Why the end of the world is not happening soon.

Exellent article here on prophecy and the future of the world. All these things have to come tp pass before the end of the world...
www.kuro5hin.org...


The different camps all roughly believe the same thing: Jesus comes back, the dead are raised, everyone is judged, good are rewarded, bad are punished, etc. The specifics are where people start to branch off in their own directions, though.

According to the prophet Daniel (whom Jesus refers to in the Olivet Discourse), there will be a seven year period at the end of the world in which the anti-christ (literally, one against Christ) rises to power and tries one more time to deceive as many people as possible before the end.

During this final seven year period many things will happen according to prophecy: two witnesses will show up preaching the Word (eventually killed then raised to heaven), the anti-christ will show up with false signs and wonders, the seals will be broken and many billions of people will perish on earth.

Halfway into the final seven year period, some believe the Jewish temple will be rebuilt on the Temple Mount. I'm not sure about this myself yet. From this temple (or what Jesus referred to as the Holy Place), the deceiver will liken himself to God and demand that humans worship him or die.

Sometime between the halfway point and the end of the final seven years (Jesus said He would cut the time short, lest every last one of us died), Jesus will make His triumphant return. The sky will go dark, the moon will turn red, a trumpet will sound, and the dead shall rise first. Then, those few who are left alive on the planet and believe will rise up to meet Him in the air.

Then, a battle will take place; Satan and the world vs. Jesus and the saints. Jesus wins. The serpent is locked in the bottomless pit. Jesus rules the planet from Jerusalem. We have our new bodies. A new heaven and a new earth have been established.

One-thousand years later, satan is let loose for one last battle, still thinking that he can win or that at least he should take as many of us with him. This is the battle of Armageddon. Lucifer loses and is cast into the pit for eternity.

Yes, yes, sounds like a fairy tale to you perhaps, with consumerism and the worship of Mammon running rampant, but I believe it's true. (And yes, I lust after material items too, although I try not to do this.)

This is a very basic outline of some of the major events that are scheduled to happen. I've purposefully left out many details (the Gog Magog war for one, the identiy of the Whore of Babylon/Mystery Babylon/Daughter of Babylon, The Seven Seals, etc.) If this doesn't flounder and sink in the queue, maybe one day I'll come back to the issue and go over some of the details.

Preterists
(The Future Prophecy is ancient history already.)

These people believe that all end time prophecy has been fulfilled, that it really only referred to the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 A.D. This camp is split up into further divisions (causing even more confusion, not an accident, I imagine) with some believing Jesus has already been here and left while others believe Jesus has yet to return to earth to claim what was given Him although think a lot of stuff has already passed.

Pre-Tribulation
(Christians are superior to even the Jews and leave the planet before things get bad.)

This teaching (which I sometimes refer to as the American version of the end times) gained popularity in the late 19th century. Lately, it has found a following in the Left Behind series, which teaches this doctrine.

Basically, pre-tribulation is a belief that for some reason modern Christians (especially those in the U.S. of A.) are 'special' and different than the rest of the world in that they're whisked away (in the rapture) before the tribulation (the final seven year period) begins.

This belief, in my opinion, leads them to not worry about the hard times ahead for the world because they don't think they will be here. This also lends itself to a lot of the Holier-than-thou attitudes that abound in the world today

This teaching, however explained, says that Jesus will return twice, once for the special Christians living at the end of the world, and then once after all the bad stuff happens for the rest of humanity. Searching scripture, though, I can't find this. I see a glimpse of how it could be interpreted that way here and there, but when you put all the pieces of the puzzle together, it doesn't jive with the info we've been given.

Pre-Wrath
(Christians will be present for most of the end times, but not the really, truly bad parts.)

People who are pre-wrath believe that halfway into the last seven years, when the anti-christ "defiles the holy place" (let him who reads understand) and demands to be worshipped, the Christian believers will be whisked away in the rapture.

This final three and a half years is the point things get really brutal on the planet and God's wrath is poured onto the Earth. This is a middle-of-the-road view that tries to incorporate some pre-tribulation and post-tribulation ideas.

Post-Tribulation
(Believers will be here until they die or Jesus returns, most likely the former.)

This school of thought is the closest to scripture, in my most humble opinion. Post-tribulation teaches that humans (saved and unsaved, Jew and Gentile) are here in the thick of it until the very end when Jesus Christ returns.

This view teaches that scripture says those who profess belief in Jesus Christ in the end times will be put to death for their beliefs (it happens today in certain parts of the world). There is no fear, but on the other hand neither is there a desire to hasten the Day of the Lord, when Jesus returns. Jesus has conquered death (the curse) and yet He warned us the final days would be as no other days seen on the earth.

And from what I've been able to gather (as information and knowledge increases) this old planet has been through quite a bit since its inception. From earthquakes, wars, and the great flood (another hint at the end times answer), this planet has been battered and bruised as we (humans), made in the image of God, utterly wreck the planet.

Well it was predicted that chaos would reign at the turn of the millenium,but it never happend i was at a BBQ with a mate his wife and me g/f and me and me mate hoping to see some violence, in the end we were very disappointed.

This will all happen..... if you take The Bible seriously.

I personally can't.

Here's someone's site that is dedicated to debunking the 'End of the World' or at least the idea that listening to someone's prophesies about such ideas is pointless. One of my personal favorites is his topic: "If first you don't succeed, fail, fail again...". It's quite long but it's a walk through historical dates and failed prophesies of the end of the world by many. Some of them are pretty funny actually....

www.geocities.com...

EDIT: "If first you DON'T SUCCEED..."

[Edited on 10-9-2003 by mOjOm]

Don't hear much from the skeptics concerning the "70 Weeks of Daniel" prophecy (Daniel 9:24 - 9:27). Almost everybody agrees that the first 69 weeks of Daniel prophecy has been fulfilled by the advent of Jesus Christ (with amazing dating accuracy). The question is whether the final (70th) week represents fulfilled prophecy (destruction of the Second Temple in 70 A.D.) or a future "end times" prophecy.

Originally posted by jagdflieger
Don't hear much from the skeptics concerning the "70 Weeks of Daniel" prophecy (Daniel 9:24 - 9:27). Almost everybody agrees that the first 69 weeks of Daniel prophecy has been fulfilled by the advent of Jesus Christ (with amazing dating accuracy). The question is whether the final (70th) week represents fulfilled prophecy (destruction of the Second Temple in 70 A.D.) or a future "end times" prophecy.

The book of Daniel of the Old Testament making prophecies for the New Testament can be easily explained away if you realize that the New Testament was written to at least in part attempt to flow with some continuity from the Old Testament. This such prophecy really means nothing to real world events.

Quote from heelstone
The book of Daniel of the Old Testament making prophecies for the New Testament can be easily explained away if you realize that the New Testament was written to at least in part attempt to flow with some continuity from the Old Testament. This such prophecy really means nothing to real world events.

Pleas explain your thesis with some details.

Originally posted by jagdflieger

Pleas explain your thesis with some details.

What he means is that the people that wrote the new testament already had the old testament. They could tell the story so that it fulfilled prophesy, even if it didn't.

Originally posted by jagdflieger
Pleas explain your thesis with some details.

My thesis? I didn't really make one rather than state an opinion.

You are making the assumption that whatever is in The Bible is factual. Facts are that the documents comprising the New Testament weren't even started until at least around 40-80 years after Jesus ascended into heaven. All the accounts of the reality of Jesus derive from written accounts. There is nothing else of historical signficance for evidence of this man's existence. All these written accounts could be complete bunk. Ever think about that?

I know people are supposed to have faith that what took place in The Bible actually happened, but that hasn't stopped me from actually wanting to look and see if what was handed down through the ages contained at least some evidence to it. I have to do it time and again for other things that have yet to be proven. Religion should be no different.

[Edited on 10-9-2003 by heelstone]

Well the 70 Weeks of Daniel relates to many events that are external to the New Testament. Again I do not see the details of the thesis. What passages in the New Testament were written to support the time frame as given in the Old Testament. The 70 Weeks of Daniel prophecy predicts the destruction of Jerusalem and the Second Temple.

I personally believer that the world will be very different by the end of the centuary there will be no different religions and there will be a huge war this centuary i believe.

The problem is with each new generation a whole new set of ideas present themselves as to when the world is coming to an end (and why). For the most part they do always reflect the immediate future, contemporary examples (of the times) are cited the and on the surface it all seems very serious but the alleged fateful day occurs and nothing happens. In the meantime the theorist have made some money and gotten attention for their efforts. Which from a certain context, to many, seems the real purpose of the claims to begin with.

Though personally, with respect to the author of the book in question. My impression is he did in fact have a vision of something, potentially relatable to some event in the future (from his perspective). The problem when one tries to form conclusions based upon the visions of others, is that the symbols of meaning with respect to that vision are specific to the person in question.



Any thoughts?

Heelstone are you contending that Jesus Christ was not a real person who was crucified 30-33 A.D. and are you saying that the Second Temple was not destroyed in 70 A.D.?

Really well written NetChicken.

There are contadictions everywhere. Somewhere along the way we'll find the balance. Like for example, from what I've heard, 'the weeds are first gathered, thrown into the fire and then comes the harvest.' Another thing I heard is that those who overcome the difficulties will be saved. And if Jesus comes to the Earth and picks up the rest of the people...hm...well it is complex. Perhaps they are picked up and then...what happens on earth, happens...and what goes on elsewhere, in another dimension where there will be no more crying, happens there too. I heard of the split. Like when a person dies, I was told some time in my life, that their good side goes into one direction and the bad side into another. Like there were two beings tied into one or something. Takes alot of thought.

Originally posted by jagdflieger
Heelstone are you contending that Jesus Christ was not a real person who was crucified 30-33 A.D. and are you saying that the Second Temple was not destroyed in 70 A.D.?

The Second Temple might have been destroyed in 70 A.D, but the reality of any Messiah simply does not exist according to history. There are no writings regarding the existence of Jesus by any of his contemporaries during his lifetime. This was a man who had so much influence that his childhood worship had a king (Herod) kill all the children of Bethlehem. Why are there no records of that time that pertain to that heinous event, or at least to the power and influence of such a child? No matter how popular Jesus was during his time on earth, which eventually led to his death from being so influencial, nobody wrote about him until decades after his ascension. There's not even any historical account of a city named Nazareth during the time that Jesus was on earth.

Other people throughout history have left traces of their existence, either through the writings of others regarding them or something left by that very person.

The fact is with regarding Jesus is that there is nothing to support this man's existence other than religious texts. Much like the mythology of other cultures like the Greek who placed fictional people in real settings.

I also want to add that I don't think that religion, such as Christianity is outright bunk or wrong. There could be a spiritual reason for life, but I want to know all the facts. Why deeply follow a religion if it indeed has no basis in reality? I have a lot of faith in NDE accounts, but I need to examine as much as I can to separate the wheat from the chaffe.

[Edited on 10-9-2003 by heelstone]

but unfortunately i have already done so...
for the choice has already been made for most of us...
a very difficult decision nonetheless, yet i pray the rapture is an expedient process...

Quote from heelstone
I also want to add that I don't think that religion, such as Christianity is outright bunk or wrong. There could be a spiritual reason for life, but I want to know all the facts. Why deeply follow a religion if it indeed has no basis in reality? I have a lot of faith in NDE accounts, but I need to examine as much as I can to separate the wheat from the chaffe.

I do not beleive that you have made a really serious inquiry as to the historical character of Jesus Christ. Indeed you have probably only access the skeptics who advocate the "conspiracy of silence" theory. You have not really studied the early history of the Christian Church or the life of Jesus Christ. In short you have read only literature on one side of the issues which most likely agrees with you particular belief. There are many web sites which show that the textual information on Jesus Christ is overwhelming when compared with the textual information on other ancient personalities such as Alexander the Great. The fact that the Gospels were written within a few years of the death of Jesus is in itself a testimony to their credability.

Originally posted by heelstone
This will all happen..... if you take The Bible seriously.

I personally can't.

Same the bible is and was a hoax noone REALLY ever follows it by the book do they?

Given such literature - what happens if you are a humanist - and have an open mind. As i see it the documentary is writen by zelots - If we choose to ignore it - given the free will hinted at in the bible - might it not come to pass ?.

since I'm thinking of my grandma, one of my favorite pearls of wisdom from her is on the end of the world. I had watched one of those specials about end of the world prophecies, and being a little kid, was scared out of my wits. she told me "don't worry about it. we're not getting out of this that easily. we just have to live our lives as best we can, and leave the universe to itself. we can only control ourselves." and she's right. the end times are just so many fairy tales until/if they happen. not worth worrying yourself over things that are basically out of your control.