The Truth Please.... Is Nessie real?

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posted on Sep, 5 2003 @ 06:04 PM
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Is Nessie real?
*you might want to maximize this window
*



Here's my proof,

I've decided to basically compile all of the information on Nessie I could...

Nessie Links:
Main Nessie Thread on ATS
BBC proves Nessie doesn't exist
The Nessie Fossil, 4 real or not?
Of course, the Chinese Nessie

Great threads that usually die out because some immature kid(or adult as it often is) ruins it..

Proof for Nessie

Legends often are true

1.) The first evidence that a fabled donkey-like creature existed in the heart of the Congo appeared in Henry Morton Stanley's 1860 book In Darkest Africa. Stanley wrote that the Wambutti pygmies, who lived in the Ituri forests, "knew a donkey and called it 'atti.' They say that they sometimes catch them in pits. What they can find to eat is a wonder. They eat leaves." But no one had ever heard of asses in the Congo. The only member of the horse family known from the region was the zebra, and zebras don't live in forests, especially the deep jungle where the pygmies hunted. Intrigued by Stanley's report, the Governor of Uganda questioned some pygmies he met in 1899. "They at once understood what I meant," he wrote, "and pointing to a zebra-skin and a live mule, they informed me that the creature in question . . . was like a mule with zebra stripes on it." When they showed him the elusive creature's cloven-footed tracks, Johnston changed his mind. "I disbelieved them," he wrote, "and imagined that we were merely following a forest-eland." (The eland is a large African antelope.) Finally, when he got hold of a skin, Johnston changed his mind yet again: "Upon receiving this skin, I saw at once what [it] was -- namely, a close relation to the giraffe."
From that skin, a pair of skulls, and the pygmies' tales, the Governor was able to conceive what the mysterious animal must look like. It was a strange beast.As some zoologists had noted, it reminded one of those mythical creatures comprised of the body parts of various animals. It was like a large antelope but with no visible horns; it had ears similar to but larger than a donkey's; its hindquarters were striped like those of a zebra; and it had an anteater's long tongue. Could a more fantastical beast be imagined? Few Europeans believed it existed, but Johnston's persistence paid off. In the early part of this century, the animal finally became known to science as the okapi. Named for Johnston, Okapia johnstoni is a heavy-bodied animal with a coat of reddish chestnut, yellowish-white cheeks, and thighs ringed with alternating stripes of cream and purplish black. Johnston's last guess about this oddball creature was right -- it is related to the giraffe. To bring to light a huge, unknown mammal in this century astounded the world. As one scientist has written, we today have no idea of "the romance surrounding the discovery of the Okapi, nor of the excitement caused in natural history circles, first by the vague reports of its presence, and later by its actual finding."

2.)In the Middle Ages, ivory horns supposedly taken from unicorns were peddled to European royalty for 20 times their weight in gold. Few if any collectors knew that these long, spiraled tusks came from an actual animal, the narwhal, a cetacean that lives in the Arctic. Scholars believe that the remarkably human aspect that the heads of seals and manatees rising above the waves can take on may have given rise to tales of the mermaid, the fabled half-woman, half-fish of the deep. While traveling across Arabia on his return from China in 1294, Marco Polo heard of a bird on Madagascar that was so large it could carry elephants aloft in its talons. Baseless? Nope. Until they went extinct about 1,000 years ago, Madagascar's elephant birds were the largest birds that ever lived. Though they couldn't lift an elephant, they did stand ten feet tall and weigh close to half a ton.

3.)For centuries, Europeans traveling in remote areas were wont to disregard any legend an indigenous person might have of beasts that they themselves had not seen. This was part paternalism, part justifiable caution in the face of the possibly apocryphal. Yet indigenous people often know whereof they speak. In 1840, for example, outsiders first heard of a dwarf version of the hippopotamus that native Liberians claimed they hunted in the jungle. But since no Europeans had seen a live one, it was not until the early part of this century that biologists finally conceded that the West African pygmy hippo actually exists. In Africa alone, there are myriad instances of animals that foreigners thought fabulous even as locals calmly informed them they were quite real. "Most of these animals were known first from native reports about them," writes the late naturalist Gerald Durrell, adding facetiously "and, of course, primitive tribesmen all over the world spend their time making up stories about animals in order to confuse and delude European zoologists."

Sometimes animals thought extinct are alive
The five-foot-long fish known as the coelacanth was thought to have died out a full 25 million years before the dinosaurs vanished, until a fisherman caught one off the African coast in 1938. (The coelacanth has recently turned up in Indonesian waters as well.) Long-lost creatures are still found on land, too. In 1995, the French ethnographer Michel Peissel discovered what appears to be an ancient breed of horse in a remote valley of northeastern Tibet. The Riwoche horse, as his team named the animal for its home region, looks just like horses in cave paintings of the European Stone Age. If an ancient horse can be found in a remote Tibetan valley, is it possible that the fabled giant sloth might one day be found in the remote Amazonian jungle?

Despite common wisdom, the world has not been fully explored
In 1812, the renowned French naturalist Baron Georges Cuvier boldly asserted that "there is little hope of discovering new species of large quadrupeds." Wrong. A short list of large mammals that have been identified since 1812 might include, in addition to all those mentioned above, the mountain gorilla, Indian tapir, black ape, siamang, gelada, Himalayan takin, Pre David's deer, Przewalski's horse, white rhinoceros, pygmy chimpanzee, and Kodiak brown bear.
Surprisingly for many, discoveries of large, previously unknown animals continue to occur. Since 1986, several new species of primate have turned up in Madagascar. In the past few years, in a single, mountainous region on the border between Vietnam and Laos, scientists have identified a new species of giant barking deer, a new kind of pig, and a 200-pound bovid, or cow-like animal, known as the pseudo oryx. The seas, in particular, continue to reveal secret beasts, some of them quite sizeable. Marine biologists have identified three new species of beaked whale off Japan in 1958, off California in 1966, and off Peru in 1991, respectively. And in 1976, fishermen near Hawaii hauled up a 15-foot shark weighing just under a ton. Never before seen, this monster plankton-feeder has since been dubbed "megamouth."




This sites had a webcam set up in Loch Ness so you could see Nessie:
www.lochness.co.uk...
It's been canceled because the Scottish government doesn't want to spend the money any more...

Pictures of Nessie





Sightings of Nessie
12 out of 100+ Nessie Sightings...

Observer: Roderick Matheson
Time: Unknown
Date: 1885
Motion: Forward
Description: Described as the biggest thing I ever saw in my Life, neck like a horse with a mane.
Observer: Alexander Macdonald
Time: Early morning
Date: 1888
Motion:
Description: He called it salamander-like.
Observer: Salmon Angler, Forester, Hotel Keeper and Fishing Ghillies
Time: Unknown
Date: 1895
Motion:
Description: Observers reported that a horrible great beastie appeared in Loch Ness
Observer: John Macleod
Time: Unknown
Date: 1908
Motion: Motionless, then moved off
Description: Long tapering tail, eel-like head. 30-40ft, creature lying in the water, flush with surface
Observer: F.W. Holiday
Time: 0600
Date: August 24th 1962
Motion: Plunged under.
Description: 40 to 45ft object 3ft out, observed to taper either end below surface.
Observer: F S Young
Time: 0730
Date: June 14th 1966
Motion: Appeared 3 times in centre of disturbance
Description: Object in centre of disturbance
Observer: Lena Holmgren
Time: 1030
Date: June 20th 1966
Motion: Submerged when observers screamed
Description: Single object
Observer: Mrs Mackintosh-Palmer
Time: 0830
Date: June 19th 1998
Motion: Emerged
Description: Videoed a dark object approx
40 to 50ft long
Observer: Gordon Strang
Time: 0730
Date: September 22nd 1998
Motion: Emerged
Description: Videoed a v wake moving
across the Loch at approx 30mph
Observer: Captain of the Royal Scot
Time: 14.00
Date: 1st June 2003
Motion: Moving
Description: Travelling at 30 to 35 miles per hour.
Loch was flat calm at the time
Observer: 25 passengers and crew on Royal Scot
Time: 20.00
Date: 1st June 2003
Motion: Drifting Hump
Description: Saw hump 4 to 5 feet long about
5 or 6 inches out of the water. Drifting along with the water.
Observer: A Fisherman
Time: 22.00
Date: 1st June 2003
Motion: Motionless then disappeared under the water
Description: The fisherman saw something resting on the surface of Borlum Bay for three or four minutes before it did a surface roll underwater and disappeared.


Credits
I'm too lazy to do a full MLA citing of all my sources, but I'll at least name the brothers out there who made this thread possible...

perso.wanadoo.fr...
www.herper.com...
www.nessie.co.uk...
www.nessa-project.com...
www.nhm.ac.uk...
www.pbs.org...
www.lochness.co.uk...


Is anyone still not convinced???
I'll be updating as I get more info.
- Tassadar




posted on Sep, 5 2003 @ 07:17 PM
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So what?
No one believes (or doesn't believe) in Nessie?
Come on people!!
Show some feeling!
...Enthusiasm!
...Motivation!

LET'S GO ATS!!!
What ya'll e thinkin' today???
- Tassadar



posted on Sep, 5 2003 @ 07:24 PM
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Long Live Nessie!

You go girl...

regards
seekerof


any

posted on Sep, 6 2003 @ 02:38 AM
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I don't think Nessie exists.

Although, what's funny is that the first ever sighting was of an very large animal walking towards the loch over a road carrying a carcass.
Not of a creature IN the loch.



posted on Sep, 6 2003 @ 08:45 PM
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Very interesting and informative thread Tass, I am undecided but think it's very possible that "she" exists. Could be a thought to be an extinct species or even a hybrid. Could even be more than one nessie, accounting for different sightings. I'm definitely going to check out your links.



posted on Sep, 6 2003 @ 08:58 PM
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Nessie exists all right. however, there is more than one of these 'nessies' in the world. In upstate NY, there is a lake called Lake Champlain. There have been rumors/sigtings of a nessie-like creature in the lake, called champ. that's all i have. Peace.



posted on Sep, 7 2003 @ 03:51 AM
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Nessie used to exist. About 65 million years ago.

If there is one mystery that I have seen very little compelling evidence for, its the Loch Ness Monster.

If there is anything poking its head out of water now, its probably gonna be a submarine's periscope.



posted on Sep, 7 2003 @ 03:56 AM
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This is one "legendary" mystery, so i really dont even want to vote, as i would have to vote "no".. but i will not vote.. i leave my options open.

As i really once did belive in "Loch ness monster" like all little kids do.. it is really like santa claus..


*edit*

What the hell,
ill just vote yes.. *votes* as i do still belive in the santa, so why not in the ness monster?


[Edited on 7-9-2003 by FULCRUM]



posted on Sep, 7 2003 @ 04:07 AM
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Yes.. Nessie exists. And I believe it looks something like this.




posted on Sep, 7 2003 @ 04:33 PM
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Originally posted by Outtis
Yes.. Nessie exists. And I believe it looks something like this.



!!!!
!!!!
That's scary, I've never seen Barn*y associated with Nessie in he conspiracy...

anyways...
Nessie is winning 10:4
Go Nessie,
Go Nessie,
Go go, go Nesse!!!
- Tassadar

[Edited on 7-9-2003 by Tassadar]



posted on Sep, 7 2003 @ 04:48 PM
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I think that Nessie is real and all of your evidence very well supports it. We have animals that have rarely been seen bt we still know that they exist. Then we also have animals that are common and very old, so no matter how weird they are, their existence is not questioned. I think Nessie is a combination of these, Old and rare. I think Nessie is definitely an actual creature that is in a great deal of danger because so many people want to beieve in it, the only way they will is ifthey see its dead body. Yes, Nessie is a real creature too me that probably is a distant cousin of the dinasour.


any

posted on Sep, 8 2003 @ 07:56 AM
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Oh and all the pictures in the first post are fakes.



posted on Sep, 8 2003 @ 08:30 AM
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There is no Nessie, it's a tourist attraction nothing more.



posted on Sep, 8 2003 @ 10:01 AM
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Barney is a tourist attraction?



posted on Sep, 8 2003 @ 09:17 PM
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No, I do not believe Barney is a toutist attraction seeing as how he was killed.
In a startling turn of events, Barney the Dinosaur was discovered dead in Central Park at 4:15 this morning...
conster74.users5.50megs.com...

Current Poll Stats
Yes: 15 (75%)
No: 5 (25%)
30 More Nessie Sightings
Here are 30 sightings from the 1930's that should help Nessie a little in this fight...
1Observer: James Cameron
Time: 1600
Date: Feb 7th 1932
Motion: Little or none, sank
Description: Hump like up-turned boat
2Observer: Mrs Kirton and P.F.Grant
Time: 1145
Date: 1933
Motion: Disturbance, moved about, great speed, disappeared and re-appeared 100yds away
Description: 6ft by 1ft hump
3Observer: Mr and Mrs Mackay
Time: 1500
Date: April 14th 1933
Motion: Commotion, wake, then humps, turned in arc then sank
Description: 20ft overall, 2 humps, one larger
4Observer: Alexander Shaw and Alister Shaw
Time: 1700 to 1800
Date: may 11th 1933
Motion: Wake, then hump moving faster than a rowing boat.
Description: 8ft hump like a log
5Observer: Miss N Smith
Time: 1400
Date: August 5th 1933
Motion: Moved circling, submerged
Description: 1 hump, size of a rowing boat
6Observer: Miss P Keyes, R.A.R. Meiklem and Mrs Meiklem
Time: 1500
Date: August 5th 1933
Motion: Moved back and forth, submerged
Description: 1 hump,(4-6ft) seen end on with ridge (size of cart horse)
7Observer: Mr A. H. Palmer
Time: 0700
Date: August 11th 1933
Motion: Disturbance, wake, saw head, moved off
Description: Head set low in the water, front view, mouth opening and closing. Width of mouth 12-18 inches, opened 6inches
8Observer: Mr G McQueen
Time: 1430
Date: August 1933
Motion: Moving slightly, ripples, sank
Description: 12ft by 4ft hump
9Observer: Mr John Cameron
Time: 1730
Date: August 15th 1933
Motion: Moving fast, V shaped ripple.
Description: 15ft long, hump about 8inches up, like floating telegraph pole.
10Observer: Mrs E Garden Scott
Time: 1100
Date: August 16th 1933
Motion: Submerged
Description: Hump like an up-turned boat
11Observer: Mrs B McDonell and Mrs Sutherland
Time: 0900
Date: August 25th 1933
Motion: Moving in an undulating way, submerged
Description: Hump with disturbances 20ft behind
12Observer: Mr W. D. H. Moir
Time: 2115
Date: August 26th 1933
Motion: Wash, then moving hump, submerged
Description: Long sloping hump, 40ft by 5ft
13Observer: Mrs J Simpson
Time: 0900
Date: October 22nd 1933
Motion: Dived
Description: Impression of 2 flippers
14Observer: Mr A Gillies
Time: 1130
Date: October 22nd 1933
Motion: Foam disturbance, submerged, re-appeared
Description: Single hump, 2 to3ft out of water
15Observer: Miss C MacDonald
Time: 1245
Date: October 22nd 1933
Motion: Moving slowly, V shaped ripple
escription: Single hump, splashing either side toward front.
16Observer: Mr C Macrae and Mr J Mackinnon
Time: 1400
Date: November 10th 1933
Motion: Splashing, sank and rose 2-3 times
Description: Single hump like up-turned boat, 25ft by 2ft
17Observer: Miss N Simpson
Time: 0900
Date: November 20th 1933
Motion: Motionless, sank, V-shaped wash
Description: One low hump and one small hump, 30ft overall
18Observer: Mr G Jamieson
Time: 1100
Date: December 27th 1933
Motion: Moved across Loch, rapidly dived when car horn sounded
Description: Two humps 15 to 20ft overall by 2ft and 3ft
19Observer: Mr Howard Carson
Time: 1825
Date: January 30th 1934
Motion: Wash, moving slowly, submerged.
Description: 2 humps 2ft by 3ft, 13ft overall including head and neck
20Observer: Mrs M MacLennan
Time: 1620
Date: February 25th 1934
Motion: Turned from side to side, submerged, left wash.
Description: Neck was 6ft round column, top small pointed.
21Observer: Mr William Mackay
Time: 1030
Date: July 12th 1934
Motion: Slowly moving streak on the water, later object appeared, disappeared
Description: Single object
22Observer: Mr William Mackay and Mr William Campbell
Time: 1630
Date: July 12th 1934
Motion: Surfaced 5 times then moved off
Description: 2 humps, 6ft apart.
23Observer: Mr R. J. Scott
Time: 1240
Date: July 12th 1934
Motion: Appeared to swim on it's side, fin or mane where neck and body met.
Description: Overall 18 to 24ft long, body 2ft out with 3 humps above
24Observer: Mr J. Mackintosh
Time: 1015
Date: July 16th 1934
Motion: Moved slowly.
Description: 2 humps 3ft out of water, 3ft apart, 15ft overall
25Observer: Mr A Ross
Time: 0820
Date: July 17th 1934
Motion: Turned over and dived
Description: Single hump, 20ft long by 2ft
26Observer: Mr D Ralph
Time: 1520
Date: July 24th 1934
Motion: Submerged, no wash.
Description: Hump 8ft by 1.5ft
27Observer: Mr P Grant and Mr James Legge
Time: 1020
Date: July 27th 1934
Motion: Moving slowly (50 yds)
Description: Hump, 15ft long.
28Observer: Mr R. J. Scott and Mr Evan Strang
Time: 0945
Date: July 30th 1934
Motion: Moving slowly, submerged, re-appeared, submerged.
Description: Hump 14ft, 3 portions showing, second appearance 4ft.
29Observer: Sir Murdock MacDonald and son and one other observer
Time: 1800
Date: August 8th 1934
Motion: Moved slowly, about 100yds in five minutes.
Description: 2 humps, 15ft overall.
30Observer: Mrs Marjory Moir, Mrs Grant Shewglie and 3 others
Time: Afternoon
Date: October 1936
Motion: Head-neck dipped into water often, stationary, turned, shot off, returned head-neck only showing, wake.
Description: 3 humps, 30ft overall, middle hump was largest.


Convinced now???
- Tassadar


xn

posted on Sep, 14 2003 @ 05:13 AM
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I'd say Nessie is real. Sonar found a large moving object in the loch(lake) really deep. It could be a school of fish, but fish don't swim 600ft below and cuz it's murky waters, they can't see. There was a picture of the fin before and another that looks really close to that one dinosaur.



posted on Sep, 14 2003 @ 07:21 AM
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nessie does exist and all these experiments to try and find it are never going to convince me animals can be very strange indeed i mean "scientists" think many species are extinct then someone finds a specimen. no one should listen to "scientists" they even had trouble believing meteorites existed.



posted on Sep, 14 2003 @ 09:05 AM
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Anything that is considered by sentience is real. If you imagine
a new car, you don't have a car but you REALLY thought about
it. Real is what is drawn into being, as a word format is not
specified. Are your eyes showing the real or is what you see projected by your brain?



posted on Sep, 14 2003 @ 06:32 PM
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I think She is real. Despite all of the fakes, I think that there is something there.



posted on Sep, 14 2003 @ 08:47 PM
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(didnt read entire thread in detail
)
Recently didnt some group scan the entire lake and come up with nothing? I suppose that the only possible explanation in defence of Nessie is that it happened to be out in the ocean. So I guess it like Salt and Fresh water. Enough hoaxes have been uncovered concerning the whole thing I'm sure Nessie is not real. I would be really pleased if it were though. It would make the world so much more interesting.





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