It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

NEWS: H5N1 Is Developing Tamiflu Resistant Genetic Mutations

page: 2
7
<< 1   >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 16 2005 @ 10:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mayet

Even though the media has in fact reported pockets of human to human transmission the reports have always been careful to use the right words like "suspected" "possible" "may" and "appears".

I really do think this is the first case where they have been so positive in confirmation of human to human. I may be wrong but I really think this is the first time the media has let their heads go and said that it is definitely human to human in this case.




No. The reports you've seen have been revised after "initial reports" - meaning changed after someone got to the publisher. ...The media pattern is 'fudging' after the fact, and pulling back.

...The quotes I provided above are definitive - using words like "can" - including the one from CIDRAP, which refers to the first case of human-to-human transmission being in September, 2004 I believe.





I read your reply where you stated that Tamiflu may be the actual cause of the mutation and I was quite startled. Startled not because of what you said and believing it but startled tht I hadn't looked at that possibility and now I have... My startled is now ...scared..........



You haven't read much of my work, have you?

...There is much proof and little doubt that 'modern' microbes interact with medicine and drugs to create new disease strains - the pathway is via prions (of course) that respond to environmental change (like drugs in the body) by adapting, mutating into a new conformation, and thereby, creating a new strain. Point being that it's not just humans and animals that get prion diseases, but microbes too. The microbe-prion relationship originally was perceived as prions 'hitchhiking' on microbes - and that may be correct - but in fact, the relationship is more complex. In a microbe-prion relationship, when the prion mutates into a new strain, so does the microbe.

If it makes you feel any better - and it should - this all has been going on for a very long time now - and escalating dramatically over the past 3-4 years. We really are at the apex - a climax of evolutionary change. Last year - I was incensed at the obstacles and deadlocks preventing vaccine production - and at the obstacles to stem cell therapy, which I know to be very advanced. This year - I am kind of hohum. I really do believe that we're better off letting 'nature' handle it.

The way I have come to see what's happening is this - We have changed our environment - substantially, chemically, and biologically - and now it's changing us - something that is necessary for our survival. We are part of the environment - a component and inextricable part of the larger system - and need to be in harmony it. Microbes (and prions) are the 'mediators' between complex life and the environment, or larger system. So-called 'disease' is simply transition, painful as it may be.

[It's late. Let me know if that makes sense to you - if I have explained myself well enough or not.]


.




posted on Oct, 16 2005 @ 11:06 PM
link   
i do understand what your getting at and am a champion for the cause of medications causing diseases and mutations but what startled me is that i was reading the article and hadn't even thought of that angle of it in this case. My slackness or tiredness from being up most of the night I guess.



posted on Oct, 16 2005 @ 11:16 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mayet
and hadn't even thought of that angle of it in this case. My slackness or tiredness from being up most of the night I guess.




Hey - that's why we collaborate. Team work - with others to cover butt, fill the gaps.

But don't beat yourself up for ghads sake! You are doing a WONDERFUL job! ...I watch for your articles - and truth be told, I don't want you to take on other responsibilities because I think it might cut into your writing and reporting time and then what where would I get my news, hey?


Just make sure you take some 'me time.' and thanks for all your hard work. You are a real ATSNN gem.



posted on Oct, 17 2005 @ 08:01 AM
link   

Originally posted by noctu
it must have had help because not even a smart virus like hiv

Viruses aren't 'smart'. They simply evolve due to random mutations. Fighting a disease doesn't 'cause' resistance to pop up, it merely creates a condition wherein the resistiant mutants have a great advantage over the non-resistant types. The virus doesn't need any 'help' to do any of this.

siriuslyone
Where does this come from? More questions than from the start of aids...anyone seeing a plot for population control or am I alone?

? The disease has been monitored in wild and domestic fowl in asia for a long time now, there's no evidence of a plot of any kind. Its expected that dangerous and deadly diseases will exist.

soficrow
This is significant in that it appears that Tamiflu is triggering H5N1's mutation

Unless tamiflu is a mutagen/carcinogen, its not inducing mutations and therefore not inducing resistence.

have asked nations NOT to vaccinate poultry flocks against H5N1 - because vaccines not only spread the disease, but also seem to trigger a mutation response

They don't want domestic fowl to be treated with medicine that humans will be treated with because in doing so they will create a selection pressure that will give already resistant types a dramatic edge over the non-resistent types. Its important to note the difference, tamiflu doesn't create resistence anymore than anti-biotics create resistance, they merely make it so that a resistent virus is more fit.

I have been reporting on bird flu and human-to-human transmission for some time here at ATS.

Indeed, its stunning to see it relatively constantly reported as not having had human to human transmission. Sometimes it shows up in some articles.



posted on Oct, 17 2005 @ 11:53 AM
link   

Originally posted by Nygdan


soficrow
This is significant in that it appears that Tamiflu is triggering H5N1's mutation

Unless tamiflu is a mutagen/carcinogen, its not inducing mutations and therefore not inducing resistence.




Uh huh.





have asked nations NOT to vaccinate poultry flocks against H5N1 - because vaccines not only spread the disease, but also seem to trigger a mutation response

They don't want domestic fowl to be treated with medicine that humans will be treated with because in doing so they will create a selection pressure that will give already resistant types a dramatic edge over the non-resistent types. Its important to note the difference, tamiflu doesn't create resistence anymore than anti-biotics create resistance, they merely make it so that a resistent virus is more fit.



True - I'm just saying there's more to the story. It is well established that microbes mutate in response to environmental change - and vaccines/drugs change the internal environment, thus triggering microbial mutation and adaptation.






I have been reporting on bird flu and human-to-human transmission for some time here at ATS.

Indeed, its stunning to see it relatively constantly reported as not having had human to human transmission. Sometimes it shows up in some articles.



Damage control and media manipulation. As you say, "Sometimes it shows up in some articles." For example:

"...researchers have recently described several instances of person-to-person transmission."

Now there is evidence that in rare cases it can spread from person to person."


...Meaning the media-lockdown, and government control, isn't absolute.



.




top topics
 
7
<< 1   >>

log in

join