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Cindy Sheehan to Abandon Anti-War Protest

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posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 06:00 PM
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Originally posted by deltaboy

Originally posted by Darth Tinku
Here you go, either way, I know you will try to debunk this obviously, go ahead. I and the rest of the world know the truth no matter what you say.

100,000 Civilian Deaths Estimated in Iraq
www.washingtonpost.com...

And that's almost a year ago. Believe what you want....




The analysis, an extrapolation based on a relatively small number of documented deaths, indicated that many of the excess deaths have occurred due to aerial attacks by coalition forces, with women and children being frequent victims, wrote the international team of public health researchers making the calculations.

Previous independent estimates of civilian deaths in Iraq were far lower, never exceeding 16,000. Other experts immediately challenged the new estimate, saying the small number of documented deaths upon which it was based make the conclusions suspect.



Oh yeah one more thing Deltaboy...I loved how YOU CUT OUT the part of the artcle btw the first and last paragraphs.....Nice job getting caught on that


"Pentagon officials say they do not keep tallies of civilian casualties"

The Washington Post

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]




posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 06:06 PM
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i cut out those paragraphs specifically to show that 100,000 as other experts that Washingtonpost has mentioned is based on inflated numbers. u can put the Pentagon does not count civilian casualties somewhere else.



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 06:10 PM
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Seekerof ...
Yeah being here and having many points I'm sure gives you supreme power of knowledge. I haven't been here too long, but I've talked with deltaboy before and have seen him in discussion trying to lie his way through everything. Everyone is has there own views, but they shouldn't twist and lie to make their point. And yeah thats one report and there many more that have put it over 100,000..so your claim can also be debunked. I heard the study where they say alot of new College students in US aren't prepared for it, I guess I met a few here....

And deltaboy..it's called a balanced article, go look at other articles, some are far left, far right and balanced.

And YOU DID CUT IT OUT trying to manipulate the article towards your favor.


[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 06:40 PM
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Originally posted by Darth Tinku

Seekerof ...
Yeah being here and having many points I'm sure gives you supreme power of knowledge.

Points are immaterial, Darth Tinku.
What is of importance is that you attack the topic instead of the credibility of a member. As such, you have attacked the validity and credibility of how many peiople in this topic already?
Stick with the topic, cause once you drop to attacking a member, you argument is null-in-void and lost.



I haven't been here too long, but I've talked with deltaboy before and have seen him in discussion trying to lie his way through everything.
Everyone is has there own views, but they shouldn't twist and lie to make their point. And yeah its one report and there many more that have put it over 100,000..so your claim can also be debunked. I heard the study where they say alot of new College students in US aren't prepared for it, I guess I met a few here....

Really?
A "lie" is what?
You posted that 100,000 figure and yet it has been debunked.
The Lancet report insinuated 100,000+ has likewsie been debunked.
Who is telling the "lie" here exactly, being that those numbers are in error?
Would it be safe to assume, just as you are assuming that others are lying, that you yourself are also telling a "lie" by posting numbers that have been debunked and refuted as in error?
Other than that, your meeting college students and their questionable education level is immaterial to this topic.


As for the "manipulation"of what an article indicates, seems that all sides do such. Perhaps when the mainstream media learns to be objective versus pushing their own agendas, then people will learn to take articles as they are without "manipulating" them, eh?






seekerof

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 07:32 PM
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I love how you say to Canadians, eh? Kind of reminds me of the perception of American's by Canadians that most Americans are hillbillies who are not very well educated and have to import there "brain power". I said the article was balanced. Some have far left views, far right views, and balanced. Your response is allot of babble. I also said there are many other reports saying the same amount of higher, do a search and look it up. Also, I've caught deltaboy lying and cutting information to make a balanced article seem otherwise, which is against the rules of ATS. Well, you obviously know nothing about Asia so let me give to a little info. In the middle east, and Asia, including Russia, which is apart of Asia and some of Europe, population is estimated figure because people also live in villages and not every person can be accounted for. They don't register every person in the country and alot of them live simple, family orientated lives, which seems to be a huge problem in North America. SO if the US shoots Missiles and kill innocent civilians, not all can be accounted for. And since The US has said because to they do not count the amount of civilians killed, so your claim is debunked because you cannot sufficiently prove that it is less. You've been "schooled", eh.

Lay off Fox and Bill O'Reilly


[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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as posted by Darth Tinku
Kind of reminds me of the perception of American's by Canadians that most Americans are hillbilly who are not very well educated and have to import there "brain power".


Dude, does Canada own a patent on "eh"?
If they don't, it isn't simply a Canadian [ithang or use that can be easily and continually claimed by some Canadians, you specifically, to justify their comtempt for some Americans.
Furthermore, your rhetoric is simply rhetoric restricted to adding nothing to this discussion but further innuendos and loathing. Save your "hillbilly" comments and lack of education equating to brain power of those Americans you so loath for someone who will give two cents for them, because quite frankly, you are immaterial and your words are parlor tricks meant to incite.

Heres something that this Amercian has for a Canadian, that being you: Grow up, move on, and participate in the topic rather than continue to spew your Canadian loathing rhetoric, k?

Have a g'day? Opps, I guess Canada owns the patent on that cliche' too, eh? :shk:







seekerof

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 07:48 PM
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If its not too much trouble I would like to ask yall to get back on topic and quit snipping each other.



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 07:54 PM
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I think you should enroll into some speical education courses on the usage of words in language. Secondly, you did say the "eh" as a derogatory comment against Canadians and trying to back track. Like deltaboy, you have no resonable reponses I can assume that you have admitted defeat, like Amercia will soon, when your country will face the same result as Japan did because of the murders you have committed around the world....Go learn about Biased and censorship in the America and embrace the views of 95% of the countries in the world that the don't like you because of your propaganda and mass murders.

Sorry Amuk..I added that last part before I saw the message..I'm done with my off topic point of view

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 09:51 PM
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OK, so now that we all know for a fact that 100,000 Iraqi's have NOT died, and that it is a COMPLETE AND UTTER LIE...

Sheehan had better take a step back. Her son signed up for the military. He got paid for it, got many benefits from it as well. Hell, he probably was going to get/already got money for school.

Her son, like many others before him, died in the service of this great nation. When you sign up, you don't get aproval over where your COMMANDER IN CHIEF sends you. You are TOLD where to go. If you don't like being TOLD where to go, don't sign up.

I am sorry her son died. I am sorry EVERYONES son/daughter died. But that is the reality of the military. If you don't like the smell of fish, don't become a fisherman. If you don't like kickbacks and bribes, don't get into politics. And if you don't like getting shot at for a living, don't join the army.

[edit on 18-8-2005 by American Mad Man]



posted on Aug, 18 2005 @ 11:26 PM
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American Mad Man....
Well reports documented show otherwise. And since you show NO PROOF that would contradict reports that say otherwise, YOUR LYING. You have shown no proof. Just Like Bush finding WMD's right? Never found them, wasn't that the reason for you invading in the first place? America's armies has become a joke..if you guys want to pick on countries, try Russia, India or China. You would cease to exist. Cindy's son and other Troops sons would not have died if you had not invaded for no good reason, except for Oil. Go raid Saudi Arabia, most of the hijackers were from there that smashed your World Trade Centre into crums.


[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]

[edit on 18-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 12:48 AM
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Yeah, we invaded for oil. That'ws why I'm paying $3 per gallon as opposed to the $1.75 I was paying before the war. That's also why a French company got the first oil contract in Iraq.

Seriously, you need to stop taking this so personally. It's just politics. No matter what we conclude here today, it's not going to change Bush's mind. Step back for a second and ask yourself, why am I having this conversation. Do you think you're going to change our minds on the 100,000 issue when the article you quoted said it was an overestimation? For that matter, do you think you're going to change our minds?

I do this because I think it's fun. I like pitting my ideas up against other people's ideas. It forces me to reinforce my stance or change it because I won't resort to petty insults. I stay on topic, enjoy the debate, and usually have to do a lot of research into the issue if someone else who is educated on the subject as well, but has a different opinion, participates. It's a learning experience, and a blast.

If you're not enjoying posting on here, but are just angry and get angrier when you don't convince people who are just as set in their ways as your are, walk away. Don't give yourself a heart attack at 25, it's not worth it.



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 02:26 AM
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It's funny, every time when someone says something that sounds "anti-american" to you guys, you go Bananas. Then you ask for proof. Proof is given, then you say it's false and insult people. Insults are said back. More proof is given, yet you never give any proof, never back up any of your statements, and are the ones who wind everyone one up, including yourselves. I don't think anyone is here to change the world from any forum, cause you can't. But if someone says a statement during a discussion and backs it up, you respond by calling them liars without any proof. So before you speak, think first. Do some unbiased research and don't get so crazy over your patriotism.

I don't understand what you mean by angrier, you sounded pretty angry and attacked me for telling the truth. Every time someone proves Americans did something wrong, you can never admit it and resort to calling people liars, when you are in fact liars. Just because you aren't smart enough to respond to proof given to you, don't go Bananas in the first place. Don't say everything is False if you can't prove anything yourself and ignore other people questions when they ask you. That shows your weakness. And if you didn't realize that the Iraq war was not for WMD (never found any, even though you claimed to know where they were, which was why you invaded) and really for Oil, and money ($9 billion of Iraqi money has been misplaced (stolen) by the US, and killed in many reports of up to 100,000 innocent Iraqi's, then you are part of the problem.

Go to University and learn Economics/Finance before you start to question why your Oil is so overpriced. We actually pay more than you go for gas in terms of International dollars, even though we posses one the biggest reserves in the world.

At least Cindy Sheehan knows the truth about the Corruption in the US gov't and is trying to do something about it.

[edit on 19-8-2005 by Darth Tinku]



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 02:31 AM
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Darth Tinku, you got me. You were able to see through the lies of that article you linked to and see the truth in it. Please, share with the rest of us how you came to be so enlightened while we reamin ignorant who disagree with you.


And people wonder why there's this complaint about the "cultural elite". You haven't addressed the issue whatsoever, you've attacked individuals here who disagreed with you, presenting reasons for doing so, with calls that they are stupid or ignorant. Take an economic class to understand? Thank you for contributing to the thread so much, I'll get right back to you next semester. If you know so much about so much, why don't you share instead of attack and insult?



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 02:39 AM
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wow, only 1 min after posting and refreshing the page, you had something already pretyped and posted... again, nothing to say and showing your weakness. good nite...I have spent a some time teaching you lessons, kid. I got to get up to go to work, and then a kegger with my gf and her annoying friends (and don't call that Blasphemy Jesus Freak) or jungle jake, whatever you are... An So you can keep writing whatever you want and teach us everything.



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 02:45 AM
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hehe yeah, I don't have your content. Would you be suprised to find out I drink?
Even if you were going to get sloshed, it sounds like you're not a Christian -- how can I hold you to rules of a religion you do not believe in or practice?

hehe as for the 1 minute response, that was a combination of good timing on my hitting "myATS" and being able to type at 80 words per minute


EDIT: With grammatical errors


[edit on 8-19-2005 by junglejake]



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 11:35 AM
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Originally posted by junglejake
Yeah, we invaded for oil. That'ws why I'm paying $3 per gallon as opposed to the $1.75 I was paying before the war.


This is a sentiment I've seen quite often and I'd just like to say that Bush didn't invade Iraq so that you or any other US citizen could save money on gas. He didn't do it for US, he did it for the Haliburton crowd. Have you asked yourself Where's the $9 Billion Bucks?

www.atsnn.com...

They did it for oil all right, but not for our benefit.



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 02:25 PM
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If anyone is interested in Cindy's mother and Cindy's plan to return to the camp she 'abandoned':



Coordinators at Camp Casey just received a phone call from Cindy Sheehan. Cindy says her mother is going to see some specialists this afternoon. Cindy said that her mother recognized her and squeezed her hand, but could not speak. Cindy is penciled in to return to Crawford on Sunday, if she can.


Iconoclast

Joan Baez is expected to be there on Sunday.



posted on Aug, 19 2005 @ 05:15 PM
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Ouch!! It's easy to see why this thread got moved to "Slug-fest"

What's truly sad, is that I don't recall seeing anyone mention any prayer or even well-wishing for the poor woman who had the stroke. ( Now if I missed one to that effect, there's no need to flame.....it just got lost in the morass....)

This stroke sounds much like my Mom's ......no ability to speak, but recognition of family members....there's probably some paralysis, time will tell how much and how permanent. There may be other 'mini strokes' to follow as well. This may be a bigger burden for the family that any of them realizes just yet.....it may take longer for her to return.

I hope those of you on here that consider yourselves 'Christians' will not stoop to gloating in any way about this......remember the devil temps everyone....even you.



posted on Aug, 20 2005 @ 04:26 PM
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What a disterbing thread indeed, as it obviously seems to be misrepresenting the facts of the article. Also, I think the author should understand the meaning behind "abandon" to know it's not the word to use in this case.

If no one else does, this Conservative hopes her mother gets well soon.

I disagree with Cindy in many of the things she says, although I too am against the war.

I think it was a strategic mistake when Iran (if something REALLY had to be done) was sitting right there with a population ready to throw off the mullahs and get back on track.

Saddam was sitting on a country that was crumbling all around him.



posted on Aug, 22 2005 @ 11:56 AM
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Well nice to see one of you republican have a heart. Sure you don't want to join us Libertarians?

So it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't.

*baiting taken out*

[edit on 22-8-2005 by Amuk]



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