guys and porno...why?

I think I should post this definition of pornography. It comes from Warren Farrell Phd. At first I had problems with it but after observing wildlife in its natural habitat...the conduct of women and men..it made sense.

Pornography ...access to ones dreams , fantasys , expectations cheaply and without rejection.

When you read womens magazines and then mens magazines in this category ...it fits. Especially romance novels.

As to the poster who said.." consider her feelings..I have a question...is this grooming for picking up on her cues and clues?? Is this a formula for male disposability? Especially in a multitasking world. A multitasking woman should be picking up on his cues and clues...its called commitment.
Dont worry ..this is way beyond the abilty of most males to think through. Your luckey in this. Feelings are not always a default setting to allow one to play through.

Thanks,
Orangetom

I was surprised when one of the guys brought to work a copy of a magazine titled "Maxim" I asked if I could read it and was shocked to find out it has the male format of Cosmopolitan. Image. Act like you are this or that image and you will be. Just buy this or that product and it will be so.
Astonishing. I was surprised that they finally came out with the same drivel format for men. I found it an awful magazine..just like Cosmo. Soft porn.
Thanks,
Orangetom

I agree in large amounts it's really bad, it can take over your life. But there is no true "addiction" to porno, it's a natrual human behavior to get aroused by these things. It can be considered a addiction if it's interfering with a serious relationship, and should be dealed with.

Thanks for all your replys guys...


and orange, i dont get what you mean by saying i should be smarter than this or more "with it" I didnt say anything really. i just asked for peoples opinons.

as far as my opinon on it, i think if a guy is in a commited relationship the he shouldnt look at porn if the person he is with is uncomfortable with it. its just out of simple respect. and to me, if i were married i would consider it cheating if my husband did it. because if he needs sex im here for that, and if im not in the mood, well he can masterbate, im cool with that, but not to pics of other woman. i can give him photos of me lol.

i think if you are in a commited relationship whether its porn or anything else, you have to be considerate of your partners feelings. and im old fashinoated i suppose to where i think that if ive told my partner, that im not ok with it, and he says he wont do it, and then goes and does it behind my back, hes cheating on me. because i consider lusting after another woman in that way, taking time out of your day to go and pic out a woman that you like, buy the subscription to the website, and then look at it, when you have a wife or partner who considers that cheating, then it is.

if a guy wants to look at it, and the girl doesnt want him to he has every right to tell her that he doesnt want to change and break it off with her, but he should never promise not to and do it behind her back. you cant have your cake and eat it too. no pun intended lol.

so thats my stance on it. it all comes down to honesty with me really.

my main question was, however not why they do it. but why would a guy promise not to, and then later on do it anyway,,,does that mean that he is unsatisfied with his partners looks or their relationship? or does it have nothing to do with her at all.

that was the question


Kind Regards,
DigitalGrl

I think the worst part about it is that he told her that he would consider it cheating, and basically labeled what he was already doing to be cheating.

When the topic came up he should have told her the truth. This is more of an issue about lying than the actual issue of watching porn or not. (remember the clinton trial? everyone made a huge deal about him w/ Monica, but the impeachment was over perjury, aka lying)

---Pineapple

I agree..his tack was poor. I deduced that this guy was insecure about losing her.. or access to her...your girlfriend. Really dumb. As I said ..guys are pretty dumb. He should be secure enought in his place to tell her no or yes and mean it.

My other point was also that women are bombarded by this stuff far more than men...daily..in every avenue of communications and merchandizing. It it to bad that most men are to dumb and ignorant to know this. A really dumb generation of men..even ones with degrees. Astonishing.
Your girlfriend is asking her man to stop being a man and modify his behavior by picking up on her cues and clues. Do women get asked to stop reading and watching soft porn ..or any other type...daily.modify their behavior.or its cheating.??? Give up the Lifetime Channel??? No ..their behavior gets catered to in every social attitude nuance, every marketing strategy.The assumption is that women dont do this. Not true.
Feelings ...talk about feelings. I just got back from a weekend in the mountains where I took the woman I am seeing to a bed and breakfast. Complete with all the trimmings..it ran about $1400. This woman believes in girl stuff and the girl stuff religion. Translation ...I foot the bills...no safetynet under me. We had a good time and the mountains were lovely. She is already planning a return trip in the Fall to see the leaves turn. Does she consider my feelings???? What it takes for me to earn these moneys or is she just intrested in hers??? Is this whoredom???? Obscene..pornographic. Dont worry..most men cant figure this out ..outside of how to reach the objective by a womans clues and cues. What about my feelings????? Especially the feelings I have to curb and dicipline to earn these moneys. To her and many women this is implicit..not explicit. Do you see how easy it is to take advantage..a. given..??? To go to the next step in conditioning?? Im going to let her down at some point close to the Fall season ...or condition her to foot the bill on this one. What do you think is going to happen in this one???? Whose "feelings" are going to come forth with a sense of entitlement?? Dont worry ..when I get enough of this ..I will tell her good by too. Ive done it before. This is whoredom...the given ..the entitlement. Obscene...especially in a multitasking world.
This is what some of us here who observe this phenomonon call Type A behavior ..verses Type B. Be careful about " Feelings" men have them too. Most are just to dumb to vocalize them and are insecure about expressing them.

My main point is dont think all pornography is aimed at men ..it is not...a view totally ignored by your girlfriend and you and unfortunately a ignorant genre of men too...this is what I meant by grow up. This is the default setting. You assume it automatically goes there and men are automatically groomed to pick up on yours or your girlfriends clues and cues...based on "feelings". That these are automatic settings socially to allow you to play through. They are not. Proof of this ...you didnt even mention this portion of my post ..in lieu of yours and your girlfriends position. The default.

I agree with the woman who said it was about lying...the guy should have been secure enough to tell her I'll quit and stick with it ...or deal with it or I'm gone. In otherwords .be secure in her womanhood!! Her femaleness!! I have told many a woman ..I dont have time for their insecuritys.

Thanks for your post,
Orangetom

Short answer...men are visual and women are mental.


Seriously, women get stimulated by things they imagine, feelings, fantasies, etc...
Men get stimulated by visual things.

In short, he may be totally committed to your friend but when he needs to self-stimulate...he needs some visual stimulation to help that.

Thanks for your replys again guys

Orange:
i think you are misunderstanding me. For one...i never said all porn was aimed at men. 2. i never said that i or my friend ashley expects men to pick up on all our cues and clues. my questions was why would a guy do it when he himself labels it as cheating and his gf specifically told him she was not comfortable being in a relationship with a guy who did that.. there was not "clue" she straight up told him..from what she says to me anyways.

and the reason why i aimed this as a guy question is because...well im a girl so i already have a girls perspective on pornography.

this was not a debate forum, at all. it was a simple question of "why would a guy in a commited relationship who thinks this is cheating and says he loves his gf, and HE KNOWS that she doesnt want him to do it ...do it anyway?" that was all i made this post for. you are going way deeper into areas that i didnt even comment on nor showed my perspective on.

i in no way shape or form think that porn or "these images" are directed at men only. i never said that. somehow you think i did. which is ok im not pissed or anything, but you are mistaken.

i was just trying to get a mans perspective on this situation. because when my friend confronted him he said it had nothing to do with him not being satisfied with her...but he himself labeled it as cheating....so i was wondering what would be his reason then if it supposedly " has nothing to do with her." I understand the whole "visual" creature thing..

BUT

if you think something is cheating you dont do it and then say to your partner it has nothing to do with you. thats all i was getting at. you went way...into a whole other issue which frankly wasnt even anything i was asking about and stuff that i already knew im not ignorant. oh and here's something that i just found out from here today....she said that she took pics of herself for him...to use if he ever needed something to look at...so why then..wouldnt he just look at those? i think that is what is hurting her. the lying and the fact that she gave him nude pics of herself to look at...and he is claiming that he thinks she is beautiful and does not want her to leave him at all. he feels really bad. she just doesnt understand.

Kind Regards,
DigitalGrl


[edit on 10/01/2004 by DigitalGrl]

You posted:

"Short answer...men are visual and women are mental. "

You've got to be joking right??? did you go to public schools and get a full dose.??? and never got over it??

I've got news for you ...women are far more visual and mental than most men ever thought of being. Especially visual.
If this were not so...than why is there on the average 7 times more display space in department stores devoted to womens products verses mens products.??? Of every colour shape and size?? Why is this Zeddicus? Because women are not visual???
Ive got news for you too..women are very visual about men too. Why do you think the average dummy of a male buys a certain kind of car??? Because he never saw a ugly woman get out of one...because women are not visual???

Think about it and get out of that standard issue mantra that passes for knowlege and look around you sometime.
Go to a party...company party or other. I went with the woman I am seeing to her annual company party. It was intresting to observe the women watch the other women enter to see what they were wearing and size them up with the nod of approval or the shake of the head in disapproval. Remember..women are not visual they are mental. Not hardly. This is a important clue as to how competitive are some women in this arena. Translate that ...territorial.
Think about it and get rid of those standard mantras.

Thanks,
Orangetom

Not visual eh???? mental???

How many women do you know who fantasize about uglyness and that they are the important part of uglyness.

Or do they dream of beauty and beautiful things and that they are core and in the center surrounded by beauty and beautiful things. Visual acuity??

When you understand this..then look around at the stores in your area, The amount of floor space dedicated to women and womens products and how ugly they are displayed. Look at the magazines and books ..in the womens genre. Romance novels..look at how much uglyness they portray on the covers. Lol Lol Visual!!! All of it..the very articles and plot lines are about visual stimulation. Only men preconditioned can be so dumb they dont get it!! The women certainly do.
Romance novels and magazines like Glamour and Cosmo et al are a billion dollar industry in this country and others. You dont get this kind of money alienating your customer with uglyness. The proper visual effects are a must in this market.

Thanks ,
Orangetom.

HAHA,

orange that comment you made about going to your womans company party or whatever and seeing all the women sizing eachother up was really on point.

as a 19 year old woman myself..i couldnt agree with you more on that one.
we have such a competitive nature..wanting to outdue the other one to get the most attention, and when we dont feel like we can compare to the other woman, be it in waist size, boob size, facial beauty etc...we have a pity party for ourselves lol. not that all woman are like this, but EVERY woman, including myself has done this at some point or another. *sigh, when will we learn. :bnghd::shk:

And i agree as well with your statement on woman being visual. i think woman do need more mental stimulation than men however, but we are definatly just as visual .

Kind Regards,
DigitalGrl

[edit on 10/01/2004 by DigitalGrl]

You asked for a opinion and I gave it to you. I suspect that both of them are insecure in this arena. Especially him. He needs to wise up ..alot.


The sickening thing socially in this country is that the belief systems permit this carte blanche in a form for women and disapproves of it for men..in its form..this is a double standard. Men need to wise up about this..but I dont hold out much hope for them. Way to dumb.

Thanks,
Orangetom

wow your up late..standing the night watches are you?? I just got off work here on the east coast.

I will tell you ..frankly ..I enjoy watching women much more than men...they are more in depth to me than most men. Men are pretty much one dimensional and basic. A really good and worthy woman is a thing to behold and savor like a fine wine, like a fine strand of pearls.
Most of my life I have dated women older than me..this is how I came into the knowlege of some of these views. Not that the women did this deliberately to educate me in this field but it is what I have observed.I have not found many women who will educate a man just to get him ready for the next woman. It is just not done.
It has been a intresting and valuable education. I recommend for the younger men to date older women for thier continued education.
Obviously I am not into sports and sports illustrated swimsuit edition.

Thanks for your post.
Orangetom

yea its 1:00am here in rockford Illinois. i cant sleep lol. The comments you made about woman were so elequant. Nice to see a guy that values the unique characterisitcs of a woman. and one that takes the time to observe and take the time to listen and understand.

Kind Regards,
DigitalGrl

Originally posted by Mizar
OK.... First off I think Porn is satan and should be destroyed....

God made us naked.

Satan tricked us into wearing clothes.

God didn't like it.

God kicked us out of paradise for it.




I'm on GOD's side on this one.

DigitalGrl

The sad truth is that men are highly vulnerable to pornographic addiction. When a man views pornography he stimulates physical desires that were not meant to be stimulated by anyone other than his spouse. As he continues to view pornography the need to view it increases as his appetite for sexual satisfaction grows out of control.

Pornography is very much like a narcotic. Small amounts satisfy at first but in time, greater and more debase forms of pornography are needed to arouse the user. Relationships suffer as the addiction grows and the spouse of the sexual addict becomes unable to fulfill all the needs of the addicted.

If you find yourself in a relationship with a man who views pornography get him help immediately or walk away. You will save yourself a tremendous amount of pain and long suffering.

While I dont recommend pornography for men..or women either..both groups are bombarded by it daily. Women especially. It is subtilty around them 24/7 more so than men. It is just not marketed in the same manner.
The sad fact is that in our commercial and heavily merchandized social structure sex sells products.
Manufacturers and especially advertisers know that women often have access to two incomes not one as is the case for most men. Her husband or spouse if she is married or her man's if she is not. It doesnt matter if she works the same formula applies. The key is to sell the woman and her soul...in order to gain access to the second income. The number one tool to do this is various appeals to her sexuality/womanhood/motherhood. Also today if you sell the kids..you sell the woman ..then it is possible to sell the man...and all of their souls for this merchandize.
Take any woman out here in their heavily merchandizable ages..and try to seperate them from various avenues of thier sexuality and watch the reaction. You cant do it....they identify so heavily with their sex and sexuality ..it is virtually impossible. Sex/beauty and access to goods and services are inseperatable in this social structure. Yet this drivel is expected and taken for granted in men. They are expected to follow the forms socially..clues and cues and support more of this drivel.
The manner in which the manufacturers and advertisers appeal to a womans sexuality is obscene and pornographic. Furtheremore they start them very young. And I mean very young on this treadmill.
They dont even know how to earn a living ...and they know all about sex and sexuality. Sickening. Talk about backwards..talk about putting the cart before the horse. Pornographic ..obscene. Both male and female today in this category. But the females are bombarded very very young into this treadmill...
The number one commodity of any lasting value that a knowlegable woman brings to a man ..is Peace...not Piece. Peace will outlast any Piece in the marketplace. It will outlast a woman's and a man's biology by a long shot. Same thing for a man..he must know about Peace..not just Piece.
To bad most men and women today know almost nothing about this and divorce and seperation statistics bear this out.
They do however know how to define themselves by the products they consume for themselves and thier children..ie..sexuality. They are often wonderful consumers...just lousy people. Statistically they are often merely consuming each other in a sense of entitlements. This is pornographic, obscene.
My point in all his is that the field of pornography extends much further than most people are aware....so much further ..and to most people it is so one sided. They just dont know any differently. Neither will they teach you any differently in public schools/colleges.
The system is designed to support this madness.

Thanks ,
Orangetom

Originally posted by Machine
DigitalGrl
When a man views pornography he stimulates physical desires that were not meant to be stimulated by anyone other than his spouse. As he continues to view pornography the need to view it increases as his appetite for sexual satisfaction grows out of control.

Who cares where the guy gets his appetite, as long as he is only eating at home.

First of all, i'm a 43yr old male. Back in the 80's i was blessed to have a very intelligent and lovely girlfriend for over 8 years. One night after enjoying a meal at a restaurant in Melbourne, when we were on the way home she asked me to park the car outside a 'porno store'.

So i parked, asked a couple of stupid male questions as to why...like "I didn't know you had second job"? Lucky for me, she laughed.

She wanted me to purchase some male/male porn. After about 5 minutes of me saying, "Get it yourself" i bolted into the store and grabbed the first magazine i saw.
You should have seen the look the dude on the cash register gave me when i said, "It's for my girlfriend".

The fact that she wanted this material didn't worry me.
So, i guess this topic can apply to both sexes.

Sanc'.

There are plrnty of women that like pornography as well, they just dont talk about it, because they are affraid of beeing stigmatized...

besides womne have lot more to do during the day, so there is really not much free time for porn...lol... try lawdry... cleaning, vaccuming... and you'll see there wont be time left for porn...