Bush: Schools Should Teach 'Intelligent Design', page 1
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Topic started on 3-8-2005 @ 05:55 AM by RANT
The creation of the Origins & Creationism Conspiracy forum could not have been more timely. Dare I say our resident swami SkepticOverlord is not only a visionary, but a rather intelligent designer as well.

The predicted
conspiracy on which this forum is based is now official.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord
The United States is singularly unique in experiencing the phenomenon of "creationism" and/or "intelligent design" advocates seeking to eliminate the teaching of evolution science in favor of non-scientific philosophy.

Over the past year, with the evangelically charged U.S. election, the creationism movement has gained new momentum along with an increase in posts here on ATS. From a purely objective standpoint, the issue of an organized group seeking to diminish or replace a widely accepted scientific topic with one of pure philosophy and faith fits the description of a "conspiracy".


And (as CNN Reports) the President of the United States is in on it!

Bush: Schools should teach 'intelligent design'
Views the theory as part of creation of life studies

CNN.com
Tuesday, August 2, 2005

During a round-table interview with reporters from five Texas newspapers, Bush declined to go into detail on his personal views of the origin of life. But he said students should learn about both theories, Knight Ridder Newspapers reported.

"I think that part of education is to expose people to different schools of thought," Bush said. "You're asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas, the answer is yes."

The theory of intelligent design says life on earth is too complex to have developed through evolution, implying that a higher power must have had a hand in creation.

Christian conservatives -- a substantial part of Bush's voting base -- have been pushing for the teaching of intelligent design in public schools. Scientists have rejected the theory as an attempt to force religion into science education.


Regardless of one's personal beliefs regarding the origins of life (which this topic is not about), the "organized group seeking to diminish or replace a widely accepted scientific topic with one of pure philosophy and faith" now has a spokesman (albeit a meek and sidestepping one) in the President of the United States.

[edit on 3-8-2005 by RANT]


reply posted on 3-8-2005 @ 07:44 PM by RANT
Originally spaketh by the President of the United States at the onset of his Texas vacation of thirty and three days
"I think that part of education is to expose people to different schools of thought," Bush said. "You're asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas, the answer is yes."


He wants to teach "both" theories. Okay?

Science and the "other" kind.

The ones that says things like...

We came from the mating of the Sky God's son and a
special five-toed chicken.

Or, we came from the first two creatures (a giant named Ymir and a cow named Audhumla) that rose spontaneously from the mixture of the glacial waters of Niflheim (the land of ice and mist) and the warm winds of Muspellsheim (the land of fire).

Or, it took several colorful attempts to make man (each effort needing to be destroyed), due to various reasons like the Gods losing manly ball game challenges to the Lords of Death.

Or, as is often pondered in these forums "aliens did it."

Or, if you prefer, another equally 'intelligent designer' theory is as follows:

Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.


And there you have it! "Both" theories. All good.

The scientifically verifiable and testable theory (either ultimately provable or disprovable) and the five-toed chicken, cow humping giant, soccer playing, Zeta Reticulan, mudpie making, rib stealing "intelligent designer" versions.

Ridiculous. Absolutely frailing idiotic. No. Hell no. The Jewish version is not any different than Mayans thinking a giant flying serpent came to earth and laid human eggs. Plus... hello, not Jewish over here. Not a vassal of the Roman Empire. Not subject to Spanish Conquistadors. Super, you burned everything my people wrote, but that doesn't make your bull# BETTER. If anything, most AMERICAN ancestors came from a combination of Animist Cow Humpers.

Yay, somebody raped my ancestors, now I must support the indoctrination of ancient Jewish lore. No. NO. NO.

Metaphysical origins gibberish is just that. Gibberish. It's not verifiable, not testable in the slightest, and it never ever will be. Evolution can at least be proven wrong or updated one day. That's why it's science. Freaking fairy tales never can.

And the man with his finger on the button of a SUPERPOWER thinks he came from mud or some other metaphysical fart in the emptiness and wants taxpayers to support "exposing" us to that. I already pay for cults to say condoms cause AIDS under Faith Based Community Initiatives.

Screw that. And the horse Jesus humped to make you "intelligent design" forced exposure fairy tale fans.


reply posted on 3-8-2005 @ 08:35 PM by Kano
If this wasn't so serious it would be utterly hilarious. (As is its still pretty funny).

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
As the "widely accepted scientific topic" is soft science at best, and more hypothesis than theory
....
Darwinism is an hypothesis taken as fact on sheer faith, and it is taught to my son against my will using my tax dollars.


Well, if your son is learning darwinism, then you have a good right to be upset, as your schools textbooks are stunningly out of date. Evolution has evolved a great deal since Darwin. Like any scientific theory it changes and adapts in response to observations.
I do take heart from the fact that we aren't still attacking the 'theory' part of it and now at least attempt to drag it back to being a hypothesis. Unfortunately thats incorrect, evolution remains a solid scientific theory, as much as religious types might wish it wasn't.

MORE IMPORTANTLY however, is that while evolution isn't a perfect theory. As far as scientific theories go it stands unchallenged in its field. Stating that Intelligent Design is as important as Evolution is like comparing a kayak to an aircraft carrier, its simply insane. Last I heard there wasn't even any noteable scientific papers covering Intelligent Design, yet people seriously think we should just start teaching it in schools?

On a side note:
Originally posted by frayed1
When one starts mentioning 'Intelligent Design', doesn't that leave the door open for questions of 'Alien Intelligen Design' as well? I'm a bit surprised they would want to go there, even theoretically.

Thats actually what my initial reaction to this was, maybe I've been around here for too long.
Sadly its just a rehashed creationism, only this time we put 'Intelligent' in the name to make it sound more scientific.



reply posted on 4-8-2005 @ 07:55 AM by RANT
Originally posted by howmuchisthedoggy
Why not concentrate on getting the kids to read, write and do arithmetic first? Then they could learn the hokey-pokey Darwinism/Creationism from their parents. That way everyone is happy.


First of all, (as Kano pointed out) it's not "Darwinism." It's the scientific theory of evolution. And creationists can no more downgrade science to their level of "hokey-pokeyness" than they can elevate themselves to the level of science by slapping the word "intelligent" on their ancient mythology.

And it's not the schools job to dumb itself down to the lowest common denominator to make crazy people "happy." We don't stop teaching the fundamentals of math because numbers may hurt some fundamentalists feelings, and we shouldn't stop teaching the fundamentals of biology and life science either, because some people still live in caves, cross their fingers for luck, toss salt over their shoulder and bark at the moon.

Many if not most of the same people that want "intelligent design" design taught on par with science (or science eradicated as you suggest because of it's offensiveness to nose pickers) don't think dinosaurs ever existed or if they did, it was within the last 6,000 years when God supposedly made the universe (in their version). Millions of years of erosion didn't make the Grand Canyon. God had a shovel. STD's aren't diseases that can be prevented with a little education, they're God's punishment for the wages of sin. The stars were just hung yesterday. Global warming isn't worthy of consideration since the Rapture is coming. And learning about man's migration, genetics and the origins of foreign languages hurts little Johnny Fundie's feelings too because he thinks God smiting the Tower of Babel did it.

Where does it end? We don't comprise with foreign extremists and terrorists. Why our own?

If you're going to stop teaching the basics of science because of some radical religious cult's demands, why not just do whatever Osama Bin Laden wants to make him happy too? No. Catering and compromising with dogmatic lunatics is absurd. You can never start, because it never stops.

They're called Dominionists for a reason.
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