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The Conspiracy of the 'other' Gospel

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posted on Aug, 29 2005 @ 11:46 AM
The Master (of the Universe) has a Plan--which I usually refer to as the 'Master Plan.'

This isn't news to many, although the true nature of that Plan is globally misunderstood. Misunderstood because those who understand it are not allowed to share with others--the good religious leaders of our world just won't have it. The reason being, if the truth gets out, religion becomes obsolete.
These are the ones destined to be 'scourged in the synagogues' and 'brought before magistrates.' Nothing in this world is as unpopular as the Truth--which is the #1 'Maker of Martyrs.'

Religion has had a purpose in the Plan, but its existence is not its purpose--that is, its reason for being is not what it seems. It has served its purpose well, during the time determined between the two brief periods in this age in which the true Gospel was appointed for broadcast. The first time being the time of Messiah and immediately after, ending at the same time the Apostle Paul's earthly sojourn was ended. The second time is just beginning--and just as Christ said on the Mount of Olives-after the Gospel is proclaimed throughout the world, the end will come.

Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

The expected defense comes, which is: 'But Christianity has spread the gospel all throughout the last two millenia.'

Then the unexpected reply is this: 'No-a gospel has been preached, but not The (same) Gospel which Peter and Paul preached.'

The Apostles preached Good News--true Good News!

And, like it or not--the idea that 'some will be saved but most will go to hell' is by no means Good News!

Sure, it's good for those who preach this idea--for no one who believes they, themselves, will be condemned to hell goes out and preaches hell.

Is that my motive, then? Many likely assume that I'm denying hell because I am headed there, myself. The truth, for what it's worth, is that no, my motive isn't self-preservation but rather a sense of love and duty (toward God, my neighbor, and truth). I've never been afraid of hell (except as a little child) but I have always had a deep-seated desire to not disappoint God. If I disappoint God, then 'hell' is the least of my heartaches.

But what about the rest of the world? No wonder there are so many atheists and others looking for some other alternative which gives them peace in their heart, and sets them free from misery and the fear and dread of death!

This can be found in the Bible--straightforward and simply stated:

  • And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. ~John 8:32 KJV
  • Through the tender mercy of our God; whereby the dayspring from on high hath visited us, To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace. ~Luke 1:78-79
  • Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. ~John 14:27 KJV
  • Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things. ~Phillipians 4:8 KJV
  • For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour; Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.~
    1 Timothy 2:3-6 KJV

Now, that sounds like Good News! Good news should make those who hear it jubilant!
Leaping for joy, with a heart relieved of a heavy burden which weighed it down beyond consolation--whether for themselves or because of those they dearly love.

What is currently proclaimed as 'gospel' is, at best, closer to 'I've got some good news and some bad news. Good for me but bad for you!' (or 'You're going to hell and I'm not!')

Is that in line with 'loving your neighbor as yourself?' If we desire good news for ourselves, then doesn't it follow that we must desire the same for our neighbor, if we love him as we love ourselves? This is the same way Christ loves us!

The well-meaning, yet always-doubting, frequently judging, christian population in this world sees the people around them and decides that surely the whole world is rife with unrepentant sinners for which there is no hope--not even the Blessed Hope found in the Savior of the World! Therefore, most reason, since these unrepentant sinners won't listen and obey their form of the gospel (which offers not peace and freedom, but guilt, fear, and increased bondage)--then obviously they cannot and will not be saved!

But what is the truth, according to the Bible?

God said:

Wherefore, when I came, was there no man? when I called, was there none to answer? Is my hand shortened at all, that it cannot redeem? or have I no power to deliver? behold, at my rebuke I dry up the sea, I make the rivers a wilderness: their fish stinketh, because there is no water, and dieth for thirst.
Isaiah 50:2 KJV

Christ said:

But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
Matthew 9:13 KJV

I see several contradictions between the Gospel found in the bible and the one being spread by the majority of christendom:

  1. The abilities and wisdom of God are presented as less than Superior and Omnipotent over all things He Himself created--because there is the assumption that man can defy God's will indefinitely, by refusing salvation!

  2. It represents God as an unjust and petty God who created souls that would be largely destroyed--simply because they didn't believe something that, truthfully, doesn't make sense (which is that He would create beings in order to love a few and destroy or torment the rest).

  3. It takes away from the work done by Christ (which was complete of His own actions and not at all dependent upon any man's--not even to believe) toward reconciliation. If Christ died only for those who believed--then essentially He died for no one, because at the time of His death, not one single person understood, much less believed what was taking place! We know He didn't die 'for no one!' That's an awful thing to think!--But not any more awful than to truly believe He gave His life to perform a partial work of salvation that was, in some part, dependent upon those being saved. If one is needing to be saved, that means they are totally, 100%, incapable of doing anything toward helping themselves. We are incapable of contributing anything toward our own rescue. Anything at all. Period. Believing doesn't bring it to fruition--believing only makes it an acknowledged fact in the mind. Believing is necessary for transformation, not for rescue.

  4. To say God doesn't intend to save every one is to deny countless declarations, by God, through His prophets and Apostles, recorded in the Bible, that plainly state, without qualification, that He intends to do just that--save the world. Not part of the world--not just the 'christians,' or the church-going-tithe-giving-pillars-of-evangelical-society, not even just those who right now consider themselves 'saved repentant believers.' Like I said, at the very beginning the grand total of believers was 0. Except for Christ--He believed and trusted. It is His faith in His Father that saves, not man's.

  5. It portrays God as possessing 2 particular qualities in a lesser degree than can found in the average human being. The first one is common sense: the ability to reason and think logically. Do we really worship a God who 'makes less sense' than His creations? Making sense is not the same as being beyond comprehension. And second, just about every human father (or at least those who are sane and healthy) in the world would give his life in order to save one or more of his children's lives--even if angry or disappointed with them. Only the deranged would actually destroy their 'creations'--and even that atrocity isn't usually enacted with favoritism. (IOW, a father who kills his child often kills all his children) Is God not The Perfect Father, sane and healthy beyond description--with a heart that loves flawlessly?

'The spreading of the gospel' is a clever conspiracy--contrived and administrated by the Adversary (Revelation 13:8, Daniel 8:12)--allowed by God for the purpose of the threshing floor (2 Thessalonians 2:11, Acts 7:42)--carried out by those who believe they work for God while they are used by His enemies.

The purpose is not what is assumed based on outward appearance and declaration--'winning souls to Christ'--but is actually serving a subversive agenda of maintaining mankind's alienation from God (from the Adversary's direction) and a higher purpose of calling out those who diligently seek the kingdom of God and His righteousness (from God's direction).

That's it. If you've got a tomato or a rotten egg, now is the time to throw it.

posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 05:08 PM
While I agree that the concept of hell is foreign to the OT, it is a part of the NT.

Hades is specifically mentioned in the NT, as is the pit of Tarsus, and the lake of fire.

If these do not refer to 'hell', then what are they?

posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 05:18 PM
the lake of fire, hades, hell, etc could be simply a metaphor for evil or something.

the Bible is full of symbols, signs, metaphors, parables, and figurative meanings, especially the New Testament.

posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 05:33 PM
If memory serves, Hades and Shiole refer to "The Pit" or "The Grave".

posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 06:13 PM
Remember as christians its not our deeds but our faith that gets us into heaven. Only by denying god can you not have faith in him and thus go to hell.

posted on Aug, 30 2005 @ 06:20 PM

Originally posted by intrepid
If memory serves, Hades and Shiole refer to "The Pit" or "The Grave".

Sheol refers to the grave, and is mistranslated in many Bibles as 'hell', however, Hades does not. Hades was the underworld of Greek mythology, and Tarsus is the deapest pit of Hades.

posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 12:16 AM

I'm assuming you mean Tartarus? (Tarsus is where Paul was from).

Tartarus is the abyss, as you said. It is mentioned only once, though--in 2Peter 2:4:

For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

This place is not for man--and therefore is not the hell christianity imagines it to be--for 'non-christians.'

Hades means properly 'unseen'--and is never used in the NT in conjunction with any kind of fire--it is a place which is represented (in context) as a place 'below'--the implications of its use are quite the same as those of sheol in the OT. It is a state of death, darkness, and separation from God. It is falsely seen as a state of existence hanging over the head of the condemned--but the mention of it being also a state of corruption reveals it to be the present state of existence for humanity as a whole. Our bodies--the physical matter of which we are composed--are just as much part of the life --> death --> decay --> life cycle which is the literal food chain of our planet, as any other plant or animal.

The simple fact that every individual thing dies and 'returns to the dust from which it came' is the very thing that maintains life on this planet. It is the inescapable reality of the law of conservation of matter.

The skin that covers us is the corruption--the sin--and it was first given to Adam and Eve when they left the garden. That is how they 'surely died' and that is also the essential separation that was created between the human mind and the Divine mind. Acquiring skin = losing conscious connection with the Creator. That is the represented as being 'unseen.' And it's not that God can't see us--it's that we cannot perceive that He does--because we cannot perceive Him in that 'hidden' state of hades.

Christ is said to be 'the first begotten of the dead.' That is because He was the first born 'again' -- not of a woman but of the Spirit of God.

The lake of fire is actually the Spirit of God--and since fire burns and destroys flesh, and if flesh is understood to be what makes us 'dead'--then it becomes apparent that that lake of fire is not an instrument to destroy man, but rather to defeat the last enemy--which is death.

I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
Revelation 1:18 KJV

The 'keys of hell and of death' means all the captives will be freed--from the prison of the flesh which is death/sin/skin/corruption--and this verse is a direct reference to Matthew 16:19 (which is probably the most slandered verse in the bible, IMO

Here is a rather lengthy post I made concerning the fire of the Spirit of God according to its various purposes and manifestations: It is post #1606491.

posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 12:49 AM

Originally posted by Rikimaru
Remember as christians its not our deeds but our faith that gets us into heaven. Only by denying god can you not have faith in him and thus go to hell.

What is heaven? The sky.
What is 'hell'? Either the pit/grave, the purifying fire of the Spirit, or a prison where the inmates are rebellious angels.

The angels were the only ones who can truly qualify as 'denying' God. We cannot deny something that was never accepted in the first place. We cannot look away from something we've never seen.

The angels knew how fair and good God was--and yet they chose the unknown uncertainty and so they denied that which had already been proven to them--we have first been given the experience of desolation so that we will never feel tempted to choose misery over happiness like those angels did.

Until God proves Himself to each of us, on an individual level--we are not in a position to deny Him.

The so-called proof which lies not within us, but outside of us--religion and all things of that nature--that is not proof of God. Denying religion and choosing to look for God within rather than through other men--that is obedience and can be truly counted as having faith in things not seen.

But even type of faith can not and will not get us past the gatekeepers--beyond the realm of death (which you call 'heaven'). No amount of believing can forge a path to freedom--bonds must be broken, and locked doors must be opened. It's a given that these things require the help of a rescuer--if a prisoner had the key to the lock on his cell--then obviously he would not truly be a prisoner. The prisoner must depend upon someone else--and in this case, also upon a promise made by the rescuer to the prisoner.

It is believing in that promise that sets us free in our present bonds--our mind is freed while we wait for complete liberation. Those of us on this side of the fulfillment of that promise must believe in the same thing that those on the other side believed--essentially that God's word is good, that He never lies, and never breaks a vow.

The 'faith' that is saving faith is the loyalty and trustiworthiness of God's appointed Servant, whose singular effort and sacrifice opened the door for all and made it possible for all of us to truly hope--to truly believe there is more to it than living in uncertainty and fear--until we die.

If we remain in our uncertainty and fear, we remain a prisoner because we don't believe freedom exists--and that is sin, because 'whatever is not of faith is sin'. The door is wide open, but our fear won't let us go through it.

We cannot shut that door any more than we were able to open it. But we must go through that door--no one can do it for us.

posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 01:01 AM
i kinda wonder now, if there are other life forms in the universe, created by god, are they facing the same fate percieved in revelations, or is it only bound to us humans? keep in mind that in bible times, everything in the sky and above was considered the heavens.

[edit on 31-8-2005 by deaf fences hit]

posted on Aug, 31 2005 @ 10:18 AM
If there is other life in this solar system--it's not in the same form we are (carbon based, water composed, oxygen dependent) flesh. So, I daresay their 'fate' is not the same as ours, since ours is directly related to flesh.

But 'fate' doesn't make it sound right--how about something like 'this stage in our progress.'

When the final days of this age are over, we'll all still be here (or somewhere) just in different forms. And at last, we'll finally be freed from hell (at least the closest version we'll know)

posted on Sep, 4 2005 @ 11:47 PM

Originally posted by queenannie38
If there is other life in this solar system--it's not in the same form we are (carbon based, water composed, oxygen dependent) flesh. So, I daresay their 'fate' is not the same as ours, since ours is directly related to flesh.

well, what i meant was the universe, not necessarily just our solar system. it's obvious that there are other planets out there, suspected to be somehwhat like earth. so i wouldn't say that we are the only flesh beings, maybe in the solar system, presently anyways, but not the universe.

posted on Sep, 5 2005 @ 01:43 AM
Hell is largely a brainwashing trick to steal money, nothing more and nothing less. Indulgences were granted for money so the "faithful," could avoid the second string "hell,' called purgatory.

Face it relgion became a business, and imagery of pain and suffering are its initial preaching making even so encompassing a belief system as original sin as a vast condemnation only redeemable by Jesus. Instead of focusing on the resurrection, which is the "good news," modern religion focuses on revenue generators such as introducting a nancebo effect in order to follow it by the placebos which are what he churches have made out of Christ's authentic teachings.

Rat poison is only one per cent of the "good food," people leave out to annihilate rats.

Your religion is either 100 per cent good and entirely of the Lord, or it is hopelessly divided by a con job that keeps happening. In the middle of the story we are told about "straining the gnat and swallowing the camel." It is a great lesson that people promptly ignore, so they can go back to their approach avoidance conflict called "heaven or hell." People waste to much time in their uncertainties and have no time for actual faith.

Oh and so get to the heart of the matter, there is heaven and hell on this earth. Whatever happens upstairs is up to the real God almighty, not the confidence job by human beings.

[edit on 5-9-2005 by SkipShipman]

posted on Sep, 5 2005 @ 09:29 AM

Originally posted by Rikimaru
Remember as christians its not our deeds but our faith that gets us into heaven. Only by denying god can you not have faith in him and thus go to hell.

Its the other way round, "you can not enter heaven by faith alone, but by what you do with your faith.." I cant remember who said that, but it is repeated in the New Testiment.

Lovely thread, Im glad others understand the love God gives and that the hope of entering heaven will give us peace of mind.
Because it does:-)

posted on Sep, 12 2005 @ 10:30 PM
It is entirely possible that the texts which the bible was made up of (As there was FAR more involved in religious texts concerning the christ that were NOT included in the official "Holy Book") could have at some time been modified or corrupted by servants of darkness.

I don't particularly believe in "The Devil" or "Satan" or "Lucifer". However, I do believe that there are forces which wish to lead mankind astray and thus hamper the effort of the Light.

At one point in the scriptures, it is mentioned that the devil can quote scripture as well as any man. I am sure there are entities which can mimic "Angels" and misinform people about the true spiritual path.

Of course, I also think that whatever original text the bible was based off of is now long forgotten or lost.


posted on Sep, 12 2005 @ 11:27 PM
I'm not easy to impress with religious talk, particularly that of a Christian flavor. And Ive been getting somewhat disgusted with the quality of the posts on ATS, however posts like yours make it worth sifting through the all garbage posts.

You have voted queenannie38 for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.


posted on Sep, 12 2005 @ 11:43 PM
so you can blaspheme the Holy Spirit and be forgiven?

[edit on 9/12/2005 by Forgiven]

posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 06:43 PM

Originally posted by Forgiven
so you can blaspheme the Holy Spirit and be forgiven?

No--to say that is to distrust what Christ, Himself, said. And I'm not willing to do that.

But if the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth, of which we are also assured from Christ, as well--then to blaspheme truth is to alienate one's self from the idea of forgiveness even being possible. Either that--or the false idea that forgiveness is not essential.

If one rejects truth, also rejected is the throne of God. And that is the place where nothing is in the way--i.e. 'sin' aka skin--the place where 'forgiveness' is reality.

To blaspheme truth is to create an obstacle for one's self--that is how there is no forgiveness in that.

posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 06:45 PM

Originally posted by df1

You have voted queenannie38 for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have two more votes this month.


Thank you.

posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 08:36 PM
Somebody needs to read their bible more closely...

posted on Sep, 14 2005 @ 08:41 PM

Originally posted by Son of the lost maji
Somebody needs to read their bible more closely...

Interestingly, not all who call themselves Christian believe the Bible is inerrant, or even approximately inerrant. Some see it as -- gasp -- a collection of ancient books for spiritual guidance, but not for legalism.

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