NEWS: H5N1 Is Developing Tamiflu Resistant Genetic Mutations

A Vietamese girl who was directly infected with H5N1 from nursing her brother who was also ill from the disease, has been found to be carrying Tamiflu resistant strains of the disease. The girl was given Tamiflu as a precaution whilst caring for her brother but the medication did not stop the disease from developing. She was later given more Tamiflu as treatment and did survive. Tests have now shown she was carrying several different strains of H5N1 and that a few of those strains had developed genetic mutations which were resistant to Tamiflu.



The report say that both Relenza (Zanamivir] and Tamiflu (oseltamivir) should be stockpiled in the case of a pandemic.

This girl was directly infected by her brother which shows the disease must have mutated in that family for it to happen. Couple that with the Tamiflu resistant strains and it could well be a forecast and hint of things to come.


[edit on 16-10-2005 by Mayet]

[edit on 10/16/05 by FredT]

[edit on 16-10-2005 by Nerdling]

[edit on 17-10-2005 by Nerdling]

Oh this is not good.

It's just a terrible situation developing.

So this is planned to go worldwide???

Cause if so I think I am gong to put alot of money in duct tape in plastic.

On a brighter note, I think this may be a bad thing, from what I understand in worse case senerio this can wipe out 80% of the population.

Then again, as my own thoughts go.. I think its a bad thing but considering how many people dont follow what they are taught then I think this is all Karma action going into play..

In other words we deserve what we get.. Just try and make it better next time around ehh????

I started to post an article on this yesterday when I first heard about it, but I knew you would and you're a better writer than me, so I didn't.

While worrisome, this development doesn't really change anything with respect to a possible pandemic arising from a "human-to-human" mutation of the H5N1 bird flu virus. A vaccine can't be developed until the virus mutates or it quite likely will not be effective. Tamiflu, at least to me, never figured to be much of a protection anyway. It would certainly be nice if someone could predict the form of such a deadly mutation and we could then take steps to counter it, but that just doesn't seem to be in the cards.

Valhall a small investment in ultraviolet lights coupled with air filters might be some defense, but the best defense of course is thorough washing of hands, etc.

[edit on 16-10-2005 by Astronomer68]

Im not surprised and I do recall reading somewhere (I cannot seem to find it now) that there were reports of up to 10X the usual dose of Tamiflu needed to be effective.

That being said there are several variables in this story as well regarding he level of exposure etc. Also did she take the drug in a supervised regime? Or are they going on faith that she took it. This bears watching but its the first report with only one patient. Important to keep tabs as is the tidbit about H2H transmission in this case.

Great Find Mayet

Im not surprised and I do recall reading somewhere (I cannot seem to find it now) that there were reports of up to 10X the usual dose of Tamiflu needed to be effective.

That being said there are several variables in this story as well regarding he level of exposure etc. Also did she take the drug in a supervised regime? Or are they going on faith that she took it. This bears watching but its the first report with only one patient. Important to keep tabs as is the tidbit about H2H transmission in this case.

Great Find Mayet

Kawaoka's team found several types of H5N1 virus in the girl's sample, some of which had developed genetic mutations to make Tamiflu virtually worthless against it.

"It is a mixture," he said. "Within the mixture we found virus that is highly, highly resistant. When you look at the virus as a whole, it is partially resistant," Kawaoka said.

"Several types of H5N1" in one person? Would this mean that it was mutating all over the place once she got it? How quickly is this mutating? Is it actually mutating constantly, within each person?

I really want to know if person to person you can get infected with one type and it can start generating multiple strains, any one of which can be passed on, or you are contracting multiple strains at once. Either way a frightening prospect I suppose.

wow the strain allready resistant to the antiviral, it must have had help because not even a smart virus like hiv gets resistant that fast to antivirals let alone some flu

Originally posted by Relentless

Kawaoka's team found several types of H5N1 virus in the girl's sample, some of which had developed genetic mutations to make Tamiflu virtually worthless against it.

"It is a mixture," he said. "Within the mixture we found virus that is highly, highly resistant. When you look at the virus as a whole, it is partially resistant," Kawaoka said.

"Several types of H5N1" in one person?

Would this mean that it was mutating all over the place once she got it? How quickly is this mutating? Is it actually mutating constantly, within each person?

Welcome to the wonderful world of prion-related disease.

FREDT - yes - the news that H5N1 required very high doses of Tamiflu dates back to its first discovery, I believe. (1997, and later)

MAYET - great find. Good writing.
...Sorry if I seem to take you and your work for granted. You are just TOO good.



.

Is this one of the first coverages of human to human transmission?

National US media (www.nydailynews.com "The H5N1 bird flu virus does not, as far as we know, have the ability at present to pass from human to human") is still saying such transmission is unproven.

Is this the other big part of this story?

SO,

There has been human-to-human transmission. What everybody is watching for is SUSTAINED human-to-human transmission. And in Viet Nam/Cambodia, there have been "clusters" of infections that would indicate a sustained human-to-human transmission. But it hasn't been confirmed.



[edit on 10-16-2005 by Valhall]

From NBC news, they have found 3 ducks who are infected.
Where does this come from?
More questions than from the start of aids...anyone seeing a plot for population control or am I alone?

Originally posted by Valhall
There has been human-to-human transmission

Agreed. But the question is... why isn't the US media reporting this correctly?

-eh-

I suppose deep-down we know why.

www.msnbc.msn.com...

Interesting thread on the possible duck contamination.

Well, they're too busy deciding how they are going to violate the constitution and the Posse Comitatus by using Federal military troops or placing National Guard troops under Federal orders when they call a quarantine.

Furthermore, the American population can't be trusted to "not panic" and demand Tamiflu or other measures be up to the needed levels.

So...you just don't tell them the truth.

Up to this point the official line has really been no confirmed human to human. There was talk of human to human transmission when two nurses were infected in Vietnam but nothing more was said. It kind of got buried. I think this is one of, if not the first definite confirmed publicly human to human transmission.

The part that is of interest is that the girl contracted the disease by human to human transmission... so we can figure there was a h5n1 mutation between her brother and herself...

what is of specific interest there is the same case that was found to be confirmed human to human is also the first case of confirmed tamiflu resistent strains of h5n1...

those two issues by themselves are a danger but together in the one case is extraordinary and may paint the picture of what does happen when it mutates

theory
...The strains of H5N1 that were killed by the Tamiflu...... were the standard H5n1 strains that can be targetted by tamiflu
the strains of h5n1 that are resistent are the new dangerous mutated strains spreadable by human to human
those resistent strains are possibly the mutation that we all fear...

Originally posted by Mayet
Up to this point the official line has really been no confirmed human to human.

Ahem. There have been numerous reports of human-to-human transmission - dating back some time. American media is simply re-writing history - sometimes daily, sometimes weekly.

[Just run a search here on ATS - look for "person-to-person" as well as human-to ]

what is of specific interest there is the same case that was found to be confirmed human to human is also the first case of confirmed tamiflu resistent strains of h5n1...

Information manipulation IMO - H5N1 was Tamifly resistant from the get-go - one of the reasons it actually got some attention from world leaders.

those two issues by themselves are a danger but together in the one case is extraordinary and may paint the picture of what does happen when it mutates

theory
...The strains of H5N1 that were killed by the Tamiflu...... were the standard H5n1 strains that can be targetted by tamiflu
the strains of h5n1 that are resistent are the new dangerous mutated strains spreadable by human to human
those resistent strains are possibly the mutation that we all fear...

...This is significant in that it appears that Tamiflu is triggering H5N1's mutation. Again, predictable - again, one of the consequences that scientists warned would occur. For the same reason, the WHO and other international agencies have asked nations NOT to vaccinate poultry flocks against H5N1 - because vaccines not only spread the disease, but also seem to trigger a mutation response...


.

Thats good information Soficrow. As far as I know, every case of human to human transmission has been within the immediate family of someone who caught the flu from birds and in most of the cases they could not be sure the other persons didn't also catch it from firds. When I say immediate family, what I really mean is from people who lived in the same house.

[edit on 16-10-2005 by Astronomer68]

Originally posted by Astronomer68
Thats good information Soficrow. As far as I know, every case of human to human transmission has been within the immediate family of someone who caught the flu from birds and in most of the cases they could not be sure the other persons didn't also catch it from firds.

Just weaseling IMO - and disinfo. I have been reporting on bird flu and human-to-human transmission for some time here at ATS. The following example dates back to March this year - but I know there are earlier examples too. ...For at least a year, we see articles saying human-to-human transmission has "just now" emerged.

QUOTE

H5N1 bird flu is now known to spread person-to-person, and to be asymptomatic in some individuals. This means that unknown to anyone, some people might be carriers.

Relatives of avian flu patients have asymptomatic cases

Mar 9, 2005 (CIDRAP News) – Two relatives of avian influenza patients in northern Vietnam have tested positive for the virus without being sick, according to reports from Vietnam today.

............

"...researchers have recently described several instances of person-to-person transmission."

"Now there is evidence that in rare cases it can spread from person to person."

Ie., see:
WHO Pushes for Bird Flu Vaccine Production
OR Military: Terrorists could use Bird Flu as Bioweapon

(forget which one this came from)

Sofi,

I agree history is being rewritten. My comment before ------re

"Up to this point the official line has really been no confirmed human to human. There was talk of human to human transmission when two nurses were infected in Vietnam but nothing more was said. It kind of got buried. I think this is one of, if not the first definite confirmed publicly human to human transmission."

Even though the media has in fact reported pockets of human to human transmission the reports have always been careful to use the right words like "suspected" "possible" "may" and "appears".

I really do think this is the first case where they have been so positive in confirmation of human to human. I may be wrong but I really think this is the first time the media has let their heads go and said that it is definitely human to human in this case.

I read your reply where you stated that Tamiflu may be the actual cause of the mutation and I was quite startled. Startled not because of what you said and believing it but startled tht I hadn't looked at that possibility and now I have... My startled is now ...scared..........



[edit on 16-10-2005 by Mayet]