K..Listen people. you have to understand FreeMasonry is a perfect Design. It works like an Onion. an Onion has layer after layer. The Deeper you go. The More you know. Thats why masons argue with masons and conspiracy theorist. first of all if your only a Master Mason. You know not what you talk. The Tree branch of freemasonry goes far beyond that my friend. Its pretty much a Brainwashing System that is impossible to Expose because it is so well organized. So basically this will forever remain a mystery. Get it? Hope you understand

All I can say is...This is probably one of the Most Evil Evil EVIL things of the exsistence of Mankind. If you only Knew......

Originally posted by sin8339
All I can say is...This is probably one of the Most Evil Evil EVIL things of the exsistence of Mankind. If you only Knew......

Please don't feed the trolls.

Yes Sir, I won't say anything else. Sorry

Common sense dictates that an actual MASON should and would know more about Masonry than some random non-Mason with outrageous claims about it.

Actually common sense dictates that someone who has sworn to keep secrets about their fraternity is less likely to tell the truth about said fraternity, than someone who hasent taken any oaths and is not in said fraternity. All masons have taken oaths to keep secrets or am I wrong here too?

Originally posted by testingatheory
All masons have taken oaths to keep secrets or am I wrong here too?

Why can't someone keep their secrets AND tell the truth about the organization? The secrets are the passwords and hand shakes, not the intent and purpose of the organization. And if they were all up to no good, they'd swear to not even acknowledge that the organization exists, and we'd've never heard've it.

Originally posted by testingatheory

Common sense dictates that an actual MASON should and would know more about Masonry than some random non-Mason with outrageous claims about it.

Actually common sense dictates that someone who has sworn to keep secrets about their fraternity is less likely to tell the truth about said fraternity, than someone who hasent taken any oaths and is not in said fraternity. All masons have taken oaths to keep secrets or am I wrong here too?

No, you're not wrong, but you only have half the story. Freemasons promise not to reveal the modes of recognition only. They will use their discretion in discussing masonic matters, primarily to avoid spoiling things for future freemasons but also because freemasonry is a private society and some of it ought to remain private.

Many freemasons who post here on ATS are entirely transparent about the organization. Whether you chose to believe what we say is entirely up to you, but the fact remains that (enthusiastic) members of any organization tend to know much more about it than non-members do.

The secrets are the passwords and hand shakes, not the intent and purpose of the organization.

Freemasons promise not to reveal the modes of recognition only. They will use their discretion in discussing masonic matters, primarily to avoid spoiling things for future freemasons but also because freemasonry is a private society and some of it ought to remain private.

This is all fine and good except there is no real way of knowing if it is true. All that is offerd here is someones word, someone who, from a completely objective point of veiw, has swarn themselves to secrecy. The idea that someone would tell what the secret is kind of makes swaring to secrecy about it in the first place self-defeating, dosent it?

And if they were all up to no good, they'd swear to not even acknowledge that the organization exists, and we'd've never heard've it.

Im sorry , but I have to dissagree with this. The idea that the only way this conpiracy theory is true is if the theory itself does not exist just dosent make sense to me. Not acknowleging that their organization exists is not nessasarily the only way someone could hide that they are up to no good. As far as not even acknowledging say... the masonic connection to satanic ritual...well, there is plenty of that going on here everyday, however in this case we have heard of "it" and according to my reasoning, this make all the difference in the world due to the secretive nature of the organization in the first place.

I know that I have the choice to either believe or not, what anybody says, and it is more than obvious what choice I have made. I would however like to mention that this is the first time since I joined ATS, that I felt that I have had a chance to "debate" my point on freemasonry, rather than just be told that I am wrong, uninformed, ignorant, and otherwise misled, and for that you have my humble respect.

[edit on 27-11-2006 by testingatheory]

[edit on 27-11-2006 by testingatheory]

[edit on 27-11-2006 by testingatheory]

Originally posted by testingatheory
This is all fine and good except there is no real way of knowing if it is true. All that is offerd here is someones word, someone who, from a completely objective point of veiw, has swarn themselves to secrecy. The idea that someone would tell what the secret is kind of makes swaring to secrecy about it in the first place self-defeating, dosent it?

There is no real way of knowing if anything is true, now is there? You have to do research, sift the evidence, and draw your own conclusion. If your conclusion is that freemasonry is hiding a great secret or is the lower levels to the "Illuminati" then fine - you are welcome to your opinion. However as time goes by certain things the freemasons do won't seem to make sense, and you might over time notice that there has been no evidence, circumstantial or otherwise, to confirm your theory. The only evidence to suggest freemasonry as an organization is up to no good can be summed up as "wot 'e said".

Many employees "take an oath of secrecy" not to reveal what they are up to in case they leak information to competitors. No-one is suggesting these people are trying to take over the world.

Perhaps you could tell me why you think I am being untruthful?

I would however like to mention that this is the first time since I joined ATS, that I felt that I have had a chance to "debate" my point on freemasonry, rather than just be told that I am wrong, uninformed, ignorant, and otherwise misled, and for that you have my humble respect.

Right back 'atcha. Its always refreshing to have a discussion here, rather than be just abused, and I thank you for that.

Originally posted by Trinityman


Come to think of it, Intrepid is still around and Axeman (occasionally) and even young Sebatwork might haunt the odd thread or two (under a nom de plume). But that's really it.

I thought that Sebatwerk was Theron Dunn? If so, he passed away last year.

OMG....when will the mud slinging stop? This was the exact reason I stopped coming to this form in ATS! I mean will you guys find anything out by bickering back and fourth? I'm not trying to insult anyone and personally much rather stay out of it. I was attempting to read through this thread and I honestly did not learn one damn thing.

Threads such as these are useless and a waste of my time, good day!