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Iraqis to Bush: Where did our money go?

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posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 05:54 PM
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Long article but GREAT. Lots of things that I hadn't read about before about the depth of corruption going on in Iraq, a lot due to everyone's favorite government contract-winner, Halliburton!

www.opednews.com...


The LOI also reported that on June 9th, 2005, a convoy of LOI trucks that was on its way to deliver construction materials for a Halliburton dining facility at an army base near Fallujah, came under attack and 3 drivers were presumed dead and six trucks had to be abandoned.

The surviving drivers limped to a military base, expecting to get help from the Halliburton staff running the facility, but instead got the cold shoulder. When the drivers tried to leave Iraq, they hit a roadside bomb and another man was killed.

Waller said Halliburton employees were instructed not to help the drivers and that the company had failed to warn LOI that two other convoy had been attacked in the same area the previous week.


...


This one is a biggie, too, it slipped under my radar:


The star witness at the hearing was Bunnatine Greenhouse, a former math teacher, who moved up the latter to become the highest ranked civilian employee in the Army Corps of Engineers, responsible for signing off on Iraq contracts. She testified that her superiors forced her to sign no-bid contracts for Halliburton on the eve of the invasion of Iraq.

She filed a complaint against her superiors for harassment but the harassment has not ceased. She said Pentagon attorneys had to tried to talk her out of testifying at the hearing three days before the hearing date.

"I have agreed to voluntarily appear at this hearing in my personal capacity because I have exhausted all internal avenues to correct contracting abuse I observed while serving this great nation as the United States Army Corps of Engineers senior procurement executive," Greenhouse said. "In order to remain true to my oath of office, I must disclose to appropriate members of Congress serious and ongoing contract abuse I cannot address internally," she said.

"I can unequivocally state that the abuse related to contracts awarded to KBR represents the most blatant and improper contract abuse I have witnessed during the course of my professional career," she said in her testimony.

Members of Congress at the hearing reacted strongly to Greenhouse's revelations. "This testimony doesn't just call for Congressional oversight -- it screams for it," Senator Dorgan said.

Hover, I have not heard of any oversight hearings in response to Greenhouse's testimony. Instead, about a short time after the hearing I read the August 29, 2005 New York Times which said: "A top Army contracting official who criticized a large, noncompetitive contract with the Halliburton Company for work in Iraq was demoted Saturday for what the Army called poor job performance."

"The official, Bunnatine H. Greenhouse," the Times wrote, "has worked in military procurement for 20 years and for the past several years had been the chief overseer of contracts at the Army Corps of Engineers, the agency that has managed much of the reconstruction work in Iraq."

In fact, none of testimony by any witness phased the top brass at the Pentagon one bit. On May 1, 2005, the Army quietly awarded the company a new contract worth nearly $5 billion to continue on with its wonderful logistical support of the soldiers in Iraq, and last I knew, the contract is as good as money in the bank for KBR.


Does this all get classified or something or is it public record? I would honestly figure there would be more an outcry on this, but I suppose the American media needs to find the good news instead of the bad, damaging news, huh?

jako




posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 05:59 PM
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Instead of editing, I figured I would reply


DESPITE all this, check out the link:

www.guardian.co.uk...


Iraq rebuilding under threat as US runs out of money

Rory Carroll in Baghdad and Julian Borger in Washington
Friday September 9, 2005
The Guardian


Key rebuilding projects in Iraq are grinding to a halt because American money is running out and security has diverted funds intended for electricity, water and sanitation, according to US officials.
Plans to overhaul the country's infrastructure have been downsized, postponed or abandoned because the $24bn (£13bn) budget approved by Congress has been dwarfed by the scale of the task.

"We have scaled back our projects in many areas," James Jeffrey, a senior state department adviser on Iraq, told a congressional committee in Washington, in remarks quoted by the Los Angeles Times. "We do not have the money."


And Katrina will only make things worse. Time to go home, America. Nobody would blame you for splitting at this point, nothing has gone right from the get-go.


jako



posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 06:20 PM
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In your initial article, could you please quote any section that has "Iraqis to Bush" asking where their money went? Not finding one such instance, but alas, your simply running with the misleading title of the slanted, anti-war article, correct?

And as for the guardian.co.uk article, seems that threat of lack of funds for Iraqi rebuilding efforts is either slanted to near bogus, or simply incorrect, because it seems the rebuilding continues, unimpeded, except for delays due to continued violence, not lack of funds:
Reconstruction underway in Tal Afar after offensive
Ira q Rebuilding Projects Continue to Progress






seekerof



posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 06:43 PM
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I believe things are going to get hard in Iraq now that our country well being comes first.

I can not imagine Mr. Bush telling Americans from the devastated areas to just wait because the money is in Iraq now.


So It's only logic that monies will be diverted to help the nation first.

Very sad that the situation in Iraq is causing so many casualties from the people that are just trying to make a living.

But big companies like Haliburtion that is using our tax payer money in awarded contracts will care less who is the one to die as long as is not any of their main people.

Just like we Americans are expendable to our government and our soldiers to keep Haliburton safe in Iraq, Iraqis are just as expendable to companies like Haliburton and terrorist.

Is nothing than a meat market of humans souls for the cause.

Now the case of the harassment I am not familiar with it.



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 06:52 AM
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Seekerof:

In your initial article, could you please quote any section that has "Iraqis to Bush" asking where their money went? Not finding one such instance, but alas, your simply running with the misleading title of the slanted, anti-war article, correct?


Actually, Seeker, that's the TITLE of the ARTICLE I linked, NOT a misleading title. I'll link it again. Click it with your mouse and read the FIRST THREE WORDS of the article.

Other than that, I would imagine Iraqis would ask Bush about things like this:


A quarter of the $200 million worth of completed water projects handed over to the Iraqi authorities no longer work properly because of "looting, unreliable electricity or inadequate Iraqi staff and supplies," the GAO report said. There has be a surge in cases of dehydration and diarrhea among children and the elderly.

Shortages of fuel have produced lines a mile long at gas stations.


Who do you think they blame that on? Jacques Chirac?


And as for the guardian.co.uk article, seems that threat of lack of funds for Iraqi rebuilding efforts is either slanted to near bogus, or simply incorrect


Yeah, pardon me for getting my news from actual newspapers instead of from the links you cited. A .gov link and .mil link. LOL!

I notice that YOUR links have not been actually picked up by any reputable newswires (AP, Reuters, etc), and yet the Guardian story has been picked up by MANY.

www.latimes.com...

www.baltimoresun.com...

www.taipeitimes.com/News/ world/archives/2005/09/10/2003271117

today.reuters.com...

You blame the delay on violence? It's the Occupying Force's responsibility to ensure the security of the civilian population, so any delay due to that is your fault. YOU are the ones driving around with Humvees and body armor and automatic assualt weapons. YOU must provide the security to the population.

So feel free to back up your .gov and .mil links that apparently back up your side of the debate that the news is "near bogus, or simply incorrect" , I'll be back.


jako



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 07:11 AM
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Ask Kofi Annan where the Iraqis money is... Or maybe George Galloway, I think they may have an idea...



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 07:21 AM
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as posted by Jakomo
Actually, Seeker, that's the TITLE of the ARTICLE I linked, NOT a misleading title. I'll link it again. Click it with your mouse and read the FIRST THREE WORDS of the article.

Other than that, I would imagine Iraqis would ask Bush....

See, thats the problem.
You post a slanted anti-war article with a misleading title and no where in the article is there mention of Iraqis asking Bush where the monies are, and yet, the title is what again? Iraqis to Bush: Where did our money go?
You then counter with: "I would imagine Iraqis would ask Bush"?!


Jakomo, I would imagine that the article and you are doing nothing but sensationalizing old news.
Kind of reminds you of the Oil For Food UN scandals, asking, "where did the money go......", huh?






seekerof

[edit on 15-9-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 07:33 AM
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Seeker:

You post a slanted anti-war article with a misleading title and no where in the article is there mention of Iraqis asking Bush where the monies are, and yet, the title is what again?


See, there's the problem. You fixate on one tiny thing when you're wrong.

You don't bother to actually ARGUE your point because your sources are laughable.

AGAIN, I ask you:


So feel free to back up your .gov and .mil links that apparently back up your side of the debate that the news is "near bogus, or simply incorrect" , I'll be back.


Your attempt to deflect is unsuccessful. The title of the article is "Iraqis to Bush: where is our money?". You choose to spend a few posts arguing that the TITLE is misleading because nowhere in the article do IRAQIS actually say anything to Bush.

Look, Seeker, I know you're no simpleton. It's THREE WORDS. Call it artistic license.

How about you leave the title alone and, um, say, read the other 2000 words and actually come up with an informed argument about that?

Oh and again:


Feel free to back up your .gov and .mil links that apparently back up your side of the debate that the news is "near bogus, or simply incorrect" , I'll be back.


They can even have wacky titles, since I tend to read the ARTICLE and then form my conclusions.

jako

ps. In case you forgot your original assertion it was ...it seems the rebuilding continues, unimpeded, except for delays due to continued violence, not lack of funds




[edit on 15-9-2005 by Jakomo]

[edit on 15-9-2005 by Jakomo]



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 07:45 AM
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MaskedAvatar to Jakomo: Where did our regard for facts over denial and disinformation go?

I hope people are motivated to read the initial article, because it names names of war profiteering individuals, and companies, and regulatory frameworks that enable the criminality and war profiteering to continue unabated.

Thanks for the service to the ATS community.




posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 07:53 AM
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Yeah if you are sick of watching me and Seeker argue, at least PLEASE read the initial article and draw your own conclusions, rather than watch us two rejects thrash around



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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www.opednews.com...


I'm not sure whether the Americans or the Iraqis are picking up the tab for the billion a week, but I think it must the Iraqis in light of the latest announcement by officials in Iraq. On September 9, 2005, the Guardian reported that, "Key rebuilding projects in Iraq are grinding to a halt because American money is running out and security has diverted funds intended for electricity, water and sanitation, according to US officials."


the title of that article is misleading. it suppose to say "Americans ask Prez Bush where the money we provided to help Iraqis went to?" and this author is NOT even sure who is providing the tab and is based on assumptions.



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 09:29 AM
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Originally posted by deltaboy
....and this author is NOT even sure who is providing the tab and is based on assumptions.


The clueless and unsure informing other clueless and unsure with the 'a' typical old news and anti-war slant, deltaboy. In journalism, it is a tactic of keeping the fires stocked and raging.





seekerof

[edit on 15-9-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 09:52 AM
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Seeker:

The clueless and unsure informing other clueless and unsure with the 'a' typical old news and anti-war slant, deltaboy. In journalism, it is a tactic of keeping the fires stocked and raging.


Okay, so the author is clueless and unsure, and I am clueless and unsure as well?

As soon as you decide to stop immediately responding with personal insults rather than actually CORROBORATE your own assertions (which I've asked you to do three times now), we'll actually be able to rationally discuss our opposing points of view... As a mod I would think you'd know better.

The ultimate point here to the article, which both of you seem to have missed, is:

That there has been GROSS MISMANAGEMENT of the Iraqi Reconstruction Funds, to the tune of tens of billions of dollars.

Will you pay for it or will Iraqis? Well, hey, whatever. It ain't gonna be me or my compatriots, so it really doesn't affect me either way. I would think you might be concerned that your country might end up sinking further into economic woes because of it, but again, it doesn't affect me so I don't really care other than to deduce what might happen.

If either of you would bother actually reading the article and seeing all the high ranking NAMED officials she quotes, you may actually derive some new perspective from the article.

Or hey, just dismiss it out of hand and pat each other on the back about the fact that you seem to be the only two who are harping on such a miniscule detail as 3 words in a 2,000 word + article.

As for now, I usually figure that when people start insulting the other debater, it's because they're losing their side, and badly.

So better luck next time, mates.


jako



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 10:04 AM
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i read the article Jakomo, as i put my own say wat the title should have really said. look back at my recent post.



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 10:09 AM
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delta, the author isn't trying to prove that Iraqis or Americans are genuinely going up to President Bush and saying "Where is our money".

Who will eventually pick up the tab isn't as important as what can be done about the level of corruption going on in Iraq right now to do with reconstruction contracts that are questionable, and contractors being paid with BAGS of money that aren't even accounted for on paper.

FORGET the title already, it is not LITERAL. Sheesh.



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 10:43 AM
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Where is the Iraqi money?

I tell you, US lost track of the moneys for reconstruction 9 billion dollars of Iraqi money.



WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Nearly $9 billion of money spent on Iraqi reconstruction is unaccounted for because of inefficiencies and bad management, according to a watchdog report published Sunday


Only in American you get to lose 9 billion dollars and not body is held responsible for it.

Perhaps we should as “Former Iraqi civilian administrator Mr. Paul Bremer” but wait!!!!! He got a medal from President Bush for his role in Iraq, Inculidng. . . . missing billions of dollars.



The Defense Department, which was in charge of the reconstruction effort, and former Iraq civil administrator Paul Bremer have disputed the findings.
CPA staff identified at one ministry that although 8,206 guards were on the payroll, only 602 guards could be validated," the audit report states. "Consequently, there was no assurance funds were not provided for ghost employees."


Only in American and under Mr. Bush administration you get away with anything and everything when it comes to the money that doesn’t belong to them.

edition.cnn.com...

Then again is conflicting reports as where of the Iraqi money that was seized after the invasion has gone, this money that was not part of the US budget.



Some Iraqi officials have criticized the contrasting spending practices. The occupation authorities "came here and spent a lot of our money but very little of theirs," said a senior Iraqi official, who spoke on condition of anonymity on the ground that criticism could affect his relationship with the new U.S. Embassy here.


www.washingtonpost.com...

One of the beneficiaries was Haliburton occurs maybe Cheney knows where the “Iraqi money went” right.



According to the GAO report, $1.1 billion of the $1.9 billion allocated for fuel imports was disbursed. Although it is not clear how much went to Halliburton, a firm formerly chaired by Vice President Cheney, U.S. officials familiar with spending patterns said a majority of those funds went to Halliburton and other non-Iraqi firms.


Yeah, Haliburton knows where the Iraqi money went.



posted on Sep, 15 2005 @ 12:17 PM
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Well, Jakomo, what you didn't know, is that most people in this country would rather go to work, read the news -- believe it, and then go to bed.

No one wants to or even really has time to connect the dots. And when someone does for them, the conversation usually ends up in gross denial.




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