WAR: Authorities Arrest Men With NYC Maps, Video

I think that you are missing a key point, Marg. The fact that they were in the country illegally. It wasn't the maps or the video that stood out to me, or even the money. If they were previously employed as engineers I can see them having that kind of cash around. That's not a big deal.

BUT, being in the country illegally with all the above, that is cause for concern.

Well we have pleanty of illegals with maps in the south, but they are Mexicans should we gather them also as "suspicious"

Let see what happen next.

If they are guilty good for the authorities, but if they are not then we have a problem, is pleanty of illegals around but which ones will become the target as suspicious, that is the key.

I think the map industry will get a downgrade from issues like this.

Yes Marg we should. Terrorists can come in any race, someone could pay someone of another race to commit an act. Our borders should be closed to illegals, should have been closed since 9/11 if we were serious about preventing terrorism in the USA.

my entire family and millions of other US citizens, have applied, waited and endured the legal process to be citizens of this country. These illegals who sneak into our country do not deserve any special treatment, they need to get on line like the rest of the us and follow the proper procedures to be a legal resident here.

the police didn't go after these men because they had maps. The maps, videos and cash made it suspicious enough for them to arrest them, which led to them finding out they were illegal.

I know how the system works my first job in GA was not as a teacher but working with a migration lawyer.

Yes the circunstances make them suspicous, maps, money, middle easter men so race is a factor, and top it with illegal.

But the key here is if things get our of hand.

especially when they ask if there is anyone else in the home, and you say "no," and just happen to forget the four illegal aliens, all of whom happen to be highly trained engineers who are looking for minimum wage jobs as street vendors.

And these aliens have come to new york city, but not to visit the statue of liberty, or the Guggenheim museum, or central park, or to see shows on broadway. Nope, these guys happen to be avid map-collectors of subway routes. Are there a lot of chemical engineers who collect subway timetables? And what did they collect as momentos of their visit to the big apple? Just some videos they made. Not of them standing in front of famous landmarks; but of the landmarks themselves, in relation to the NYC skyline.

Frankly, if these guys were Americans of European descent, I'd think the cops would at least have a few questions for them . . .


The giveaway is the "unemployed engineer seeks job selling falafel from a push-cart."

Reminds me of an "ex-" marine, who was trained speaking Russian, and in operating top secret radar equipment. He had a job working with top-secret materials in the photo lab at a military contractor in Dallas, Texas. But he quit that job in order to take a minimum wage at the Texas Schoolbook Depository . . .

Part of me is going "yay, another terrorist sympathizer gone and plans prevented". Even if these guys have no membership in a known terrorist cell, doesn't mean they don't know pople who do and are doing the intel gathering for them.

Another part says "what crime was committed"? and worries that the definition of terrorism is changing too far. Or that these guys were doing a protest action or some sort of propaganda mission, to get arrested being "innocent" and use that to attack the legal system and law enforcement.

I fear, that like crime, terrorism cannot be fully "prevented". And that by attempting to do so, we destroy too much.

Better, we produce a system that allows full, severe, righteous anger and punishment after an attack. A system that doesn't cover for dictators, royal families, and so-called religious groups. One that punishes the guilty and involved parties so severely that criminals realize their free ride is over, and get them to try other, safer nations to target.

But as long as the enemy uses our own system against us, the Media willingly the propaganda tool for the murderes, as long as (thanks, Mick!) "the cops are all criminals and all the sinners, saints" there will never be proper retribution. And without a high probability of violent, severe, effective punishment to all that terrorists hold dear (the same targets they assault on us) they will continue to try to get away with it.

Sadly, it means reacting as opposed to acting. Or being ready to act the second a bomb is placed and before it goes off, catching these bastards red-handed.

This is the true American Way. Punish the guilty, as savagely as they attack...not punishing everyone to lesser degrees. This is the way of the enemy, of the ancient royal families who now use their obscene wealth and connections to try to restore their world-spanning empires of old.

America was a dynamic, agressive, innovative nation. To be these things we have to be willing to take risks, earn criticism, make mistakes. To be the friend of honest people and the bully that steps on the necks of the corrupt and evil. Instead we spend our time worried about the public opinion of the same nations we used to work so hard to avoid being. The more we work to be like the so-called "old world" the worse we have gotten.

We were our greatest when we were a nation of cowboys. John Wayne type, hard working, hard drinking, hard fighting, hard loving, scarred and rugged, honest to a fault. We were regarded as "primitive savages" in the eyes of Europe and the Middle East and Asia. So the rich and powerful wanted to be accepted by these older , decadent, declining powers and in so doing, inherited their decay. Worldly "sophistication" did us not one bit of good.

what crime was committed?

great post phugedaboutit, but you forget "THEY"RE ILLEGALS" They've broken the law and committed a crime by illegally entering and residing in this country.

and one more thing...
The only problem with cracking down on illegals in this country is if we only crackdown on people from one country or region. All illegals, whether Mexican, Chinese, Korean, Peruvian, Indian, or Canadian should be prosecuted equally, but before we even get to equally, let's just get to prosecuted. We don't have to give up our civil liberties if we close our borders and refine the process for legal entrance. Terrorists and specifically Muslims (for those who only have tunnel vison) come in all colors, races and nationalities.



[edit on 7-28-2005 by worldwatcher]

All illegals are prosecuted. The hospitality industry in Florida employs many Euro/Slavic nation immigrants and the agricultural industry hires lots of cubans and mexicans. They all get raided.

Sorry for the earlier rant (EOH)

They should be deported because they are here illegaly.

The deportation should have absolutley NOTHING to do with the video's or maps. It will though.

Punishing anyone for a crime they did not commit is ILLEGAL also.

Past that... in all reality punishing anyone for threating to do a act may be illegal, but it is in most case's unconstitutional, and just plain wrong. (With exception to threats on the president, and such)

Originally posted by Xerrog

.. in all reality punishing anyone for threating to do a act may be illegal, but it is in most case's unconstitutional, and just plain wrong. (With exception to threats on the president, and such)

You're kidding, right?

There are all kinds of criminal statues that outlaw specific behaviors in which you "try" to do something, but are prevented or never carry out the act. For instance "attempted murder."

In many states there is a crime called "terroristic threat" which is from British common law, where you threaten or pretend to do something horrible in order to inspire fear, or to coerce people into doing your will.

Waving a gun in a bank is an example of an implied threat. You may not have committed murder, but you've definitely done SOMETHING. If nothing more than freak out a lot of well-meaning people.

While the people in this article may be guilty of nothing more than illegal presence in the US, an investigation will reveal whether or not they are agents of criminal organizations. "Criminal Association" IS a serious felony--I think it's covered under RICO. If you know what your associates have done or are planning, you are just as guilty as they are when you assist them.