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WAR: France ejects 12 Islamic 'preachers of hate'

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posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 09:37 PM
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Taking unprecedented anti-terrorism steps, France announced that between now and the end of August, a dozen Islamist 'preachers of hate' will be deported. France does this despite the vocalizing by the human rights lobby against such actions. Of notable interest was this mention:
 



France ejects 12 Islamic 'preachers of hate'
Imams and their followers who fuel anti-western feeling among impressionable young French Muslims will be rounded up and returned to their countries of origin, most commonly in France's case to its former north African colonies.

Mr Sarkozy also revealed that as many as 12 French mosques associated with provocative anti-western preaching were under surveillance. Imams indulging in inflammatory rhetoric will be expelled even if their religious status is recognised by mainstream Muslim bodies.

Those who have assumed French citizenship will not be protected from deportation. Mr Sarkozy said he will reactivate measures, "already available in our penal code but simply not used", to strip undesirables of their adopted nationality. "We have to act against radical preachers capable of influencing the youngest and most weak-minded," Mr Sarkozy told the French daily Le Parisien.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


France has long been cracking down on its Muslim populace, more so, than any other European nation. I would imagine that there will be ramifications against this decision by France, to what degree or how, will certainly be of speculation. Is this move by France legitimate and without violation, or simply a move made out of desperation and necessity?

Related News Links:
Crackdown On Radicals
French Prisons Teeming With Muslims
France 'to expel radical imams'

[edit on 29-7-2005 by Seekerof]




posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 10:13 PM
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Obviously, this meets everyone's approval?
No issues whatsoever?
Interesting....


Anyhow, another enlightening excerpt from a rather interesting read:


And make no mistake: this is no mere matter of Free Speech. The Islamist being struck at is generally not the Islamist attempting to exercise his constitution right to free speech; it is rather the Islamist who, having given his allegiance wholly to totalitarian Islam, has acted to systematically conceal this fact. We will not merely abridge his freedom of speech; we will also abridge his freedom of thought.

'We Don't Need to Fight, We Are Taking Over!'




seekerof



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 10:48 PM
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I voted yes to this. I warned people in another forum a couple years ago about the Islamization of France on the parts of Muslim radicals and fundamentalist clerics living in France.

In 732, France came close to being conquered by the Muslim forces invading France from Spain, all thanks to this great man. If it hasn't been for him, history would have been very, very different today.

He sired a son who would produce the greatest European king of the first millennium.


[edit on 7/29/2005 by the_oleneo]



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 10:53 PM
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You will not hear this soften from me............

Mark one
for France.......

Hopefully others will follow their lead....


did I just say that?



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 11:05 PM
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France is very strange in how they can pass crazy laws such as deporting their own naturalized citizens and throwing people in jail for years without charges or a trial yet criticize others (read the U.S.) for doing far less...

However, I can't complain about this new policy...seems like it's just meant to correct past mistakes in allowing these people in.



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 11:05 PM
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Hey edsinger......long time listener, first time caller....

You do realize that this sets a precedent, right?

If not in the American legal system, then in the social structure.......

Are we to be prone to allow a blatant disruption of our rights at the behest at somene who says we are a 'fill in the blank' label that is socially unacceptable.....all it takes is a bit of legwork and someone who said something out of context gets labeled to the extreme where and decisions get made without a logical process........I prefer to think of it more as a legal witchhunt.....

I'll step up on the record in this thread as one who disagrees with here......the French dropped the ball here.....

NOTE: I do not in any way condone the preachings. I further do not condone hate and it's many subsequent actions.

[edit on 29-7-2005 by MemoryShock]



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 11:34 PM
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This is only the beginning.
The articles linked indicate that the numbers will grow and grow apparently unabated.

One issue I am seeing here is how and what will be defined or gauged as 'hate speech or preaching.' France is pretty much saying that if you are a Muslim or have a Muslim heritage and you decide to voice harsh dissent, in whatever form, despite your being a French citizen, you can and will be subject to deportation.

This move, though seen by some as a positive necessary action or step, if not checked or monitored, will lead to some major ramifications, both from a individual freedom aspect and inalienable right, to simply causing further Muslim discontent. In regard to the last mention, I posted an interesting article discussing Terrorists' Strategy for Europe?, where it was mentioned:



The terrorists' strategy for generating additional European recruits is simple: launch vicious attacks and count on the resulting harsh government crackdown to alienate the local Muslims.


Read it again, then apply what France is doing and what other European nations are contemplating. Is this not playing right into that alleged strategy?

Fine line here people and one worthy of taking notice of.




seekerof

[edit on 29-7-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 11:39 PM
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Seems to me Human Rights and Laws respecting Free Speech go's out the window when terrorism get's attached.

Perhap's rightfully so.. France is doing a pre-emptive thing.

Dallas



posted on Jul, 29 2005 @ 11:56 PM
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I'm sure this is just one in a progression of laws like this, that started with the banning of the chador in schools and public buildings. I don't think France has a Bill of Rights in its Constitution like the U.S. does, so they can pretty much pass any law they want to. I wouldn't be surprised to see many Muslims expelled as they see more of a risk of terror from their massive disaffected and disenfranchised Islamic population.


[edit on 7/29/2005 by djohnsto77]



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 12:05 AM
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[Nicolas Sarkozy's]proposals [to deport 'preachers of hate'] reflect French determination to act swiftly against extremists in defiance of the human rights lobby, which is noticeably less vocal in France than in Britain.


With regard to the human rights issue, I would say that the right of the majority to live peaceably outweighs the rights of certain individuals to incite terrorism. Until we wake up and determine that the enemy is in our midst, we will be like fish being shot in a barrel. Whatever France does in this regard is the business of France. It's about time they did something.


[edit on 2005/7/30 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 12:39 AM
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as posted by GradyPhilpott
Whatever France does in this regard is the business of France.


Though I do have some tendency to agree Grady, in this applied case, especially if not done prudently by France, France's actions may have possible bearing and ramifications within Europe or even the US, as in more acts of terrorism, thus possibly making it the business of those who may be affected?
Again, bear in mind:


The terrorists' strategy for generating additional European recruits is simple: launch vicious attacks and count on the resulting harsh government crackdown to alienate the local Muslims.


Removing those who spread and preach "hate" will not resolve the problem of preventing future acts of terrorism. The action being taken by France will only inflame, embolden, and incite further "hate" rhetoric and possible acts, IMHO. Time will tell...





seekerof

[edit on 30-7-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 01:03 AM
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Well I guess the advice would be to quit preaching hate if you don't want deported.

simple concept - you don't play by the rules of a civil society, you leave. Forced or not.

They can not just let them continue, nor can they imprison them as that would just create more problems.

If you don't like it, leave for be forced to leave.

Its not like they are exercising free speech, they are inciting hate and calling for JiHad against non Muslims.

This should make the Moderate Muslims do MORE to stamp them out.



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 01:29 AM
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Originally posted by Seekerof[/http/www.techcentralstation.com/072205E.html]'We Don't Need to Fight, We Are Taking Over!'[/url]
seekerof


A most interesting read indeed. I have not even attempted to read & digest the remainder of this thread as yet, but the article called up by the link you provided is most thought provoking and troubling.



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 02:26 AM
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SeekerOf - I'm not so sure I agree with the contention (in one of your links) that the simple strategy is to commit terrorist acts so the western govts. will crack down harshly and thus alienate the remainder of the Muslim population.

Now, having said that, my comment on the recent French actions regarding those Muslims preaching hate & viloence, is that their actions are understandable. The French potentially have more of a radical islamic terrorist problem than any other western nation simply because of the sheer number of people of the Islamic faith. If insurrection ever gets started there it could spiral into a widspread problem that would be difficult to contain.

I would imagine the French have considered the possible ramifications of their actions.



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 03:20 AM
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This is a good thing!

Freedom of speech is one thing, however promoting hatred against another group should NOT be tolerated...and I don't care whether the hatred promoters are Muslim, Jewish, Catholic or WHOEVER.

Cheers

JS

[edited for spelling]

[edit on 30-7-2005 by jumpspace]



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 03:24 AM
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the only thing i can say is about time! Holland needs to do the same. Europeans are too welcoming for their own good. they open their arms and show tolerance etc. what do they or will they get in return, probably bombed. This isn't a rascist thing so i dont even want to hear that, but euros need to step up and take some pride in their land, and way of life.



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 04:28 AM
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As "XphilesPhan" said, the same thing is going on in Holland, and its good.

These 'Preachers of Hate' don't speak Dutch (of French),they grew up in Saudi Arabia, come to our western societies to tell muslims how they should live. These preachers are an example of how muslims should behave, but they have no idea what our society is all about, what is normal and acceptable in our countries.

Let me give an example: A few years ago. a notorious preacher in Holland told his followers that gays should be thrown of 10-story buildings, heads first.

To my opinion those kind of people simply do not belong in a modern society, they are a danger to it, we should be procected from them.



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 04:35 AM
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This is perhaps one of the most sensible things France has done in
a long time. It seems to me to be a sensible policy to eject those who
hold in contempt a nation that has so generously allowed them there
for no really good reason other than very misguided humanitarianism.
Removing those who despise one's nation, culture ,etc. (even as they benefit
from it) is good policy. IT can only make that place better for those who actually deserve
to be there. What positive contribution has the massive influx of often virulently anti–western Muslims (and others) into Europe really made? How have they improved
things for the natives?

I think this situation relates very well to the bigger issue for all western nations, which is the problem of massive incompatible immigration. Why import a problem population when you have always had problems enough of your own? It is very easy for nations to tolerate themselves to death..



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 07:13 AM
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but is this really a solution....theyll just continue their work elsewhere



posted on Jul, 30 2005 @ 08:44 AM
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France is showing common sense and a courage that the British government lacks the preachers of hate have been allowed to stir up trouble in Britain, particularly London for years, this should be stopped now. Tony Blair is good at going to war in other countries whilst ignoring what's happening at home this country is now full of illigal's and home grown exremists, I fear for our future, and it's Blair and his wishy washy liberal-minded mates that's got us in this mess



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