Concerning Lucifer in Freemasonry

Ok. it took a few pages, but the information I wanted to know has finally come to light.

Pepsi, you say you have met two Masons, and you say they were pushy with trying to recruit you. What a shame, you only know two. I am fortunate to know many Masons. I find them to be good friends and good people.

I am also glad that the Axe revealed another bit of info in saying that some lodges have relaxed the whole recruitment thing. Down here in Alabama, that is not, and I dare say will never be tolerated. These guys are very much against that, and would deal with a Brother who was caught recruiting. Had Axeman not clarified the change, I was going to make a terrible mistake in banning you for possibly no good reason. That bit of info placed doubt in my mind.

As far as the idea of me being a Mason goes, I cannot do it. I am a Christian, and in being this, it would be a sin for me to ask a man to lead me from the dark and into the light. Christ has done that for me already. Also, I need know organization to make this good man better, if one would be foolish enough to call me "good", as I am nothing without Christ, and it is He who can make me better. Also, I don't believe that I, a Christian, should be in an organization thta has secrets, or is rumored to have secrets.
Understand, these are simply my convictions, ok? I would not for a second claim that there are no Christians in the Masons, as I know too many people in the Masons who claim Christ as their savior, and I know the consequences of saying or even thinking otehrwise and being wrong; don't you.

There are many instances in the Masonic history that are not very favorable to the name, and some of the instances are relatively recent in history, but I'm not about to throw any rocks at them because of this as I was an active Teamster until a year and a half ago and am still a fightin' Teamster at heart today - we all know the shady Teamster history, don't we.

Don't judge a group over two people if you've met no more than those two.

I'm out.

Tomas i am not forming my opinions on them two i tryed to explain it.
Maybe my eanglish does suck badly.

Let's just leave things like this it will create hate and i dont hate anyone even if i have other opinions but in a debate i admit it, i like wining.
I'm off to sleep.

Masonic Light...thanks for clarifying the issue aout Lucifer - which is what I thought was the original point in the thread.

I had started another thread on Luciferianism and the CR+C.

Anyway sad to say that these threads end up becoming a condemnation o Freemasonry...

I have been reading here for the first time. I just became a member
at this site. OH MAN, where do people get this stuff. First of all, I joined
the Freemasons because I love history. After all, they did form the
United States of America. I mean come on, They were the driving force
behind the Boston Tea Party, EXACTLY 15 PRESIDENTS have been
Masons, President Ford being the last one, and George Washington's Army
was 50% Freemason. Down through the ages many great poets, author's,
scientist's, ect, were members of the fraternity. So yes, I love history.
I can tell you that the Freemason's do not worship Satan. For what it is
worth, at a masonic wake I went to, at the end of a prayer, a past master
said " OUR LORD, JESUS CHRIST, AMEN." Now I don't know about you,
but that sure don't sound like Satan to me. No lets move on here. If you
decide to try to become a mason and you do, you take all three degree's
with the Good Book, thats right ! The Holy Bible right smack in front of you. If your of a say middle eastern faith, you can take your oath with
the Koran. If Buddha works for you, heck, we got a book for that to. All
we ask is you believe in a supreme being. So for anybody to try to tell me
that we get down with that zero under the ground, is just crazy. On
another note, one of the big things they look for if your going to become
a 33 degree mason in the Rite, is WHAT CHURCH YOU HAVE BEEN AN
ACTIVE MEMBER OF MOST OF YOUR LIFE. Honest to God folks. On a final
note, we are not a secret society, we are a society with secrets. If we
were a secret society, do you think we would be giving info to the History
Channel, ha ha ha ha ha. Ya, big secrets. My friend, when we are at the Blue Lodge, half of the time, we can't even agree on what to eat for the
evening meal, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha On a final note, the Grand Master
of Massachusetts has declared that there are no secrets. You can find me
at Grand Lodge Boston at our next quarterly meeting. I will be the biggest
guy walking in the front door, ha ha ha. Have a good evening everybody.
And by the way, may the Love of Jesus bring us all closer, because we
sure could use more of it in the world.

Does a mason take the Good Book literally? Or is it just allegorical stories like Aesop's fables?

Originally posted by MassMason32
The Holy Bible right smack in front of you. If your of a say middle eastern faith, you can take your oath with the Koran. If Buddha works for you, heck, we got a book for that to.

Does the Holy Bible say it doesn't matter what belief you follow?

Originally posted by MassMason32
And by the way, may the Love of Jesus bring us all closer, because we
sure could use more of it in the world.

Did Christ, the Son of God, exist in the flesh and say, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6) ? Did he die and was resurrected to pay the penalty for the sins of those who believe in him?

Originally posted by saint4God
Does a mason take the Good Book literally? Or is it just allegorical stories like Aesop's fables?

Originally posted by MassMason32
The Holy Bible right smack in front of you. If your of a say middle eastern faith, you can take your oath with the Koran. If Buddha works for you, heck, we got a book for that to.

Does the Holy Bible say it doesn't matter what belief you follow?

Originally posted by MassMason32
And by the way, may the Love of Jesus bring us all closer, because we
sure could use more of it in the world.

Did Christ, the Son of God, exist in the flesh and say, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6) ? Did he die and was resurrected to pay the penalty for the sins of those who believe in him?

Some would say yes, some would say no. Why do Fundies always think that Freemasonry is as parametrically restrictive as their own beliefs? We are as varied in our beliefs as the people of the earth.

Originally posted by Roark
Some would say yes, some would say no.

I have a question then for those who say yes.

Originally posted by Roark
Why do Fundies always think that Freemasonry is as parametrically restrictive as their own beliefs?

I dunno, guess you'd have to ask a "Fundie" whatever that's supposed to mean.

Ahh, Freemasonry..

'When you don't know where you are going, ALL roads lead to the same place'

Indeed they do but only one path continues in Christianity.

Masonic Light.. When it comes to "lucifer" in the Bible your focus is your undoing: You probably already know my angle but I'll save myself the trouble and post this link. This is a great start for people who understand the concept that the Bible CLEARLY delineates the difference between the devil and Jehovah God his creator:

www.chick.com...

This requires some degree of spiritual discernment so keep that in mind.


This is an interesting thread, don't get me wrong but I get rather riled when I see people even remotely trying to reconcile the Bible with Freemasonry. Bible based Christianity and Freemasonry will NEVER be compatible or reconcilable. The only way for you to get around this is to disbelieve the Bible all together.


I get a kick out of people who tell me they are Christians AND Masons...So it's ok to be a Christian and support an organization that leads others away from Christ? You can argue with me on that until you are blue in the face but that is exactly what you are doing when you are a Mason. I'm sure I'll get an interesting response but we will all stand before God (rest assured) and He will hold all of us accountable and for this particular issue especially greivously. Freemasonry strips God of his identity and I find that quite laughable. The One and ONLY God of the Bible went through 'great' pains for his NAME SAKE, that is why Jesus didn't mince words when he sad I am THE ONLY WAY . If Allah was the way, or YOUR way with a little help from your Mason buddies then what Christ did on the Cross was a big joke!

In Freemasonry Jesus is 'just another' xxxxx..... You never know what 'holy' book you find on the altar at a lodge.



1jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is NOT of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.


How can you say Jesus Christ is of God but out of the other side of your mouth you tell others it's ok to pursue 'their' god as well? How can you say Jesus Christ is of God and support ANY organization that helps other people pursue their own gods? To do so is to call Jesus a liar. Of course if you don't believe in the Bible or only partially believe in it (which is entirely the same thing) then it's no problem for you is it?

This is not at all meant to be an acidic reply but let's not confuse Jesus, The God of the Bible with 'lucifer'.












[edit on 31-3-2008 by ViewFromTheStars]

That's cool; you're entitled to your opinion and all, as I am entitled to mine. I think you are... incorrect... but we can agree to disagree, right?

Or... is it important to you for me (and others) to see things your way?

I'm sstill reading over this thread, which is sort of hard to do since my computer's crashed and I'm using my PS3 instead, which is a barely useful standin, but after looking through the many Mason threads that get posted here on ATS, I keep seein ghte same theme come up that i'm not sure has been addressed.
When I was younger and was being taugh Christiantiy, I was taught to help others selflessly, to lead by example, and to do so humbly.
I've always taken that as helping without needing to be asked, being Chritian quietly (and therefore being embarressed by the loudmoths on TV) and not even impressing upon other peoplke that i am Christian unless I'm asked. If you are Chriistian, and you know you are in the right, you should be able to work with other people regardless of wether or not you know their religouse orientation.
To lead by example means, to me, to stand out in a room full of other religiiouse folks of other religions and stand out from them in a good way, without ever having to say you ...

reply to post by RuneSpider


Sorry about that, this PS3 browser thing doesn't let me type as much as I'd like in one window.
Anyway, it seems to me to mean that you shouldn'tt have to let anyone know you are Christian, you should be able to stand out anyway. I see a lot of people picking apart what Masons say, but otherwise ignore their actions. When was the last time you donated to charity, or helped someone build a house or work for a cause you feel is worthy? All of which I've seen Mason's do. Sure, as some people have stated, they don't need to be part of a group to do so, but at the same time, they don't do these things themselves. I'm sure I'm a bit off topic, but it's something I've noticed that's starting to grind on me.

And wouldn't you know it, the next page I read has someone say something much in similar. Yeesh. Need to be a bit more patient.

[edit on 31-3-2008 by RuneSpider]

reply to post by gps777


Sorry to ask so far after the fact. But it would seem that after stating that Lucifer was the state of Satan before he fell and then later stating that Lucifer is actually something/one to be equated with Satan doesn't make sense.

It would seem that instead, if Lucifer was Satan's state before his fall, then God had granted this to him with intent and acceptence. Upon his fall, Satan lost this standing.

Also, that, since the status as light bringer IS named "lucifer" and that was presented and condoned by God that we should view it instead as a benefit to mankind presented by proxy through the holder of this "position" (to use the word lightly) by God to us?

Originally posted by gps777

P.S. i have faith in the KJV bible but is not where my faith rests,my faith comes from a belief and a personal expirence with Christ as my Lord something that i can not deny if i wanted to.

[edit on 13-9-2005 by gps777]

some people cant deny project blue beam, lol

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