New Satanic Age???? (Not anti Christian)

Please post proof that human sacrifices have taken place amongst Satanic worshippers.

Thanks evahsomuch.

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by riley
There are christian 'denomiations' that get into a pit of snakes during a mass to test their faith and whether or not god is willing to save them.. whats the difference?

Which denominations do that?

When I lived in Alabama there were numerous snake handling
'christian' sects that lived in the N.E. part of ALabama. They
would handle snakes and toss 'em around and tease them during
worship. They quoted a bible quote about being able to be with
snakes and not have them bite or hurt you if your faith in God was
strong enough. I have not heard of 'pits', but I have seen the
Christian snake handler churches and I have seen more than a few
interviews and news reports from those churches ... they even
showed the actual service while it was in service with the boxes
of poisonous snakes at the front of the church that were used
in the services.

THese people consider themselves the 'true' Christians and most
will tell you that if you are a Christian and you don't 'handle snakes'
then you aren't a true Christian and you are going to hell.

It amazed me how many different Christian groups there were in
Alabama, and even more amazing was that each and every one
thought THEY were the only ones that were doing 'it' right and
everyone else was going to hell.

But anyways ... christian snake handlers are real. I don't know
one way or the other about the 'pits'. Haven't seen or heard of those.

Churches that practice serpent handling tend to be wary of publicity. This desire for privacy stems, in large part, from negative media attention that inevitably follows the practice after injuries or deaths due to snakebite occur.

"There are over 100 documented deaths from serpent bites," said Hood. "In every tradition, people are bitten and maimed by them. They risk their lives all the time by handling them. If you go to any serpent-handling church, you'll see people with atrophied hands, and missing fingers. All the serpent-handling families have suffered such things."

"It's a misconception that these people believe they won't get hurt," Hood explains. "The Bible says to take up serpents, not that they won't be bitten. If they're bit, that's up to God. The issue is obedience to God. There's no magic power type of stuff. They know the reality of it because so many families have had people hurt and killed."

www.rickross.com...
www.universalministries.com...
Penticostal [extreme] and 'Appalachian'. I don't see much difference between daring the fire or the poisonous snake bite though [tough choice ].

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
Please post proof that human sacrifices have taken place amongst Satanic

At first glance, it looks like there is evidence for both sides. However,
I would add that if anyone really was doing human sacrifices it would be
easy to do (homeless people) and I'm sure they wouldn't be advertising
that they do it. I'm sure they'd cover it up.

These say human sacrifice DOES go with Satanism -

Cases of Satanic sacrifices (human sacrifices) from around the world.
www.missingpersons-ireland.freepress-freespeech.com... humansacrifices.htm

Aliester Crowley--Knew about Human Sacrifice
www.the7thfire.com... crowley_33_degree_Mason_knew_about_human_sacrifice.htm

SRA CALENDAR
Satanic holiday dates change annually according to the regular calendar and ... Some groups are thought to sacrifice, cook and eat a human baby
on Easter ...
www.members.cox.net...

These say human sacrifice do not go with satanism

The Truth About Human Sacrifice
www.tylwythteg.com...

Ritual human sacrifice is done for the purpose of empowering Satan's followers
www.libertytothecaptives.net... fasting_and_prayer_candlemas.html -

Wicca and Paganism -
Anyone performing a human sacrifice nowadays is not wicca, nor satanist: is a ...
www.puertasdebabel.com...

Originally posted by riley
Penticostal [extreme] and 'Appalachian'. I don't see much difference between daring the fire or the poisonous snake bite though [tough choice

].

Hey, that's pretty whacked. Thanks for bringing that up. I'm surprised more action has not been taking by it if there is injury and death involved. The fact that it's maintained in secrecy in a free nation such as ours should be a red flag. Within those two links though, I don't see anything in the Bible about handling poisonous snakes. What I do see is Jesus when confronted with a proposition from the devil is his answer: "Do not put the Lord your God to the test" in Luke 4:12, which is what is also said in Deuteronomy 6:16. Does this practice make me angry? Yes, because it looks to me like a twisiting of the Word that I hold sacred and as a consequence the lives of people. Here's why this makes me angry. Those who are bitten and die are 'not strong in the spirit' and those are the people you need to keep alive, right? It makes no freakin' sense to anyone who's read the Book. Send 'em to Hell early? Where's the love in that?

I've been to a Pentecostal church a few times. It is a bit bizarre with supposed 'talking in tongues' that no-one understands (which is the opposite of what talking in tongues meant in the book of Acts. They all understood each other despite the different languages.), faintings and ballet dancing. Yes, I do mean actual ballet during church.

I believe the gifts of the spirit as recounted by Jesus and the apostles are not 'shows' to put on in front of a crowd, rather those things we do to benefit each other for the glory of God. This includes but is not limited to love, giving, faith, hope, joy, encouragement, understanding, and a willingness to serve God in a way that helps His children. Want to see a miracle? That fact that I'm still alive is one of them. I know I know, you'd rather see me avoid a snake bite...

I do believe Satanism is a little more wide-spread than the snake-handling Pentacostals of the Appalachians.


[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by FlyersFan

But anyways ... christian snake handlers are real. I don't know
one way or the other about the 'pits'. Haven't seen or heard of those.

religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu...

Here's a page I found with a little history on snake handlers.

religiousmovements.lib.virginia.edu...

It's nice to see an isolated group of snake-handlers who call themselves 'Christians' that are clearly in violation of the Word by putting others in danger, but let's talk about a much larger group that's titled in this thread. Satanists are not in voilation of their scripture by routine human sacrifice, rather encouraged to do so.

[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God
The fact that it's maintained in secrecy in a free nation such as ours should be a red flag.
::snip::
Within those two links though, I don't see anything in the Bible about handling poisonous snakes.

It's not a secret... I remember a show about them in the 70's (I think it was "in search of")

Mark 16:17-18: "And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues; They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover"

Luke 10:19: "Behold, I give unto you the power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over the power of the enemy: and nothing by any means shall hurt you"

Satanists are not in voilation of their scripture by routine human sacrifice, rather encouraged to do so.

Show me where their scripture allows it?

edited to fix quote

[edit on 8/1/2005 by Cug]

Originally posted by Cug
It's not a secret... I remember a show about them in the 70's (I think it was "in search of")

Not my idea, I took it from the linked article that said they like to maintain their secrecy.

Originally posted by Cug
Mark 16:17-18: "And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils;

In His name, yes. This isn't a "pentacostals only" reference.

Originally posted by Cug
they shall speak with new tongues;

Do ya think they're talking about languages here? If it is tongues of fire like in Acts, why cannot everyone understand them like in Acts? Also, where is the fire it speaks of appearing above their heads?

Originally posted by Cug
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them;

Score one point for the Pentacostals who can do this, but does that mean they are to use it as a test to kill those who do not or may not believe? This goes against that very same commission quoted about going out and spreading the good news. What they are doing to others, is that "good news"? Surely not if it's being brought up as a problem Christianity.

Originally posted by Cug
they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover"

Again, not a "Pentecostals only" sign.

Originally posted by Cug
Luke 10:19: "Behold, I give unto you the power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over the power of the enemy: and nothing by any means shall hurt you"

Pretty much the same as Psalms 91 for believers (not non-believers nor to be used as a test). Again, this doesn't negate not putting God to the test.

Originally posted by Cug
Show me where their scripture allows it?

The cost isn't worth the benefit, sorry. Same reason why I'm not going to start throwing out names and locations of these events.


Flyersfan, I can confirm some things about the calendar you've posted although it looks blended. Is it straight or blended? U2U me if I'm unclear with what I mean by that.

Can we get back to the topic on hand? These diversion tactics are getting annoying. Start a new thread if you want to talk about Snake-handling Pentacostals.

Pray, train, study,
God bless.

[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Cug
Show me where their scripture allows it?

The cost isn't worth the benefit, sorry. Same reason why I'm not going to start throwing out names and locations of these events.

That is not a good way to have a discussion saint4God. :-(

Flyersfan, I can confirm some things about the calendar you've posted although it looks blended.

So confirm away! please.

Originally posted by Cug
That is not a good way to have a discussion saint4God. :-(

Why would I put any sister or brother in harm's way? The Book I have next to me tells me not to, and I know exactly why it tells me not to do it.

Originally posted by Cug
So confirm away! please.

Gah, this is going to make me a freekin' target. What's new, right? Alright, I've signed an agreement with ATS (as we all have) to maintain the truth and so will do despite consequences. Hallows Eve is dead on. Equinoxes and Soltice also right. Full moon does relate to hightened activity. I've heard there are anti-holidays based on Christian belief. A lot of Satanic symbology is about anti-Christianing, sex, blood, and majik. They have their own Sabbaths to perform these things. I'd heard of abductions, but didn't think there was that kind of aggressive fulfillment. Again, raises too much suspicion I thought. They've black-bagged animals though so why not if they have the ability.

[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God

Why would I put any sister or brother in harm's way? The Book I have next to me tells me not to, and I know exactly why it tells me not to do it.

Why would you want to put me in harms way? That is exactly what these rumors do. For example. I'm sure sometime at work somebody has asked you "What did you do over the weekend?" and you might of said I went to a Church social, or had my Bible study group over to my house, or something to that effect. or maybe on your lunch breaks you read the Bible. No big deal right? I on the other hand would never mention my religion at work, because frankly I fear that I would treated like a pariah. Like what happened in my last job.

Another example, about 10 years ago, I attended a get together at a local "New Age Bookshop" Durring this event, a brick with "repent sinners" written on it was thrown thru a window and a small child had to be taken to to the hospital for glass cuts.

Another... right now there is a court case going on in Indiana where a Judge as part of a divorce settlement (Both parents are Wiccans) Prohibiting the parents from teaching their child their faith.

This is the real harm you are doing.

Gah, this is going to make me a freekin' target.

Join the club! I get targeted for my faith all the time.

Hallows Eve is dead on.

Dead on??? "sexual climax, association with the demons, animal and/or human sacrifice" How is that dead on?

I'd heard of abductions, but didn't think there was that kind of aggressive fulfillment. Again, raises too much suspicion I thought. They've black-bagged animals though so why not if they have the ability.

You know what I have heard similar. a person who tied up his victims and tortured them before killing them....... The BTK Killer .... Who was a leader of his Christian Church.

Originally posted by Cug
Why would you want to put me in harms way? That is exactly what these rumors do. For example. I'm sure sometime at work somebody has asked you "What did you do over the weekend?" and you might of said I went to a Church social, or had my Bible study group over to my house, or something to that effect. or maybe on your lunch breaks you read the Bible. No big deal right? I on the other hand would never mention my religion at work, because frankly I fear that I would treated like a pariah. Like what happened in my last job.

I feel ya. I can't talk religion at work either. I'm also thinking about changing my work so that I can.

I don't want to teach scripture from Satanism. I have my own scripture I'm to represent. When a Christian says the "power" of the Word, they mean that it has a sincere, honest, truthful message of a loving God. When a Satanist says the "power" of their word, they mean something entirely different. I have no wish to facilitate that process whatsoever. I'm flagging it as a warning, not bannering to promote.

Originally posted by Cug
Another example, about 10 years ago, I attended a get together at a local "New Age Bookshop" Durring this event, a brick with "repent sinners" written on it was thrown thru a window and a small child had to be taken to to the hospital for glass cuts.

That sucks! I'm sorry that happened. It's totally uncalled for. What good came from that brick? None. A true Christian would already know that. I've been in a new age bookshop, a blatantly occult shop or two, a mixed (Christian, occult and others all in one store), and a few other places without realizing it. When I did realize it, I didn't go running out, throwing stuff or what have you. I just didn't buy anything.

Originally posted by Cug
Another... right now there is a court case going on in Indiana where a Judge as part of a divorce settlement (Both parents are Wiccans) Prohibiting the parents from teaching their child their faith.

Er...I thought one was Wiccan and the other was not. Are we talking about the same case? I believe there was a whole lot more to the story than that. It got sensationalized as anti-wiccanism but the case didn't really have to do with that. I may be wrong since it's been a few months since I read the articles so feel free to correct me.

Originally posted by Cug
This is the real harm you are doing.

Tell me again the real harm I am doing? I haven't seen it here yet.

Join the club! I get targeted for my faith all the time.

Hehe, makes two of us then. Sad, isn't it?

Dead on??? "sexual climax, association with the demons, animal and/or human sacrifice" How is that dead on?

As I've said, which is why I want to know if it was a calendar blended of different cults or is a straight standard for all to the best of the poster's knowledge. Per above, I mentioned one cult does not do the human sacrifice thing.

You know what I have heard similar. a person who tied up his victims and tortured them before killing them....... The BTK Killer .... Who was a leader of his Christian Church.

I've followed that case as well. Again, we've got this miniscule case of 1 non-Christian claiming to be Christian versus a Satanic society that finds these practices acceptable. Let's stay focused, shall we? Start a thread on the BTK killer and I'll join you in saying how screwed up he was.

[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
Please post proof that human sacrifices have taken place amongst Satanic worshippers.

Thanks evahsomuch.

Funny thing about sacrifices. The evidence is destroyed. Oh, and they don't let you take pictures.


[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by Cug
This is the real harm you are doing.

Tell me again the real harm I am doing? I haven't seen it here yet.

I've followed that case as well. Again, we've got this minuscule case of 1 non-Christian claiming to be Christian versus a Satanic society that finds these practices acceptable. Let's stay focused, shall we? Start a thread on the BTK killer and I'll join you in saying how screwed up he was.

There you go... that's the harm. Nobody with an ounce of sense is going to think the BTK killer or say Jim Jones are true Christians and represent all of Christianity. They were not Christians even if they claimed to be ones.... they were wackos.

Now the group you were talking about even if they claimed they were Satanists they were not.. they were wackos. It's just not fair to lump them all together. Yea you said the other group you know about don't kill people, but it read like they didn't only because they can't get get away with it.

What this is doing is fueling hate. And the simpletons who think they are doing Gods work come out of the woodwork and they are the ones causing damage. Examples like the abortion clinic bombing wackos, or the guy behind the godhatesfags.com website (Another good quote on that site "Thank God for the bombing of London's subway" sigh)

The thing with these wackos is they don't stop with Satanism, take a look at flyersfans links, of the 3 links promoting that satanist practice human sacrifice The first one mentions everything from witchcraft to vampires, one mentions Crowley who wasn't a Satanist (FYI I'm a Thelemite, a follower of Crowley's teachings) the calender link shows Wiccan holidays as Satanic. you see what happens of you don't make a distinction between legitimate groups and the wackos? If I wanted to I could compile a long list of "Christian" ritual murder and back it up with some bible missquotes, but that would be just as wrong as what these people are doing.

[edit on 8/1/2005 by Cug]

Originally posted by Cug
There you go... that's the harm. Nobody with an ounce of sense is going to think the BTK killer or say Jim Jones are true Christians and represent all of Christianity. They were not Christians even if they claimed to be ones.... they were wackos.

Now the group you were talking about even if they claimed they were Satanists they were not.. they were wackos. It's just not fair to lump them all together.

My friend is NOT a wacko. You'd probably have to know him to know that. He's got logical, intelligent, and explains why he does all of it. Looking back, I'm surprised at the amount of education he was willing to provide. The fact is that it is evil and against God, both of which he's perfectly aware of and can attest to. All actions have sufficient support according to his ideologies so he's not going out on a limb here. I was seriously considering joining myself at one point. Well, that when the stuff hit the fan as they say and got away from it all while I still could. Anyhow, not a wacko and that's a pretty bold judgement to make about somebody you don't know.

Originally posted by Cug
Yea you said the other group you know about don't kill people, but it read like they didn't only because they can't get get away with it.

Good, because that's how he'd represented it to me.

Originally posted by Cug
What this is doing is fueling hate.

I'm not fueling hate. I do not hate someone I befriend. I'm providing the information to you in the way he provided information to me. The only difference is I recommend that people do not practice it instead of recruiting for it.

Originally posted by Cug
And the simpletons

Sheesh, here we go again. Talk about hate...

Originally posted by Cug
who think they are doing Gods work come out of the woodwork and they are the ones causing damage.

Again I ask what damage I have caused. Again you've not answered that question with any reasonable answer.

Originally posted by Cug
Examples like the abortion clinic bombing wackos, or the guy behind the godhatesfags.com website (Another good quote on that site "Thank God for the bombing of London's subway" sigh)

More spin. Can't stay on topic, can we?

Originally posted by Cug
The thing with these wackos is they don't stop with Satanism, take a look at flyersfans links, of the 3 links promoting that satanist practice human sacrifice The first one mentions everything from witchcraft to vampires, one mentions Crowley who wasn't a Satanist (FYI I'm a Thelemite, a follower of Crowley's teachings) the calender link shows Wiccan holidays as Satanic.

That why I asked if it was mixed or straight.

Originally posted by Cug
you see what happens of you don't make a distinction between legitimate groups and the wackos? If I wanted to I could compile a long list of "Christian" ritual murder and back it up with some bible missquotes, but that would be just as wrong as what these people are doing.

Back to Christians again. Okay Cug, there's a bajillion threads on Christianity. How about going there to rant?

[edit on 1-8-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
There's no evidence of human sacrifices relating to any real Satanic cult/group/religion, and the "Satanic ritual abuse" myth has been debunked several hundred times.

tinkleflower-
if the '"myth" of ritual abuse has been debunked several hundred times, then please provide us all with a few links that prove that such activity is just a myth. i'd prefer some well-documented research as opposed to someone's opinion that the who idea of ritual abuse is ridiculous.

Saint4God, Just for the record. I'm being nice here. I'm not attacking you or your beliefs. I'm saying this just because it sounds to me you think I'm "attacking" you.

Originally posted by saint4God

My friend is NOT a wacko.

If your friend is part of a group the kills animal and people he is a wacko and you should report him to the police!!!! If he is not part of the group that kills people and is part of the group just wants to kill if he could get away with it, he is in great danger of doing something very very bad. In anycase they are not satanists! They are just think they are.

]

Originally posted by Cug
And the simpletons

Sheesh, here we go again. Talk about hate...

]

You don't think the godhatefags guy and the abortion bombers are simpletons??? What are they find upstanding Christians? That is who I was referring to as simpletons.

Again I ask what damage I have caused. Again you've not answered that question with any reasonable answer.

Hate speech.
You are claiming all Satanists practice human sacrifice or would if they could get away with it. That at least is the impression you have given me. That type of thing feeds the paranoia of the people who are willing to do bad things.

More spin. Can't stay on topic, can we?

]

How was it spin? I was showing an example of what hate speech becomes.

Back to Christians again. Okay Cug, there's a bajillion threads on Christianity. How about going there to rant?

SIGH

So your telling me you see no correlation between bad people claiming the are Christians, and bad people claiming to be Satanists? Bad people are bad people, no matter what they claim their Faith is?

Originally posted by Cug
Saint4God, Just for the record. I'm being nice here. I'm not attacking you or your beliefs. I'm saying this just because it sounds to me you think I'm "attacking" you.

It's cool. Apologies on my end if I'm sounding harsh, it's not intentional.

Originally posted by Cug
If your friend is part of a group the kills animal and people he is a wacko and you should report him to the police!!!!

Hehe. Let the jury decide. What I'm trying to say is he's not mentally unstable or insane, which is what I though you meant by wacko. He's doing his master's work as requested. He's not off doing something on his own. In fact, he said he believes true Satanism is very clear and straight-forward. Others who get wrapped up in the mystery and convolutedness are really wasting their time when they can go right to the source and get the power they need.

Originally posted by Cug
If he is not part of the group that kills people and is part of the group just wants to kill if he could get away with it, he is in great danger of doing something very very bad.

That may be. I did my best to talk and level with him. I don't know what more can be done on my part.

Originally posted by Cug
In anycase they are not satanists! They are just think they are.

Well they're pretty well versed and practiced imposters . I wish I could step out of it and let you talk to him directly. The level of detail he has to offer may be surprisingly impressive. I think that'd be the only way to convince you he's not going off half-cocked.

Originally posted by Cug
You don't think the godhatefags guy and the abortion bombers are simpletons???

On the contrary, I think the mind that hates and kills is incredibly complex...and not in a good way either.

Originally posted by Cug
What are they find upstanding Christians? That is who I was referring to as simpletons.

Clarity appreciated on that part. Sounded like they were being lumped in with Christians.

Originally posted by Cug
Hate speech.
You are claiming all Satanists practice human sacrifice or would if they could get away with it.

If I claimed this then I was in error. I can say however I know of two cults, one that has a reputation for doing so and a person representing the other who would probably participate given the opportunity.

I'm not giving hate speech. I love my friend (regardless of belief), any Christian, any Muslim, any Bhuddist, any Hindu, any Wiccan, any Shinto, as well as anyone who'd consider pinning me to a floor-drawn symbol and draining me dry. What I give is testimony based on the information I've received and what I've experienced. If you hear anything beyond that then by all means pitch it into the garbage.

Originally posted by Cug
That at least is the impression you have given me. That type of thing feeds the paranoia of the people who are willing to do bad things. It's an ugly way to go in my mind, but cannot hate a person for it.

It's not meant to make anyone paranoid. This thread is bringing up all kinds of ugly memories so it's not the easiest thing in the world for me to talk about, but I'm leaving those thoughts out of this. What matters is that people are informed in every regard possible about the topic.

Originally posted by Cug
How was it spin? I was showing an example of what hate speech becomes.

Do you fear I'm in danger of becoming a non-Christian who bombs clinics and become swelled with homophobia then beat down others? If so, rest assured. It is not possible.

Originally posted by Cug
SIGH

So your telling me you see no correlation between bad people claiming the are Christians, and bad people claiming to be Satanists? Bad people are bad people, no matter what they claim their Faith is?

Motivation. Who do Christians worship? God. What are the characteristics of God? Love, faith, hope, truth, good, compassion, etc. Who do Satanists worship? What are the characteristics of Satan? If you need help on this one, I can then draw on first hand experience. Are you going to have exceptions to the rule, where people claim to be something they're not? Sure, but rarely. Let's talk about the 99% on both sides of the fence. Since this isn't 'yet another' Christian thread (or at least should not be), let's stick with the 99% based on the thread title. Also, if I may point out the parathesis that say "Not anti Christian". I think that's why I was attracted to this thread in particular. Here I thought I could reasonably speak my mind without going through the normal throws against Christianity. It's the username isn't it? I get into the same situation on the evolution thread. Surprisingly on the UFO, Masonic, and Cryptozoology threads they seem not to get in an uproar.

I frequent ATS a lot and don't mean to 'threadjack' as some call it. So Cug, if you're inclined to, would you be willing to share some of your experiences with Satanism and those you know involved in it?

Originally posted by Tinkleflower
Please post proof that human sacrifices have taken place amongst Satanic worshippers.

Thanks evahsomuch.

uh... in the satanic bible there is a chapter called "On the choice of a Human Sacrifice (that just gives it away...) and i think that.... uhhhh.... page 99 "The Black Mass" .... "If a baby can be slaughtered during the ritual, so much the better (...)" ok after the whole ritual black mass thing (prostitute blood dead baby blah blah blah) Satan if sepost to apper.... so im guessing that the satanists will like that so they will do much to make it happen and im not sure if the woman for the black mass is sepost to be dead or alive