Crusading americans and their "holy war"

Originally posted by slink

Originally posted by American Mad Man
Every Muslim holy site in the ME should be destroyed if a nuclear weapon is used by Islamic terrorists.

Destroy Islam, and the world is better off.

Yes... Think about how angry that will make ALL Americans as opposed to the very small percentage of angry Americans right now.

Btw SS this holy war stuff is stupid, Your little muslim buddies made a HOLY WAR, not the united states or bush, We didnt give a damn about the middle east before 9/11, We didnt need to profile muslims, We didnt dislike islam, Blame your buddies, For the current problem, Not us.




[edit on 2-8-2005 by C0le]

Thomas Crowne
What about all the passages in the books of the bible that speak about fire and brimstone? What about all the passages in the Koran that advocate peace and understanding?

What about the fire and brimstone? Does Jesus command us to send anyone to Hell? No, He does not. Context, man, context.

Speaking of context, Was Mohammed in Mecca or Medina when he wrote of undertanding? To whom was he speaking and about whom?

Originally posted by C0le
Btw SS this holy war stuff is stupid, Your little muslim buddies made a HOLY WAR, not the united states or bush, We didnt give a damn about the middle east before 9/11, We didnt need to profile muslims, We didnt dislike islam, Blame your buddies, For the current problem, Not us.
[edit on 2-8-2005 by C0le]

Instead of trying to destroy Islam you should aim for peace with Islam. After Iraq, hopefully the U.S. will attempt to strengthen ties with other Islamic countries like Iran and Syria. Get their people on your side instead of trying to fight them.

If the U.S. decided to destroy every Muslim holy site you would have every Islamic state declare war on the United States and I doubt that anyone would back the U.S. for doing something that extreme.

Of course, the United States isn't run by idiots and would never try anything that stupid.

Why should we aim to make peace with islam? They obviously dont want peace with us, If they wanted peace they would have never attacked us, If they wanted peace THEY would have come to us, and said lets talk , they wouldnt have taken our planes and flew them into our buildings killing my fellow americans.

Islam is a concept, a religion and that is an idea. You can never beat an idea with force - it has never in the history of mankind worked. You can only beat an idea by showing the failings in that idea - that can only be done through peace - not force.

See the flow of logic?

How does bombing anyone solve anything? I swear some people just seem to want violence.

Originally posted by slink
[
Instead of trying to destroy Islam you should aim for peace with Islam. After Iraq, hopefully the U.S. will attempt to strengthen ties with other Islamic countries like Iran and Syria. Get their people on your side instead of trying to fight them.


maybe if they stop promoting brainless UK Paki's Somali's west indians algerians etc from killing us as we try to get to our offices, the UK could talk about peace with IRAN and SYRIA . but that's not going to happen is it. this is all about Islam being rammed down the west's throat and they don't care how many of us die in the process. we don't want to fight anybody but we won't take this jihad crap for much longer, I'm glad we have a strong bond with AMERICA like us they see through all the rubbish spouted by crazy religious leaders in the middle east, UNITED WE STAND

How exactly is Islam being rammed down your throat?

Jeohavahs witness', you may have something there, but Islam? How is that?

Originally posted by C0le
Aside from the fact that responding to a SS thread makes us all borderline retarded, SS this is a great idea and they are legit targets get over it, Muslims started it we will finish it, With every suicide bomb that goes off, one more lefty joins the DROP THE FRIGGIN BOMBS ALREADY Club,

I admit it, I must be borderline, but you make good points and I want to point that out.

Originally posted by C0le
Im to the point where as much as i agree with bush on some things, I almost wish something would happen, Because then Cheney would be in charge.

I do not nessesarily think he would be more 'bullish' than Bush is.....Bush keeps a certain public opinion floating out there, but those that know him know that he is in control and has the knack to put good people around him....I like him more and more, but he is still no Reagan imho.

blood_thorn

“And in their twisted minds the terrorists have found a way to use as an excuse to target western countries.”

It is very hard to twist anything in the koran which says “ do not transgress for god does not loveth transgressors”. So you see, you can’t twist anything to target any country, if a true Muslim struggles for anything it’s their own defence. As Crowne quoted himself from the koran, if they’ve kicked you out of your home get back, and if their oppressing and occupeing you, fight back! If you love your country in islam, that is one of the highest forms of worship.

But loving your country doesn’t mean waving a flag, and supporting a traitorous leader, who keeps attacking people who have done nothing to you. Loving your country means to fight against occupation, and fight against a leader who seeks to defame it’s name. So wether your muslim or Christian, (because the word of god applies to all of us), remember that persecution is worse than death.

“The US has troops spread on muslim soil so to them the US ( UK, Italy,etc. also) are legitimate targets”

In islam, civilians are never legitimate targets. Ever, ever not in any case or any situation. However in war military targets are legitimate, I think most people belive that wether your muslim or not. And since the US, Britain and Italy has declared war on Iraq then by international law, iraq has the right to strike at military targets anywhere in the US, Britain or italy. Those are the rules of war, if you want to start one, you have to be prepaierd that your enemy is going to fight back. It is unfortunate that the resistance doesn’t have long reaching weapons that can hit back at military targets in these imperialist countries.

Besides this “al Qaeda” thing, is just a CIA/Mossad created front. George orwell 1984, Goldestein, it’ll open your eyes.

syrinx high priest
As I said for the second time syrinx, and as Blood thorn will also tell you. Jihad does not mean holy war, there is no such thing as holy war in islam, Jihad means to struggle.
As for this comment.
“in the event of a NUCLEAR ATTACK......bo dietl suggets we bomb religious sites”
Exactly, which means you perceive that you are not at war with a country or a group of people, you are at war with all the muslims, a third of the worlds population. Now if you are fighting against an entire religion isn’t that by your definition “holy war” ?

“if there is no such thing as a holy war in islam why do all the extremeists praise allah after their acts”

Which extremists are you actually talking about? Muslims quote from the koran in everything we do, wether it’s before we eat, or we before we take a test at school. We ask for guidance and help from god to lead us to the right path. But no where in the koran does It say you can have wars against an entire religion, unlike for Dietl whom you seem to support.



[edit on 2-8-2005 by Syrian Sister]

Originally posted by Syrian Sister
Islam has troops spread on American/Western soil so to them the MidEast ( Iraq, Iran, Mecca, etc. also) are legitimate targets”

I agree.

[edit on 2-8-2005 by C0le]

Too much crusading on all sides I feel .
Religion a good way to get young ment to die for low wages!

No one else seemed to notice the succint brilliance of CTID56092's post, so I have pasted it here.

Personally, I feel Christians AND Muslims are sub-humans.

Originally posted by Ray Davies
Personally, I feel Christians AND Muslims are sub-humans.

Hitler thought that Russian, Slavs, Poles, Blacks, and Jews were "sub-humans".
Combined, how many tens of millions were exterminated, murdered, killed, etc.?

Any thoughts on what you have just said in relation to what I have pointed out, Ray Davies? Your only talking about labeling/categorizing roughly 3.5 to 4 billion people as "sub-humans" there, mate.






seekerof

I know it's definetly not true about the majority christians, but some fundementalist christians won't stop terrorising and attacking people untill the whole world is christian. In the words of Dietly above "They have to wipe out everybody unless you become one of them". These are not real christians ofcource but more like demonic evangelists that where resurected from the last crusades.

I'm so glad someone was willing to say it!

What is this war really all about? WMDs? Human Rights? Dictatorships? Terrorism? Oil? Religion?

I am really beginning to wonder, it seems like bombing Iraq was exactly what Bin Laden wanted, it certified everything he's been telling the people around him about America for a long time.

I am just so ashamed to be human these days, and Australian who is a country aiding the war in Iraq (though only a few hundred troops so not by much I can assure you). I thought we'd put aside all these differences in politics and government a long time ago.

A "Holy War" is just one big load a crap, because I don't see how any war can be holy. If you beleive killing others because they don't have the same beliefs is Holy, then you are not only very very wrong, but you are also extreemly sadistic. Just my opinion though.

"syrinx high priest
As I said for the second time syrinx, and as Blood thorn will also tell you. Jihad does not mean holy war, there is no such thing as holy war in islam, Jihad means to struggle.
As for this comment.
“in the event of a NUCLEAR ATTACK......bo dietl suggets we bomb religious sites”
Exactly, which means you perceive that you are not at war with a country or a group of people, you are at war with all the muslims, a third of the worlds population. Now if you are fighting against an entire religion isn’t that by your definition “holy war” ?
quote: “if there is no such thing as a holy war in islam why do all the extremeists praise allah after their acts”
Which extremists are you actually talking about? Muslims quote from the koran in everything we do, wether it’s before we eat, or we before we take a test at school. We ask for guidance and help from god to lead us to the right path. But no where in the koran does It say you can have wars against an entire religion, unlike for Dietl whom you seem to support. "



do you support a nuclear strike on the US ? what would allah lead you to do after that ?





the second example of jihad I provided was from an islamic source, not my own, did you read the info on the link ?


try this one

www.answers.com...
jihad
The word jihad actually means "struggle, strive." The Arabic root of the word is jahada "to strive for." (The Arabic word for war is "harb.") Of the two types of jihad, the lesser type is the struggle against religious or political oppression, the second and greater is the soul's struggle with evil. Moderates think that while "jihad" might refer to an active war against an oppressive regime, such a war may be waged only against that regime, not innocent people. Radical Islamic fundamentalists assume that a jihad is a war without constraints.



Yes, if syria nukes the US, I would support a counter-attack, and no targets would be off limits. I'd support wiping it off the face of the earth


when will the moderate muslims get the courage to stand up to the radicals ?
haven't you seen enough suffering at their hands ?
www.washingtonpost.com...

Bomb Kills 25 at Funeral in Northern Iraq
Insurgents Press Campaign Against New Government; Death Toll Rises to 116 in 4 Days

By Caryle Murphy
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, May 2, 2005; Page A10

BAGHDAD, May 1 -- A suicide car bomber drove into a gathering of mourners at a funeral for a slain political leader Sunday in northern Iraq, killing 25 people and wounding at least 30, a provincial official said.


praise allah !

Originally posted by Ray Davies

Too much crusading on all sides I feel .
Religion a good way to get young ment to die for low wages!

No one else seemed to notice the succint brilliance of CTID56092's post, so I have pasted it here.

Personally, I feel Christians AND Muslims are sub-humans.

So, let's think about this for a second. If a Christian or a Muslim (the two are 180 degrees from one another, but is beside the point and beyond you) denounces their beliefs and takes up your beliefs, then they have become human?
Please, type with two hands and a brain, if you don't mind.

[edit on 2-8-2005 by Thomas Crowne]

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne

So, let's think about this for a second. If a Christian or a Muslim (the two are 180 degrees from one another, but is beside the point and beyond you) denounces their beliefs and takes up your beliefs, then they have become human?
Please, type with two hands and a brain, if you don't mind.

[edit on 2-8-2005 by Thomas Crowne]

No , he will consult with Pharaoh, all the while quoting Darwin.

sub-human? its funny how someone cant just be content with the feeling that what they believe is true....instead they have to make their own beliefs appear more valid by knocking other people down.

beliefs religious or otherwise are personal and usually very important to the person. and so to knock them down in such a way as to call them sub-human, in fact, only makes it harder for you to seem like a credible person...not the people you are trying to bring down.

Since we should be dealing with facts here..i think you may want to redefine what your impression of the word subhuman is because last time i checked the people that are less than human are the ones that are commiting the violence that has us all pissed off in the first place.

again, lets give credit where credit is due...the only people we should be mad at are the psycho people that are suicide bombing, the petafiles that are taking advantage of children, the judges that let them off with the a slab on the wrist, the people that invade your personal space by knocking down your beliefs, or forcing you to accept theirs.

the definition of sub-human are those that show blatent disrespect for your right to personal space and safety. and those people come from ALL walks of life. religious, non religious, black, white, asian, men woman.

so lets stop walking around with a chip on our shoulders because someone that belonged to a certian group religious or otherwise screwed us over once. lets start holding the individuals accountable not the philosophical ideas they hijacked and manipulated to further their selfish agendas.

Those are the facts.

Kind regards,
DigitalGirl

Originally posted by DigitalGrl


so lets stop walking around with a chip on our shoulders because someone that belonged to a certian group religious or otherwise screwed us over once. lets start holding the individuals accountable not the philosophical ideas they hijacked and manipulated to further their selfish agendas.

Those are the facts.

Kind regards,
DigitalGirl

Fine, then lets call a spade a spade and quit trying to be politically correct in dealing with an enemy.

When Islam itself speaks out against these crimes, then I will listen. I am not meaning the isolated ones in the West, but those that 'control' what is taught.

Christians do not sit in church thinking of ways to kill moslems....

your right ed, no true christian would, but im sure their are people that call themselves christians who have been trying to hurt people.
im not speaking out against christianity here ed, i am one

what im saying is be pissed at the right people....and i am in agreement with you, the ones that arent speaking out against these terrible acts are not doing their beliefs, or the people fighting to help them any justice.

all i was saying is that people shouldnt go around calling people with personal beliefs that they hold dear and personal to them sub-human.

on the other hand as well, we live in a free country its easy for us, or at least me to speak out against things because i dont have to worry about my family getting slaughtered if i do. i would like to think that if i were in their situation i would speak out anyway....but i cant pretend to be in their shoes. so while they SHOULD be speaking out, im sure some of the muslims want to, they are just afraid. im not saying that their arent some that support the terrorists..but the ones that dont support them, im sure they are just very afraid.

but am definatly in agreement with you

and political correctness is bs.

Kind Regards,
DigitalGirl

[edit on 10/01/2004 by DigitalGrl]

The fact people in this thread can seriously suggest that IF America is nuked, that Islam should be nuked off the planet makes it very easy for America to nuke itself and blame Islam for the sake of Bush's 'Crusade'.

How long do you need for an investigation to be done to determine where, who and why nukes were set off in America? Or should it just be 'assumed' it was Islam and therefor, right or wrong, America should nuke Iran in retaliation?

Be careful what you wish for. Any christians who have yet to visit the Vatican should do so very soon because if you nuke Mecca or Iran/ME in general - the Vatican will be destroyed very soon after.


"This crusade, this war on terrorism, is going to take a while. And American people must be patient.
-- Washington, D.C., Sep. 16, 2001


Dictionary definition:
Crusade

Any of the military expeditions undertaken by European Christians in the 11th, 12th, and 13th centuries to recover the Holy Land from the Muslims.