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Just picked up a new H&K

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posted on Sep, 16 2005 @ 11:53 AM
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Originally posted by DeusEx
Winch, you certainly can not make this horse drink. In which case, let us resume conversation about the USP. Do you know if you can buy the stainless steel slide seperate?

DE


Sorry Deus I owed you a response on this.

My understanding is that if you don't jump in now and buy gun complete with stainless slide, your only aftermarket option would be to have it re-finished in Nickel.

Some USPs are already unavailable with the Stainless, I am still kicking myself for passing up on a 45 full size, incredible looking weapon. I did a search of Gunbroker.com and I haven't seen one for ages, stainless 9mm and .40s still seem to be out there though but if you want one, now is the time.

BTW - CDNN investments is selling off USP compacts in stainless for very low $ right now, awesome deals, check out their downloadable catalogue.




posted on Sep, 16 2005 @ 11:58 AM
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Great gun Winchester Ranger T Ive always wanted one USP Tactical but they are alittle too expensive for my taste.

Did you happen to get one with a threaded barrel by any chance? Cant remember if only the USP tactical has that option

[edit on 16-9-2005 by ShadowXIX]



posted on Sep, 16 2005 @ 12:10 PM
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Only the full size USPs have a threaded barrel that I know of - that would be the Tactical and the Mark 23 SOCOM as used by the SEALs (Lord that's a big gun - the SEALs jokingly refer to it as a crew served weapon
).

I have heard tell of a special compact version with a threaded barrel but I have never seen one.

Remember that you can legally own a suppressor, you just need to pay the $200 tax stamp first.

A Mark 23 SOCOM fitted with an Abraxus (spelling ?) suppressor would be about the same size and weight as a bazooka



posted on Sep, 16 2005 @ 11:01 PM
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I find not even factoring in the $200 stamp suppressors range from $500-$800 in the gun stores in my area. Ive also heard that depending on the gun they could also require recoil enhancing accessories. Heckler & Koch MK-23 and the Colt 1911 dont require any though.



Man that would be sweet


If you get a extended barrel for your gun Gemtech can thread it for a ''nominal'' charge. Gemtech also makes a fine suppressor.



posted on Sep, 17 2005 @ 05:14 AM
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I guess a supressor would be nice for indoor shooting or something, otherwise I see little use for it, it's almost the same deal for me as Full-Auto's, what's the point in a civilian PoV?

I actually prefer the completely black USPs, the stainless steal just sticks out like a sour thumb IMO.

and have you seen those ugly new guns in Drab Olav green and such? man that's hideous!



posted on Sep, 17 2005 @ 06:37 AM
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well, it's the "starchilds" favourite weapon, and he's in the navy...



posted on Sep, 17 2005 @ 07:52 AM
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I've seen a lot of chatter about H&K and Sieg Sauer here.
I have to agree that Sieg is among the best, if not THE best you can carry.
I think SS and FBI carry them, at one point 9mm, but now .40 I think.
I own and carry a Sieg P239 Black Stainless; very nice gun, much smaller and easier to conceal than say a Beretta of the same caliber, but still accurate.
Best investment I've made.
I'm looking now for a Sieg P232 Stainless to carry in a concealment holster 24x7.
Not a major knock down weapon, but a bullet hole in the head is a bullet hole in the head!

I was troubled reading about the lack of rights to carry protection overseas.
Bless God; American by birth, Southerner by his grace!!
Banjo

Banjo.



posted on Sep, 17 2005 @ 02:22 PM
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The FBI now carry the Glock 23, before that the SiG P228, before that the Smith & Wesson Model 13 revolver.

The P239 is a superb gun, the P232 is probably the "cutest" gun out there, but since it's about the same size as a P239, why downgrade from 9mm to .380ACP.

Stainless slides are much easier to clean, don't rust, and don't show holster wear.

[edit on 17-9-2005 by Winchester Ranger T]



posted on Sep, 20 2005 @ 02:52 PM
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Originally posted by Winchester Ranger T
The FBI now carry the Glock 23, before that the SiG P228, before that the Smith & Wesson Model 13 revolver.

The P239 is a superb gun, the P232 is probably the "cutest" gun out there, but since it's about the same size as a P239, why downgrade from 9mm to .380ACP.

Stainless slides are much easier to clean, don't rust, and don't show holster wear.

[edit on 17-9-2005 by Winchester Ranger T]


It looked to me like the P232 was a bit smaller than the 239.
My 239 is black stainless, I haven't noticed what wear actually shows up yet.
By the way, why the heck are the H&K so much more expensive; they are at least 40% more than a Sieg?
Banjo



posted on Sep, 20 2005 @ 05:08 PM
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The P232 may be a tad smaller than the P239 but there's very little in it. Suffice to say that by modern standards the P232, lovely as it unquestionably is, is big for a .380.

H&K is expensive like Mercedes is expensive, some think it's a rip off, others would never drive anything else. Actual production cost of a standard high quality handgun is rumored to be around $80, painful but true.



posted on Sep, 20 2005 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by DeusEx
Ugh, nine mil. Nine mil makes babies cry and crooks survive.


Its about shot placement. Mr. Turd won't be more dead with a .45 than a nine. Maybe happen a fraction of a second quicker, but dead is dead.

IMHO the 9mm is on the lower end of lethality, but the whole caliber argument is a matter or preference. I like a quick recovery and rapid follow-up shots, but I certainly won't argue with a .50AE either.

My favorite is a good old Colt 1911, but I can't wait to shoot a new .45GAP. If H&K or maybe SIG ever makes a compact version, that could be an ultimate carry pistol.



posted on Sep, 20 2005 @ 11:35 PM
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Don't get me wrong- I like shot placement. Everyone does. Forget those hunting calibers- I prefer .357 Mag, 10mm and .45 for the manstopping. .357 is just how I learned to shoot. It's a comfortable, meaty, and all around probably the best manstopper ever made. I mean, a headshot is a headshot is a headshot. But the caliber difference is a real factor in torso shots.

Remember the FBI paper- officer stops car, armed gang member leaps out and opens up. Body armor stops two shots, officer had a few broken ribs. Officer returns fire, hitting with 13 of 16 shots fired (9mm Black Talons, not at all a bad brand). Gang member not only survives, manages to RUN THREE BLOCKS to a friend's house!

Lethality my ass. For that matter, shot placement my ass. Look at 50 Cent.

Bigger. Meaner. Better. BUY .357 MAGNUM.

DE



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 12:00 PM
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What about .45GAP?
Is it just another 'jump on the bandwagon' weapon or fad?
Banjo



posted on Sep, 21 2005 @ 03:57 PM
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For every one of those "9mm ain't enough" stories there are equivalent numbers of .45 and .357 Mag failures.

Don't believe me - try the story of Trooper Coates (in NC I think) he shot the perp 5 times with solid center thorax hits from his .357 Magnum, and the perp shot him once in the armpit with a .22LR which missed his vest and ripped hole in his heart, killing him dead right there. The perp with a chest and gut full of .357 is still in jail I believe.

9mm is not only an adequate caliber, in my opinion it remains #1 when all factors are considered - lethality, shootability, cost, availability, high capacity.

For more info check out the thread I just posted on 9mm effectiveness.



posted on Sep, 22 2005 @ 04:56 AM
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Winchester, I never heard the FBI switched to the glock, doesn't make sense to me since the Sig Sauer and the Glock are both guns from about the same era, why the switch now? magazine capacity?



posted on Sep, 22 2005 @ 12:17 PM
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I don't know the answer definitively but I can give you my opinion.

Primary Answer - cost.

They could have switched to the SiG P229 in .40S&W, but those guns are significantly more expensive even in bulk Federal contracts than Glocks.

A secondary and lesser consideration is probably recoil. SiGs have a high bore axis and a steel frame (except the SigPro that is) and the weak wristed college grads that the FBI hires these days have proven to be extremely recoil sensitive. The FBI originally went with 10mm, then they asked for a "weak 10mm" load which gave birth to the .40S&W (first chambered by Glock hilariously even though it was developed by S&W), and then the FBI asked for a weakened .40 load which gave birth to the Federal 165 grain JHP round that they now carry - probably the lowest powered .40 load available commercially.

Glocks have a lower bore axis and the polymer frame better absorbs recoil.

So I would say Cost is #1, and Shootability #2.



posted on Sep, 22 2005 @ 01:20 PM
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I just looked at a Glock; I own a Sieg in Black Stainless.
The dealer tells me Glock does not come in stainless or Black stainless.
I was not really impressed anyway, but then I have never shot one.
I am looking for a smaller handgun than my 239 that will not rust whenI carry it a lot in concealment.
I'm considering Sieg P232, but am open to suggestions as I would like to have enough stopping power in a quality weapon like Glock/Sieg/H&K
(H&K are juts too expensive anyway).
Any suggestions?
Banjo



posted on Sep, 22 2005 @ 04:25 PM
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Originally posted by banjo_guru
By the way, why the heck are the H&K so much more expensive; they are at least 40% more than a Sieg?
Banjo


Several reasons. One would be the "Mercedes factor"
as was stated above. After all, weapons like the MP5 or G3 with their roller lock are as expensive as they are top-of-the-line. But one must not forget that HK (maybe along with FN Herstal) probably runs the most productive research division of all major gun manufacturers. Sig Sauers and Glocks may be fine, but they never could have come up with something like the G11 or FN P90. Glock doesnt even neglect that they make weapons at a bargain price.

Personally, I even think that it is in HKs best interest to make their products in a way that not everyone could afford them. That way, a privately owned HK will always be a precious thing, which equally is desired by many of those who cant afford it.



posted on Sep, 23 2005 @ 10:48 AM
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You either love Glocks or you hate them, there rarely seems to be a middle ground.

They are relatively inexpensive, very reliable, extremely corrosion resistant (indeed I have never, ever heard of one rusting) very reliable, extremely easy to clean and maintain, and have a consistent trigger pull (as opposed to traditional double action) - something that most firearms experts agree is a priority in a serious defensive combat arm.

The downside is that they have an unusual grip angle that points high for many experienced shooters, the design needs well trained handling as it has been shown to have a higher rate of NDs (Negligent Discharges) - but this is NOT the gun's fault, operators just need to maintain strict trigger discipline. In calibers other than 9mm, there has always been the lingering allegation that it is prone to KBs (KaBooms) especially in .40S&W because of an unsupported chamber in the 6 o'clock position.

Like I say, people either love them or hate them. For me personally I find the grip to be too blocky, but I would not have any undue concerns if I had to carry one as my primary sidearm, they work, and ultimately that's all you can ask of any firearm.



posted on Sep, 26 2005 @ 02:27 PM
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What about the Walther PPK /S stainless.
I understand Smith & Wesson makes them, and that a lot of the jaming problems have been resolved.
Has anyone any experience with them?
Banjo



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