Government Coverup of UFOs - Proven?

Incredible post Gazrok,

Enjoyed it very much. Very well thought out, and great infomation.

-Cheers

Why is that only the goverment coversup UFOs? Whya can't people outside this entity do so?


Oh, I know, the goverment is just the easiest to blame for coverups and since they've covered things up in the past, they must obviously be covering up UFOs. Right?

It isn't because of "desire" for the government to be blamed here, it's what the evidence points to... It isn't just arbitrarily pointing a finger...

Remember, they are the ones (in their own press release) that first claimed to have captured a flying disc. They are the ones who publicly dismissed the subject, only to study it in private. It isn't a blame game, it's just what the evidence shows.

So that means that what they captured is obviously an ET UFO?

No Frosty, it means the the subject you are so fond of ridiculing , is taken seriously by the Governments of the World.

And so does the above type comments.

Nothing to looking in abook or probably simple web site views then posting them.

I suppose I'm saying when one can take two or three hundred views and put the significant anomolies together and show and post, there's what I would suggest might be consenses on EBE/UFO reality.

Simply I don't believe in this - simply does not cut it in my Ufology books.

Dallas

Originally posted by lost_shaman
No Frosty, it means the the subject you are so fond of ridiculing , is taken seriously by the Governments of the World.

So that qualifies a mass conspiracy of world governments to keep hidden UFOs which they have in their possession because a setient group of beings dodging comets, asteroids, starts, planets, radiation, black holes, and other possible alien travelers managed to crash their spaceship because them telephone poles in New Mexico are just so much trickier than what lies out in the unkown of space?

Well lets see .... Brazil opened secret UFO files this year, thus proving that they have kept secret files since 1954.

Ask yourself does the Brazilian Air Force know more than the U. S. Air Force?

And the Brazilians are not talking about just any old UFO sightings , they are talking about UFOs that they had on Radar , that they usually scrambled aircraft to intercept.



[edit on 6-9-2005 by lost_shaman]

Originally posted by FrostySo that qualifies a mass conspiracy of world governments to keep hidden UFOs which they have in their possession because a setient group of beings dodging comets, asteroids, .......alien travelers managed to crash their spaceship because them telephone poles in New Mexico are just so much trickier than what lies out in the unkown of space?

That description is funny and gives me an idea for a graphic.

Yes, that level of cooperation and collusion is not likely in the best of political times. Let alone durring the height of UFO sightings durring the Cold War. People in the US have a tendancy to forget about UFO's and the global picture. It would not be enough for the US to cover up. It would have to be an air tight operation for every case for every nation for the last 60 years. that paints a highly improbable statistical operation for every year that passes.

Originally posted by nullster

People in the US have a tendancy to forget about UFO's and the global picture. It would not be enough for the US to cover up. It would have to be an air tight operation for every case for every nation for the last 60 years. that paints a highly improbable statistical operation for every year that passes.

I don't understand how you can talk about how improbable it would be after I have pointed out that Brazil has done exactly what you are saying isn't probable.

lost_shaman - You seem to take all my posts to heart but I can not change my objectivety. My statement you question is not answered by the Brazilian government disclosure. As a skeptic, significant evidence is required. Hard incontrovertible evidence scientists can touch, test, validate, and identify. How many nations in the world? How many governments? Remember, Unidentified Flying Objects are unidentified. Unidentified does NOT make them Alien.

Evidence
We need to get one of those alien ships and bodies everyone claims exist. Eyewitness accounts without the above mentioned evidence is getting us nowhere.

This may end up being my mantra
I, like many others would like for the existence of aliens
to be true. Therefore, I have to be even MORE
exceptionally skeptical about it, especially when
dealing with "evidence" presented by "believers".

Well I'm no believer.

If your objectivity means you can not check facts nor except facts, it isn't objectivity anymore now is it?

The whole Idea behind being objective is to see the evidence clearly without bias to your beliefs. In other words you don't skew your interprtation of evidence one way or the other , you let the evidence speak for itself.

The discussion was about Governments covering up UFOs from the public while secretly gathering information.

Some you think this is not probable , but it is a fact that Brazil acknowledged doing just that since 1954.



[edit on 6-9-2005 by lost_shaman]

Let's just say one of the sightings, or landings, or abductions or contact with a government happened -- then what?

99.00009 % of the above are right or the one contact is wrong?

Dallas

BOYZ...se ello tu ma lito frund

you're in LA

why not take a drive out to the panamint mts

on the weekends and hangout

say from 10pm - 6am

maybe you'll have an event

you'll remember for the rest of your life

Im in LA too. Where are these mountains, and what kind of experience are you talking about?

My comments about Adamski and Meier are based on research into the cases (much of which is right here on ATS in various threads)...and yes, I will completely stand by the claim that such frauds do incredible damage to the field and how it is viewed by the public.

Simply put, Adamski has a fictional book detailing the same (almost verbatim) story about Venusian travel, etc. and published BEFORE his alleged encounters. This is either the most incredible coincidence in history, or of course, compelling evidence to show fraud.

Meier has early photos that even the most average person off the street can clearly see are fakes, bizarre stories of Swiss MIBs when caught in a hoax (like using screenshots of a talk show as alien photos), pics of gold foil wearing humans wielding hokey PVC rayguns, etc. etc.

There is of course, a ton more that debunks either of the above, but that's just a sampling....

So that means that what they captured is obviously an ET UFO?

No, logic means that.

SOMETHING crashed at Roswell...THAT is a FACT. The press, the government, the witnesses, etc. all agree on that. It's a matter of record.

So, WHAT crashed? Here are the "terrestrial" possibilities...

1. A MOGUL balloon. (the timeline is all wrong for the claim, and it's ridiculous to believe that senior intel officers would be unable to identify tin foil and balsa wood as something otherworldly. Not to mention, MOGUL recoveries happened before and after, and NEVER with the secrecy and urgency as Roswell. NOTHING of the physical materials of MOGUL was classified, only the MISSION of MOGUL was....)

2. A US Test Plane or Rocket. (were this the case, Roswell would have been put to bed a LONG time ago, as a craft from 1947 would hardly still be worthy of classification, and it would provide an easy out for the USAF. You also have (on the same page of the Roswell Record), General Twining stating that the Army was conducting NO tests in the area, which of course, also discounts the MOGUL explanation, as if more was needed).

3. A Foreign Test Plane or Rocket. (same reasons as above why that's a miss...).

So, we've got a recovery of SOMETHING, that required military cordoning off of the area (as related by numerous witnesses), rushed debris flights to Air Materiel Command (a matter of record, a lot of fuss for tin foil, balsa wood, and other off the shelf parts, no?) So, something crashed in Roswell, it wasn't a MOGUL balloon, it wasn't one of our military tests, and it wasn't a foreign craft. Witnesses describe materials (all in agreement by the way) that defy our understanding. All of this LOGICALLY leads into the idea that if it isn't ours, and it isn't a foreign power's, then it had to come from SOMEWHERE ELSE.....i.e. "extraterrestrial". And this somewhere else had the military scrambling, and less than a month later, we see the entire overhall of the Department of Defense (i.e. National Security Act), centralizing intelligence, creating the Air Force, etc...all seemingly overnight.

[edit on 7-9-2005 by Gazrok]

Originally posted by Gazrok

And this somewhere else had the military scrambling, and less than a month later, we see the entire overhall of the Department of Defense (i.e. National Security Act), centralizing intelligence, creating the Air Force, etc...all seemingly overnight.

And also the order to investigate UFOs was given in Sept. of '47 too.

www.cufon.org...

HISTORY OF USAF INVESTIGATION OF UFOs

Investigation of UFOs by the U. S. Government began on September 23, 1947, when, following a rash or UFO sightings, Lt. Gen. Nathan F. Twining, Chief of Staff of the U. S. Army, recommended to Brig. Gen. George Schulgen, Commanding General of the Army Air Force, that Headquarters Army Air Forces issue a directive assigning a priority, security classification and code name for a detailed study of UFOs. In this letter, Lt. Gen. Twining also noted that in his opinion, the phenomenon was real and not visionary or fictitious. Since Air Material Command (AMC) had originally been collecting UFO data, Lt. Gen. Twining recommended that AMC continue the investigation within its present resources until the official study could be organized.(3:1379)

This source also contains some evidence of a general deception of the Media and public.

Beginning in 1949, the news media constantly ran negative articles pertaining to the existence of UFOs. This was not surprising since Captain Ruppelt admitted that the negative approach was typical when issuing information to the news media. The project chief was continually being told by higher headquarters to "tell them the media? about the sightings we've solved - don't mention the unknowns."(29:89)

Originally posted by Gazrok
Still think there isn’t a coverup? One can find even more than what is mentioned here.

It's irrefutable there's a cover-up. Just look at the Roswell fiasco. The USAF, in their own words, admitted a "white lie" covering up Project Mogul. So the question is, covering up what?

Many people mean to imply that they're covering up ET visitation. I much more inclined to believe they're covering up a host of things including: counter-intelligence efforts, foul-ups, secret military crafts, their own lack of knowledge on the subject, fear that a lack of understanding would incite panic, and on and on and on.

When it comes down to it I tend to lean more towards grand foul up than conspiracy cover-up.

Just saw this and asked if there was a pdf download available if
the printing was not copyrighted.

Might have seen this topic before and said how do we know anything
about UFOs and ETs.

No hardware or medical information unless its a big secret.
Specialized knowledge of the Illuminati only I suspect.

The UFO is dangerous when energized, don't stand underbeath
or close by. Negative currents are going up from the ground.
Imagine being thrown up into the bottom of the craft and burnt
by all the electrified atmospheric ions at the bottom coil.

When crashed hope they don't take off again.
Heard of crashes from Bill Lyne as one was 1993 on
his way to a Tesla Society convention when a large craft set
down in government property and another had six people
taken out in stretchers with nothing in the papers.
Months after an 'Aurora' crash he followed a CIA truck to
a salvage yard and found high voltage parts. GE was named
on one part at 15kva.