush going awol if you look.

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Anyway, if we have come to the point were use American soldiers deaths to pass our agenda it has really become a sad day indeed.

Not as sad as president GW Bush spouting lies about the supposive WMD's that Iraq was said to have had to use against the U.S.A. that brought about the 2000 deaths of our soldiers, not to forget all the injuried and maimed soldiers too, plus all the Iraqi civilians that were killed in the proccess of our wonderful President wanting Saddam at all cost and Vice-President Tricky-Dicky getting his hands on the Iraqi oil . The day Bush and his thugs took the American people hostage when they took over the White House was the saddest day in American history, IMO, a very sad day indeed.

Break out the shampagne for the 2000 mark ?????? I don't think so !! The shampagne will be opened the day we're rid of GW Bush and his thugs for good. Here's an idea, Bush, his family and his thugs can all move to Iraq with my blessings and I know a lot of other people feel the same as I do.

Originally posted by skippytjc
Its too bad Cindy didnt think about the troops until the 2000th has been killed. Maybe if she stopped taking money from and being led around like a trained poodle by special interest groups long enough to actually care about these fine soldiers lives, she may be done grieving by now. Pathetic.

Where have you been hiding ??????? Cindy has been thinking about all our troops way before the 2000 mark !!!! What do you think she's been protesting so hard against this war for months on end now ??? Do you think Cindy's been out there for the fun of it ? Have you ever sat and listened to her or any of the other mothers/fathers/sisters/brothers/wives/husbands or children in-person that have lost loved ones due to Bush's BS that started this war in the first place ? I have ! Bush and Co have used our soldiers as a way to gain control over the Iraqi oil fields and to satisfy Georgie's need for revenge on Saddam for threatening his daddy's life, those are the ONLY reasons we are in Iraq ( IMO ) and thousands have died and been maimed, just to fill the lining of certain peoples pockets that GW Bush owed for helping him financially when he was running for President and to help get him re-elected.

But finally, at last the TRUTH is coming out about the Bush Adminstration's deception of their so-called facts as Bush stated for the reason to attack Iraq.

I hope that Fitzgerald hangs Bush and Co by their jewels when he gets done!!! serve them right !!!

[edit on 27-10-2005 by nanna_of_6]

Originally posted by DiRtYDeViL

Originally posted by skippytjc

Her son didnt share her views and was patriotic to the core,

How do we know his views, he's dead? If there is a heaven or hell or after life he is probably madder then hell knowing he died for nothing. Not even for America’s security or defending the constitution but for a bunch of republican crooks.

DD,
I agree 150 % to this statement you stated .
What I want to know is this....... Skippytjc, how do YOU know what Cindy's dead son or her other family member's think or feel ???? Are you a member of her family ????????? Do you know Cindy personally ???????? And what makes you think Cindy is being PAID to do what she has been doing ?????
You know, there are people that truely beleive in Cindy's cause and have the same beliefs as she does when it comes to this war, this President's BS and are willing to donate money for the cause that she represents !!

I would be interested in hearing your answers to my questions !

Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by nb25
see this is what i am talking about.....veterans claiming that todays generation is rap hip hop punks.

Hey man don't put words in my mouth, I never made that claim. But it looks in this case that the hat fits though.
And actually I'll take rap and punk over country any day...lol You think listening to country makes you a true patriot American?

You know during WWII a lot of 16 year olds lied about their age so they could go fight against the fascist threat. How much do YOU really care? $20 an hours worth?

Love your Avatar !!!!!!!!!

Originally posted by nanna_of_6
Love your Avatar !!!!!!!!!

Thank you nanna! And I love your comments, very well said!!

For that...

You have voted nanna_of_6 for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have one more vote left for this month.

Originally posted by nb25
it ain't about the money........and i couldn't lie today to enlist...soon as i did they would need to see id......don't worry I have talked to the Natl. Guard at my school...and they are supposed to call on march 16 2006....when i am 17.

ha ha listening to rap makes you a patriotic american or listening to country makes you a patriotic american.......i never said that so ditto to you...don't put words in my mouth.......i was just making a generalization pal.
by the way.......that is a disgrace to the statue of liberty in your avatar.

LOL you can't even tell the difference between an assumption and a question???
Did I say you think listening to country makes you a patriot? No I didn't, I asked if you think it does, because the way you said it made it appear that is what you meant.

It aint about the money? So why did you even bring it up? We don't miss a thing on this site, as you'll hopefully learn pretty quick. Your first post that totally bad mouthed me, and got it all totally wrong, sounded like money was exactly all you cared about.
You're going in the National Guard eh? Well good for you. But why not the regular military? Oh I know, they don't pay $20 an hour!! Yeah, it's not about the money.

If you are going to try it on with me buddy you better get your "you know what" straight. I was fighting for your so called freedom before you were even on this earth. You aint gonna win. Enjoy your $20 an hour you weekend worrier, leave the real work to the rest of us. Then think about us real patriots who did our time in the REAL military, who are now living on $800 a month cause we can't work anymore.

And you know what buddy? I'm not even American, yeah that's right I'm a bloody foreigner, but I served in your military and am suffering for your country.
You aren't even gonna do that for your own country, but you have the nerve to judge those that did!

You wonder why we "adults" think you kids are just a bunch of punks?
(actually I don't BUT you are changing my mind pretty fast, pls help your fellow kids if no one else)

And you had the nerve to U2U me and ask me what my problem is!

[edit on 27/10/2005 by ANOK]

i'm on ANOK's side for this post. I come from a family of vets that have done their service. From great-grandparents that fought in the Civil War to Vietnam. My great-grandfather fought for the Union side during the Civil War. My grandfather served in Germany after World War II and in Korea. I had an uncle KIA during Vietnam. So yeah I come from a long line of veterans.

By the way, don't get me started on rap music.

Anok,

I respect vets I want you to understand that , ok?

But I have a few questions...

A) You said yourself your an ex-serviceman but could you explain to me how we would "get them back"?
Whats the exit strategy? I mean does the US go crying to the UN for help? Do we let iraq descend into chaos and civil war?
Do we help them?

B) I think the comparision about the drink driving is quite the same, what about all the deaths that have happened in my country and yours due to drink driving, assualts, gang wars, etc. When you look at the results you start to wonder, wheres the real battlefield? Iraq or at home?

C) 2000 men and women dead from america is..well theres no real word for it..but you have to ask yourself, or more precisely ask those that did make it out. Was it worth it? Did THEY think it was "the right thing to do"?


Edit:
D) You made a comment earlier about "armchair" generals, I wanted to ask something. I support the war and frankly I have to ask, what do you want me to do?Go fight in the war?Stay at home?Finish my cadetship? Become a full comunist? What do you want me to do?

Yours respectfully DW.

[edit on 26/02/2005 by devilwasp]

Ever since there was no WMD found in Iraq I have been against the war. I know the west has a history of thinking they know what is best for everyone in the world and we have a history of following. However my main concern was never if the Iraqi's live how we think they should but whether or not the war would help protect my country. I certainly don't begrudge the Iraqi's freedom but it has been years and they can't seem to get the extremists under control. This suggests that they can't decide on what they want and anarchy is going to reign until they can come to some sort of consensus on where their country should be headed. No country can function with constant attacks and something needs to be done to adress this problem, sheer force does not seem to be having an effect. Whether they divide the country up into three regions or not i really don't care. Whatever happens it must be up to the Iraqi's because the west has a long history of not understanding other cultures and really messing them up, even when they had the best intentions in mind. Anyway like everyone else i just want this nightmare to end as happily as possible and the sooner the better, I don't know what the best course of action is but I'm tired of people dying.

[edit on 27-10-2005 by Sabre262]