BUSTED!

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posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:02 AM
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HEY,

I agree, the man must be punished....

But his punishment cannot be decided by mob action or social anger.. It must be based on the laws on the books.

And, TO BE VERY HONEST, internet crime, no matter how much it costs, pales in comparison to urban gang crime,,, yet some here want this kid to serve more time than a murderer...

I can already hear the Bonanza theme...




posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:10 AM
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Before the nimrods here do their spying,
Yes, OIMD and I have the same IP... I am sitting next to him...


He;s also right, however, as much as I hate to admit it. You cannot design a punishment after the fact to make an example of an individual. They must be charged and processed under the statutes that existed at the time of their actions. Anything less is a reversion to pre-modern law.

Also, you can't have an angry mob (in this case the computer guys from various companies) decide punishment without the context of the law...


And no, this is not just lefty college kid stuff. It is what the Founding Fathers themselves believed in and agreed upon....



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:14 AM
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What will most likely happen is, they'll do the same thing to anyone over 18 that's gets busted with drugs....ruin his life for as long as they can. Not only will they ruin his life, they'll ruin his family's life. See, they know that if the kid has anyone who even remotely cares for him, they can extort all of their money too. He'll pay the bail through bondsman, then suffer through years of anticipated court dates. When the day finally comes, if they haven't saved up enough money, he'll go to jail until they get some money. Then, when they get enough money to make the deal, he and his family will spend at least the next 10 years paying them exorbitant fines. If he and his family should ever pay off the fines, his life will still be ruined by the permanent blemish on his record. He won't be able to get a decent job, and he'll probably be a complete loser, trapped in the justice system's lovely "rehab" program. I sort of feel sorry for the kid. It's not a system designed to teach people a lesson. It designed to ruin peoples' lives....and not just the perpetrator, but their families too.



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:35 AM
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(actually... the laws never.. well, not that you'll care...).


Ummm ok... Now that we have that OUT of the way...

On the one hand you argue that you are "half my age" BUT contend that you "actually have as much real life experince as me" hmmmm I will simply reply that that is IMPOSSIBLE...

One would only have to look at the time/space equiem to understand that, not to mention that all I do is produce commerce, employ hundreds of people directly and thousands indirectly... but I digress...

The POINT at hand is whether or not it makes sense to make an example of a known loserboy who, seeking attention for his deflated ego and complete lack of female attention (I am admittedly speculating here) caused the complete shutdown of and damage to 500,000 computers.

Computers that are DEPENDED upon by thousands of individuals and companies who EMPLOY (like Fury who had to deal with this scurge PERSONALLY) other individuals who must PRODUCE in order to feed their families.

Your claim that making an example of someone is "midevel" does NOT hold water... Not at all. Medevel folk would have simply called the young lad a warloch and be-headed him on the spot...

No, the experienced mind would immediately see that the proper, contemporary and LOGICAL response to this calamity is to make an example of the young lad so as to create a total FEAR in the mind of whom so ever should wish to attempt such a dastardly deed that they dare not.

While I'll forgive that you were "rushed"(for what reason I can not fathom - this IS the web) on your first response, all I see in your second response is the appology of your youth and inexperience.

Don't appologoze for that which you have no control or faculty over! Rejoice in the fact that you have your WHOLE life ahead of you with which to learn these things!

The law and punishment and two VERY distinct and DIFFERENT things.

One is the guideline the other is the consequence.

The experienced mind understands that the consequence MUST be adjusted to each unique circumstance when it benefits the future of the society which it serves.

The inexperienced mind rushes, as I have stated before, to the text for explicit nomenclature due to a lack of data.

While I am certainly not a wizened old judge, I understand these tenets. Thus the average age of our judges is 49 years old... Much older than I. I have no idea of your age but I would assume, based on your points here, that they are much older than you as well.

When all is said and done this young lad will pay the piper dearly. His penence will, hopefully, prevent future folly of this nature by its EXAMPLE.

P...
m...

[Edited on 8-30-2003 by Springer]

[Edited on 8-30-2003 by Springer]



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:46 AM
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umm, do you want me or FunGirl to tear that statement apart? We can both do it.

PS: "points here"=Points not spent doing things. Thus, if I have less points than you expect...



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:57 AM
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This says it all... Or does it?


PS: "points here"=Points not spent doing things. Thus, if I have less points than you expect...


I can only assume YOU are referring to "ATS" points (which you a plethora more of than me), while I was referring to intillectual points. It matters not however.

It makes my heart HAPPY to know that I had a small part to play in the advancement of your perspective.

BTW- what is a "Nimrod"? Have to look that one up I guess...

Goodnight one and all...

PEACE...
m...



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 02:57 AM
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Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
umm, do you want me or FunGirl to tear that statement apart? We can both do it.

PS: "points here"=Points not spent doing things. Thus, if I have less points than you expect...


Go ahead,
either way you're playing with fire.
So you got a choice between a know -it-all kid, or a shallow cheerleader.

yea, let the fun begin.



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 03:04 AM
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Springer,

Space and time continum aside, I have known 60 year old fools and 20 year old wise men. Age doesnt equate alwasy with real life experience or wisdom, nor does youth always mean folly. There are children in afghanistan who have more real life experience than my 68 year old grandpa.

Just a thought.



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 03:09 AM
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Originally posted by Springer
The POINT at hand is whether or not it makes sense to make an example of a known loserboy who, seeking attention for his deflated ego and complete lack of female attention (I am admittedly speculating here) caused the complete shutdown of and damage to 500,000 computers.

Computers that are DEPENDED upon by thousands of individuals and companies who EMPLOY (like Fury who had to deal with this scurge PERSONALLY) other individuals who must PRODUCE in order to feed their families.

Just for the record, as I stated posts ago, this kid was not responsible for the original "blaster" worm that infected over 500,000 computers. He made a variant of that worm which infected 7,000 computers. It's still a major offense, I just want to make sure we're all on the same page here.


From Springer's CNN link:


The damaging, viruslike infection, known as "Blaster," LovSan" and "MSBlast," was unleashed on the Internet weeks ago. Some experts said it has infected more than 500,000 computers across the globe and has quickly become one of the most widespread computer worms this year.

Parson acknowledged changing the original "Blaster'' worm and creating the "Blaster.B" version.

Court documents allege that Parson's version of the worm infected at least 7,000 computers.



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 03:12 AM
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Skadi:

Point well taken. The law/punishment of the land is a dicey subject at best. It's darn near incomprehensible at worst... Thus I go for the wisdom of years on this one.

At the same time I'll grant you that has proven to be "wrong city" too BUT it seems to work out better through the averages.

P...
m...



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 08:05 AM
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Well, just make it perfectly clear Springer is a LOT older than me
LOL...

anyway, I'm not going to even attempt to get into the mind of Springer and interpret what he is trying to say (I tried it once and had to have extensive therapy), but I'll input how **I** take the view "make an example" of this kid. They can't make some special punishment for him outside of what is available at this time. And since there are precedents concerning this crime they most likely have something to base his punishment on. BUT, there are also always "ranges" within the available punishment and I personally believe they need to pick the endpoint over on the high side OR, if possible, slide it out a little further for him (but it would be a permanent adjustment to the range). As long as what they sentence this guy to is applicable to all other like offenders from this point forward, they are within the law.



posted on Aug, 30 2003 @ 08:29 AM
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Cush (son of Ham, one of the 3 sons of Noah who survived the flood) also begat Nimrod, who was the first man of might on earth. He was a mighty hunter by the grace of the Lord; hence the saying, "Like Nimrod a mighty hunter by the grace of the Lord." Genesis 10: 8-9

Apparently Fungirl has noticed your manly prowess and uncanny investigative abilities into shady IP issues...






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