Why does this have to turn into a race issue?

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posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:15 AM
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Why does this have to turn into a race issue? I have seen and heard that the reason why it took so long to get action was that the stranded persons were primarily black. This is absurd. I don't believe for a minute that this is the case. We are all Americans not skin colors. This should not be turned into a race issue. It just happens that 80% of people living in N.O. are black skinned. Thats all.




posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:27 AM
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Originally posted by I See You
Why does this have to turn into a race issue? I have seen and heard that the reason why it took so long to get action was that the stranded persons were primarily black. This is absurd. I don't believe for a minute that this is the case. We are all Americans not skin colors. This should not be turned into a race issue. It just happens that 80% of people living in N.O. are black skinned. Thats all.


I agree it should not be a race issue, unfortunately you have the likes of Jackson, NAACP, Sharpton (sp?)etc., who seem to want to make a race issue out of it since it involves mostly blacks.

I honestly think they are just trying to get into the lime light for a few minutes of fame



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:29 AM
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Well, here's the simple outline:

1: Circa 1850: Rich whites in America set the place up, while black Americans provided the labor [research king cotton, slavery, the civil war, etc]

2: Circa 1900-1950: Rich whites continue to not care about the poor, non-white or disenfranchised [blacks and non-whites, "sinful" single mothers, etc]

3: Circa 2005: New Orleans' poorest and weakest citizens were not helped to escape.


...Now you may not see a connection between item #3 and the other two, but many people do. See, if you want to discuss this issue, you've got to separate the groups "black" and "poor", but as you will find, it's not always so easy to do.

Poverty makes you do things you wouldn't normally do. When you have nothing, (and particularly if you live in a "Christian" nation) you tend to think that the people above you (your so-called "leaders") will protect you.

Blacks in America, are more likely to be poor. If you are poor (and if you are old), you are not able to evacuate quickly. The question being raised is: Why is a dead black person not as important as a dead white person, in America?

Or to phrase it more clearly, why was Jon Benet-Ramsey a national tragedy? If any of these starving black NOLA kids were white beauty queens, would the rescue have been quicker? I think the answer is yes.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:34 AM
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Originally posted by shots

Originally posted by I See You
Why does this have to turn into a race issue? I have seen and heard that the reason why it took so long to get action was that the stranded persons were primarily black. This is absurd. I don't believe for a minute that this is the case. We are all Americans not skin colors. This should not be turned into a race issue. It just happens that 80% of people living in N.O. are black skinned. Thats all.


I agree it should not be a race issue, unfortunately you have the likes of Jackson, NAACP, Sharpton (sp?)etc., who seem to want to make a race issue out of it since it involves mostly blacks.

I honestly think they are just trying to get into the lime light for a few minutes of fame




Why would I have the likes of Sharpton and Jackson? Reread my post.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:40 AM
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Originally posted by I See You

Why would I have the likes of Sharpton and Jackson? Reread my post.


You are making no sense.

You asked;Why does this have to turn into a race issue? I simply answered your question giving my reasons as to who may be wanting to turn this into an issue of race nothing more.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:43 AM
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God when are people going to start looking at the obvious instead of reversing what they see with their own eyes and denying the truth! It’s why America is so #ed up. Everyone keeps following blind optimism and irrational thinking. What did you see on tv that was different in other hurricane situations. They didn’t helicopter in the usual food and water and made excuses for not doing so. They don’t give a # about the poor hell you see it every dam day. Someone asks you for a dollar you tell them to get a #ing job or no or some other cute phrase. People don’t give a # about the poor they spend their time ridiculing and belittling them. America has a president right now who represents them perfectly. It makes me sick seeing those people suffer because I know the reason as you do.

Keep telling yourself if they had 2 tickets to the super bowl they would find a way to get there, but you tell me they couldn’t find a way out of the city? It makes it easier for morons to except just how brutal we are to the poor.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:44 AM
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I don't actually know if it's a race issue or not. Or a 'poor' issue. I think the possibility exists for it to be just that. Depending on what you believe about the current administration and it's response to the hurricane, it could be that the poor response was because the majority of the people are black, poor and not Bush supporters. It could be that if they were white, weathy Republicans the response would have been quite different.

I don't know enough (and probably never will) to say for sure, but I do have an opinion about it. I agree, though, that jumping on the race bandwagon may be a little premature. But, then again, what do you expect from Jackson, NAACP and Sharpton? That's where they go first.

AND, "We are all Americans not skin colors" is a bit of an idealistic way of thinking in this situation. Yes, that's the way it should be and we'd like it to be, but I highly doubt that political decisions are made based on the equality of all Americans. Even if lip service is paid to that notion, it's just not realistic. Unfortunately.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:50 AM
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Well it is need a race issue...... From the very start of broadcasting.. this tragic event. The report : yahoo showing two pics one of a yoiung black man carrying foodstuff described as a looter. The other pic a white couple, described as finding food items! Comeon, isn't that discrimnation if that is not, well tell me what is? Bush's lack of support, when the people needeed it most, was appalling, maybe if it was the state of FLORIDA! FLORIDA!, we will have seen a much quicker response. Anyway, the lack of his response, will have devastating consequences in the coming weeks, and months..



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:53 AM
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Btw I forgot to mention I have an family member that lives just outside of baton rouge. High end white neighborhood. They had helicopters drop off food and water Monday. This will all come out soon enough. Get ready for the riots again.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by DiRtYDeViL
Btw I forgot to mention I have an family member that lives just outside of baton rouge. High end white neighborhood. They had helicopters drop off food and water Monday. This will all come out soon enough. Get ready for the riots again.


Can you confirm this through any media source?



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 12:42 PM
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Ok, if we are going to seperate whites and blacks in this tragedy lets do it,
how many rapes and murders were reported in the white neighborhoods compared to the black, I guess they do this because they are poor, So all poor people will rape and kill people because they are poor? What about other miniorities? did they rape and kill people because they were poor to? As sad as it is to say blacks often destroy their own communities, seen it in 92 saw it again now, same thing with africa, They have overpopulated and destroyed that place with war. Of all the places hit, the only places ive heard where these things have happened are in black communities. They always tend to make a bad situation worse.

[edit on 4-9-2005 by Rikimaru]



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 01:15 PM
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Originally posted by loam

Originally posted by DiRtYDeViL
Btw I forgot to mention I have an family member that lives just outside of baton rouge. High end white neighborhood. They had helicopters drop off food and water Monday. This will all come out soon enough. Get ready for the riots again.


Can you confirm this through any media source?


No I looked. It will be. I doubt my uncle would lie about it.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 01:25 PM
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It's a race issue because you want it to be a race issue. It's a race issue because Sharpton et. al. want it to be a race issue because it empowers them.

What about the tens of thousands of white people trapped in New Orleans? What about the tens of thousands of rich white people trapped in NO suburbs who only got food/water dropped to them yesterday? What about the ten white people in downtown NO who have been stuck on top of a building roof (including a couple tourists from Scotland) and have been on multiple media sources but have yet to be rescued even though everyone knows exactly where they are located? What about the dozens and dozens of TV images of black people being dropped cases of food and water we see on TV for the past 2 days? What about all the white and black people we saw stranded at different arenas?

It's not a race issue, and I do not believe that it's a poverty issue -- not the rescue part. Yes, it's a given that the poor would have had a harder time evacuating before the storm, and yes it's a given that the majority of the remaining victims of the storm would be classed as poor. But have you ever looked at the US military? Have you ever looked at the National Guard? Have you ever looked at the Coast Guard? Have you?

Almost 25% of the US military is comprised of black people, yet the population of blacks in the USA is around 12.3% (2000 census). In the past 3 years the percentage of blacks recruited has been dropping (from 22.7% in 2001 to 13.1% in 2005) the reasons for this are chalked up to a better economy and lower unemployment (more opportunities at home including a significant increase in college enrollment by blacks) and to the fact that there is a much higher chance of being killed and/or being deployed in the middle east for extended tours of duty (many young black men disagree with the Iraq war are aren't willing to enlist to fight and possibly die for something they don't believe in). (source) 9.4% of all generals in the US army are black (close to 12.3% don't you think?). (source)

My point being, do you seriously think that the black helicopter pilots, and the black crewmen, and the black guardsmen, and the black rescue people, and the black generals, and the black majors, and the black captains, and the black sergeants, and the black corporals, and the black privates, and the black coremen, and the black chaplains, and the black doctors are going to say "screw those black refugees"? Please...

No. It's a race issue because you want it to be a race issue, it's a race issue because Jackson, Sharpton, et.al. want it to be a race issue.


[edit on 4-9-2005 by CatHerder]



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 01:34 PM
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Originally posted by CatHerder
My point being, do you seriously think that the black helicopter pilots, and the black crewmen, and the black guardsmen, and the black rescue people, and the black generals, and the black majors, and the black captains, and the black sergeants, and the black corporals, and the black privates, and the black coremen, and the black chaplains, and the black doctors are going to say "screw those black refugees"? Please...

[edit on 4-9-2005 by CatHerder]

Yes I do they think they are better then them.

Really this topic will be better served after a few weeks after all the facts have come out. We need to know the factors that went into them Political, Logistical, etc. I hope they wait awhile before rioting. Cause it sure looks bad.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by CatHerder
It's a race issue because you want it to be a race issue.


Not really. I'd prefer that not to be true. I HOPE that is not true....



It's a race issue because Sharpton et. al. want it to be a race issue because it empowers them.


Maybe.



What about the tens of thousands of white people trapped in New Orleans?


What is your source for that number?



What about the tens of thousands of rich white people trapped in NO suburbs who only got food/water dropped to them yesterday?


Again, source?



What about the ten white people in downtown NO who have been stuck on top of a building roof (including a couple tourists from Scotland) and have been on multiple media sources but have yet to be rescued even though everyone knows exactly where they are located?


Assuming that race IS the issue (again, which I am not prepared to assert) can you not forsee where there would naturally be cases of "collateral damage" ?


What about the dozens and dozens of TV images of black people being dropped cases of food and water we see on TV for the past 2 days?


Isn't that the point??? When did Katrina make landfall?????



What about all the white and black people we saw stranded at different arenas?


What were the proportions of each?




It's not a race issue, and I do not believe that it's a poverty issue -- not the rescue part. Yes, it's a given that the poor would have had a harder time evacuating before the storm, and yes it's a given that the majority of the remaining victims of the storm would be classed as poor. But have you ever looked at the US military? Have you ever looked at the National Guard? Have you ever looked at the Coast Guard? Have you?

Almost 25% of the US military is comprised of black people, yet the population of blacks in the USA is around 12.3% (2000 census). In the past 3 years the percentage of blacks recruited has been dropping (from 22.7% in 2001 to 13.1% in 2005) the reasons for this are chalked up to a better economy and lower unemployment (more opportunities at home including a significant increase in college enrollment by blacks) and to the fact that there is a much higher chance of being killed and/or being deployed in the middle east for extended tours of duty (many young black men disagree with the Iraq war are aren't willing to enlist to fight and possibly die for something they don't believe in).


How many of them are officers?

Like I said. I'm not ready to jump off that cliff yet. But there is plenty to make you wonder....



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 02:02 PM
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It's a race issue because the black caucus and Jackson..followers of have made this one. Watch TV. It's been mentioned numerous times already. It shouldn't be though. Like I said the % of N.O. is predominatley black so givin that how would it not be that there are a larger number of blacks not being rescued as quickly? Granted that the effort had failed in certain areas but I don't believe that it was planned to fail and to premeditate the deaths on 100's or 1000's of people.

Unfortunately this is going to cause quite a stir and needlesss to say millions of taxpayer dollars. Maybe even people getting hurt if this escalades into something more than what it is.

[edit on 4-9-2005 by I See You]



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 02:15 PM
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Originally posted by loam
How many of them are officers?


These are 1998 numbers, I didn't spend much time looking up more recent stats but I will later when I have some time (and I have seen more recent numbers and know they are higher than those frm 1998). In 1998 blacks comprised 26.6% of the Army and 11.1% of the officer strength, up to the rank of major, black officers constitute about 12 percent of the officer corps. (again this is 1998 stats and I'll give an honest effort to look up more current stats when I get back tonight)

General 25 8.1
Colonel 233 6.4
Lieutenant Colonel 920 10.2%
Major 1,715 12.4 %
Captain 2,663 12.0 %
1st Lieutenant 1,027 10.7 %
2d Lieutenant 865 10.4 %

Remember: the path to an officer rank doesn't begin as an enlistedman. A better example of promotions through the enlisted ranks would be to show the number of top Sgt ranks (Staff Sgt, Master Sgt, Gunnery Sgt, Sgt Major, etc).

I do notice that there is/was no outcry (in the past 15-20 years) regarding the opportunity to advance (achieve officer rank) in the military for blacks. The reason there is no outcry (from the NAACP etc) is because the military is truely one of the most equal opportunity career options out there.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 02:32 PM
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Friday August 13, 2004 hurricane Charley destroys Punta Gorda, Florida.

Scott McLellan on August 13th issued this statement:

Secretary Ridge, during the briefings, also updated the President on Hurricane Charley, and talked about how we have deployed federal resources and put them in place to be in position to respond to Hurricane Charley when it hits Florida. We've got disaster supply kits in place. We've got response teams in place. So the President received an update about all that we're doing at the federal level to respond to Hurricane Charley.


By Saturday the 14th, FEMA was already in there going from house to house with food, medical supplies and looking for survivors via helicopter view.

Two days after the hurricane hit, Sunday the 15th, Bush was on the ground surveying the damage.
www.cnn.com...



This is a race issue indirectly. It is obvious that when the largest majority of a state happens to be black and is ranked as one of the poorest, it is as a result of a differentiation in class; discrimination and what is not available to that majority class as opposed to the other. Otherwise it would have to be said that the black population in the United States are willingly choosing to live in poverty.

On Wednesday, CNN televised a live telephone conversation with a woman who along with 300 other hotel guests stayoing at the Ritz Carlton, found themselves trapped and complaining that no one had attempted to rescue them. By Thursday midday, CNN was very pleased to interview this woman once more by phone. One day later, this woman, this obviously well to do woman who could afford the Ritz, was now safely ensconced in her Baltimore, Maryland home.

Her tale of woe described how shortly after her conversation with CNN, hotel management gathered these 300 together and told them they would be rescued but because the flood waters did not allow for rescue vehicles to approach from the street, they would have to walk 4 blocks to the Marriott. They were given special clothing to wear while wading through the “diseased and filthy water” and doctors in the hotel went across to the WalGreen’s nearby and “got” (note not looted) all the antibiotics they could find, came back and inoculated all 300 Ritz Carlton guests. They made their way to the Marriott where they were greeted by staff and given ”sandwiches and drinks” and told that 8 busses would be by that night to rescue them, and that it would be by night because it was “unsafe during the day.”

She then recounts: ”that night 8 busses did not come, but 18 busses escorted by armed police vehicles and helicopters with national guardsmen with special scopes on their guns.” From there they were taken out of state where ”they boarded planes for home.” and as far as she knew all 300 got flights out.

It is very clear here that FEMA’s and Bush’s reaction to Florida was vastly different from the get go to that of Louisianna, Alabama and Mississippi, and it is particularly clear that when rich white Ritz Carlton patrons screamed for help it was delivered toute de suite. That is undeniably class distinction and preferential treatment.

What was particularly disturbing to me as I heard this woman tell her tale was how, not only were they bundled up in protective clothing to keep themselves from contact with the same filthy water tens of thousands of less fortunate folk were wading through in trying to seek shelter, but doctors took the liberty to loot Walgreens and ensure these 300 were given antibiotics before they even stepped foot into it.

It is appalling to me that the rescue was made not just under heavy police guard, but by highly trained, most likely by now, battle hardened fighting men from their positions in helicopters during the night, and presented as though they are somehow afraid of dealing with gunfire. The truth is more likely that it was done under cover of darkness so that the less fortunate black folk could not see the extent of the rescue efforts extended to these ‘poor’ Ritz Carlton patrons who for three days had to suffer being holed up in a swanky hotel.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by I See You
It's a race issue because the black caucus and Jackson..followers of have made this one. Watch TV. It's been mentioned numerous times already. It shouldn't be though. Like I said the % of N.O. is predominatley black so givin that how would it not be that there are a larger number of blacks not being rescued as quickly? Granted that the effort had failed in certain areas but I don't believe that it was planned to fail and to premeditate the deaths on 100's or 1000's of people.

Unfortunately this is going to cause quite a stir and needlesss to say millions of taxpayer dollars. Maybe even people getting hurt if this escalades into something more than what it is.

[edit on 4-9-2005 by I See You]


If this level of damage happened in Florida, will they took so long to send help? I don't think so.

Peace
Crustas



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 02:47 PM
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Simply because this is a way that some can get at Bush. Its already started and I feel that the Governor filed to head the feds asking for control. Her political leanings caused delay that should not have been there.





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