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Why are People Defending FEMA??

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posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 05:24 AM
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I just don't get it. There are at least 20 threads on here regarding some aspect or other of FEMA's incompetence and negligence in the Katrina disaster and its aftermath.

Why are some people so intent on disregarding them and placing blame only on local government? Am I missing something here? Are FEMA employees posting on ATS?

Why defend them when it can't possibly be constructive for future disaster recovery? There is something not only greviously wrong with how FEMA reacted, managed and handled everything but something rotten at the core of their incompetence as well.

[edit on 8-9-2005 by nikelbee]




posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 05:36 AM
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My guess is as good as anyones i suppose.

1.they wish not to be like most people?

2.they honestly think the Gov did what they could?

3.they hope by coming up with a different theory than the mainstream that they maybe found to be right and elevated to some kind of supreme God status?

4.Troll effect for points?

5.they think that everyone uniting against the Gov is unheathy for the US?


I`m with you though its a mystery



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 05:45 AM
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GP - all good points. But I think is more unhealthy for the US to cover up what has proven to be such a disasterous situation. We all like to think we could do better of course, but they are paid a LOT of money to actually do it, not just to think about it and/or discuss it, while watching sports or American's Next Top Model or something in the background.

The worry is always what will happen next. If they reacted this badly to this disaster, how will the next one go? Isn't anyone else worried? Surely the trust has been eroded. Even if you want to be 'nice guys' and not bad-mouth anyone, you have to hold them responsible for not having provided adequate recovery management.

It seems the arguments get twisted around and criticism for FEMA is counted as anti something or other or pro local gov. Do people really believe FEMA did the best they could?






[edit on 8-9-2005 by nikelbee]



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 06:11 AM
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Originally posted by nikelbee

Why defend them when it can't possibly be constructive for future disaster recovery? There is something not only greviously wrong with how FEMA reacted, managed and handled everything but something rotten at the core of their incompetence as well.

[edit on 8-9-2005 by nikelbee]


Its not about defending FEMA, It is about identifying the failure points in decision making and implementation.

There are also 20 threads (Or More) on ATS detailing the problems with Louisiana Government and the requirements not met/made/decided for that government to get the aid it claims it wants.

Little gems such as this should not be ignored,



American Red Cross



The state Homeland Security Department had requested--and continues to request--that the American Red Cross not come back into New Orleans following the hurricane. Our presence would keep people from evacuating and encourage others to come into the city.



Maybe a distinction needs to be made between the state (Louisiana) controlled FEMA and the nationally controlled FEMA.


So far as I've seen, gathering facts, ignoring emotional kneejerk MSM stories with little factual basis, researching source data such as that above directly from the Red Cross. I've concluded that nearly all roads lead back to poor decision making by Gov. Blanco.

I am also of the opinion that every disaster leads to change in the response and readiness of agencies such as FEMA, its much like the axiom for military, "Armies train to fight the last war", FEMA "Trains and plans for the last disaster."

Ignoring the evacuation failure, levee board problems, refusal to federalize by Blanco and the failure of Louisiana instate FEMA is to miss the biggest componet contributing to a greater death toll than was neccessary in Katrina's aftermath.

In the future if changes are made allowing the federal government to rush in without permission as it were, could lead to police state conditions that many here fear.

Its a double edged sword, is it not? - Overiding states rights is what I'm getting at.

It would seem the state legislators need to put in a mechanism to quickly remove inept Governors and/or department heads in emergency situations, maybe similar to the federal government emergency continuation plans.

I really resist using the Katrina aftermath to expand federal powers, they've got more than enough as it is.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 06:11 AM
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Your no Lone Ranger in your thoughts or concerns Nikelbee garunentee it.

The greatest concern is people will get sick of hearing about your Gov response to Katrina because normal everyday people just want to get on with their lives.

Just like we hardly ever hear the the US attacked a Soverien Nation which the world and UN`s opinion was against it and after the fact it was found to be false evidence the the US provided to attack Iraq.

For the American peoples sake i hope they hold their Gov responsible, act on it and fix the problems because they are some doozies.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 06:15 AM
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Nothing wrong with a little devil's advocacy, not necessarily to say FEMA is #1 Big Time Super Good Choco Party, but more like keep an open mind in the investigation to save future lives.

But yeah, the officals and people saying there's no need for investigation or scrutiny are kind of out there beyond simple advocacy. They're just the devil.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 06:39 AM
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It still amazes me that people blame Blanco and Nagin when the State of Emergency was declared BEFORE the storm. We have FEMA down there turning down trucks full of water, food, and supplies because it is not a part of their agenda. We have people turned away by FEMA because they want to take care of a family. They are detaining the citizens of New Orleans in various institutions around the U. S. not allowing them to leave.

I just don't get it.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 07:07 AM
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It's not that people are defending FEMA. It's just that there will be a time to analyze and criticize all parts of the recovery effort after the situation stabilizes.

Wait until all parties can sit down together to discuss this. Otherwise, it is nothing more than a partisan attempt to put the admin in a negative light.

It reminds me of an old saying: "It's hard to remember that your original objective was to drain the swamp when you're up to your a$$ in alligators".



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 08:38 AM
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Jsobecky

Problem is while we wait for AFTER more people are dying. Too late for them after.

Lots of good responses here. I agree with Rant that playing devil's advocate is good in a situation like that because we will be able to see both sides of the coin (excuse my old cliche).

I'm just railing on about the same one sided response that FEMA isn't at fault in some way and thus it MUST be the fault of local/state government.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 10:40 AM
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Maybe it is because in order to blame FEMA you have to completely ignore the total breakdown of both foresight and leadership by both the Mayor and Governor. There is plenty of fault to go around and FEMA isn't blameless by no means. But always playing the blame game on the fed's and the Bush administration just doesn't cut it in this instance. New Orleans was not prepared for the disaster that struck it, PERIOD! I leave in Eastern NC were the threat of Hurricanes is constant. Because of this constant threat we have an Emergency Response Team. This team consist of the Govenor, Commander of the Highway Patrol, Commander of the NC National Guard and a FEMA rep. It is their job to access the threat, make preparations and stage response teams for quick action. NOLA has a Emergency Response Plan but it was not acted on. President Bush called the LA Govenor and insisted that she call for evacuation of NEW Orleans and declare a National Emergency two days before the storm hit. Until then she did nothing! The Mayor of NO had city and school buses sitting idle that could have been used to evacuate those without transportation. Not only that they were left in low lying areas so they were flooded out from the on set. The LA National Guard should have been sent into NO before the storm hit to handle the crisis that might develop afterwards just in case. The Govenor should have asked for Federal help sooner and they should have upheld the MANDATORY evacuation!! They let a hundred thousand people remain in their homes knowing that there was the potential for a major disaster. Now FEMA is under the Sec. of Home Land Secruity which creates more beaucratic BS. FEMA should only answer to the President and no on else. There will be a full investigation of what happen in NO, but to try and pin all the blame on FEMA at this stage of the game is rather lame. I like everyone else in this country wants answers but lets not try putting the horse before the cart until all the evidence is in. An by the same means lets not blow the Mayor and Govenors trumpets too loud.
Personaly I see the most gross negligence of Local Public figures that I have ever witnessed.

[edit on 8-9-2005 by Yorga]



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 10:54 AM
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Originally posted by nikelbee
Jsobecky

Problem is while we wait for AFTER more people are dying. Too late for them after.

I'm just railing on about the same one sided response that FEMA isn't at fault in some way and thus it MUST be the fault of local/state government.

The situation in NO is stabilizing more each day. There still remain people in the city who need to be forcibly evacuated, and hundreds of thousands of evacuees who need to figure out what they are going to do after lunch to get their families and lives back together. There are pumping stations still down. Gunfire still echoes throughout NO.

Now tell me, is this the time for the workers and leaders to sit down and discuss what went wrong?

Or will more lives be saved if the rescue/recovery mission continues?

Turn turn turn...



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 10:56 AM
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Generally the majority of posts made in defense of FEMA have been made by those
who fear the political repercussions to their favored party
once the looming investigations reveal how badly this administration has managed
the U.S. taxpayer's resources.

This blind loyalty generally comes from those who somehow benefit from
this administration's agenda.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 11:16 AM
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Does the phrase, 'Innocent until proven guilty' mean anything here?
Or maybe you would prefer, 'Let he who is without sin cast the first stone'
And I am not talking about 'trial through public opinion''. I am talking about trial by fire' when the proper authorities will set down and get to the bottom of what happened and what failed. Now all that can be done is being done to try and rescue the remaining survivors. Public outcry will demand a complete indepth investigation into all factors involved in this calamity. Then I say let the apples fall where they may. No one here is defending anyone, there are too many lost and displaced lifes at stake.
America has never gone through anything like this before and it will stand as a testimony of our will and our governments ability to get to the truth no matter who it hurts. Republican, Democratic, Independent it doesn't matter, we are all Americans and right now we are all sickened to death over what was allowed to happen in NO. The world is watching, Americans are seething and heads will roll, you can count on that.



[edit on 8-9-2005 by intrepid]



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 11:42 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
It's not that people are defending FEMA. It's just that there will be a time to analyze and criticize all parts of the recovery effort after the situation stabilizes.

Wait until all parties can sit down together to discuss this. Otherwise, it is nothing more than a partisan attempt to put the admin in a negative light.

It reminds me of an old saying: "It's hard to remember that your original objective was to drain the swamp when you're up to your a$$ in alligators".



how could you say wait? i'm sure the people in new orlean's the first couple of days weren't saying wait... They had to take bowel movements out on the street, weren't allowed to leave the dome, were yelling at the camera's for help, you think they wanted to wait? no, they were very upset and in totally disbelief that the government couldn't help when it was needed MOST.

Like the one lady at the dom said, 'they can drop loads of food over in iraq from planes but they can't do that here?'

Let's not forget that in the midst of disaster and starving people, bush went on a photo op which stopped all the aid from flying in. Nobody could fly planes!

Your telling me he wasn't asking for citicism by doing that?

Despite all the facts that lay at your front door, I believe you are turning your back to them because you voted for this administration and that trumps everything to you.

And your telling other's not to be partisan.

these fox 'reporter's' say the same thing, but they don't realise when they are also being hypocrits.

bs, where's your outrage about barabara bush's comment about the response being good enough for the poor?
that's a political statement about class, not to mention in very poor taste. Bush's comment about Brown doing a standup job?

That was an uneducated assumption and also in poor taste.

What he was doing was anything from being honest, that was a political statement that was meant to pull people away from criticizing thought and commentary.

These little comments are not acknowledged by those who voted them in. They are in denial.

You put your partisan sunglasses on as soon as you hear these things.

And that in itself is being partisan..Mr hypocrisy.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 12:00 PM
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Originally posted by nikelbee
Why are some people so intent on disregarding them and placing blame only on local government? Am I missing something here? Are FEMA employees posting on ATS?


I think Fallen From the Tree's answer is the closest. People identify with their political party or political side so strongly, that to criticize FEMA, in their minds, is to criticize George Bush (FEMA being a federal agency) and therefore criticizes Republicans.

There are a few, I'm sure who aren’t necessarily Republican who just want to withhold judgment until we know more, but that's not the majority of FEMA defenders. The majority of FEMA defenders are also Bush defenders, supporters and apologists. It's the 'home team' mentality that is a pet peeve of mine.

Last night, Jon Stewart showed of a series of our leaders saying that we shouldn’t be playing the ‘blame game’. He then said, “When people don't want to play the 'blame game'... They're to blame.” And I think most of the FEMA defenders here relate to ‘that side’ of the whole argument, and therefore wish not to play the ‘blame game’ because it feels like a personal criticism.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 04:21 PM
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FEMA is doing a spectacular job in my town of Biloxi, MS. What is wrong with defending them? An opinion is formed from your experience with them, and FEMA has been doing a great job in Biloxi.



posted on Sep, 8 2005 @ 04:24 PM
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Originally posted by nikelbee
I just don't get it. There are at least 20 threads on here regarding some aspect or other of FEMA's incompetence and negligence in the Katrina disaster and its aftermath.

Why are some people so intent on disregarding them and placing blame only on local government? Am I missing something here?



Uh huh. It's just a few short steps from blaming FEMA to holding the Commander in Chief accountable.



posted on Sep, 9 2005 @ 12:38 AM
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Originally posted by TrueLies
how could you say wait? i'm sure the people in new orlean's the first couple of days weren't saying wait... They had to take bowel movements out on the street, weren't allowed to leave the dome, were yelling at the camera's for help, you think they wanted to wait? no, they were very upset and in totally disbelief that the government couldn't help when it was needed MOST.

Let's not forget that in the midst of disaster and starving people, bush went on a photo op which stopped all the aid from flying in. Nobody could fly planes!

Your telling me he wasn't asking for citicism by doing that?

Despite all the facts that lay at your front door, I believe you are turning your back to them because you voted for this administration and that trumps everything to you.

And your telling other's not to be partisan.

these fox 'reporter's' say the same thing, but they don't realise when they are also being hypocrits.

bs, where's your outrage about barabara bush's comment about the response being good enough for the poor?
that's a political statement about class, not to mention in very poor taste. Bush's comment about Brown doing a standup job?

That was an uneducated assumption and also in poor taste.

What he was doing was anything from being honest, that was a political statement that was meant to pull people away from criticizing thought and commentary.

These little comments are not acknowledged by those who voted them in. They are in denial.

You put your partisan sunglasses on as soon as you hear these things.

And that in itself is being partisan..Mr hypocrisy.

You prove my point perfectly, TL. This post is about FEMA and you throw in a half-dozen other issues that you are so outraged about.

There hasn't been a timeline or determination of responsibility set down yet, and you want to analyze?

You can't wait to indict this administration. You will gladly overlook the failures of the governor and mayor just to help your case.

Half-truths and disinformation don't cut it. What is the full truth and real information? Well, that will take some time to sort out.

And please stop making assumptions about who I might have voted for. And knock off the name calling, as in "Mr. Hypocrisy".

I stand by my position that time right now would be spent best helping the people, not pointing fingers.



posted on Sep, 9 2005 @ 12:53 AM
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Oh yes lets wait for the truth from politicians,i also believe in the words of used car salesmen.

All i can truly think as an explanation to the slow response was it had to be intentional.

Because the bazaar is easier to believe, than believe in pure gross incompetence on a major scale from the US in this day and age.



posted on Sep, 9 2005 @ 10:09 AM
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Does anyone here understand what has happend? 90,000 sq miles of destruction and 1.5 million people displaced! My god people nothing like this has ever happened here before and people are playing the blame game before all the facts are even in. This is a disaster of Biblical proportions and all I see is political bickering about who is to blame. My God
no human or agency is capable of handling such a large tragedy and making it run smooth as silk. I am sure when all the smoke clears that FEMA will take a lot of heat. I am sure that the Mayor and Govenor will probably have to answer for their mistakes also. But playing Devils Advocate for a moment, step back and take a look at the whole picture.
No one was prepared for what happened, No One period! About the only people that come out of this whole debacle unscathed are the folks at the National Weather Service. Damn they tried to warn everyone and no one listened. So please get a grip of yourselves, drop the conspiracy crap, the Bush-bashing rhetoric and the race/hate mongering. Put down the keyboard and go outside for some air, geez!




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