Who was Responsible for the Failure of the Katrina Relief Effort?

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posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 05:13 PM
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Interesting tidbit from this site:

www.realcities.com...



For example, in the 1990s, in planning for a New Orleans nightmare scenario, the federal government figured it would pre-deploy nearby ships with pumps to remove water from the below-sea-level city and have hospital ships nearby, said James Lee Witt, who was FEMA director under President Clinton.

But it's not so bad. They did spend $250,000 on New Orleans. Uhhh... Yeah. Now I'm hearing estimates as high as 100 billion in Katrina insurance claims of which 25% will actually be paid.



Last year, FEMA spent $250,000 to conduct an eight-day hurricane drill for a mock killer storm hitting New Orleans. Some 250 emergency officials attended. Many of the scenarios now playing out, including a helicopter evacuation of the Superdome, were discussed in that drill for a fictional storm named Pam.




[EDIT:]

Found this in a blog:

rudepundit.blogspot.com...



9/1/2005
Even Mr. Bill Knew the Levees Wouldn't Hold:
In early 2004, lovable, crushable clay animated figure Mr. Bill from Saturday Night Live starred in an ad to alert people to the problems with the wetlands in Louisiana. On Good Morning, America today, President Bush said, "I don't think anyone could have anticipated the breach of the levees." He was wrong. Mr. Bill already had. Here's a transcript of the stunningly prescient ad, from CNN on May 27, 2004:

MR. BILL: Gee, kids, I'm not sure we can do our show today because it looks like Hurricane Sluggo is headed right for us here in America's wetlands.

WALTER WILLIAMS, MR. BILL CREATOR: That's right, Mr. Bill. And since New Orleans is below sea level, if a hurricane hit us directly, it could push the water over the levees and fill it to the top.

BILL: Well then we'd better leave.

WILLIAMS: Well it's too late to evacuate since all the roads are jammed and under water.

BILL: Then where can we go that's safe?

WILLIAMS: Here this should work.

BILL: Gee, I hope it doesn't get much higher.

WILLIAMS: Well, Red, the alligator, doesn't seem too worried.

BILL: Yes, that's because he can swim. You know I don't do that too well.

WILLIAMS: Well in that case, Red says he'll have one of his buddies come and give you a lift.

BILL: That's OK. Maybe you could mind the water wings or something. Oh, get me out of here! No, wait, no, no, ohhh!

WILLIAMS: Let's act now before it's too late.

By the way, Williams pulled Mr. Bill out of the campaign in June of this year when he believed it was being used as a tool to cover up the misdeeds of Shell Oil.
// posted by Rude One @ 9:51 PM

...The poster links to this site, in which ESPN promotes Mr. Bill in a Lousiana wetlands commercial --no mention of levees that I could find. Has anyone seen this commercial? I'm not sure if the text above is in it, but this is pretty creepy.

espn.go.com...



Mr. Bill tapped to help save La. swamps
By Cain Burdeau
Associated Press — Jan. 22, 2004
NEW ORLEANS — Mr. Bill, the "Saturday Night Live" clay character from the 1970s whose misadventures usually left him squished, will be part of a campaign aimed at teaching people — especially children — how Louisiana is losing its coastal marshes and swamps.

"I wish I had a quick three-word synopsis for it, other than maybe Mr. Bill says 'Ohh, nooo!!! — the coastal erosion,'" said Walter Williams, Mr. Bill's creator and a native of New Orleans.

The campaign will be launched next summer with Mr. Bill and a gang of "Estuarians" — Salty the Shrimp, Eddy the Eagle, and others — talking about the shrinking coast.



[edit on 3-9-2005 by smallpeeps]




posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 08:55 PM
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Originally posted by groingrinder
Anybody else notice that in the pictures in the first post that Bush has the wrong end of the phone up to his ear?? That explains right there why he is out of the loop.


With all honesty, I couldn't help myself when I saw that pic.



posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 08:58 PM
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Originally posted by SpittinCobra


They where not taken care of till yesterday, and still thousands are still with out food. Im not even talking about the people in thier houses, im talking about people on I/10 that see buses and food go past them.

[edit on 3-9-2005 by SpittinCobra]


And you're absolutely right, but it is also a UGE undertaking, rescues like this take time to pprepar, you have to gather people, material, fund, its sad but the truth is that it takes time, it doesnt happen in seconds.

Atempts of rescue were made earlier, but they got shot at, so that only delayed things...Hopefully now, all seems to be taken care in a orderly way.



posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 09:11 PM
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Originally posted by BaastetNoir
Hopefully now, all seems to be taken care in a orderly way.


Only because the rescue effort only really BEGAN last night. They had days of warning before landfall.....Again, pure nonsense. Those responsible for these failures WANT you to believe the things you say...

WAKE UP FOLKS!!! Don't condone this governmental incompetency.

EDIT: Moreover, I'd like to point out that if the issue were truly a logistical one, the pinheads at the feds wouldn't be advancing this feeble "Posse Comitatus" argument and solely blaming the governor of Louisiana.

[edit on 3-9-2005 by loam]



posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 09:27 PM
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Originally posted by loam

WAKE UP FOLKS!!! Don't condone this governmental incompetency.

[edit on 3-9-2005 by loam]


What would you hae donne ?



posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 09:49 PM
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Not this........

movies.crooksandliars.com...

OPEN YOUR EYES PEOPLE!!!



posted on Sep, 3 2005 @ 11:59 PM
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Suspect Number 1



I only just became aware of this....

Apparantly, FEMA and Brown did not become aware of the crisis developing at the Convention Center until Thursday of this week, despite the fact it had been reported upon for days and in real time by all of the major news networks.....




...federal officials were not even aware there was a crowd at the convention center for three days into the crisis, according to Michael Brown, director of the Federal Emergency Management Agency. Mr. Brown told network television interviewers on Thursday night that federal officials had learned about the refugees just that day.

"Don't you guys watch television?" Ted Koppel asked him on "Nightline." "Our reporters have been reporting about it for more than just today."

Mr. Brown, who indicated that officials had heard word of the problem earlier but were too busy dealing with refugees at the Superdome to confirm it , said, "We learned about it factually today that that's what existed."

NYTimes



This, along with Shepard Smith and Geraldo Rivera's reporting that people were being forcibly prevented from leaving the Convention Center, makes me believe less that all of this is the consequence of incompetency, but rather caused by something far more sinister.....How can this be?



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 12:07 AM
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All of this just makes me and many others wonder how differently the FEMA response would have been
if major cities like Washington D.C., New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Miami or exclusive Palm Beach would have suffered the same kind of natural disaster?



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 05:46 AM
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Originally posted by FallenFromTheTree

All of this just makes me and many others wonder how differently the FEMA response would have been
if major cities like Washington D.C., New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Miami or exclusive Palm Beach would have suffered the same kind of natural disaster?



Anywhere else on the planet would have gotten a better response becuase they have better elected officials. The mayor of NO is almost as incompident as the Govenor of Louisiana.

Disaster planning starts at home.

On election day the very people being rescued on national TV were driven to and from the polls in one day...........pretty good mass transit for POWER just none to save their lives..........

Failure in NO or LA is a local issue for LOCAL problems.....

FredT...thank you for the "RED BADGE of HONOR"..........

PS...good planning from good officials shows up in Texas. The astrodome was prepared in 12 hours............Bush, Fema, and everyone else is still the same.......difference.......LOCAL Officials..........

Wiseman once said "Leadership is ACTION not a position".

[edit on 4-9-2005 by SkepticSanity]



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 04:50 PM
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Suspect Number 2
Michael Chertoff



Must read transcript with Tim Russert on Meet the press, where Suspect Number 2 blames the media for not reporting how bad the damage was! Is that were our feds get their information? The media???? He also claims that the levies breaking was not contemplated even though their own assessment of such a possibility took place months earlier in a hypothetical Hurricane Pam....

I can't belive so many find this acceptable!


[edit on 4-9-2005 by loam]



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 05:27 PM
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Originally posted by SkepticSanity
I am very, very familiar with NO area. Bill O'Reilly is just plan stupid.

NO has been a center of evil and coruption since the French built it where the local indians wouldn't live.

BLAME the people themselves for electing a parade of theives that stole billions of dollars then turned around and handed a very small percentage to the local poor, and drug addicts, etc, etc.

It is moronic stupidity to rely on any government in a disaster spanning 90,000 square miles. Too many people with there hands out when they spend their welfare checks on "Crack".

It is no coincident that this storm happened with the timing it has. This very weekend in NO was to be "Decadent" weekend....a GAY/Lesbian celecration of homosexual EVIL.

YES, GOD has punished NO for its centuries of evil.......New Orleans is/was modern day Sodom!!!!!!

Flamers be damned.


People like you make me sick. This had nothing to do with god and every thing to do with humans. WE CAUSED THIS!!! We pollute this planet so much that it is trying to balance it's self out. The sea levels have risen because of global warming and their is a hole in the ozone layer. Get a clue and stop using "your" god as an scapegoat. It makes your little ego feel better that innocent people died in the name of GODS wrath.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 05:38 PM
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Originally posted by loam
§ 5192. Federal emergency assistance {Sec. 502}

a. Specified

In any emergency, the President may--

1. direct any Federal agency, with or without reimbursement, to utilize its authorities and the resources granted to it under Federal law (including personnel, equipment, supplies, facilities, and managerial, technical and advisory services) in support of State and local emergency assistance efforts to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, and lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe;

2. coordinate all disaster relief assistance (including voluntary assistance) provided by Federal agencies, private organizations, and State and local governments;

3. provide technical and advisory assistance to affected State and local governments for--
A. the performance of essential community services;
B. issuance of warnings of risks or hazards;
C. public health and safety information, including dissemination of such information;
D. provision of health and safety measures; and
E. management, control, and reduction of immediate threats to public health and safety;

4. provide emergency assistance through Federal agencies;

5. remove debris in accordance with the terms and conditions of section 407 [42 U.S.C. § 5173];

6. provide assistance in accordance with section 408 [42 U.S.C. § 5174]; and [(Pub.L. 106-390, § 206(b), October 30, 2000)]

7. assist State and local governments in the distribution of medicine, food, and other consumable supplies, and emergency assistance.


b. General

Whenever the Federal assistance provided under subsection (a) with respect to an emergency is inadequate, the President may also provide assistance with respect to efforts to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, and lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe.




Notice here a couple of things:

The language is about the president "providing assistance."

He is allowed to coordinate the relief efforts of federal agencies. There is no language about him striking out on his own, or federalizing the state actors.

It seems to be true from what I've seen that LA gov didn't "beg" for federal intervention. "States' Rights" is still a rallying cry in the deep south. Loam mentioned the use of federal troops during the civil rights struggle. Every time, the President threatened to halt federal dollars to the state unless that governor begged for 'assistance." Remember the image of the governor standing in the door of the Little Rock High school, and then the next week, calling out the national guard???


While in law enforcement, I participated in two "disasters." One was a flood. The second was a toxic waste spill of a railroad car in a populated area. In both cases, the Feds didn't come in until specifically asked. In the toxic waste spill which happened on federal (railroad) property they didn't show up until the emergency response was over. And then, they passed out "report cards" complete with lists of our mistakes.

When asked why, they pointed to Southern (and specifically texan) attitudes against the USGOV stemming from the "Branch Davidian" bungle, as well as the Murrah building bomb.

I think the whole Murrah building thing was a watershed for federal employees (I expect Katrina will be another). The whole militia movement put a definite scare into them, as has this year's assasination of federal judges and one judge's family.

My dealings with FEMA/FBI/CD after the Murrah Building was to notice at what pains they were to show themselves as "no longer" being heavy-handed globalist goons.

Look at the FEMA terrorism preparedness webpage, and you'll see the same, "we're not taking over the country" language.

Not that any of this mitigates anybody's guilt. But it might explain some of their motivations, and specific pitfalls they wanted to avoid.

Of course, all of that is irrelevant in the face of the "Reign of Terror" career-bloodbath we will see in Washington this winter, as anyone who was a federal employee is tarred and feathered for this fiasco.

I personally am looking forward to the Soviet-style show trials in front of Congress. Who will be cast as Robespierre?



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 06:54 PM
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Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
Not that any of this mitigates anybody's guilt. But it might explain some of their motivations, and specific pitfalls they wanted to avoid.


Yet the scale and compelling nature of this disaster compared to the examples you gave are indeed VERY different. Would you not agree? How many would have honestly raised the specter of excessive federal power if they had arrived immediately?



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 09:08 PM
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Originally posted by groingrinder
Anybody else notice that in the pictures in the first post that Bush has the wrong end of the phone up to his ear?? That explains right there why he is out of the loop.
ROTFL. I am sure that picture is doctored but I do know what I heard with my own ears when he was trying to express agreements the 3 affected states had undertaken with others for policing...he referred to to the 3 states as having"compacts" with the others.



posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 09:11 PM
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Originally posted by loam

Originally posted by dr_strangecraft
Not that any of this mitigates anybody's guilt. But it might explain some of their motivations, and specific pitfalls they wanted to avoid.


Yet the scale and compelling nature of this disaster compared to the examples you gave are indeed VERY different. Would you not agree? How many would have honestly raised the specter of excessive federal power if they had arrived immediately?


The US goverment is being laughed at by hole the world, Fema gets billions of dollars and their act was a joke, even bush has admitted that., because everyone noticed.
US policy is a joke and everyone except some dumbass patriots with a cloaded mind see that.

The US maybe rich in resources but poor is so many ways.



posted on Sep, 5 2005 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by SomewhereinBetween
. . . . ROTFL. I am sure that picture is doctored but I do know what I heard with my own ears when he was trying to express agreements the 3 affected states had undertaken with others for policing...he referred to to the 3 states as having"compacts" with the others.






Shows how ignorant YOU are.

A contract is an agreement between parties for a limited time.

A COMPACT is an ongoing agreement between governments or sovreign entities describing how they will do business henceforth.

www.thefreedictionary.com...

com·pact 2 (kmpkt)
n.
An agreement or a covenant. See Synonyms at bargain.


yep. ignorance denied. But whose ignorance????



A compact between states usually governs the questions of extradition and how/whether they will enforce each other's laws. For instance, when a patrol officer runs a criminal history check on a motorist, some states will not co-operate. When I was working, Utah, Michigan and Massachussets were famous for not having "compacts" with distant states regarding info or extradition, though they would still honor arrest warrants.

An example is that TX, OK, AR, LA will allow officers in border counties from the adjoining states to pursue a fleeing criminal into their state; they deputize them for the duration of the pursuit.

The agreement is called a (tee hee!) COMPACT!

A compact between states would cover electricians and engineers not specifically licensed in one state to work in that state in an emergency.

This is why, if you are in NO today and get stopped by a Texas Ranger or Arkansas State patrol, you still have to obey them.

because of compact between the several states.


And check out this website, belonging to the Texas Comission on Law Enforcement, which in Texas is a separate legal entity from the state's political apparatus:

www.tcleose.state.tx.us/ Public%20Notice/compact_with_texas.htm - 43k -

what is the document called? "Compact with Texas"

!!!!

Now, I'm not chastizing you for not being informed about a certain field which may be of little interest or importance in your own life. There are limits on everyone's knowledge, certainly mine included.

What I am knocking you for is your assumption that this President is IGNORANT because a bunch of TV people have told you to expect that from him. Ironically, the uninformed intellect was yours and not his; but you jumped on the existence of ignorance to berate him (behind his back) for what was really ignorance on your part.

But hey, everybody KNOWS he's an idiot, right? After all, the media told you so.

Just like he's responsible for the Hurricane problem, the oil problem, and that terror thing.

[edit on 5-9-2005 by dr_strangecraft]





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