Here are my thoughts and logic.


First, lets discuss the most likly environmental changes, as this will ultimatly determine the choice of a suitable location.

Here is a list of stuff that could possibly occur.

• Volcanoes (perhaps the caldera at Yellowstone, causing the blocking out of the sun, causing an ice age type event)
  
• Earthquakes (causing tsunamis)
  
• Solar Flares (causing electronic malfunctions of various telecommun ications equipment)
  
• Magnetic pole variations (possible electrical equipment malfunction)
  
• Thunderstorm activity (tornadoes, hurricanes, blizzards, etc etc)
  

If you can think of other events please add them.

Now some pre-requisites to having a place to support a long term self sufficient society.

• Resources (timber, livestock, farmable soil, stone, fresh water, fishing)
  
• Quick access to both high altitude, and low-altitude areas
  
• Abililty to create underground systems (for added underground protection if needed)
  
• Running streams or water systems for hydro-electric (preferably underground streams for added protection of the systems)
  

Please add anything that you would also see fit. I am pretty sure that most of these list items are pretty self-explanatory.


With these things in mind, here is what I would look for.

A cavern or cave complex of some sort, which extends both deep below the surface, and extends high into a mountain or mesa of some sort.

I would not just blindly decide to go very high into the mountain to run from a flood. There could quite possibly be an ice age type event and you could end up freezing to death. And on the opposite side you may encounter floods which would make you need to go to these higher elevations. This is why I would try to find a location where either area is easily accesible.

Those are my thoughts.

reblazed:

yes, i grew up in wyoming. but i am concerned about the extreme temperatures as it gets cold there without any help from a storm. besides, all of wyoming montana was covered by a glacier last big storm. as for beliefs, i think diversity is good. they dont have to be white like me; im not a racist. they dont have to be christian or buddist. they just have to have a skill, work together towards survival, and be a team player. im sure that in the adversity i think is coming, all peoples from all religions will strive to forget thier differences and work together.

suzy ryan:

im not sure what your getting at or why you replied but um...thankx?

Master Wu:

thanks for the reply. i agree with you on all points except the sudden or violent theme to your logic. that mammoth was frozen instantly as were other fossil discovery's. if the ocean rises even a little bit, the water could fill up basin canyons overnight, thats pretty sudden to the creatures calling that place home. in all areas where geothermal activity is triggered, all events subsequent to that activity will be sudden, though not neccessarily global. I dont know if 'no place' will be safe master wu, as i dont think every square inch of our globe will suffer from these effects, so i'll hold out for an area that hasnt had much history with fault lines, as an earth quake is sudden enough for me if im living where it hits, or an area with geothermal history or a avenue of access for the ocean to reach me, like a river valley in our breadbasket.

celticniall:

unfortuantly celticniall, i agree with everything u said, i just dont want to be a forigner in a country whose population include terrorists and zealots who hate and will probably blame white americans for gods wrath.

robertfenix:

you couldnt be more wrong. ever heard of Centrifugal force?? or "for every force there is an equal and oppisite force"? let me break it down for you. our world is surrounded by water. water sloshes every night compliments of our moon, twice as a matter of fact...low and high tide. if our earth wobbles, then this will cause ocean water, spinning up to then at a contant speed and direction, to alter as it seeks out the new center of rotation as earth is bully'd around by the magnatism forces and it will continue to slosh its momentum energy to and fro untill things settle down. the heat and cold and plate tetonic activity will not be caused directly from the earth magnetic poles switching, but it precipitates it. and i agree with you about teh weather patterns...but let me say it again:::

"ok you guys...if u know the topic, reply...if u dont, well....dont.

where on this earth would be the best place to weather this storm out here on earth?????

IF U REPLY WITH AN IDEA, PLEASE BACK UP YOUR IDEA WITH YOUR LOGIC AS I WILL PICK ONE OF YOUR IDEAS TO RELOCATE TO

so do u have an idea or were u just bleeding at the mouth.

This is a PRATT. There is no evidence to claim that 2012 is the end of anything other than the end of the Mayan calendar.

Originally posted by gemini6767
robertfenix:

you couldnt be more wrong. ever heard of Centrifugal force?? or "for every force there is an equal and oppisite force"? let me break it down for you. our world is surrounded by water. water sloshes every night compliments of our moon, twice as a matter of fact...low and high tide. if our earth wobbles, then this will cause ocean water, spinning up to then at a contant speed and direction, to alter as it seeks out the new center of rotation...
...these sunstorms seek to equalize and reset a 'glitch in the matrix'. but like earth, sometimes the storm hits a category that is severe. it is this storm that i refer to. this storm causes the magnatism on earth to reverse.

No gemini, robertfenix may not be completely right, but you are the one that is completely wrong here.

A magnetic pole "flip" would not result in any of the things you describe. A geographical pole "flip" would, but that has never happened and will never happen, at least not until the Moon leaves Earth's orbit. The moon stabilizes the rotation of the Earth. The "wobble" the poles undergo takes tens of thousands of years between one direction and the opposite, and the pole never "wobbles" beyond about 15 - 20 degrees as measured against the plane of the ecliptic.

Additionally, solar wind does not cause the magnetic pole flip. The actual source of the Earth's magnetic field is not completely understood, but it is understood well enough to rule this out.

The Earth's magnetic poles do wander around over time. They also gain and lose strength. In fact, right now the strength of the Earth's magnetic field is way down compared to measurements made a hundred years ago or so. The field varies from maximums to minimums this way, it always has, according to geological evidence. Usually, the field starts to lose power first, and then when a minimum is reached the poles wander to a new area.

Originally posted by gemini6767 as earth is bully'd around by the magnatism forces and it will continue to slosh its momentum energy to and fro untill things settle down. the heat and cold and plate tetonic activity will not be caused directly from the earth magnetic poles switching, but it precipitates it...

The Earth never has been, nor will it ever be "bully'd (sic) around" by magnetic forces. The Earth is the source of the magnetic forces. Solar winds are made up of ionized plasma, not magnetic fields. Alternating magnetic fields will have absolutely zero effect on the oceans, and no effect on tectonics or temperatures either, for that matter.

Originally posted by gemini6767
"ok you guys...if u know the topic, reply...if u dont, well....dont.

It is my opinion that the members at ATS have every right to respond to any post at this site, regardless of whether they "know the topic" according to your standard. After all, it is rather painfully obvious that you yourself posses practically no knowledge at all on "the topic."

Originally posted by gemini6767
where on this earth would be the best place to weather this storm out here on earth?????

Assuming a magnetic pole shift, the higher the worser. A weak EM field deflects fewer of these particles of the solar wind that you exhibit such an irrational fear of. Higher up, you would further lose what little protection the atmosphere offers.

Harte

The San Juan mountains of Colorado--Because they are the highest mountains that are farest away from nearby volcanos--nuclear reactors (denver) or faultlines. This is my best suggestion for North America but the problem with the northern hemisphere is that in 12/21/12 it will be winter and so this will make it awfully difficult to reach a isolated bunker in the rocky mountains, but not impossible. Also, the America will be bitterly cold after the pole shift, so...well anyway I wish the best of luck to you...Maybe we will meet in the golden age. Farewell...

Heyy

I dunno if this convo is still going on since the question was posted two years ago... but this person sounds smart so I wanted to reply just in case..
I know a lot about what you're talking about and I've been trying to think of a safe place to go too when the changes are going to happen.
I was thinking central Australia, not just because of the natural earth changes, but also because there are rumors of the US starting a third world war that will be fought mainly in the northern hemisphere. I don't know if this will actually happen but I don't want to stick around to find out. If it does happen it will be before 2012 from what I've read/heard.
Also, if you listen to an interview between George Green and George Noorey on Youtube, there is a point in the interview where George Green talks about leaders and high-up people in the government in North America going to an underground base in Australia around this time to take shelter from the changes that will be occurring, whether they are natural or from war.
It made me wonder why choose Australia to go to? Why not an underground base in America?? Well I'm sure they know a lot more then us, thanks to their secret society's, and if they think they will be safe on the continent of Australia then they're probably right.
Also it makes sense that if the U.S. does start a war then it will be mainly in the Northern Hemisphere.
Central Australia would also be safe from tides, warm, not an area prone to high winds, safe from the melting of the Northern ice cap, not common for earthquakes to hit or volcanic eruptions.. I'm hoping to go there as a transfer student asap..
So what do you think?
oh p.s. I'm a Gemini too

That is a bit strange I read someplace the other day that the government is selling bunker space here in the US for billions of dollars so the rich will survive the 2012 fiasco. Which tells me that there is something to the 2012. Others are saying that the polar change will make england into the next north pole. If that happens then part of the USA would be on the equatar, oh well we wont know until after it happens, but from what I have read we will be having huge solar storms. Which means no electric maybe for months. How will people in cities and towns live?

I dont talk about 2012 around here people look at me like I am crazy when I do. But I figure if they dont get ready for it and ignore it they wont make it. ignorance sometimes is best. That way you get rid of the idiots in the world. Either way I cant tell you where is best to go. I live in the middle of North Carolina. The mountains, here are not safe they have had small earth quakes before so I dont trust them. Then you have the coast no one wants to go that way. Of course I better move my butt figuring there is a huge nuclear plant 40 miles from my home.(just remembered that)

So I guess now me trying to prepare my home for the worst isnt going to work. But I can always try and find another place somewheres, to settle down in. Oh well maybe hubby is right that going to Mexico would be the place to be. But I dont know. But either way if anyone here from NC wants to get together on plans give me a yell.

Hilda

I am so glad to have found this thread!! I hope it is not dead..

.Yes, I know the area 51 look very well! The people I work with look at me like that.. they think I am insane.. Everyone thinks I am crazy! I bring them stuff about the world changing..still they refuse to believe me.. they keep insisting that the government would tell us if something like this was going to happen.. yeah, ok , you just keep believing that. yeah like that would not cause mass panic and hysteria!!! the only thing they are starting to accept is the global warming idea, especially they like the movie "an incovienient truth"

I live in missouri and have some goats and a lot of chickens.. we have to start getting ready.. I also have been trying to figure out where to go to survive... I raise goats and chickens so that I will have food for the coming tragedy. my boyfriend and I are trying to become self sufficient.. You are going to have to be, if you are going to make it..
would like to migrate somewhere like Egypt but, being a white american female, I don't think that would go over very well..

like the 7,000 ft idea.. just have to somehow win the lottery to be able to move there.. and be able to build a defensible compound..
I totally agree with the weapons idea. if you have something especially food and everyone around you is starving, they will try to take it from you.

it would really be bad to have to watch people die but what happens if you have enough food for your own people for, let's say a year. ok then now what happens if you let in about 50 or even 100 extra people? if they are not bringing anything useful like skills to get more food , you all die! because they just ate all of you food and you do not have enough..

so in the long run you will need guns and lots of ammo. not necessarily to kill them, but to make tham leave, move along ..

why dont you go live in space where we wont have to hear from you ever again?
or... you could live in a plane until it runs out of fuel and gravity catches up with it?
in fact... why dont you just get as close to the ocean as possible and pray that a sea serpent eats your house

The End of the Muslim Calendar:, 2076

The end of the Jewish Calendar: 2240

The Mayan calendar only applies if you're Mayan. If you're Mayan be afraid...be very afraid

The good thing is that our own calendar doesnt ever have to end...

That's easy they don't

I'd seen that date before, 2076 when I lived in the Middle East. I checked and its a Sufi myth from one of their sects. I checked a Saudi based date converter and its shows that our year 2076 equals AH 1500 and 2077 equals 1501 AH (after Hejira)

Just a meaningless religious prediction I suspect - throw it on the back of the truck with the other ten or so thousand failed religious predictions.

I'm not familar with the Jewish Calendar but again I've never heard of a end date.

Alright. In any case, the point being made is: Why focus exclusively on the supposed Mayan calendar...

Most true...however I just got an email back from one of my Saudi friends.

There IS a date for the end of calendar!!!!

Since 1423 AH – Such cases indeed occurred in 1421 AH and 1422 AH and from 1423 AH (15 March 2002) onwards, the rules for the Umm al-Qura calendar have been modified to:


Since 1423 AH – Such cases indeed occurred in 1421 AH and 1422 AH and from 1423 AH (15 March 2002) onwards, the rules for the Umm al-Qura calendar have been modified to:
If on the 29th day of the lunar month the two following conditions are satisfied, then the next day is the first day of the new lunar month:

The geocentric conjunction occurs before sunset.
The moon sets after the sun.
Otherwise, the current lunar month will last 30 days.

Western-Islamic Calendar Converter based on the Umm al-Qura Calendar (1356 AH to 1500 AH)
The following Western-Islamic calendar converter is based on the Umm al-Qura calendar and is valid from 1356 AH (14 March 1937 CE) to 1500 AH (16 November 2077 CE). Outside this interval, the converter will give erroneous results.

So most converters will not go past 16 November 2077 - I suspect that the date of 2076 was set based on an earlier such date.

The limits to the dates seems to be due to the difficulty of calculating when the new moon can been seen by the human eye.

Arbitrary points in time are taken sooooo seriously

Nice find.

It's funny that people are so quick to dismiss things..

No one believes there's any signifigance to:

The heliopause not closing after the last solar cycle?Allowing cosmic dust to freeflow into our solar system?

The recent discovery of possible dark matter near us emitting cosmic rays?

The almost in-existent solar activity we are currently experiencing..how bout the solar winds?lowest recorded in over 60 years?(which even worries scientists)

This passing through of the galactic equator(speaking of which,that it is recently discovered that we actually don't belong to the milky way,that our galaxy (the sagitarius)is actually a dwarf galaxy being...accumulated we'll call it,by the milky way?for as long as we've known,we've never been able to explain why it is the milky way doesn't share the same ecliptic as us..what i mean is,we are on a diffrent 'angle' than the rest of the milky way,and this is the reason...we aren't from the milky way!!

This mysterious galactic alignement?which admittedly i know practically nothing about,other than the fact that it may upset the barycenter of the sun which would cause possibly a massive Coronal Mass Ejection,which is in itself a massive solar flare.Which would explain why there was glass found on the moon...

The fact that ALL the planets in the solar system are heating up,global warming my ***,solar warming maybe..

Put it this way,we thought the world was flat for how long?And that the earth was the center of the universe,until the telescope was invented and the masses and paradigm were proven to be wrong?Even jailing one of the greatest minds in history because people couldn't handle this small reality?..

well,relate this to this circumstance and tell me it's not eerie even,everyone shuts down this theory as if they're all knowing and are absolutely right...giving scientific explanations as to why it's IMPOSSIBLE,but,it was only..approximately,5years now,that we have in fact realized that our own (alleged) galaxy has a giant black hole at it's center emitting radiation,and that this radiation is becoming stronger, affecting all it's surroundings like a pebble drop in a pond

Yet somehow,the ancient maya,whom everyone is to dismiss as.. primative supersticion)..actually knew this for a fact over 5000years ago, right, and they were the primative one's.

We believed Darwins theory of evolution until it's been proven we simply cannot have evolved from monkees, for many reasons among them are the number of chromosomes we possess. it's just,ridiculous to even assume this is the truth..so why does everyone assume that we know everything there is to know, and it isn't possible...must i remind you, we've always just been playing with masters tools,never fully understanding.. wake up and realize how insignifi#(on purpose)we all are in a cosmic sense.. in this vast universe do you really think we have the ability to KNOW much of these things as facts?or merely speculation and 'most likelyhoods'..All i'm saying is,as much as we cannot prove that this IS going to happen, you'd be an ignorant sack to say without a doubt it ISN'T!

So prepare,or don't prepare,move or don't move,dynamite a cave in a mountain top, or build an underground lair,or better yet,a Noah's Ark whatever it may be you choose to do,thats exactly what it is,a choice. There is no wrong or right one,but i personally,after reading as much as i could (with a limited scientific base and understanding). usually finding the lehman's explanation to get through the technical mumbo jumbo,am inclined to believe this is a possibility..we are killing this planet slowly but surely,and i believe it has it's own defenses,and that life works in mysterious ways,we need a cleansing,and this may very well be it.

The I-Ching,Mayan Calendar,even internet software monitoring the world's subconscious,all depict some crisis in the very near future,there's even a movie,search google '2012 movie'.. by Sony/Columbia pictures!