It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

NEWS: European Union To Log All Electronic Internet And Phone Data

page: 1
7

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 08:16 AM
link   
In the name of combatting Terrorism, the Europeon Union has announced plans to log all internet traffic along with telephone data. The push for the move came as a result of the Madrid and London bombings and at the time that Britain became the rotating European Union president. It is proposed under the plan that data be kept for twelve months before being destroyed, although it is believed that a rival plan has that period of data retention stretched, to between twelve months and three years. Telecommunication firms currently assist in investigations on an individual case basis but some data is not currently kept for billing such as pre paid and free services.
 



www.abc.net.au
The Commission proposes storing data related to mobile and fixed telephone traffic for a year, to allow the police to trace the time, place, and numbers used.

The executive's Vice President Franco Frattini said the harmonisation will take into account the fundamental rights of security, the protection of private information, the interests of the police and concerns of industry.

The Commission's proposal will need to be agreed by member states and the European Parliament, while a rival plan will need unanimous agreement among the 25 EU governments.

The rival plan proposal envisages storing data between one and three years.

There is no intention to store the content of communications.



Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


There's not much to say about this, except that it was just a matter of time and only a matter of time before other countries follow suit.

I can see this being enacted without opposition as more rights and freedoms are stripped from us.

It is sad that the world has come to this point and it is sad the downhill journey into a police state which follows. I do not know who to really thank for all this but all i can say is this terrorism stuff is really one of the worse things to happen to humanity.




posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 09:04 AM
link   
I don't know if they understand how much "All internet traffic" is. That's going to be one mother of a hard-drive to store all that. Some ridiculously large number of terrabytes. And how do they plan to manually sift through this proverbial storage tank of information once it is all logged. I dunno... seems like a bit of a waste to me. Seems sort of unsecure too.... if they store basically any info you input onto the internet or phone, then they will be storing everyone's credit card numbers too. Probably not good to store an infinite amount of information in one place. Some crazy guy is going to probably manage to hack it, too.

1. How does this thing work... how does it tap into your internet/phone lines
2. Once you figure out #1, there is probably some way around it.

I am not suggesting or condoning that anybody do it. I'm just saying that people are very good at finding ways around things. And anybody that seriously wants to hide their information (terrorists) are going to bypass it somehow, so you will just end up with a bunch of information on innocent people. Similar to registering handguns... you get all the law-abiding gun owners to register... but there are still a bunch of un-registered guns out there, and those are the ones that are doing the damage.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 09:14 AM
link   
I'm sure ALL the bogeymen that are supposed to lurk in our midst use cell phones, landlines and email for all their deadly deeds and planning. I'm sure they never meet up for a coffee and discuss things face to face.

The resistance fighters in France, and other places, during WWII managed to carry out operations without the benefit of email, the internet and cell phones. Why should alleged "terrorists" be any different? If the technology is in danger of being monitored, they just won't use it


So, we end up with the situation where the only people whose emails and phone calls are monitored are the ordinary folks going about their business.
Of course, who's to say that a simple email conversation or discussion forum posting, critical of the governmemt of the day, will not flag you as a possible subversive, just for having an opinion different to that of your leaders?



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 09:43 AM
link   


There is no intention to store the content of communications.



Originally posted by Yarcofin
I don't know if they understand how much "All internet traffic" is. That's going to be one mother of a hard-drive to store all that. Some ridiculously large number of terrabytes.


They will probably keep a registry of phone calls made from this number to that number and data and time, but they will not store the content. With Internet they might store the data on 'this email adress from this IP was sent to this email address on that IP'. That's my guess.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 09:53 AM
link   


There is no intention to store the content of communications.


......what a waste then. You can't really use that in court, that someone was calling someone else at a certain time. The terrorist can just say he was calling his other terrorist friend to ask how his mother was doing.

If they don't store the data itself, they can't really prove that it was misused at all. Saying 111.222.33 emailed 333.222.11 on Sept 21 at 9 am has no real relevance if you can't see the "RE: Somebody set us up the bomb".

All it can really prove is that people know and/or contact certain other people, for reasons unknown.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 09:58 AM
link   
Its not as impossible a task as one might believe. For web traffic all requests to the DNS server are logged, for email all the outgoing and incoming headers are logged (alot smaller than the content of the email itself), for IM just grab the packets indicating the beginning and ending of a conversation, etc. I had an internship with an ISP over the summer and believe it or not they had logs of every request their DNS server EVER handled, back to the first dialup customers.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 10:56 AM
link   
This all sounds worse than it actually is...

First, as mentioned they aren't going to (and really can't) store the content...

Second, even if they WERE, they couldn't possibly have the manpower to sort through even a fraction of it...

Third, this is likely only to be usefull in combination with other intelligence information...i.e. they know terrorist A and terrorist B spoke with each other between 5/8 and 5/12, so they pull the logs from those days, search for the names, etc. and then narrow down the parameters of the search, and then combine that with the survellience logs for the day, sat recons, etc. etc. to get more info. It's more to corraborate other intel, more likely than not, and not a bad idea really....

Fourth, this plan seems pale in comparison to Carnivore or Echelon, etc., which allegedly DOES flag content.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 11:12 AM
link   
What good will it be for them to have logs of internet traffic from cyber cafes?



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 12:05 PM
link   
The US has already been doing this for awhile with its ECHELON bases located all over the world. ECHELON can capture radio and satellite communications, telephone calls, faxes and e-mails nearly anywhere in the world. ECHELON is estimated to intercept up to 3 billion communications every day.



Originally posted by Yarcofin
And how do they plan to manually sift through this proverbial storage tank of information once it is all logged.

1. How does this thing work... how does it tap into your internet/phone lines
2. Once you figure out #1, there is probably some way around it.



Sifting through the massive amounts of data is the hardest part. But they have developed programs that use Key words such as Bomb for example to filter down informantion.

Encrypted are nodoubt also given a high priority and broken as needed. Thats the NSA's bread and butter



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 01:27 PM
link   

Originally posted by Yarcofin


There is no intention to store the content of communications.


......what a waste then. You can't really use that in court, that someone was calling someone else at a certain time. The terrorist can just say he was calling his other terrorist friend to ask how his mother was doing.


It would not necessarily be for use in court, it's simply intelligence and allows them to see any patterns and links to other suspects.



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 06:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by alternateheaven
Its not as impossible a task as one might believe. For web traffic all requests to the DNS server are logged, for email all the outgoing and incoming headers are logged (alot smaller than the content of the email itself), for IM just grab the packets indicating the beginning and ending of a conversation, etc. I had an internship with an ISP over the summer and believe it or not they had logs of every request their DNS server EVER handled, back to the first dialup customers.


Exactly.

I work for a Telecoms firm in the UK and you would surpised what info i can dig up on anyone if I am bored at night.

Any phone call made is logged anyway for billing purposes. Ie:

Time, date, length of call, dialler and recipient.

If you call traverses my network, I can see it. And believe me, lots of calls do come across the network. even if the dialler and recipient are both not customers...

All this legislation is doing is making the companies keep the info for a minimum period. its nothing new in itself, its just at the moment companies are not required to keep the info for longer than a year (varies from country to country)



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 07:00 PM
link   

Originally posted by Mayet

There's not much to say about this, except that it was just a matter of time and only a matter of time before other countries follow suit.

I can see this being enacted without opposition as more rights and freedoms are stripped from us.





heres what you need to do...get off of your ass and go do something about it! and it it doesnt work out you can always say you tried!



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 07:26 PM
link   
Ivan dear.. I am off my .... and doing something. Please do not assume that I am not. Everyday I have my say very vocally on issues that affect us all. Everyday I am active in having my say.

Everyday of my life I seek the truth, everyday of my life I try to show people the other side of the coin, whichever coin I am handling at that time. Everyday of my life I practise balance and my actively pursue beliefs. Everyday of my life I do not back down and cower from my beliefs.

I am not going to do a Cindy Sheehan however, I have six children here to nurture and lead towards adulthood. They are my aim and purpose. I can educate them but really, they do not need their mother locked up for the cause. They do not need to go and visit their mother in a loony bin or worse they do not need me dead, from an "accident". They need me home here with them showing them how to survive the minefield of life's offerings.

To post a reply like that to me is an insult.

I know I can't change the world, the world has to change itself. I can only live my life and show my children and family their own pathes through life. Introduce them to crossroads and point out the lovely looking poison ivy amongst the blooms.




top topics



 
7

log in

join