Do you really believe the "times of troubles" are coming? How sure are you?

See to it that no one takes You Captive through hollow and Deceptive Philosophy, Which Depends on Human Tradition and the basic Principles of this world rather than on Christ....
For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in Bodily form, and You have been given fullness in Christ, Who is the head over every power and authority...


Remember, the last time God clean the Earth, only one family save from the deadly Waters...

Machine
As long as the church teaches solid biblical truths and practices in a Christian manner it’s well within God’s plan.

Queenannie38
But they don't. ++++

Either you are a liar or you have been to or investigated all the Christian churches of the world and found each one of them to be lacking in solid biblical truths. I’ll leave the readers to decide.

In Christ,
James

Originally posted by Machine


Either you are a liar or you have been to or investigated all the Christian churches of the world and found each one of them to be lacking in solid biblical truths. I’ll leave the readers to decide.

In Christ,
James

Funny how readily those who call themselves christians jump to call another a 'liar' anytime they're confronted with something that disrupts their comfort zone.

Totally an UN 'christian' thing to do.

I agree. Let the reader decide--they've got no other choice anyway, since neither you nor I can decide for another.

[edit on 10/7/2005 by queenannie38]

Originally posted by Machine
As long as the church teaches solid biblical truths and practices in a Christian manner it’s well within God’s plan.

What are solid bibilical truths? What is the Christian manner?



[edit on 7/10/2005 by AkashicWanderer]

Originally posted by queenannie38

I'll give you that because universalism isn't Biblical.

That's what you claim, but cannot support in any satisfactory manner so far.

We have already gone over that paticular question on other threads.

As I recall, though, you never seem to go the distance with it--there are many verses that I have cited that you can't refute or explain according to what you feel is 'scriptural.'


[

You believe all, key word all, people will be saved and that there is no Biblical verses that refute this. In Revelation we are told that the false prophet and antichrist are in the Lake of Fire and will be tormented day and night forever and ever. That refutes universalism.

In Revelation it says books were opened and the dead were judged according to what was written in them. It doesn't say that "if" there are those in the dead condition they will be judged, but it tells us that the dead are judged by the books according to their works, so there are some who will depart from God's presence for all eternity.

In Jesus own words He tells us that He, Himself, says to some, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire..............And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous to eternal life. Matthew chapter 25. You can try to put a good spin on that but it's not the truth.

It is obvious that some will not be saved. It is possible to read a verse and rationalize it to where it makes God into who you want Him to be and what you want Him to be like and how you want Him to act. I've done that before. But that destroys the truth. It also relieves us of the responsibilty of telling people plainly that they are lost without Christ and need a Savior.
But that is why we are here to warn people that there is an eternal place of seperation from God that is escapable through Christ.

Originally posted by dbrandt
You believe all, key word all, people will be saved and that there is no Biblical verses that refute this. In Revelation we are told that the false prophet and antichrist are in the Lake of Fire and will be tormented day and night forever and ever. That refutes universalism.

I now have the perfect way to refute Christianity. Write a book that says Jesus doesn't exist, this will refute Christianity.

Originally posted by AkashicWanderer

Originally posted by dbrandt
You believe all, key word all, people will be saved and that there is no Biblical verses that refute this. In Revelation we are told that the false prophet and antichrist are in the Lake of Fire and will be tormented day and night forever and ever. That refutes universalism.

I now have the perfect way to refute Christianity. Write a book that says Jesus doesn't exist, this will refute Christianity.

What?..........there are already enough of those.

Originally posted by dbrandt
What?..........there are already enough of those.

Then using your logic, Christianity has been refuted. Case Closed.

[edit on 7/10/2005 by AkashicWanderer]

Originally posted by dbrandt
You believe all, key word all, people will be saved and that there is no Biblical verses that refute this. In Revelation we are told that the false prophet and antichrist are in the Lake of Fire and will be tormented day and night forever and ever. That refutes universalism.

Proper exegesis will show no conflict on this point. You choose one verse of a figurative nature as a refutation....yet ignore plain-spoken words by Isaiah, Paul, and various others. You pick and choose what you think supports your indoctrinated thinking. I just read the bible and I believe what it says.

You can try to put a good spin on that but it's not the truth.

I'm not spinning anything. It's called exegesis, study, and open-mindedness.

It is possible to read a verse and rationalize it to where it makes God into who you want Him to be and what you want Him to be like and how you want Him to act.

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: --Romans 3:22 KJV

Plain spoken words. No rationalization required to understand--for there is no difference.

I've done that before.

And you continue to do so.

But that destroys the truth.

Truth cannot be destroyed.

It also relieves us of the responsibilty of telling people plainly that they are lost without Christ and need a Savior.

You're taking on something that is not yours to take on. You have one responsibility, first and foremost, to other people. Same one as all of us. Commanded by Christ. Love your neighbor as yourself. So far you have judged your neighbor, but that's not love.

But that is why we are here to warn people that there is an eternal place of seperation from God that is escapable through Christ.

No, you are here to love. You cannot serve meat while you still drink milk.

Queenannie38
Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference: --Romans 3:22 KJV

Plain spoken words. No rationalization required to understand--for there is no difference.

Romans 3:22 Even the righteousness of God [which is] by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Queenannie38, I think I understand what it is you’re trying to pull out of this scripture. Read the entire section and you’ll clearly see that Paul is discussing the simple fact that both Gentiles and Jews are saved by believing and having faith in Jesus Christ. This does not give any help to those who do not have faith in Jesus Christ and believe upon his name for their salvation.

The last part which reads, “for there is no difference” simply confirms this teaching. “For there is no difference”, between Gentile and Jew if they place their faith in Jesus Christ. Are you trying to use this scripture to justify your belief in universalism?

A plain and literal reading of the Bible clearly lays out the doctrine of eternal punishment in the Lake of Fire for all who do not believe upon the name of Jesus Christ. Universalism is easily refuted in the Word of God.

You keep teaching your lies and giving false hope to the damned and I’ll keep warning anyone who will listen about the real danger they are in if they accept your teaching.

In Christ,

James

Originally posted by queenannie38

It also relieves us of the responsibilty of telling people plainly that they are lost without Christ and need a Savior.

You're taking on something that is not yours to take on.

Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mark 16:15-16

Wrong, we are told by Christ to go into all the world. If you love someone you don't want them to go to hell for eternity. So you will tell them about the salvation in Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by dbrandt
Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned. Mark 16:15-16

Wrong, we are told by Christ to go into all the world. If you love someone you don't want them to go to hell for eternity. So you will tell them about the salvation in Jesus Christ.

If you do not tell someone about Jesus Christ then he won't be able to "beliveth not", so by telling this person you are giving them the opportunity to deny Christ, while if they were ignorant they could have not.

Originally posted by AkashicWanderer
If you do not tell someone about Jesus Christ then he won't be able to "beliveth not", so by telling this person you are giving them the opportunity to deny Christ, while if they were ignorant they could have not.

No because Romans 1:18-20 speaks of that. Mankind is without excuse. We are made to know there is a God and creation itself, that mankind sees, clearly tells that there is a God, yet some choose not to believe.

Plus all where born needing sin and it's effects removed, so they need to hear how this is accomplished.

[edit on 8-10-2005 by dbrandt]