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Why do Brits still use the tactic of charging and bayoneting?

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posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:44 AM
as the weather got bad in the trenchs, and in most areas, mud mad most weapon's useless,
they would have to fight alot had to hand, if you have seen a trench knife,wich look's
like brass knucles and a dagger put into one thing, they all so had small "fire" axes, wich
where still in use in ww2, you ncan see these as surplus once in awile.
mostly though they only had there bayonets, remeber even though they trained with them,
on the end of a rifle, they still use them as a sort sword, in hand to hand,[there bayonets were made
longer then the ones now], the pistols and revolers were for officers.[ though in the mud i wood want a bayont ], also i read the brits use to sharpen there hemits, to use in hand to hand.
i fig that you never know when you gpoing to need a hand to hand weapon, if your weapons
get mud sand or ect.. in them and you can't clean them, ie: read sand storm.
most common rifles need to be keep really clean to prevent malfuntion.
durning the first gulf war, they made a big stink in the media if the troop where taking
big knives or daggers with them so , most had to do with only there bayonet. thats where we get most of the new lock blade knives, when you where them you only see, the clip.
if there doing house to house, and they have enuff stuff they will not need, the bayonet,..but
run out of ammo, that make you rifle a club, with a bayonet it becomes a spear.

posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 01:49 AM
I've read a story of british troops using a bayonet charge in Iraq against insurgents and it was surprisingly effective. I'll try and find the officers recount but the Iraqi's didnt expect it at all and they stabbed them to death with the bayonet.

You might think its 'outdated' but sometime the oldest, outmoded and outdated military hardware and traditions can surprise you.


posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 05:16 AM

Originally posted by HowlrunnerIV
On the SLR and the M16 maybe. But not with the Enfield individual weapon. Still, they made bayonets for Sterlings and Webleys, too!

Right then..

The L85 can be fitted with the proprietary knife-type multipurpose bayonet. The bat thing about this bayonet is that it uses its hollow handle as a mount - the handle is put around the muzzle of the rifle, so when rifle is fired the bayonet handle becomes really hot.

[edit on 26/02/2005 by devilwasp]

posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 05:22 AM
Okay, I'll agree with you.

"I agree, the L85 (SA80, whatever) can mount a bayonet and still fire."

Now, I'll use semantics to defend my position.

"It can't do it practically. Whereas the SLR (FN FAL, whatever) and M16 (and variants) can."

Plus the SLR just looks so much scarier with a bayonet on it, I mean look at the extra reach you get!

But I guess if you're fixing a bayonet and intending to fire your rifle so much that the handle will overheat, then you're in that position where you need to call in CH's armed UAV drones for CAS!

posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 08:07 AM
When I went to the Infantry Training Depot at Lichfield in 1983 to become a
weapons instructor, my cadre instructor was a chap called Roberts 'Bob' Baldwin of 1 Glosters.

During week 2 of the course, we students were introduced to a very large circle of sandbags placed on the ground. There was just enough space for one student to stand between each sandbag. We were issued with an SLR (FN) rifle bayonet and told to stand by 'our' sandbag. It was a devastatingly hot day, with the sun high overhead, baking us dry. We were in full battle order complete with pudding basin tin helmet.

For the next 2 hours, we ran round that bloody circle stabbing the sangbags with the bayonets, then we had a very quick teabreak before we had to crawl round the circle, again stabbing the sandbags. All the while, Bob Baldwin was shouting himself hoarse and demanding that we emit our best 'battle scream' at the top of our voices, each time we struck at the sandbags. With the words, "If you aint got a headache, you aint doing it right!", ringing in our ears, we broke for a very welcome lunch.

For those of us who preferred a liquid lunch, we soon learnt the error of our ways, because all afternoon was spent learning how to move from the 'High Port' posn to the 'On Guard!' posn - where the rifle butt is firmly placed in the pit of your stomach and the bayonet thrust forward.

From there, we progressed to the Dummy Frames and spent a couple of hours running up to and stabbing them, screaming our 'battle scream' at the top of our voices. (I can tell you dear readers, that if there was an enemy out there on the ranges, he would have been terrified - cause they terrified the crap out of me - and I was one of them!)

Then it was on to the complex training of thrust, block and counter-thrust, how to butt stroke and then how to attack bunkers and trenches. (There's nothing like a bunch of screaming blood-crazed lunatics running and shaking their bayonets at you to make you realise that yer days are numbered! Just ask the Argies during the Falklands!)

The incident in Iraq that you refer to, was when a Cpl in charge of a Warrior ICV discovered that his veh had broken down, after the convoy he was in, was attacked by insurgents.

The lead and 2nd veh crews were pinned down by RPG's and heavy mg firing. The Cpl discovered that he and his men were in a flanking posn but could not use small arms or the Warrior's chain gun for fear of hitting innocent civvies. He ordered the half section and crew to 'fix bayonets' and led them in a bayonet charge which succeded in dislodging the insurgents and causing them to break off the attack.

I believe the Cpl was awarded either the MM or the QGM and well deserved.

posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 09:37 AM

Originally posted by Popeye
I think you will find that in most armies bayonet charges still form a part of basic training, not only for training in what to do at close quarter without ammo, but more importantly the mental training and edge it gives.

Your exactly right.
Wasnt there an article recently about a shortage of munitions for the UK.

posted on Aug, 17 2005 @ 11:03 AM
Bayonet is also great for crowd control. Some "civilians" are not scared when you point the gun at them (they think you will not kill civilian) but when they see a nice sharp steel right before their face they will back off.

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