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Family history

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posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 02:58 PM
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Hey everyone, I have had this problem referring to my grandfather, here is a brief timeline done to the best of my ability and from what I and other family members know:

1. Born in Minnesota
2. Lived in KS
3. Joined Military(only in for 2 years)
4. Was in WWII and got shot in Germany(lived and recieved purple heart, and honarable discharge)
5. Joined the Masons(unknown year, but was around 1950's)
6. Life became a secret until the day he died in 2002 (with only bits and peices being know of what he did for a living for most of his life).
7. Died in 2002, left behind a box of papers(thousands), used plane tickets, business dealings, ect......
8. Contacted people who's names were in some of the papers and supposed dealings, but they either vanished, or didnt know anything, or hung up on us.
9. Still dont know anything to this day, it still remains a dark secret.
10. From the papers and items found in the box, he supposidly had dealings in Uranium mines, Overseas dealings, Numerous bank accounts, stuff in Mexico, Saudi Arabia, Iraq, (there were plane tickets for all of these places also).

Has anyone else on here know any other Mason that may have also been a secret like this?

It's been driving me and some of my family crazy for years trying to figure it out. He would never tell us anything, just change the subject.




posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:04 PM
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Try his tax returns, which will list employers, dates, earnings etc.

Your grandmother didn't know anything, either?

Parents?



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:08 PM
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that's another funny thing, there are no files of every doing any taxes, supposidly the IRS was after him because he never completed any taxes since the early 80's. Weird huh?

My Grandma died in 1999 and didnt know anything, or at least if she did, she put on a good show of playing dumb.

[edit on 29-8-2005 by Kamikazi]



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:19 PM
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I'm sure you did it already but just in case -- did you try to google his name? Do you have his SS number you could get one of those background checks maybe? Or google the companies he worked with etc.



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:29 PM
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Has anyone else on here know any other Mason that may have also been a secret like this?


If he had some kind of secret life or profession, I don't believe it could have ANYTHING to do with Freemasonry.
Being a Mason myself, I have no such secret life nor profession.

Perhaps government work?



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:39 PM
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Well, the Masons had it in for him also, because he was supposidly stealing money from them, in upwards of a $1,000,000 + . Man, I have googled more crap that I have ever wanted to, I have contacted 30+ banks, 2 attorneys, 4 of his old friends/business partners, and I have turned up nothing. It's almost like he covered his ass so well that after he died, no-one would be able to ever find anything. I have also questioned the gov. work thing also, but have not done any researching on that. Maybe I should try to contact someone, but who?

[edit on 29-8-2005 by Kamikazi]



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:39 PM
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Originally posted by Kamikazi
that's another funny thing, there are no files of every doing any taxes, supposidly the IRS was after him because he never completed any taxes since the early 80's. Weird huh?

[edit on 29-8-2005 by Kamikazi]


Don't rule out this route just yet; presumably if he served in WWII, and died in 2002, he would have been...at least retiring age in the 1980s, correct?

Thus, even tax returns prior to that date would hold information on where and when he did work.

He won't have had to file much afterwards in any case, unless it was government work - and even then, the government does have retirement age guidelines for most areas...

It doesn't sound Masonry-connected at all, really.

But absolutely, check into a private investigator.



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:42 PM
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Originally posted by Kamikazi
5. Joined the Masons(unknown year, but was around 1950's)
6. Life became a secret until the day he died in 2002 (with only bits and peices being know of what he did for a living for most of his life).

What do you mean his life was a secret? No one ever saw him from the 50's until his funeral? How secret are we talkin here?

Weird huh?

Not that weird, there are some people that simply refuse to pay taxes altogether.

Also, if he lived a secret life, but was also a mason, then I'd say you are in luck, because you can figure out what lodge he attended, and then talk to the people that are still living from that lodge. What town did he live in? It would be worthwhile chekcing the lodges for that area, and for whatever area he lived in in the 50s when he joined. It would also be a good idea to get images of the masonic stuff that he left, and post it here, so that people can id what side groups he was in.

But what precisely are you trying to find out???



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:42 PM
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I have wanted to get a private investagator, but just dont have the money, they seem to be kinda expensive. But I have a feeling that is the only way we will ever know anything.



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan

Originally posted by Kamikazi
5. Joined the Masons(unknown year, but was around 1950's)
6. Life became a secret until the day he died in 2002 (with only bits and peices being know of what he did for a living for most of his life).

What do you mean his life was a secret? No one ever saw him from the 50's until his funeral? How secret are we talkin here?

Weird huh?

Not that weird, there are some people that simply refuse to pay taxes altogether.

Also, if he lived a secret life, but was also a mason, then I'd say you are in luck, because you can figure out what lodge he attended, and then talk to the people that are still living from that lodge. What town did he live in? It would be worthwhile chekcing the lodges for that area, and for whatever area he lived in in the 50s when he joined. It would also be a good idea to get images of the masonic stuff that he left, and post it here, so that people can id what side groups he was in.

But what precisely are you trying to find out???


I have all of his Masonic pins, the rule/guide bood(small and black), a certificate for something and the large red hat that he wore at the events.



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 07:53 PM
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Originally posted by Kamikazi

Has anyone else on here know any other Mason that may have also been a secret like this?


Yeah my grandfather who was a grand master poopah mason.. had a secret.... ME.......

He hid my mother when she was pregnant with me and I was taken at birth... He hid me from my uncles even .. they were also masons....

I don't think being a mason had overly too much to do with the fact I was so hidden but still .. he had a big secret.... ME



posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 08:28 PM
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Originally posted by Kamikazi
I have all of his Masonic pins, the rule/guide bood(small and black), a certificate for something and the large red hat that he wore at the events.


Is there a lodge mname/number/location on the certificate you mentioned? If not, and you know the State in which he was made a Mason, you can call the Grand Lodge of that state. That's what I did to find out about my grandfather's Masonic career. Just call up the Grand Secretary (or email him) and identify yourself as his grandson(daughter?) and you should be able to find out what lodge he joined, and the dates of his initiation, passing, and raising and also if he ever held office within the fraternity. You mentioned a red hat (it's called a fez, BTW); you might also try contacting the Shrine and inquire about his mebership there. Considering the time period, it might be helpful to contact the Scottish Rite there and inquire with them too. There was a time when one had to be a 32° Scottish Rite Mason to join the Shrine. Once you know where and with what Bodies he was affiliated, you may be able to find people that knew him, that might help you put the peices together.

Try Genealogy sites too, sometimes you can find information that you would not expect on public record, especially if you have his SS#.

Hope this helps. Keep us posted.



posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 08:54 AM
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Originally posted by Mayet
He hid my mother when she was pregnant with me and I was taken at birth... He hid me from my uncles even .. they were also masons....

WTF?



Can you elaborate? That sounds incredible! Maybe start a thread? Or point me to one where you discussed this in more detail?

[edit on 30-8-2005 by Nygdan]



posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 02:53 PM
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Originally posted by The Axeman

Originally posted by Kamikazi
I have all of his Masonic pins, the rule/guide bood(small and black), a certificate for something and the large red hat that he wore at the events.


Is there a lodge mname/number/location on the certificate you mentioned? If not, and you know the State in which he was made a Mason, you can call the Grand Lodge of that state. That's what I did to find out about my grandfather's Masonic career. Just call up the Grand Secretary (or email him) and identify yourself as his grandson(daughter?) and you should be able to find out what lodge he joined, and the dates of his initiation, passing, and raising and also if he ever held office within the fraternity. You mentioned a red hat (it's called a fez, BTW); you might also try contacting the Shrine and inquire about his mebership there. Considering the time period, it might be helpful to contact the Scottish Rite there and inquire with them too. There was a time when one had to be a 32° Scottish Rite Mason to join the Shrine. Once you know where and with what Bodies he was affiliated, you may be able to find people that knew him, that might help you put the peices together.

Try Genealogy sites too, sometimes you can find information that you would not expect on public record, especially if you have his SS#.

Hope this helps. Keep us posted.


Hey, thanks for the help, this will definitely be a good place to start, I know exactly which place he went to, now I just need to contact them and see what they have to say.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 12:28 AM
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Originally posted by AngelWitch


Has anyone else on here know any other Mason that may have also been a secret like this?


If he had some kind of secret life or profession, I don't believe it could have ANYTHING to do with Freemasonry.
Being a Mason myself, I have no such secret life nor profession.

Perhaps government work?


i work for the government and i'm a mason. i dont really have a secret life to speak of....well sort of but that's because of work and not really like this either. i just cant say exactly where i'm going or why. But it's all for security reasons. i cant imagin that masonry had anything to do with this secrecy though.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 12:52 AM
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Originally posted by AngelWitch
If he had some kind of secret life or profession, I don't believe it could have ANYTHING to do with Freemasonry.
Being a Mason myself, I have no such secret life nor profession.

Perhaps government work?


we are citizens of a government, but that doesn't mean we know all of their actions or intentions for that matter. so what makes you think that everything the freemasons tell you about themselves, to this effect, are any different?

sure they could have nothing to do with it, but you can't neglect the possibility based on what they decide to let you know.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 07:45 AM
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Originally posted by deaf fences hit
we are citizens of a government, but that doesn't mean we know all of their actions or intentions for that matter. so what makes you think that everything the freemasons tell you about themselves, to this effect, are any different?

sure they could have nothing to do with it, but you can't neglect the possibility based on what they decide to let you know.


Hi deaf fences hit

I'm interested who you mean by 'the freemasons' and 'they' in your post. As Angelwitch has confirmed he is a freemason too, presumably you're referring to other freemasons that aren't him.

Just curious.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 01:19 PM
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Originally posted by umwolves123

i work for the government and i'm a mason. i dont really have a secret life to speak of....well sort of but that's because of work and not really like this either. i just cant say exactly where i'm going or why. But it's all for security reasons. i cant imagin that masonry had anything to do with this secrecy though.


Dunno
I was thinking along the lines of some kind of gov undercover work or something. This is a wierd one.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 01:34 PM
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Originally posted by AngelWitch

Originally posted by umwolves123

i work for the government and i'm a mason. i dont really have a secret life to speak of....well sort of but that's because of work and not really like this either. i just cant say exactly where i'm going or why. But it's all for security reasons. i cant imagin that masonry had anything to do with this secrecy though.


Dunno
I was thinking along the lines of some kind of gov undercover work or something. This is a wierd one.


Well, it's a possibility i suppose. it would totally depend on who he works for in the gov. but that is assuming he had a gov. position, i would venture to ask what rank he was when he got out of the service and what he did in the service. If he only got out as a PFC (private first class), then i would say he wasnt a government worker. But had he gotten out a major or Col. then it could be a possibility. the lower the rank the less amount of gov. contancs he's gonna have.

As for the freemasons having a hand in this i highly doubt it. it doesnt sound like that to me. It could have also been something highly illegal as well that he was into.



posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by Trinityman
Hi deaf fences hit

I'm interested who you mean by 'the freemasons' and 'they' in your post. As Angelwitch has confirmed he is a freemason too, presumably you're referring to other freemasons that aren't him.

Just curious.


I was wondering the same thing.



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