It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

NEWS: Catholic Church No Longer Swears by Truth of The Bible

page: 1
7
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 01:57 PM
link   
The Catholic Bishops Conferences of England & Wales and Scotland have released a "teaching document" instructing Catholics not to consider The Bible as a literal text, stating that portions of the Bible are not scientifically accurate or historically precise. Release of the document, entitled The Gift of Scripture, comes on the 40th anniversary of the Second Vatican Council which promulgated the Dogmatic Constitution on Divine Revelation, popularly known as Dei Verbum. The Gift of Scripture is intended to be an instruction and clarification of that and other Catholic Church documents.
 



www.timesonline.co.uk
The Catholic bishops of England, Wales and Scotland are warning their five million worshippers, as well as any others drawn to the study of scripture, that they should not expect “total accuracy” from the Bible.

“We should not expect to find in Scripture full scientific accuracy or complete historical precision,” they say in The Gift of Scripture.

In the document, the bishops acknowledge their debt to biblical scholars. They say the Bible must be approached in the knowledge that it is “God’s word expressed in human language” and that proper acknowledgement should be given both to the word of God and its human dimensions.

They say the Church must offer the gospel in ways “appropriate to changing times, intelligible and attractive to our contemporaries”.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.




I'm no expert on Catholic doctrine, so perhaps another contributor can explain what, if any, is the significance of this document in regards to any change in stance from the church official hierarchy.

Personally I have always regarded the Bible more as a general and inherently personal guide for each and every individual. Interpreting the Bible literally will always raise issues of apparent contradictions, arguments over which books should be included and which not, as well as questions regarding historical alterations to the text and the accuracy of translations.

www.cts-online.org.uk...

Related News Links:
www.cliftondiocese.com

[edit on 2005-10-5 by wecomeinpeace]




posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 02:13 PM
link   


so perhaps another contributor can explain what, if any, is the significance of this document in regards to any change in stance from the church official hierarchy.

Hmm, Im no expert either...but I think I have an axample of what they mean. I think according to the bible, the Earth/Man is only 6,000 years old....but obviously we're much older than that and the Church knows this...so they're sending this document to let people know that some things in the Bible are not at face value...or something like that.

Im all confused now



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 02:43 PM
link   


They say the Church must offer the gospel in ways “appropriate to changing times, intelligible and attractive to our contemporaries”.


OMG!!!
if they make birthcontrol OK, and let priests marry THEN I WOULD KISS THE POPE

Actually this is just documenting the changes that they have had for decades...

when the "christian right" says that the world is only 6000years old... those particular christians are in a very small minority... the catholic church advocates that it is way older than that ...(they admit, they don't know for sure, but at least 270,000years old

so it cracks me up whenever someone trys to get literal with the bible and quote unreal numbers...
they are stepping away from the mainstream Christian perspective.

Applause for the Catholic leadership... this is a positive move... now i hope to see lots more...
(for Gods sake, at least advocate Birth control in overpopulated famine ridden countries...it is only humane)



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 02:45 PM
link   

The Catholic Bishops Conferences of England & Wales and Scotland have released a "teaching document" instructing Catholics not to consider The Bible as a literal text




I am no expert either, just curious what has taken them so long to make this known?

Every Catholic church I have attended have always taught never to take the bible literally for years.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 02:50 PM
link   
I think you must reside on the moon, if you don't understand the importance of this document. The literal interpretation of the Bible ruled Western Civilization for millenia, impeded the advance of science, and is at the heart of school curricula debates throughout the land. How many heretics were burned at the stake, literally and figuratively, for believing that the earth is round or that the earth was not the center of the universe? This doesn't really come as a surprise, since the church some while back issued an apology to Galileo.

www.beliefnet.com...



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 03:25 PM
link   

I think you must reside on the moon, if you don't understand the importance of this document.


I am not sure if you were directing that to me Grady; all I was pointing out is the churches I have attended all my life have said that one should never taken the bible literally and I am 68. I am in no way saying the document is not important, just wondering what took the Catholic church in England so long since it is the way that I was taught.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 03:26 PM
link   
If I read this right it is the Church of England that has announced this right. The Vatican still stands pat. I've said for a long time that I personally have no problem with the Bible, it is the editorial staff that I am at odds with.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 03:39 PM
link   
This report has nothing to do with the Church of England. Also the title of the article is misleading. The Bishops are not denouncing the truth of the Bible, but the limitations of its facts.




In the document, the bishops acknowledge their debt to biblical scholars. They say the Bible must be approached in the knowledge that it is “God’s word expressed in human language” and that proper acknowledgement should be given both to the word of God and its human dimensions.

They say the Church must offer the gospel in ways “appropriate to changing times, intelligible and attractive to our contemporaries”.

The Bible is true in passages relating to human salvation, they say, but continue: “We should not expect total accuracy from the Bible in other, secular matters.”

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 03:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
This report has nothing to do with the Church of England. Also the title of the article is misleading. The Bishops are not denouncing the truth of the Bible, but the limitations of its facts.



Ok now ya really lost me. I never mentioned the Church of England what I said was the Catholic church in England



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 04:00 PM
link   
If you read the post directly above mine you will note the perception that the Church of England is involved. I'm trying to follow the rules regarding excessive quoting.



Quote the post immediately before yours: This doesn't make much sense, but if you must quote the post before yours, please quote just a small portion.

www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 04:10 PM
link   
This is old news.
Its may not have been covered on ATS, but i know it is old news from a priest i used to see.

Basically i had to covert to Catholicism to get married. The Priest, or to be more specific, Monsignor, actually told me to interpret the Bible in my own way. He did not say not to believe it, but basically to take things contained in it with a pinch of salt, and make my own opinions of what i read.

This has turned out to be very sound advice.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 04:29 PM
link   
Sorry. I was asking if it was the Church of England. I know now that it wasn't. I apologize for the confusion created by my previous statement.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 04:56 PM
link   
This story is not as significant as it may seem at first glance - the Times Online article shows sure traces of sensationalism in its text and its title. That being said, this is still somewhat of an important moment in church history. It should be noted DULY that this book is intended to be ecumenical and its release should be regarded as an official Catholic Church action.

For decades now, the church has arguably been playing the role of "catch up" as scientific advances have threatened to imperil the future of fundamental church teachings. It would not be inaccurate to state that the Catholic Church has gradually relaxed its positions on such topics as evolution - in fact, you may recall Pope John Paul II's message to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences of October, 1996, wherein the pope officially acknowledged that the Catholic Church recognized evolution as a possible tool of God's creation.(1)

I'll try to keep this short and cut right to the chase. The merit of this action lies in the church leadership sanctioning the church and Christian worshippers to observe flexibility in their interpretations of biblical science and history. In this apologetic manner, many specific problems are being solved simultaneously (the first thing that comes to mind is an apology to the Jewish people - the source article touches on this somewhat).

Using the kinds of semantic manipulation that we've come to know and love from the Catholic Church, the stance is that God's Word is simply unsuitable for perfect human interpretation.

The big news is that the action is basically another huge concession from the church. It will probably be the last one we will see for a VERY long time because it is quite encompassing.

We will probably be talking about this over in the Origins and Creationism Conspiracy forum. I urge you to stop by!

Zip



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 06:15 PM
link   
The catholic church does not take a literalist reading of the bible. Where it says that the earth was made in six days, it doesn't read that as meaning 6 24 hours days, nor that women were made from a man's rib, etc etc.

This conference is not a change in the theology.


The catholic church, and the orthodoxic church, having the advantage of comming out of the actual original early christian commnity, and having the historical perspective of being able to see just how there were many false gospels and that there were many alterations of the accepted canon, would naturally not insist that the bible be interpreted literally, and woudl also pay attention to stuff no in the gospels, such as Lent, holding communion, etc.

As far as science, the RCC, infamous for opposing the helicentric system, has changed quote a bit. JP2 had an astronomical observatory set up in his papal apartments, and infact the Vatican holds many conferences on pure science, at least one of which is annual. The church realises that science poses no obstacle for faith.


for Gods sake, at least advocate Birth control

I've never understood this argument, sex for any purpose other than procreation is a sin in the church, a pious and obedient catholic would break that rule, commit that great sin, but not use a condom? They'd be ok with breaking the rules about having sex, but not about using contraception? Perhaps its less of an issue with respect to married couples tho.
I've never understood this arguement. Premarita



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 06:29 PM
link   
When did the Catholic church EVER advocate the Bible as being true? They have always said their tradition and the pronouncements of the pope trump their "bible."

Their bible is based on flawed manuscripts. Their bible says whatever they want it to say.

The former pope issued a decree endorsing evolution.

The Catholic church through the ages has kept the bible locked away, not wanting the commoner to have a peek at it. When William Tyndale and the people from England were trying to get a translation for the common people the Catholic church hunted them down, confiscated the printed copies, and burned them.

Now that it's too late to keep the common man from having his own Bible, they simply fund a slew of counterfeit "modern versions" -- new and improved, to create the impression that there isn't any real bible anyway, never was, and that if anybody wants to know what God wants or thinks they should come to them for the answers.

Even though the church is full of depravity, pedophilia and all kinds of vile and wicked behavior, going back to its history of persecution of Christians in the Inquisition, the torture and persecution of believers who would not bow their knee to the "Mother church."

The Catholic church is thought by many to be the whore of Babylon spoken of in Revelation, the beast who sits upon the seven hills.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 07:11 PM
link   

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
If you read the post directly above mine you will note the perception that the Church of England is involved. I'm trying to follow the rules regarding excessive quoting.



Thats ok all I was asking for was clarification as to whom you were addressing your original statement. That by the way has noting to do with the previous post since. I was simply seeking an answer to a statement that I perceived was addressed to me, which was.


quote: I think you must reside on the moon, if you don't understand the importance of this document.

I am not sure if you were directing that to me Grady; all I was pointing out is the churches I have attended all my life have said that one should never take the bible literally and I am 68. I am in no way saying the document is not important, just wondering what took the Catholic church in England so long since it is the way that I was taught.



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 07:22 PM
link   
I should have used the term "one" rather than "you." Of course, by the time the Vatican rules on anything there is already movement within the church. Clearly, the church has to revise it's view of the cosmos as the evidence grows toward one view or the other. But, a document of this nature is bound to have far reaching consequence throughout the Christian world. Of course, Jews have held a more sane view of the such matters for a long time and it really is their scriptures that are at issue here.

[edit on 2005/10/5 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Oct, 5 2005 @ 08:34 PM
link   

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
I should have used the term "one" rather than "you."
[edit on 2005/10/5 by GradyPhilpott]


Thank you
Worded that way it makes sense.



posted on Oct, 6 2005 @ 11:09 AM
link   

Originally posted by resistance
When did the Catholic church EVER advocate the Bible as being true? They have always said their tradition and the pronouncements of the pope trump their "bible."

You're completely mireading whats going on. The church isn't saying that the bible isn't true, the church is saying that not everything in it has to be taken literally, and the church isn't saying that the pope 'supersedes' the bible.


The Catholic church through the ages has kept the bible locked away, not wanting the commoner to have a peek at it.
Considering the atrocious readings that lots of people have given teh bible, this perhaps wasn't the worst idea in the world.

Now that it's too late to keep the common man from having his own Bible, they simply fund a slew of counterfeit "modern versions"

What in the world are you talking about??

The Catholic church is thought by many to be the whore of Babylon spoken of in Revelation, the beast who sits upon the seven hills.

Strange, I thought it was the protestants that were the whore of babylon. Or maybe it was the 'revivalist' christians that are the false prophets. Gosh, guess what a bunch of panicy people 'think' doesn't really mean much does it?



posted on Oct, 7 2005 @ 07:07 PM
link   
Nygdan -- Modern translations are based on two Catholic Greek texts (Vaticanus, from the Vatican; and Sinaticus, from a monastery), their translators calling them “the best and most reliable texts.” Because the Protestants are using these flawed and corrupted manuscripts for their new versions, Rom now tolerates and even recommends most of the modern translations. Rome continues to condemn the King James Bible as they have from the beginning. Tyndale, whose translation is mostly intact in the KJB, was martyred by the Catholics, and his printed translations were confiscated and burned by the Catholic church whenever possible. So today, thanks to the corrupt manuscripts provided by the Catholics, Catholics and many Protestants have pretty much the same phony bibles (apart from the apocrypha). Meantime, the real Bible, the KJB, is excoriated by Protestants and Catholics alike.

If Genesis is not to be taken literally, what explanation for creation does the "Mother Church" wish to substitute in its stead? (Answer: Atheist theory of evolution.) If God did not literally create the first man and woman and name them Adam and Eve, then how DID the first man and woman arrive on the scene on Planet Earth? (Catholic authoritative answer by former Pope: They evolved over billions of years from dead matter, one life form turning into another, one kind becoming another kind, until finally, voila, we have man.) What a big crock!

And who are all those people listed in the "begats" as having descended from Adam and Eve? Are they also "allegorical" persons? And since Jesus' geneology is traced through all those "begats," is the "Mother Church" saying that Jesus is an allegory also?

THIS is one reason I believe the Catholic Church is in fact the Harlot of Babylon spoken of in Scripture.



[edit on 7-10-2005 by resistance]




top topics



 
7
<<   2  3 >>

log in

join