Is there a growing anti american sentiment on the board?

This is purely my personal view as opposed to anything from the board.

We have had a few complaints about the rise of anti american comments on ATS over the last few months. Some people take it personally, and want it to stop. However I personally feel that such sentiment derives from international events and press reports themselves.

Iraq and katrina have given America unprecedented bad press, outside of that there seems to me to be very little anti-americanism. The sentiment seems to be focused on the current events themselves In such cases I would consider the comments to be legitmate.

Also the board is only reflecting the comments from the media itself, its a microcosm of the international debate. All negative comments I have seen have been legimatly based on similar comments found in the media.

ATS is merely the focal point for international opinion. What I find scary is that it reflects a growing world stereotype of america that was certinaly missing from ATS pre Iraq.

What IS hurting the board seems to be the virulent republican / democat debate that mostly internal between posters from America. That debate in itself generates most of the bad press and really must reflect the polarization of society itself.

In all cases ATS is merely a microcosm of world opinion itself, and society in general.

What is scary is that because of this polarization, what we see here is repeated in millions of households, communities, and gathering places world wide. Maybe for the first time the internet has given us a tool by which world opinion, and opinion of the average joe can be easily assessed.

[edit on 19-9-2005 by Netchicken]

I have to agree with NetChicken on this. There definitely is a very strong anti American flavor to many of the posts on ATS/BTS as of late. But the thing that gets me is that much of this sentiment is often based on nothing more than the slant that the press can give it. Born of the intense partisanship of the Democrat and Republican parties and the Iraq invasion, I find that people are not merely anti Bush but anti American as well! Why?
Every American did not vote for Bush....why the vehemence against America in general?

The attitudes expressed on ATS (or in the Manestream media) accurately reflect the bulk of US or world opinion.

People on this board tend to be politically strident, tech savvy, and youthful.

They only reflect the views of people who own computers, have copious ammounts of liesure time, and enjoy political debate with a certain amount of posturing thrown in.

I really DO think that ATS has changed over the summer (pre-Katrina!). I have quit posting on political topics, because I usually get shouted down; and in the name of "dissecting" my point of view, my own posts are frequently taken out of context or simply altered, to say what my opponents please.

More and more often, my posts are simply ignored, while two people who agree with each other alternate their posts, congratulaing themselvesfor their insight, and shooting down anyone else's input.

Not exactly fun for the rest of us.

I've found a couple of other sites that have a bit less traffic and are more focused. I'm posting more and more elsewhere.

I think this is complete and utter untrue. I regurlarly visit this forum and I've yet to see any anti-american posts unless you are making anti-Euro posts. Euro politics at PTS are full of anti-Euro posts with the siren or the shocked icons beside them.

It's this self-flattery that annoys me because you actually think people take the time to bash America.

I Love the USA, were #1

But:
I don't like the direction the USA has been going since 9/11. The Freedoms/constitution is what has allways set us apart from the rest of the world. The rest of the world evied us for our freedoms, but these freedoms are bein eroded in the name of security. Its dificult for me to trust this administration, or there causes or Anything they say.

I have never like Bush, or the Religous Right Republicans, but hey I don't like pure liberelizm either.

Bush has definitly hurt the USA's image worldwide this is a fact because of the Iraq War, Global Warming denial, And the loss of freedoms here, and like Katrina....the world watched as those in Washington slapped each other on the back and talked about the good job they where doing there, then the nightly news would come on and show a completely differant story.

Much of this Anti-American sediment is our own fault, We choose our leaders.

peace

America and Americans are uniquely unpopular in the World, that much is difficult to deny. There's nothing unusual there, the World's leading power has always been unpopular throughout history.

This board has a large UK membership, I'm not even sure if it's "owned and run" by someone in the UK, so there's a definite socialist tinge to the attitudes (guns are bad, capital punishment is wrong, love thine enemy etc) and those kind of opinions go hand in hand with resentment of the USA.

I find it to be a nice balance to websites like Glock Talk where the rabid right wing of the USA live.

The problem is not getting worse, it has always been here and, unfortunately, it a perspective that is in vogue, not only abroad, but also among too many Americans. Patriotism began to become unpopular during the sixties and while it has gained in acceptability in some quarters, it has never regained acceptability in the academy.

I will say this, however, about this board. Almost any negative generalization toward any group or entity, even written in jest or tongue-in-cheek, is likely to garner a warning, unless, of course, such a generalization is directed toward the USA. America bashing is considered fair game for intellectuals and pseudo-intellectuals alike.

I wholeheartedly agree, Grady.
What Netchicken describes was around when I joined over two years ago.
It 'ebbs and flows' but has existed for quite sometime.

as posted by GradyPhilpott
I will say this, however, about this board. Almost any negative generalization toward any group or entity, even written in jest or tongue-in-cheek, is likely to garner a warning, unless, of course, such a generalization is directed toward the USA. America bashing is considered fair game for intellectuals and pseudo-intellectuals alike.

Again, I wholeheartedly agree.






seekerof

america is the new nazi germany. why wouldn't there be an anti-american sentiment?
i, for one think america sucks hard in it's current state. i know many americans, and they don't suck at all. they're great people.
the problem is the gap between the man on the street and the man in the star chamber. the rest of the world identifies america with the actions of it's armies and government. america only identifies with television. they think that the america that they see on television and in movies, is the america they live in. they are hoodwinked.
america would be great if they scrapped the federal reserve, took away all the 'executive order' power from the president, used paper ballots and humans to count them, seperated state from corporation, etc, etc....
i bet iraqis are nice people, too.
and north koreans.
and iranians.
just because they are in the 'axis of evil' doesn't mnean they're evil. the same is true of america. good people, bad rulers.

i think there's less Anti-Americanism now than there was last year as the Fallujah assault was going on and then later when the Sgrena incident occured.

I was even one of the persons guilty of some of it but I don't see too much of now, except from the usual people who you expect it from just as there are those who will jump up and bash France and the UN at every opportunity.

I think the new rules that were introduced a month or two ago have helped keep the board a bit calmer.

>not only abroad, but also among too many Americans.

This is a slightly different question, but posibly a more important one. if the rest of the world is learning to dislike the US, that's one thing...but if even US citizens are growing to dislike their own country...?

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

I will say this, however, about this board. Almost any negative generalization toward any group or entity, even written in jest or tongue-in-cheek, is likely to garner a warning, unless, of course, such a generalization is directed toward the USA. America bashing is considered fair game for intellectuals and pseudo-intellectuals alike.

Are you suggesting that people with an education (intellectuals) and psuedo-intellectuals (self educated) are the ones who are causing America grief on this board? I hope I'm reading you wrong, because your intent seems to be to blame the very ones who are the brains of America and abroad.

If I remember correctly, isn't the very first action of tyrants of all stripes to destroy the 'intelligencia' of a population as the initial action of control? That would be university professors, writers, historians, poets, etc, etc.

Mao destroyed intellectuals
Pol Pot destroyed intellectuals
Stalin destroyed intellectuals

If the educated become scapegoats for problems at ATS, who do you propose should replace them?

Just to set my opinion on this down in the purpose of this thread...I don't see much anti-American rhetoric in the past few weeks here...I see criticism of an administration and its handling of an unfortunate event in NO due to Katrina.

There is a wealth of difference between criticism of the American government and a 'bashing' (as you call it) of America. For the most part, I still like American people...I find them friendly when they're here in Canada as tourists and also enjoy meeting them when I visit America. Most folks are just plain nice, friendly and helpful

I might not enjoy the policies of the Bush administration but i certainly do not extrapolate that dislike to the American people.

Like a war battered ship, listing to the left.
Thats the tone I perceive.

it "feels" like warnings are unequally distrbuted as Grady mentioned.

I'm sure the ballast will be shifted as time goes by..

Keep in mind that this is a conspiratorial related discussion board. I would guess that 90% of the ATS membership probably don’t exactly trust any government official or agency. While we have many members from many different countries I believe the majority are from the Unites States so we get many more critical discussions about our government. Not to mention the new world view of the US because of the Bush administration.

Certainly the United Stated gets more negative attention than most other countries, I think it has everything to do with the members that we attract, our current administration and the fact the US is the last “superpower” left in the world.

You know, the way things are, we cannot help. I beleive that we're just reacting to the ways of the world and how things currently are.

Unless somebody can figure out how we can look at everything thru rose colored glasses and speak of nothing but "niceness" in the world, i just dont see how it is that some can be offended by the so called anti americanism.

I am an American by choice. I love America. It highly upsets me that we are forced to bring up things that are unpleasant- I think some of us are bitter and we want the America of yesteryear back. We speak out of love, not out of hatred.

My 2 cents

No is not any anti American resentment in this boards but only in the imagination of the few that finally has seen the truth of what is going on with the Utopia that has been sold to us by the leaders of our country.

Now that the pieces to the puzzle as the true affairs of our country are together and that some like me can freely said "I told you so" many take it personal.

American people is finally catching up with reality, and I know for many it hurts, but that is part of the weaning from the lies that had been feed to many across the nation.

First comes denial, second conspiracy and feelings of persecution and then reality will settler in.

Our country is in trouble, economically, financially and politically, is up to the people to united and make things right, after all we all are Americans we all live in America.

Just give up and admit that our country under the present administration is in big trouble.

Claiming some type of "conspiracy" and "anti americanism" is not working anymore.

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
Almost any negative generalization toward any group or entity, even written in jest or tongue-in-cheek, is likely to garner a warning, unless, of course, such a generalization is directed toward the USA.

Originally posted by billybob
america is the new nazi germany. why wouldn't there be an anti-american sentiment?

Case in point.

[edit on 2005/9/19 by GradyPhilpott]

Come get some, or if you can't take the smell of the feet, get out of the Ritz then.

Bring it on trolls, every single one of you were born under a bridge.

(North Michigan humor, anyone born in the lower state/s are trolls because they are "under the bridge".)



I agree Netty, seperation is still an issue. The polarization still hasn't ceased or decreased, significantly anyways. Any thing and every thing that can be used to create a division, will be.

Media a lone is proof of this, manipulation, sensationalism, you name it. All boils down to the same thing, people fighting people who all refuse to be open minded enough to accept anothers opinion, as they would have them, theirs.

Common sence, is not very common.

between an honest critique of various leaders (of whatever stripe) and basically rooting AGAINST America at every turn.

I remember seeing on this board, people cheering that homes and business were being looted in New Orleans.

There were a lot more saying "tsk, tsk" and clucking about America "getting what it deserves."

Very few people on this board cheered the Tsunami's wake of shattered lives.

Even the most "John Wayne hard right" types expressed concern or at least irony at the plight of Iraqi civilians. I don't remember anyone saying that it was Iraq's fault for not getting another leader, a sentiment I've read TODAY on ATS when applied to America.

I veiw this site as kind of a "fringe" forum. I think there are a lot of netizens who cruise through here, look around for half an hour, and move on. I also try to intuit the average age of the posters here. I think the site is heavily skewed in the direction of junior in high school through sophomore in college.

The rest of us are just the fruits of arrested development and/or mispent youth.

I'm impressed by the civility of this thread..
It's an important topic, for all the members within..

I know the title contains the phrase Anti-amercian sentiment.
But I feel that it's really "anti-current administration" sentiment.
Am I far off?
You see, I think that if George Bush left a golden egg on everyones doorstep, there would be complaints about a little bit of goose poop..That it would be alll over the media, that ammonia levels have increased in the suburbs, since This administration has taken office..


PS. Marg, did you know the ballons in your sig, dance very well to Led Zepplin's
"Tampled Under Foot"?