I'm sure this has been said before....

A lot of people will complain about this, but I would like to say this.

Why do people think that the war in Iraq has been a failure?
The number of dead service men from America is under 2000, but the British is 95. Source People have compared it to Vietnam, by saying at least in Vietnam help was asked for, but that was even worse than the War on Terror death toll.
Considering the service men and women who join the army are perfectly aware of the dangers of combat know the risk, and wanting to join the army when I'm older I know I might die. Also we got rid of Saddam Hussein who was a b****d of a man and comitted genocide and people weren't able to call for help.

The only problem with the war on terror is that the CIA helped fund the Taliban while fighting the Russians.

It seems as if we've won all the battles but not the war...

Exactly.

I don't understand why people consider it a failure either. Iraq invasion was primarily based on WMD's, we supposedly didn't find any but that doesnt mean failure. They could of easily been sent out of the country within days. While im on the topic of WMD's people seem to forget the Iraq > Iran war, were saddam hussein gassed many many Iranians, no reason why he wouldnt keep such weaons incase of another war.

As far as removing a mad man and introducing democracy to another country mission complete , the weapons im convinced we'll eventually come across. It's not comparable to Vietnam in my opinion.

The war was won within minutes of the first cruise missiles. Possibly before a bullet was even fired.

Vorta

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Vorta]

All you seem to be thinking about is how many people we have lost. That is your only looking at things from your point of interest first.
Here are just some of the reasons why "so many people" think the war in Iraq has been a failure...

1. First Gulf war killed 250,000 civilians but this war we don't respect the Iraqis we kill enough to count them. However given that this war has been going on for so long many people are wondering if it might just be higher.
2. According to Pentagon website Saddam killed between 250,000 and 350,000 people over 30 years of been in power. (So if we carry on much longer then even by our high end estimates we would have killed more).

This does not include the people who died because of his decisions like the Iran Iraq war which America openly supported him and i still think is right. It merely includes those "thought" to have died through oppression.

3. Despite Saddam's death toll he did bring Iraq stability. When Saddam took power Iraq was in more or less exactly the same kind of mess it is today.
4. Our removal of Saddam has created a "power vacuum" that has unleashed long term anarchy. This will be a long term source of death thanks to our military actions even after we leave Iraq.
Really it is more of a "power struggle" than a vacuum as the vacuum has already been filled. The fact the armed struggle is getting worse not better at this point in time shows how long it may continue.
5. Iraq's Sunnis are being massacred both by the population they used to control, and the Americans who are fighting the insurgency. The Sunnis although a minority are educated people, and follow a secular Muslim faith. They accepted and tolerated other faiths, this is opposed to the majority population (Muslim fundamentalists) our democracy has put in power (the Shiite group who make about 60% of a population).
As a Christian i feel for the Sunni Secular Muslims, and dislike the Fundamentalists Muslims who are Iraq's majority but also often dislike all other faiths (including different versions of their own).
6. Thanks to the insurgency Iraq is producing little more oil than it did under Saddam. Had we made peace with Saddam we would be getting a lot more oil.
7. Saddam was a good leader in the sense that he spent more of his countries wealth on his own people than any other Arab leader. Though UN Sanctions reduced much of Iraq’s populous from near Western style living standards before the Gulf War, to third world poverty by the start of the invasion, Saddam didn’t build nor even finish a palace half way through construction before the Gulf War. But yes he did live in them.
8. a: The western media is full of propaganda in the sense it "forgets" to tell you things. Little things like Kuwait had been part of Iraq for over 5200 years before 1921 when it was created by the British who ruled Iraq as part of the empire. That the only reason why Kuwait has so much oil is because we deliberately included Iraq’s oil within its borders through the Summer Protocol of 1921. That we did this to prevent Iraq being too powerful in the (then) future.
b: That the Kurds where accepting bribes from Iran to steer up in trouble inside Iraq. That Saddam had tried to negotiate with both the Iranians and the Kurds before he apparently gassed the Kurds, and invaded Iran because they had continued to bribe the Kurdish tribal leaders in spite of the Iran Iraq border deal, before the Iran Iraq war.
c: Our media is owned by few people who can and do deals with our politicians without braking the law. Be it taking questions in advance, or favouring on party over the other; their is no law against “not reporting the truth”. The only law Westerners have to give them faith in the media are ones which ban fabricating the truth. Many people know that is not enough, but know that we are a minority to have done our research and in a democracy only a majority rule.

When just this war (never mind Kuwait) has killed more people than Saddam's 34 years of brutality (it might have already; if only we could count!!!) it is then I want George Bush to go on trial. Since there is no justice in this life, let’s hope he (and people like him) will get it in the next!!!

Oh there is another great reason why some people are against war. Some people are doing it just for the hell of being anti establishment, egoist freaks. It’s sad but true with any left wing cause.
But on the other hand I think it’s a lot better than being in right wing group; where so many people are there because they think the State is almost a version of Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by Liberal1984
Oh there is another great reason why some people are against war. Some people are doing it just for the hell of being anti establishment, egoist freaks.

This might come as a shock regarding the above quote from your posting.
I am against the War in Iraq, and have been from the onset.

My son returned from a 6 months tour out there, and yes, i still believe this War was started under false pretenses, that is why i am against it.

I don't protest against the War, nor am i anti establishment, nor a freak. I have my opinions just like the next person. Labeling them as 'freaks' is wrong when its their opinion.

Dear Bikereddie when i said "anti establishment egoist freaks" I did not mean people like you who actually have their heads skewed on.
What I mean is the people who dominate small left wing political groups with so much energy, yet mostly from ego as opposed to brain. The sort who say "I'm protesting against: walling on Monday, nuclear energy on Tuesday, Oil on Wednesday, animal rights on Thursday and Iraq on Friday.

In England there are a lot of those people around. Sort of professional protesters if you will. But they are really annoying because they will rip a small political group apart by hogging the table, and (because they often smoke pot) got nothing done.
Its those people I’m talking about, not people who have different reasons for being against Iraq than myself. Especially when your reasons are also mine (though clearly not at the forefront of my thinking).
Sorry for the misunderstanding; Alex.

First Gulf war killed 250,000 civilians but this war we don't respect the Iraqis we kill enough to count them. However given that this war has been going on for so long many people are wondering if it might just be higher.

www.historyguy.com...

Civilian Casualty 2,300 estimate

www.cnn.com...

Civilian Casualty 35,000 estimate....Baghdad reports numbers are significantly less.

www.answers.com...

Scroll way down to find Dead civilians. Estimates 2,300


I could go on and on with sources that show the civilian casualties for the Gulf war #1...I have no idea where the heck you got 250,000. You just can't add zeros on the end of estimates.

In Fact I will go on with sources

www.reference.com...

www.businessweek.com...

All I did was type in Civilian Casualties numbers First Gulf War and listed every source from the first page. I still want to know where the heck you got 250,000

Oh by the way I did Casualty...That means injured and dead. So I am guessing dead is around 2,500. Little bit less than 250,000

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Timcouchfanclub]

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Timcouchfanclub]

Originally posted by Liberal1984

All you seem to be thinking about is how many people we have lost. That is your only looking at things from your point of interest first.
Here are just some of the reasons why "so many people" think the war in Iraq has been a failure...

1. First Gulf war killed 250,000 civilians but this war we don't respect the Iraqis we kill enough to count them. However given that this war has been going on for so long many people are wondering if it might just be higher.

These figures are completely wrong

2. According to Pentagon website Saddam killed between 250,000 and 350,000 people over 30 years of been in power. (So if we carry on much longer then even by our high end estimates we would have killed more).

Saddam killed over 100,000 Kurds alone, this doesn't include all the mass graves in and around Bagdad that we found. He left the Kurds dead in the streets.

This does not include the people who died because of his decisions like the Iran Iraq war which America openly supported him and i still think is right. It merely includes those "thought" to have died through oppression.

3. Despite Saddam's death toll he did bring Iraq stability. When Saddam took power Iraq was in more or less exactly the same kind of mess it is today.

At what point does stability become oppression? I hope I don't hear you correctly and you are justifying his actions?

4. Our removal of Saddam has created a "power vacuum" that has unleashed long term anarchy. This will be a long term source of death thanks to our military actions even after we leave Iraq.
Really it is more of a "power struggle" than a vacuum as the vacuum has already been filled. The fact the armed struggle is getting worse not better at this point in time shows how long it may continue.

Long term anarchy huh, I guess you can see into the future with a crystal ball. Give the Iraqi people some credit, they haven't even finalized a constitution yet.

5. Iraq's Sunnis are being massacred both by the population they used to control, and the Americans who are fighting the insurgency. The Sunnis although a minority are educated people, and follow a secular Muslim faith. They accepted and tolerated other faiths, this is opposed to the majority population (Muslim fundamentalists) our democracy has put in power (the Shiite group who make about 60% of a population).
As a Christian i feel for the Sunni Secular Muslims, and dislike the Fundamentalists Muslims who are Iraq's majority but also often dislike all other faiths (including different versions of their own).

This statement is where I quit reading you're factless opinions. The Sunni are the ones causing the terror, you are backwards in your statement.

6. Thanks to the insurgency Iraq is producing little more oil than it did under Saddam. Had we made peace with Saddam we would be getting a lot more oil.

Oil production in Iraq is higher than under Saddams rule, and it would be higher if terrorists quit their sabatoge.

7. Saddam was a good leader in the sense that he spent more of his countries wealth on his own people than any other Arab leader. Though UN Sanctions reduced much of Iraq’s populous from near Western style living standards before the Gulf War, to third world poverty by the start of the invasion, Saddam didn’t build nor even finish a palace half way through construction before the Gulf War. But yes he did live in them.

Clue? Saddam is the sole reason Iraq was inpoverished in the first place, Sanctions were offset by oil for food in which Saddam spent on his family and the weatlhy Sunni minority.

8. a: The western media is full of propaganda in the sense it "forgets" to tell you things. Little things like Kuwait had been part of Iraq for over 5200 years before 1921 when it was created by the British who ruled Iraq as part of the empire. That the only reason why Kuwait has so much oil is because we deliberately included Iraq’s oil within its borders through the Summer Protocol of 1921. That we did this to prevent Iraq being too powerful in the (then) future.

In this ignorant line of thinking, Russia should just take over 1/2 of the Balkans and sub - states that were formed in the Communist split, maybe you prefer China to take back Taiwan and I guess you also would prefer Israel to own half the Middle East again also. You have no concept of freedom. Maybe we should give Germany back Europe again also.

b: That the Kurds where accepting bribes from Iran to steer up in trouble inside Iraq. That Saddam had tried to negotiate with both the Iranians and the Kurds before he apparently gassed the Kurds, and invaded Iran because they had continued to bribe the Kurdish tribal leaders in spite of the Iran Iraq border deal, before the Iran Iraq war.
c: Our media is owned by few people who can and do deals with our politicians without braking the law. Be it taking questions in advance, or favouring on party over the other; their is no law against “not reporting the truth”. The only law Westerners have to give them faith in the media are ones which ban fabricating the truth. Many people know that is not enough, but know that we are a minority to have done our research and in a democracy only a majority rule.

English?

When just this war (never mind Kuwait) has killed more people than Saddam's 34 years of brutality (it might have already; if only we could count!!!) it is then I want George Bush to go on trial. Since there is no justice in this life, let’s hope he (and people like him) will get it in the next!!!

Oh there is another great reason why some people are against war. Some people are doing it just for the hell of being anti establishment, egoist freaks. It’s sad but true with any left wing cause.
But on the other hand I think it’s a lot better than being in right wing group; where so many people are there because they think the State is almost a version of Jesus Christ.

Thank God! you don't represent the majority in America we would be speaking German and living British. A healthy disagreement about the Iraq was is fine, but incorrect figures and analysis gives your arguement no merrit.

Dang! You guys hit him with truth and facts before I could!

Mashup, The USA helped the Mujahideen and the former Afghan Government during the very illegal Soviet invasion. The Taliban came about AFTER the Soviet pull-out. Don't let the lies of the left get in the way of your reality.

As nobody can predict the future, there was no way we could have known that rival tribes would fight for power among themselves, destroying any semblance of pre-Soviet government or leadership.

Of the 19 provinces in Iraq, 16 are calm, quiet, and orderly, with life going on so much better than 3 years ago. Electricity is available in more areas than ever, even in places that NEVER had power before. Same with clean/fresh water (two villes that were out in front of us, had a community canal that was used for everything you can imagine: washing, swimming, fishing, drinking, cooking, urinating and defecating). The Engineers with us, built a pipeline from the Tigris river to the villes, providing clean filtered water for the first time in about a thousand years...literally. Sadly, our LSA still used the canal water----heavily filtered of course---for our showers and toilet water.

rstrik, i think its pretty immatuer to say somethign like that. consider the time that ww2 happened, the morals and values of people in that day and age.. they were defending america against an attack on pear lharbour...
America was hit by Osama ' supposidly ' yet they hit Iraq? this is a completely different matter.

The war in iraq isnt COMPLETE yet, so to call it a failure is like counting your chickens.

To call it unjust? illegial? Stupid? arrogant? hot headed.. .well dang best call it an American war then!

The war on TERROR is a failure.. why? because the SUPPOSID master mind of the terror attack goes free, while america destorys mames and murders IRAQIS who did NOTHING WRONG!

This war is a failure of American respect and principles! why? because your commander in cheif, who LIED and decieved the world, still stands in front of his camera, with that stupid smirk on his face, reading PREPARED speaches saying that even tho there were no WMDS, iraq WASNT a threat and had NOTHING to do with sept11, that we have waltzed in, murders thousands of innocent people, destroyed endless amounts of historical buildings and artifacts but its all ok people... This was the RIGHT THING TO DO! those DAM iraqi's... they never wanted peace, they were EVIL SOB's and the might of American power destroyed there puny, pathetic ancient army...

God BLESS AMERICA!

you patriotic fools that still defend this criminal need to look in the mirror and make a serious assement.
How can anydefend what is happening in Iraq?,... democracy? bringing freedom?.. how about you ask the people on the ground in baghdad how FREE they feel?.. how DEMOCRATIC they are?

america created a hell hole on Earth, and they are prepared to throw in as MANY of its own Sons and Daughters as it needs to, to ensure that precious black gold that lines Chenney and Co's pockets keeps coming in.

this war isnt a failure, its a Joke.
A joke that is going to destroy this world as we know it.
The problem is america has created such a sh1t storm in Iraq that it is impossible to bring the troops home.
the point of no return was reached years ago, and Americas sons and daughters are going to pay for Bush's mistake with there blood.

for all you defending this war I ask if your son or daughter is there spilling there blood!.... defneding the troops is one thing, but defending the president who sent them there over BULLCR@P is another.
Thankyou America..

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]

Originally posted by Agit8dChop
rstrik, i think its pretty immatuer to say somethign like that. consider the time that ww2 happened, the morals and values of people in that day and age.. they were defending america against an attack on pear lharbour...
America was hit by Osama ' supposidly ' yet they hit Iraq? this is a completely different matter.

The war in iraq isnt COMPLETE yet, so to call it a failure is like counting your chickens.

To call it unjust? illegial? Stupid? arrogant? hot headed.. .well dang best call it an American war then!

The war on TERROR is a failure.. why? because the SUPPOSID master mind of the terror attack goes free, while america destorys mames and murders IRAQIS who did NOTHING WRONG!

This war is a failure of American respect and principles! why? because your commander in cheif, who LIED and decieved the world, still stands in front of his camera, with that stupid smirk on his face, reading PREPARED speaches saying that even tho there were no WMDS, iraq WASNT a threat and had NOTHING to do with sept11, that we have waltzed in, murders thousands of innocent people, destroyed endless amounts of historical buildings and artifacts but its all ok people... This was the RIGHT THING TO DO! those DAM iraqi's... they never wanted peace, they were EVIL SOB's and the might of American power destroyed there puny, pathetic ancient army...

God BLESS AMERICA!

you patriotic fools that still defend this criminal need to look in the mirror and make a serious assement.
How can anydefend what is happening in Iraq?,... democracy? bringing freedom?.. how about you ask the people on the ground in baghdad how FREE they feel?.. how DEMOCRATIC they are?

america created a hell hole on Earth, and they are prepared to throw in as MANY of its own Sons and Daughters as it needs to, to ensure that precious black gold that lines Chenney and Co's pockets keeps coming in.

this war isnt a failure, its a Joke.
A joke that is going to destroy this world as we know it.
The problem is america has created such a sh1t storm in Iraq that it is impossible to bring the troops home.
the point of no return was reached years ago, and Americas sons and daughters are going to pay for Bush's mistake with there blood.

for all you defending this war I ask if your son or daughter is there spilling there blood!.... defneding the troops is one thing, but defending the president who sent them there over BULLCR@P is another.
Thankyou America..

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]


[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Agit8dChop]

so we meet agian. same argument, same points. same facts.

if iraqis are willing to kill thousands of their own such as saddam hussien did, what makes you think they wont attack america such as osama did. its like a chess game, take out your threats before they attack you.

Because prior to the invasion Iraqi's WERNT attacking America..
But now that the US has unjustly gone in and murderd thousands of mothers/fathers/sons/daughters/autnies/uncles
thousnads of the aboves RELATIVES are going to want to seek revenge..

PLUS..
If Osama Really did hit the USA...why hasnt he been brought to justice..
its just MORE proof about the hidden agender behind ' terrorism '

Iraq did nothing wrong.
Saddam even asked for DIRECT dialogue with Bush prior to the war to explain the accusations that had been directed at him from the Americas,
but bush denied this...
Now come on..
Its obvious bush didnt give a hoot, he knew saddam would sway the public that he had nothing ' WHICH HE DIDNT '
but he didnt want to risk LOSING this war so he said no.

Saddam didnt have any threats to take out.
He barely had a defensive army to stop us coming in.
And all that this war has created is thousands more terrorists, endless world HATRED for America, and a major split about morals and principles between american public and the international community.

Your leader lied and decieved to get into Iraq.
He lies and decieves to continue OCCUPYING Iraq.

This is how the world see's it, and rightly so.
America has yet to shed ANY light on anything that has happened since sept10 2001. Its all been kept secret for internal eyes only, and the world has been expected to TRUST that the Americas really doooo have the right intentions at heart, even if it appears there just a bunch of greedy, bloody thirsty morons.

I take it your a soilder?...
even so.. I support the troops. I admire anyone willing to do the hard yards in a war zone. I understand your there following orders.
But the man making the orders, the man sending the troops in, the man MAKING this case for war is wrong, he's LYING and he's CURROPT!
and anyone who supports him is just as misguided, blinded and gullable as John howrad has prooven himself to be.

if iraqis are willing to kill thousands of their own such as saddam hussien did, what makes you think they wont attack america such as osama did. its like a chess game, take out your threats before they attack you.

Oh heck, why not eliminate every other country in the world because they could possibly attack America as Osama did. Everyone is a potential threat to America.

I don't like Saddam, for the most part I'm glad he's gone even though the country lost all stability in the aftermath of the war. My problem is the "reasons" that were given for going to war, the outright lies given to rationalize the invasion of a country once supported and supplied by the US.

Where was the invasion when the Iraqi people were getting gassed, or after Iraq invaded Kuwait? Did Iraq not pose a threat then? Oh, well in post 9/11 world it's different. It's not, the only difference is that people are aware of the threat, it was always there it's just a majority of the public couldn't see it.

Originally posted by Ponderosa

if iraqis are willing to kill thousands of their own such as saddam hussien did, what makes you think they wont attack america such as osama did. its like a chess game, take out your threats before they attack you.

Where was the invasion when the Iraqi people were getting gassed, or after Iraq invaded Kuwait? Did Iraq not pose a threat then? Oh, well in post 9/11 world it's different. It's not, the only difference is that people are aware of the threat, it was always there it's just a majority of the public couldn't see it.

thats why were over here

Why do people think that the war in Iraq has been a failure?

Hmm let me think about this one for a minute. I have a better question, why do people think that the war in Iraq has been anything but a failure?

Its hard for me to believe anybody with a functioning brain can ask a question as stupid as that but this is probably coming from one of the people that voted Bush in a second time so that makes it alot easier to believe.

Let me answer your question with two more questions.

1.) What was the reason I mean excuse Bush gave the orders to invade Iraq?
Ill give you the answer seeing as you probably dont even know that. His pathetic excuse was that Saddam possessed weapons of mass destruction.

2.) Did the U.S. army find any weapons of mass destruction?
You probably dont know that either so the answer is no.


You say it wasnt a failure because only 2000 or so U.S. troops died? So that makes it a success? Wouldnt it have been more of a success if not a single troop died?

And what about all the Iraqi's that died? Im not talking about Iraqi soldiers here either. The death toll of innocent Iraqi men, women, and children that died was over 20,000 and thats only what they counted not to mention all the people left injured and crippled for life. But I suppose you dont give a thought about the Iraqi people that suffered throughout this so called war.

Heres a question for you.
How can you sit at home knowing that all these innocent people died for absolutely no good reason and ask a question like that.

You make me sick.

No its not...
your over there because ur leader told u he had WMD and was a threat.

the people are irrelevant.
They are mearly cannon fodder to the president.

If you were there for the humanitarium crisis why werent you there WHEN it actually happened, not in 2003 when saddam was over the gassing of his people.

saddam was a ruthless leader, but finatical people need a ruthless leader.
he held them in faction, i dont agree with it, but thats how it worked.

America had no right to waltz in on its highhorse.
and if you still beleive ur there to save the people and bring them democracy then ur as blinded as the patriotic fools back home.

Of the 19 provinces in Iraq, 16 are calm, quiet, and orderly, with life going on so much better than 3 years ago. Electricity is available in more areas than ever, even in places that NEVER had power before. Same with clean/fresh water (two villes that were out in front of us, had a community canal that was used for everything you can imagine: washing, swimming, fishing, drinking, cooking, urinating and defecating). The Engineers with us, built a pipeline from the Tigris river to the villes, providing clean filtered water for the first time in about a thousand years...literally. Sadly, our LSA still used the canal water----heavily filtered of course---for our showers and toilet water.

Wow army, your such good guys, you obliterate the city of Baghdad, destroy the resources across the country but you all have such kind hearts that you help to rebuild it.

About most of Iraq being calmer and having more resources than ever before. Thats funny, I have friends who left Iraq because of the war and they keep contact with relatives there, funnily enough they seem to have a completely different description from yours.

yes the US removed saddam from power and took control, but they still failed to provide evidence that supposedly justified this war. so yes, i believe they did fail.

iraq co-operated with the USA to search for WMD's. the USA didnt find any WMD's. the USA invades iraq based on supposed WMD's that they didn't find, but instead claim to be stopping saddam's reign of terror. so what was the real reason, saddam's removal from office, or the supposed harbouring of WMD's? excuses, excuses...

unecessary blood of innocents has been spilt, only at the hands of GWB rather than saddam this time, and the USA is in more debt than ever before. a jorb well done??

costofwar.com...

[edit on 26-9-2005 by deafence#]

The stated goal of stopping Saddam Hussein's regime and WMD appears to have been a success despite the fantasy surrounding the reasons for the war.

Restoring the peace appears to be a huge failure. If more civilians and soldiers die after the end of the invasion and civil war appears to be already taking place or nearly taking place, I'd hardly consider that a successful transition from war to peace.

2005 has so far been deadlier for the coalition than 2004, and 2004 was deadlier than 2003. Escalation of violence is exactly what this pattern shows and if this is how a successful war ends, I'd hate to see what the U.S. military considers a failed end to a war.

If one of the reasons for the war is also to stem terrorism, the continued and escalating violence that appears to have much to do with terrorist tactics appears to be showing that this reason has failed.

Finally, if one of the reasons for the war was to make Iraq a "bullseye" for terrorists or to keep islamic extremist terrorism in the Middle East. This too has failed miserably. There may not have been a foreign terrorist attack on the USA homeland, but the coalition has certainly been hit recently.

[edit on 26-9-2005 by Frith]

Frith I agree with most of what you said, But stopping saddam husseisn regime?... I got a feeling a great number of them surrendered, and saddam ran to hide in a hole..
we didnt stop them, they gave up. And rightly so because many many more civilians and americans would of died if the Iraqi's believed they had a legitimate chance to defend.

and as for stopping the WMD's... The US didnt stop them, them were never there to begin with.

Id say the civil war has begun, with all the bombings and murders in public aginst civilians, can only be classed as a civil war..

The USA has created thousands of extremist terrorists in Iraq.
The only way this war is going to come out successful is by murdering every single IRAQI, which in the end will create an even bigger war when the surrounding muslim nations dont stand for the genocide.

For every mother, daughter, son, father, auntie, uncle, cousin, nephew, niece, friend killed, I can only imagine the amount of furious & angry mothers, daughters, sons, fathers, aunties, uncles, cousins, nephews, nieces & friends that will feel the USA is responsible, not just for the death, but for the LIES, fo the destruction, and for the life they have jsut ruined.
And these emotions will lead them to revenge, through extremist views.

Everytime i think of the people over there fighting this war I lower my head and really feel a piece of my self cry, because the soilders must surely know the pain they are causing these familes, the pain they are causing them selves.. all because of ones mans LIES.

Its unfortuante this man is there commander in cheif.

to make it conspiracy related:

war with iraq = more terrorism
more terrorism = enhanced security
enhanced security = control
control = invasion of freedoms (but the public wont care)

and so the path of the NWO unfolds...