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Why sinners hate God.

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posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:12 AM
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Ambient Sound,
Sure, I've made mistakes, and I do deliberately break various religious "laws" on a regular basis, but "sin" doesn't mean the same thing to you that it means to me. If I don't accept or believe in your version of God, then I am under no obligation to accept or believe in your definition of sin.


Ambient, does it really matter what you or I think sin is? If I say sin to me is a potato and you say sin to you is a flower, does that in any way change what sin truly is? When I say that you are a sinner I place myself in the same category. I’m also a sinner and in need of a saviour. The Bible says that everyone is a sinner, if you decide not to believe that simple fact that’s your choice.

Have you ever entered an archery competition by chance? When the archers shoot their arrows they try to hit the very center of the circle. If they miss the very center the judge cries out, “sinner!” It simply means that you have missed the mark. God's call for us is to live in perfect obedience to Him if we fall short of that then we are sinners as well.






Ambient Sound,
As far as labeling someone a "sinner", I think anyone who does so is commiting an act of arrogence and hubris. Sorry, thats what I believe. I expect that when Machine calls someone a sinner, he intends it as an insult in the worse and most derogatory way.


I’m only telling you what the Bible says about everyone including me. If I’m also a sinner and I recognize that fact how do you insinuate that I’m being arrogant about it when I say that everyone is a sinner? We are all sinners Ambient and when we sin we insult God in the most derogatory way, no question about it.






Ambient Sound,
In your mythology, isn't judgement reserved for God? By your own religious teachings, is anyone on this planet perfect enough that they have the right to judge and punish others? Apparently Machine thinks he is. At least that is what his postings would lead one to believe.


God alone has the power to determine the true standing of a person. God knows what you believe and why you believe it and this information will be used to condemn many and free some. God also calls on all Christians to make judgments based on His Word. The type of judgment that I do is simply to determine whether or not someone is following right doctrine or to promote the faith. I have no power to condemn anyone but I do know my Bible and have been commanded by God in His Word to warn and admonish those in danger of Hell. I do this in love and with a heartfelt desire to reach the lost.

In short, I’m not judging the persons end condition but only his or her stated beliefs to see if they line up with Gods Word.






Ambient Sound,
I suppose in a way that I have singled Machine out as an example of dangerous intolorance and circular dogma in religion, as well as a prime example of using God's name to spread what I can only interpret as hatred.


I’m not at all intolerant of your right to believe what you want to believe Ambient. I can totally disagree with you and argue against you and still tolerate your right to disagree with me. Too many people these days have twisted the word, “tolerance” to mean something totally different from what it actually means. A person does not have to agree with you or accept your view as equally valid in order to be tolerant of you. He only has to allow you to believe what you want without harming you with violence.

I can sit in the same room as you and tell you to your face that everything you believe is a lie and that you are completely wrong. You can do the same to me and we can both do it without violence. This is the purest form of tolerance. Two people in complete disagreement who think each other is absolutely wrong but they do not physically assault each other.

You’re not the first person who considers God to be hateful Ambient and you will not be the last. When I quote scripture and argue right doctrine many people are offended and angry at me personally. Jesus warned all Christians that this would happen with increasing frequency as we approach the last days. Jesus use to make people incredibly angry when He attacked their wrong teachings and hard hearts. In the end they killed Him for it. If the rapture doesn’t come before the seven year tribulation I’m sure people with hard hearts and anger towards God and His followers will kill me as well. I'm ready to die for my faith but I can assure you I will not kill for it. If the time comes I'll go quietly like a lamb led for the slaughter.






Ambient Sound,
It is my right and I believe my responsibility to speak out against things I think are dangerous and that I believe do harm to others. I see his zealotry as being of the same stripe as that which produced the Crusades, the Inquisision, and most of the other unspeakable horrors that we all can thank the Church for through the years.


I’ll never harm a hair on your head Ambient. If I saw you in person my attitude toward you would be warm and loving. I may preach you into a fit but I’d do it with love in my heart because I care about where you’ll spend eternity. I care enough to endure your hatred of me and your ridicule. It would be very easy for me to leave this forum and never return. But for the sake of the lost I keep coming back and taking it on the chin over and over again.

The horror and evil of the Roman Catholic Church belongs to that institution alone. I’m not a Catholic and my spiritual ancestors harmed no one. In fact, millions of true Christians were slaughtered by the Roman Catholic Church for not renouncing their simple belief that men are saved by grace alone. More true Christians were killed by Rome than any other category of person. A few thousand pagans and witches were murdered during this time right along side with millions of true Christians.

If you think the Roman Catholic Church was bad then wait until the last days, “You haven’t seen anything yet!”






Ambient Sound,
JJ, I've read many of your posts and dispite the fact that I personally feel that what you believe is factually incorrect, I think your heart is in the right place and I do see that you try to project positive energy. Even though I think your information is wrong I think that your motives are fairly pure. That is a big difference from Machine, who I feel is just looking to ego trip and enjoy his petty self-rightousness as he tries to pedestal himself by chopping others down.


No ego trips here, just sharing the truth in love. If God’s Word is chopping you down then maybe you’re heading in the right direction. God’s law is set up to do that very thing. First His Word brings you down to your knees in fear and repentance. Then in your humility you have an opportunity to receive His grace.



A True Christian
In These Last Days,

James




posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:15 AM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic

Originally posted by Machine
My audience will hear God’s truth which may be bitter at first but brings about salvation and eternal life.

A True Christian
In These Last Days,

James


Your audience? What is this, another performance? A contest? A battle? A war? Your audience? Oh, brother!
You know 'God's truth', do you?

He is the next messiah.. no wait.. Jesus actually had followers didn't he?

I suspect this guy thinks he's 'gods chosen'.. every few months someone appears on the boards proclaiming to be an arch angel or something... it very entertaining sometimes so I guess the term 'audience' is very appropriate.

Could someone please pass the tomatoes?


[edit on 19-10-2005 by riley]



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:24 AM
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Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
"Why is God so embarrassed by some who prefess to follow him"?

Where do you get this idea from?


"What does God think about people speaking for Him"?

On this point He is clear. Since you're talking about God's thought of those spreading His Word, aka speaking for Him, I'll limit it to a quote by Jesus:

"'Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit," (Matthew 28:19)

There are many examples in the Bible of people going out and doing this, as well. Acts 8:4, Acts 11:19-21, Philippians 1:12, 2 Timothy 2:9, 2 Timothy 2:10, and 2 Timothy 4:16-17 are all examples where we're explicitly told to do so. Most of the epistles have the author speaking for God, as well.


"What does God have to say about people judging others as sinners"?

That depends on your definition of judgment. If, by judgment you mean punish or condemn, then He's very clear that we are not to do that. So judgment in the sense of a court judging someone, we are not to do. However, we are to rebuke sin and sinners:

Proverbs 24:25 says, "25 But to those who rebuke the wicked will be delight, and a good blessing will come upon them."

Titus 1:13 is even more explicit on how one should rebuke someone, and why: "This testimony is true. For this reason reprove them severely so that they may be sound in the faith,"



"How does God look upon religious arrogance"?

Pride is pride, hidden behind the cloak of false humility or in blatant arrogance, and that is not approved of in any way. However, pride lies in the heart of the individual suffering from it. While you may think machine is being prideful, you are only making an assumption of what his motives are. You cannot know, only machine and God know. If he is stating these things in order to glorify himself that is something he needs to get right with God. God would want you to rebuke him severely, if you're close to him, but gently if you're not, because if he is suffering from pride and you rebuke him as a stranger or antagonist severely, he is only going to get angry and defensive.


"Why do people claim to be 'true Christians' yet constantly attack others"?

This, too, depends on the definition of attack. If you mean hostile, angry emotional assaults, the only excuse is that they, too, are not perfect. That doesn't make it right, though. If, however, you mean to rebuke, I answered that earlier.


"Why must one say they're a "true" Christian, instead of just a Christian"?

...hmm...I can only assume this would be to draw distinction between one's focus on scripture as a whole and those who skew the scripture in order to be justified in not changing behaviors and ignoring rebukes. As I said in Faith Without Works, though, actions speak much louder than words.



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:25 AM
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Benevolent Heretic,
How about these question?
"Why is God so embarrassed by some who prefess to follow him"?
"What does God think about people speaking for Him"?
"What does God have to say about people judging others as sinners"?
"How does God look upon religious arrogance"?
"Why do people claim to be 'true Christians' yet constantly attack others"?
"Why must one say they're a "true" Christian, instead of just a Christian"?


1) God can feel shame towards those who profess to follow Him but have no works to validate their supposed faith.

2) He commands it. All Christians are commanded by God to go out into the world and preach the gospel.

3) Again, He commands it. All Christians are commanded by God to tell the world that they are sinful and in need of His salvation.

4) God abhors pride more so even when it comes in the form of religion.

5) If what you mean by, “attack others” is to preach the Word it’s because God commands it of all Christians.

6) In these last days apostasy is growing out of control. Many people confess to be Christians but do not believe in the basic tenants of the Christian faith. The gospel of Jesus Christ is under constant attack by those who would twist His Word into something other than the simple truth that it is. These liars often claim to be Christians and I do not want to be associated with them.


A True Christian
In These Last Days,

James



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 12:28 PM
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So does that mean you are 'a respector of persons,' James?

And since you are a 'sinner' do you also hate God?



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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Originally posted by Machine
My audience will hear God’s truth which may be bitter at first but brings about salvation and eternal life.


Don't count on it. Your 'audience' will feel judged, repulsed, and will run from you and your 'teachings' to somewhere where they will be loved and understood instead of reviled and criticized. Your methods push people away and make them never want to be like you. Every post I've seen of yours is full of judgment and ridicule. You aren't doing your religion any favors.



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 03:07 PM
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My audience tells me that you worship Enlil and that's the real reason you hate Enki.

But why do you hate Enki? What did he do to you?

Even when Enlil abandoned you for those 70 years, you did not turn from your foolish support of him. Enki held his hand out to you and you rejected him.

Nergal is going to be very upset with you.

"May your bulls be large bulls, may they be ‘highland' bulls"



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 07:05 PM
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Originally posted by spamandham
My audience tells me that you worship Enlil and that's the real reason you hate Enki.



"May your bulls be large bulls, may they be ‘highland' bulls"


You are too much, spamandham.




posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 07:07 PM
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Queenannie38,
So does that mean you are 'a respector of persons,'


I wonder what your motivation for asking that question in that manner is? Are you trying to trick me like the Pharisees tried to trick Jesus? I wonder?

Matthew 22:15-18
Then went the Pharisees, and took counsel how they might entangle him in [his] talk. And they sent out unto him their disciples with the Herodians, saying, Master, we know that thou art true, and teachest the way of God in truth, neither carest thou for any [man]: for thou regardest not the person of men. Tell us therefore, What thinkest thou? Is it lawful to give tribute unto Caesar, or not? But Jesus perceived their wickedness, and said, Why tempt ye me, [ye] hypocrites?


Acts 10:34
Then Peter opened [his] mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:


God is not a respecter of persons so I’m not either. What this scripture is referring to is the point at which Peter realized that God brought salvation to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. God doesn’t care what race you are, anyone can come to Jesus Christ and receive His forgiveness.







Queenannie38,
James? And since you are a 'sinner' do you also hate God?


John 9:31
Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth.


If a sinner is outside of God’s forgiveness then He has a reprobate mind and is incapable of accepting God’s truth. Only God’s Holy Ghost can make it possible for someone to hear and accept the truth of God’s Word.

As a Christian I still have a sin nature and I still sin. The difference is that I have been washed clean in the blood of Jesus Christ and also have the Holy Ghost of God indwelling me. This places me in a different category from those that do not know God or have rejected His grace.








Benevolent Heretic,
Don't count on it. Your 'audience' will feel judged, repulsed, and will run from you and your 'teachings' to somewhere where they will be loved and understood instead of reviled and criticized. Your methods push people away and make them never want to be like you. Every post I've seen of yours is full of judgment and ridicule. You aren't doing your religion any favors.


Psalms 19:7
The law of the LORD [is] perfect, converting the soul: the testimony of the LORD [is] sure, making wise the simple.


Mark 16:15
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.


Isaiah 55:11
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper [in the thing] whereto I sent it.




You say that God’s Word will have no positive effects but God says otherwise. I’ll believe God and His promise that His Word will not return void. Most will throw away God’s free pardon but some, hearing His Word will repent and be saved.



Turn to Him,

James



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:10 PM
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Originally posted by Machine
I wonder what your motivation for asking that question in that manner is? Are you trying to trick me like the Pharisees tried to trick Jesus? I wonder?


That's right! You're the second coming of Christ and so everyone is trying to trick you.


Originally posted by Machine
God is not a respecter of persons so I’m not either.


:bash:



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:18 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38
You are too much, spamandham.


I'm glad you found it amusing.

The sad thing is, machine has no idea what it's referring to and will not bother to go find out either. He doesn't know the origins of his own mythology. He thinks all the stuff in the Bible actually happened and has delusions of grandeur to boot. How sad.



posted on Oct, 19 2005 @ 10:20 PM
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Machine....

What a crock, I'm sure you with reak with just as much sin as I, show me one person who isn't a "sinner"


if enjoying yourself and living the way you see fit gets you a ticket to hell, well atleast I'll be chilling around a lake of fire jetskiing with all the cool people, while the select few (all 20) go to heaven.


II. Sinners do hate God, because they are supremely selfish; and he is, as he ought to be, infinitely opposed to their supreme object of pursuit.

hahaha, according to that there fancy bible, you are a sinner, and you hate god according to your little site.


How can I hate that which doesn't exist?



posted on Oct, 20 2005 @ 03:26 AM
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Originally posted by Machine
I wonder what your motivation for asking that question in that manner is? Are you trying to trick me like the Pharisees tried to trick Jesus? I wonder?
Now, c'mon, James--why would I seek to 'trick' you?

You trip yourself up far too much for me to find sport in such an activity--if that were my nature to begin with.

The reason I asked that was because of your comment:


These liars often claim to be Christians and I do not want to be associated with them.


Which would seem to indicate that you are choosy about those with whom you fraternize--based on whether they believe as you do (since those who do not are promptly labeled a 'liar'.) Yet how can you pursue what you feel you are commanded to do, if you shun the company of the 'lost?' Do you spread your gospel from a distance, then? Is the internet your only venue?


God is not a respecter of persons so I’m not either. What this scripture is referring to is the point at which Peter realized that God brought salvation to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. God doesn’t care what race you are, anyone can come to Jesus Christ and receive His forgiveness.
Is that truly what you think that means, James? Really? That God is not a racist? You have got to be kidding.

My question to you arose more from the frame of reference found in the book of James:

My brothers, do not practice your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ by showing partiality.
(In the KJV we read: My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons. )
2:1


Nevertheless, you are doing the right thing if you obey the royal law in keeping with the Scripture, "You must love your neighbor as yourself."
But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and will be convicted by the law as violators.
For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point is guilty of breaking all of it.
2:8-10

Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more severely.
For all of us make many mistakes.
If someone does not make any mistakes when he speaks, he is perfect and able to control his whole body.
3:1-2

Do not criticize each other, brothers. Whoever makes it his habit to criticize his brother or to judge his brother is judging the law and condemning the law. But if you condemn the law, you are not a doer of the law but its judge. There is only one Lawgiver and Judge-the one who can save and destroy. So who are you to judge your neighbor?
4:11-12

We consider those who endured to be blessed. You have heard about Job's endurance and have seen the purpose of the Lord-that the Lord is compassionate and merciful.
Above all, brothers, do not swear oaths by heaven, by earth, or by any other object. Instead, let your "Yes" mean yes and your "No" mean no, lest you fall under condemnation.
5:11-12


As a Christian I still have a sin nature and I still sin. The difference is that I have been washed clean in the blood of Jesus Christ and also have the Holy Ghost of God indwelling me. This places me in a different category from those that do not know God or have rejected His grace.

Now I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who create divisions and sinful enticements in opposition to the teaching you have learned. Stay away from them!
Rom 16:17

A simple 'yes' or 'no' would suffice, James. Since you say you meet the criteria for being a 'sinner'--do you hate God--as is written in the article you recommended?

All your blah blah blah ing with theologically correct vocabulary doesn't count as 'let your yea be yea and your nay be nay.'

1John 3:7-24


You say that God’s Word will have no positive effects but God says otherwise. I’ll believe God and His promise that His Word will not return void. Most will throw away God’s free pardon but some, hearing His Word will repent and be saved.

Actually, what I understood her to say is more specifically that your words about God have no positive effect.

God's word will not return void, as you point out from Isaiah--but do you really understand the implications of what He is saying there?

Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts:
and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.

For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

For as the rain cometh down, and the snow from heaven, and returneth not thither, but watereth the earth, and maketh it bring forth and bud, that it may give seed to the sower, and bread to the eater:

So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Isaiah 55:7-11

His ways, His thoughts--are higher than ours! That means that He has much better things planned for all of us than you propose that He has planned for just those who think like you. He is righteous--what does that mean? Equitable, just, and fair in judgment. And the only way to be truly fair to a whole bunch of 'sinners' is either kill the whole lot of them--or save them as a whole.

Would not it be a void thing if the life that was given wasn't given for all, but only for some? Wouldn't that be a damn shame--truly? As well as an imperfect and less than glorious end for the whole thing, after all that has been invested?

Also--regardless of what your idea of 'sin' is, or mine, or anyone else's--there is one thing that must be acknowledged in that regard, according to scripture:

If we are all of us sinners, each and every one of us born a sinner only to die a sinner--then that means that, just as we all share an identical state in the beginning, so shall we share the same state at the end of this age.

For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
1Corinthians 15:22

'even so' = 'likewise in the same manner'

Those are powerful and simple words, Machine--and even standing alone that sentence means what it means--the same as when read in that whole 15th chapter. You can offer up all sorts of convoluted defenses to satisfy your own need to show me to be some sort of enemy of God--but your idea of what is true is not simple and it doesn't stand fast like the plain and straight-forward truth that is just and equitable toward all. And that would include not only you, but also me, and spamandham, and our lovely and benevolent heretic--and even every Catholic, every atheist, every wanderer , every homosexual, every drug addict, every last one of us--not a single solitary heart will be left on its own to break of loneliness and despair.

Even (but, and, also, moreover, now )

the righteousness (equity (of character or act); specifically justification: righteousness)

of God (supreme Divinity; figuratively a magistrate; by Hebraism very: exceeding)

which is by(a primary preposition denoting the channel of an act; through, from, in, by occasion of, of, by reason of, for sake, that )

faith (persuasion, that is, credence; constancy in such profession; assurance, belief, believe, faith, fidelity.)

of Jesus (that is, Yehoshua)

Christ (the anointed)

unto (to or into--indicating the point reached or entered--of place, time, or purpose, or result, etc)

all (all, any, every, the whole: - all manner of, whosoever)

and ( and, also, even, so, then, too, indeed, likewise, moreover)

upon (superimposition of time, place, order, etc.-- a relation of distribution, direction towards)

all (all, any, every, the whole: - all manner of, whosoever)

them that believe: (have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing) or to credit; by implication to entrust: - commit (to trust), put in trust with)

for (assigning a reason --used in argument, explanation or intensification): - because, for indeed, no doubt, therefore, verily, why, yet)

there is ( is, are, consisteth, follow, make, meaneth, remaineth)

no (the absolutely negative adverb; no or not: nay, neither, never, none, nothing)

difference: (variation: difference, distinction)
Romans 3:22

There is no difference made between those that believe (in the resurrection) and those than don't--if one man rose, then we will all rise. There's no mention of 'just these certain ones' or 'those favorite ones'--the resurrection of the dead is just that of the dead. And that's something we've all got in common, without exception.

The gospel is the good news--that death is not our victor--and that in God there is only life.

But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen: And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
1Corinthians 15:13-14

Not the 'saved' dead--just the dead. That's the underlying principle of 'salvation' --it is the fact that we are saved from something that makes us 'saved' --not that we are rescued because we are 'saved.' (in the Hebrew it is 'deliverance, victory, prosperity' and in the Greek it is 'rescue, deliverance, safety')

We have come to know and believe in the love that God has for us.
God is love, and the person who abides in love abides in God, and God abides in him.
This is how love has been perfected among us: we will have confidence on the day of judgment because, while we are in this world, we are just like him.
There is no fear where love exists.
Rather, perfect love banishes fear, for fear involves punishment, and the person who lives in fear has not been perfected in love.
We love because he first loved us.
1John 4:16-19


[edit on 10/20/2005 by queenannie38]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 12:03 AM
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First mistake of christianity is the fact that it is based on something so negative as a crusifiction. It has had negative vibes from the start. Everytime I tried to understand it it made me feel terrible inside. Like I was doing something unatural. It has been a horrible exprience for mankind this negative religion. Millions upon millions have been killed tortured and burned for it. Alas though it is finally showing signs of dying.

Churches are splitting and shrinking while these mega-churches are flurishing. The mega-churches are a fad that will soon pass and there wont be much left of this horrible negative controling religion. It will pass along with the age that brought it into being.

We are entering the age of mans enlightenment, and are feeling the change it is so new it is for now bringing a lot of chaos and confusion. Maybe because the energy is so high. Jesus opened the 7th Chakra (the third eye Chakra) at the beginning of the age of pisces. The next mesiah will open the last Chakra ( The crown Chakra) in this, the begining of Aquarius. Some will reach the higher vibration state, and some will not. Just as sure as can be though it will be the end of the Christian religion.

Blessed Be



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 05:18 AM
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Queenannie38,
Which would seem to indicate that you are choosy about those with whom you fraternize--based on whether they believe as you do (since those who do not are promptly labeled a 'liar'.) Yet how can you pursue what you feel you are commanded to do, if you shun the company of the 'lost?' Do you spread your gospel from a distance, then? Is the internet your only venue?


2 Corinthians 6:14
Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?


I’m particular to whom I consider my friends. This does not forbid me from preaching the gospel to the lost. I spend my time doing a number of exciting works for my God to include: Internet preaching, open-air preaching, handing out gospel tracts, and other Christian works.




Acts 10:34
Then Peter opened [his] mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:





Machine,
God is not a respecter of persons so I’m not either. What this scripture is referring to is the point at which Peter realized that God brought salvation to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. God doesn’t care what race you are, anyone can come to Jesus Christ and receive His forgiveness.





Queenannie38,
Is that truly what you think that means, James? Really? That God is not a racist? You have got to be kidding.


You obviously have no understanding of the great implications of this verse. Jews and Gentiles were a totally divided people, more so where religion was concerned. A good Jew was not to be seen eating with a Gentile or fellowshipping with him during this time in history. When God revealed to Peter that He had accepted believing Gentiles into the fold as equals with the believing Jew this brought in a major change to the way everything would be done from that point on. It shocked Peter to learn this truth as it did the other Jewish believers.




Romans 3:22-23
Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;


Queenannie, the above posted scripture explains that everyone that believes upon Jesus Christ will partake of the righteousness of God. How much simpler can it get? Everyone has sinned and, “all them that believe” in Jesus Christ partake of His righteousness. God only knows what leap of intellectual faith you take to pull whatever meaning out of this simple verse that you want it to be. The gospel is a simple message Queenannie let me break the entire Bible down to you in one sentence.

Anyone who believes on Jesus Christ as Lord and Saviour shall be saved.

Simple.




Queenannie38,
There is no difference made between those that believe (in the resurrection) and those than don't--if one man rose, then we will all rise. There's no mention of 'just these certain ones' or 'those favorite ones'--the resurrection of the dead is just that of the dead. And that's something we've all got in common, without exception.


You are absolutely right in believing this. Where you fall off the turnip truck is in thinking that all the dead will rise to everlasting joy with God in Heaven. Let’s allow the Bible to elaborate on this resurrection of the dead shall we.

Revelation 20:11-15
And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them. And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


And there you have the simple truth. I don't even have to explain it anyone who can read can understand this.







LoneGunMan,
We are entering the age of mans enlightenment, and are feeling the change it is so new it is for now bringing a lot of chaos and confusion. Maybe because the energy is so high. Jesus opened the 7th Chakra (the third eye Chakra) at the beginning of the age of pisces. The next mesiah will open the last Chakra ( The crown Chakra) in this, the begining of Aquarius. Some will reach the higher vibration state, and some will not. Just as sure as can be though it will be the end of the Christian religion.


Oh, we are indeed entering the age of man in that we can both agree. You have a fine romantic ideal as to what that will mean but I’m going to let you in on a not so little secret.

Proverbs 16:25
There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof [are] the ways of death.


I pray you will turn away from new age lies and turn to Jesus Christ before it’s too late for you to turn. Don’t wait LoneGunMan you do not know how much time you have left. If you die before that time you will go to Hell forever. If you live to see the antichrist rise to power you will fall for his lies and be damned. Either way there is only one path to salvation and His name is The LORD Jesus Christ.


A True Christian
In These Last Days,

James



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 06:28 AM
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Originally posted by Machine
I spend my time doing a number of exciting works for my God to include: Internet preaching, open-air preaching, handing out gospel tracts, and other Christian works.

So do these 'other' christian works include things actually helping the needy? ..the sick, homeless, starving etc. You know.. the kind of stuff Jesus apparently done.. or do you just scream at them and tell them they're going to hell?



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 08:49 AM
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Oh man so much hate in religion and god!

Come on already please. If your gonna preach to people is that really loving the person? By me questioning your actions am I really loving you?

Do you see what I am getting at?

There has been so much hate and ignorance surrounded by religion it truely makes me sad. It is really impossible to say who is real and what is fake. I mean you have hindus,indians,buddah,etc etc etc Lots of religons have a return on Christ or whatever name there is. Than hardcore Jews don't belive in Christ. So much crap and anger which needs to vanish.

I think I am as scared as you hardcore Christians that act as if you are forsure! Deep down inside I think you would be acting a differnt way if you were so sure. I think you may give a hug in place of a tug next time you spoke.

Everything must evolve man/soul/spirit/god



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 09:49 AM
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Oh, we are indeed entering the age of man in that we can both agree. You have a fine romantic ideal as to what that will mean but I’m going to let you in on a not so little secret.

Proverbs 16:25
There is a way that seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof [are] the ways of death.

I pray you will turn away from new age lies and turn to Jesus Christ before it’s too late for you to turn. Don’t wait LoneGunMan you do not know how much time you have left. If you die before that time you will go to Hell forever. If you live to see the antichrist rise to power you will fall for his lies and be damned. Either way there is only one path to salvation and His name is The LORD Jesus Christ.


A True Christian
In These Last Days,

James



The anti-christ, well then was every mesiah the anti-christ?




The Age of Gemini

The Age of Gemini (c.6000 — c.4000) corresponded to the flourishing period of early Hinduism. It was under this sign that Rama, the seventh incarnation of Vishnu was manifested by the birth of the two pair of brothers: Rama and Lakshmana on the one hand, Satrughna and Bharata on the other. Rama Himself had twin sons: Lav and Kush (in harmony with the name of the constellation where the Sun was at that time.) Lav went to Russia from this we get the name of Slav. The other son, Kush went to China, hence we get the name Kushan. These two divine principles were also incarnated as Buddha and Mahavira, then as Adi Shankaracharya and Gnyaneshwara. In other Avatars they were Hassan and Hussein the sons of Fatima and Hazrat Ali . . . Rama incarnated during the Treta Yuga when the fourth chakra (Adi Anahathh) was opened in Virata. Anahathh is an important centre of the human being since it is here (on the left side, at the heart level) where the individual Spirit or the Self resides. "For where your treasure is, there also will your heart be" Jesus said (Luke 12:34.)






The Age of Taurus

The Age of Taurus (c.4000 — c.2000 B.C.). The aeon governing this age was Krishna, the eight Avatar, the Lord of the cows (Govinda.) The age stayed under the sign of the bull (Apis, or sacred bull Mnevis of Helipolis, identified to Ra), of the holy cow (Hathor in Egypt, surahbhi or Kamadhenu in India or may be worshipped in many spiritual cultures), or the golden calf in the polytheistic beliefs (see Exodus 32:4), preceding the Judaic monotheism. Krishna was said to have lived at the end of Dvapara Yuga (Encyclopaedia Universalis, Paris 1968, vol. 9, p.711) considered by some to have ended in the year 3102 B.C. (Zimmer, quoted work.) According to tradition, Krishna lived in the fourth millennium B.C. (La grande encyclopedie, H. Lamirault et Co., Paris, vol. 21, p.647.) During his time the fifth chakra (Adi Vishuddhi) of the Cosmic Being was enlightened.




The Age of Aries

The Age of Aries (c.2000 — 1 B.C.) was characterized by the establishment of the monotheistic Judaism through great spiritual personalities like Abraham (19th century B.C.) and Moses (13th century B.C.). Generally, this period was dominated by the manifestation of the universal principle of the spiritual master (Adi Guru Dattatreya.) Indeed, before the Christian era, Zarathustra incarnated (7th or 6th or even 10th century according to some opinions), Confucius and Lao-Tse (6th century), Socrates (5th century), alongside with the two great Jewish prophets (see chapt. X.) The symbol of the ram (or the Passover lamb) appeared as an object of sacrifice instead of worship, as a reaction against the belief of the previous age. That could be illustrated by the cult of Mithra who stabbed the mythological bull.




The Age of Pisces

The Age of Pisces (A.D. 1 — c.2000) during which Christianity appeared and spread out. The fish was known to have been the secret sign used by the early Christians to identify each other. The Greek word Ichtus (=fish) was made up of the following phrase capitals (acrostic): Iesous Christos Theou Uios Soter (=Jesus Christ Son of God, the Saviour.) In Hinduism it was also the symbol of the Saviour (Vishnu's first incarnation in the shape of a fish saved Manu from the flood) . . .

Similar to Mahavishnu, Jesus represented the ninth Avatar, who opened the Agnya chakra within the Cosmic Being. The reflection of this chakra at the microcosmic human level is situated in the centre of the forehead where the left channel (Ida nadi) and the right channel (Pingala nadi) form a subtle crossing. From an anatomical point of view, this is the place of:

*

the chiasma opticalis (optical nerve crossing), corresponding to the anterior aspect of the chakra (front Agnya);

*

the decussatio pyramidum (crossing of the motor nuclei fibres of the spinal nerves for the upper limb and upper trunk and for the lower limb and lower trunk respectively), corresponding to the posterior aspect of the chakra (back Agnya.)

The three channels cross at the Agnya which represents the most narrow way for the Kundalini to pass through. It is the "narrow gate" that Jesus said about: "Strive with earnestness to enter through the narrow door, for many, I say, will seek to enter and will not be able" (Luke 13:24.) "Enter through the narrow gate" (Matthew 7:13.) Jesus revealed Himself as the Master of the Agnya chakra: "I am the door; if any one enter in by Me, he shall be saved" (John 10.9.) He will be saved because he will be able to reach the end, of the spiritual ascent, Sahasrara (the Kingdom of Heavens the synthesis of all chakras, where the individual Spirit joins with the Universal Spirit — God.)

The Mahabharata (14.2784) says that the gate of heaven is very small and narrow. It cannot be seen by those without any sense and blinded by the vain illusions of this world. Even those who can see well, who see the way and want to enter, will find the door locked and hard to open. Its heavy bolts are pride, lust, greed and debauchery. Jesus said to the Pharisees: "The kingdom of God does not come with observation" (Luke 17:20.) Schmemaan wrote: "For the early Christians the all-encompassing reality and the terrific newness of their belief was precisely that the Kingdom had drawn near and though unseen, it had already been there, among the people, illuminating and working in the world."

The Agnya chakra controls mental processes. Maitrayana Upanishad says (6:34) that the thoughts are the only cause of the cycle of birth and death; man, therefore should endeavour to purify his thoughts. A man is what he thinks: this is the ancient secret. The same idea was expressed by Guatama Buddha in the first line of the Dhammapada: All that we are is the result of what we have thought, is based on our thoughts, and made out of our thoughts. That is why Yogis attach such a great importance to thought detachment and getting into the "thoughtless awareness" or Nirvichara Samadhi; the real state of meditation enabling the union (Yoga.)


So were all of the above Avatars (besides Jesus) the antichrist? If you Christains could open your eyes you may find the world is quite fascinating. The age of man ascending to something greater is something the church does not want to happen. For then all of man will realize it has all been a scam.

[edit on 21-10-2005 by LoneGunMan]



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 10:26 AM
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Originally posted by Machine
I spend my time doing a number of exciting works for my God to include: Internet preaching, open-air preaching, handing out gospel tracts, and other Christian works.


Let me guess. You used to have a problem with drugs or alcohol. Then you got saved and have substituted mythology as your new addiction.

If you're married, odds are you're going to have an affair and unless your livelihood depends on ministry, you'll likely abandon all this religious stuff.

If I'm right that you used to have a drug/alcohol problem, you need to seek professional help before you hit the wall.



posted on Oct, 21 2005 @ 01:15 PM
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Riley,
So do these 'other' christian works include things actually helping the needy? ..the sick, homeless, starving etc. You know.. the kind of stuff Jesus apparently done.. or do you just scream at them and tell them they're going to hell?


Jesus told people they were in danger of going to Hell far more often than anything else He did while on Earth. I have had the opportunity to donate clothing, food and other items as part of my Christian works but this is not my primary calling at the moment. Each member in the body of Christ has special gifts, talents and callings. I have been blessed with good communication skills and a bold spirit. Less than 1% of all Christians do the type of work that I and many other Christians do so it is definitely an area that is understaffed.

People need to hear the truth and I’m thankful to God that I have the chance to be one of many who tell them. It’s impossible to preach the gospel and not offend some people but all Christians are required to do just that. I have also found that those who are most offended seem to have a high rate of eventually turning from their sinful lives and accepting Jesus Christ as their LORD and saviour. I believe, and the Bible asserts, that this is because deep down the Word of God convicts their soul and conscience. When an unrepentant sinner is forced to acknowledge his or her sin it cuts them deeply and they often respond in anger.

Few people make confessions of faith on the spot but later that night while they are alone on their beds strange and wonderful things sometimes begin to happen. As they reflect on how much they hated that preacher guy the Holy Ghost can begin to move in their hearts and bring them to a point of confession and repentance.

This is my prayer, my hope and my love.








LoneGunMan,
So were all of the above Avatars (besides Jesus) the antichrist? If you Christains could open your eyes you may find the world is quite fascinating. The age of man ascending to something greater is something the church does not want to happen. For then all of man will realize it has all been a scam.


The Bible breaks down the term antichrist to mean two different types of antichrist. The first meaning covers any person or spirit that has or will exist that is in opposition to God. The second type is an actual man who will live and rule during the last seven years prior to the return of the KING and LORD Jesus Christ.

It saddens my heart to hear you say such things. You are so very lost to a false faith that will offer you much but give you Hell as a reward. If you live long enough you will indeed continue to see the decline of Christianity and the rise of this new world religion that you desire. The antichrist will use this new world religion as a stepping stone to obtain his power. Then, just prior to the last three and a half years of his reign he will turn on the new age harlot and destroy her and set up a new god and a new religion. He will force everyone to worship him directly as god and if things were not bad enough already the whole world goes to Hell in a hand basket.

For your sake and mine I do hope you live to see that day you long for, maybe as the signs begin to pass you’ll wake up and turn to Jesus Christ.

Then again…

2 Thessalonians 2:8-12
And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: [Even him], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.









Spamandham,
Let me guess. You used to have a problem with drugs or alcohol. Then you got saved and have substituted mythology as your new addiction.

If you're married, odds are you're going to have an affair and unless your livelihood depends on ministry, you'll likely abandon all this religious stuff.

If I'm right that you used to have a drug/alcohol problem, you need to seek professional help before you hit the wall.


Have I ever told you how much I love your avatar name? I love Spam and I love Ham.

Many good Christians have had problems with drugs or alcohol and have turned to Jesus Christ for deliverance. I thank God for all of them. My history is different as I have never used an illegal drug in my life and that includes marijuana. I’ve only consumed alcohol on two prior occasions when I was 18 years old and hated it both times. So I guess that blows your first attempt to know who I am out of the water.

I’ve been a professing Christian since I spoke my first words as a baby. I’ve always held Jesus Christ up as my LORD and saviour even when I was not living a good Christian life. It wasn’t until I turned 23 that the Holy Ghost came to me and convicted me of my sinful thoughts and actions. I feared going to Hell and in tears I begged God to show me mercy and to change my heart so that I would live a life that was pleasing to Him. God moved quickly and I’ve been walking with Him ever since.

God forbid that a day would ever come that I would not want to do His work. I have been handing out gospel tracts and preaching the good news since I was a Sheriff’s Deputy working in the County jail. I continued this work out as a patrol officer and loved to hand food and gospel tracts out to transients while on patrol. I love the lost and my heart breaks for them. I love you as well and pray that you would turn to Him for forgiveness.

I do not earn any money from preaching. I preach because I love the lost and want them to hear the truth in a world filled with lies. I’ve been married for 12 years and my life is filled with joy and happiness. You are wise to point out the likelihood for an affair and warn me of it. I’ve had a few women proposition me in the past (mostly when in uniform) but glory be to God I have turned them down flat. I make it a point to pray daily for God to strengthen my marriage and to protect me from the sin of adultery, so far He has kept me clean.

I have a 4 year old daughter to think about and I hate the sin of adultery. Adultery destroys marriages and divorce destroys children. I didn’t bring my daughter into this harsh world with the intentions of bailing out on her when she will need me the most. I also love my wife deeply and will not turn my back on her or betray her trust. God will keep me from such wickedness!


A True Christian
In These Last days,

James



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