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The motives behind the O&C Conspiracy Forum?

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posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 10:29 AM
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There is no reason to establish this forum.
While I do not wish this to become a little bickering forum of between creationists and evolutionists, it is out of a respect for the truth I must say God created the world. There is no conspiracy behind it.
Nor is there a conspiracy within evolutionist theory.
Certainly many organizations seek to use Modern Evolutionary Theory to further their own agenda, but that's not conspiracy, that is merely deceit.

I've only seen a few threads that came even close to conspiracy

Young earthers vs Old earthers the conspiracy keeps growing.
and this thread was just foolish.


quoted from marg6043
The creationist movement is almost exclusively the Protestant American Fundamentalist movement that seeks to impose on the general public, by “Political” means, a religion that revolves around the creation stories of the bible.


I'm sorry to be so blunt marg, but Christians are not despite what you may say, trying to force our views on others by political means man. All of these souls you see up in here fighting off evolution in the name of Jesus are here because they don't want to see you hurt for your sins. Whether you accept that or not does not change the fact this is how it is...

and then there was...
Creationism Conspiracy in the News: Creationism's blind eye
well, SO tried, but again this isn't a conspiracy, in fact it's trash. I subscribed to the Philly, went through all 13 sponsors and read the article, it was disgusting. Creationists should not (though I still must pray they do not, as a few will still) be defending creation to protect their own repuation. The reason I, as millions of others also have, sided with Biblical creation is there has never been any legitimate reason not to believe a word the Bible says. Now don't start attacking Scriptures you bloodthirsty fools, but listen... The motives are out of love for others. Again, another failed attempt to pin conspiracy on the believers in Christ.

Considering these things and more, I am lead to say it to all of you, "where is this conspiracy in orgins and creationism?"
This forum is mererly being used as a slaughterhouse for Christianity.
Now if it were use for "conspiracies in orgins" as I would have hoped it had been established for, we would see more threads on how history is and has been re-written or erased from us.
However, it is not and so I must conclude this forum has fallen to waste.

Please respond with wisdom and address the material and message above, for foolishness and anger lead to nothing,
- Tass




posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by Tassadar
There is no reason to establish this forum.

It was established because threads in other forums were being derailed by this issue.

Yet another creationalist willing to slam evolution as being false without being able to offer irrefutable proof against it.. big surprise there.



posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 10:44 AM
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Foolishness!!!
No where did I slam evolution.
I am telling you there is not need for this forum.
If it is simply to be a battleground between creation and evolution (which is what about 40 of the 153 threads here are about), then rename it.

You try to ignore the truth by attacking my character which, at this moment, isn't working with your smooth little "yet another" label. Your kind disgust me for they will not hear reason or listen to wisdom.



posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 11:17 AM
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Originally posted by Tassadar
There is no reason to establish this forum.
While I do not wish this to become a little bickering forum of between creationists and evolutionists, it is out of a respect for the truth I must say God created the world. There is no conspiracy behind it.

I disagree. Things like the Wedge Document clearly indicate that there are people within the creationist movement who are indeed engaged in a conspiracy. Creationism itself needn't be a conspiracy, but there is a conspiracy that uses creationism. Its just like with our Conspiracies in Religion forum, not all religion is a conpsiracy, but there have definitly been conspiracies in religion. Just look at the NCSE feeds for the forum to see the activity of the conspiracy in creationism.




Certainly many organizations seek to use Modern Evolutionary Theory to further their own agenda, but that's not conspiracy, that is merely deceit.

Who does this??


I've only seen a few threads that came even close to conspiracy

Because there is a conspiracy within creationism, the forum will also discuss the creationism and evolution controversy. ATS is not a science site, is a conspiracy and weirdness site, so of course the Conspiracy angle is what attracted the attention.





I'm sorry to be so blunt marg, but Christians are not despite what you may say, trying to force our views on others by political means man.

All christians, no, certainly not, you are correct. But there are christians out there who are doing just this.


All of these souls you see up in here fighting off evolution in the name of Jesus are here because they don't want to see you hurt for your sins.

Accepting that evolution occurs is hardly a sin. Its no more a sin that recognizing that matter is composed of atoms or that gravity is what puts the heavens in motion. Recognizing science is not sin. Even the apostle Thomas, a saint for god, had to see the wounds in jesus firsthand.


sided with Biblical creation is there has never been any legitimate reason not to believe a word the Bible says.

What does that have to do with it? The creationist movement states that 'creationism' is a scientific theory and that it should be taught in science classes, that creationist researchers shoudl receive science grants and that 'creationist research organizations' should receive scientific endowments. The creationist movement that is engaged in a conspiracy here is saying that god is limited by science, and that indeed science can 'trap' god, so to speak, and that his existence can be proven or disproven scientifically. Its a position of very weak faith to say "i need to find scientific evidence of the flood, the garden," etc etc.


Now don't start attacking Scriptures you bloodthirsty fools,

What do the scriptures say about calling other christians fools? Most people who understand that evolution is an acceptable and well supported scientific theory are....christians.





This forum is mererly being used as a slaughterhouse for Christianity.

If you beleive this, then why participate? By participating you are presenting your ideas up for critical examination by everyone else who happens along here. Its silly to complain that people are critical of your beleifs when you are the one who has presented them. Thats all that this forum is doing, there's an interest amoung the ATS community to discuss creationism and evolution, and a recognition that there is infact a political conspiracy to replace science education with faith-based creationism. What more is needed to warrant a forum here? Nothing.



Now if it were use for "conspiracies in orgins" as I would have hoped it had been established for, we would see more threads on how history is and has been re-written or erased from us.

Creationism is a re-writing of history and nature.

And, on a side note, this forum itself has seen an aspect, tho a less organized one, of the creationist conspiracy at work. Since it started, there have been numerous 'posters' pretending to want to discuss the issues, but in reality their actions reveal that they are just mindlessly mouthing propaganda from the more organized wider creationist movement, indeed, they follow the standard technique of the creationist conspiracy and propagate its literature uncritically. Thats a small, self organizing aspect of the conspiracy. We've also had a number of people come here, be revealed for what they are, get banned, and then try to come back agian, each time unsuccessfuly. Its not evolutionists that are doing this, its creationists (not all creationists obviously). These individuals are without scruples and unethical deceivers, who try to acheive some vague 'goal' of promoting their faith thru lies, deception, and dishonesty. Thats conspiratorial, and the activities of the organizers of the creationist movement are also conspiratorial. True enough, we permit discussion of the merits of creationism and the merits of evolution and consideration of the evidences for either along with direct discussions of the conpsiracy, which is a smaller (tho not a small) aspect of the creationism-evolution controversy, but why shouldn't we permit open and honest discussion of the subject?



posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 11:20 AM
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Originally posted by Tassadar
Foolishness!!!

I beg your pardon?

No where did I slam evolution.

You did in fact:

it is out of a respect for the truth I must say God created the world.
[proof?].

And here is an example of you judging people:

All of these souls you see up in here fighting off evolution in the name of Jesus are here because they don't want to see you hurt for your sins.

[Jesus didn't like that btw.]

And here we have an example of you attacking people without provocation:

Now don't start attacking Scriptures you bloodthirsty fools


Cliaming false witness:

This forum is mererly being used as a slaughterhouse for Christianity.



I am telling you there is not need for this forum.
If it is simply to be a battleground between creation and evolution (which is what about 40 of the 153 threads here are about), then rename it.

Seems you started a thread attacking all who believe in evolution.. which one of us is blood thirsty?


You try to ignore the truth by attacking my character

Your charactor does not need attacking to be put into question.


which, at this moment, isn't working with your smooth little "yet another" label. Your kind disgust me for they will not hear reason or listen to wisdom.

So I was wrong and you are going to offer me reputable scientific proof of creation after all?



posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 11:26 AM
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Thank you Nygdan, you are indeed a man of repute.
I certainly did overreact and use some harsher wording than was necessary and will make no attempt to excuse myself.
I experienced culture-shock after returning.
I will certainly now, permitting others would allow, retract my prior statement and say you have justified the foundation of this forum.
I guess that settles it.
Many thanks.
- tass

**and riley, I have been caught up in too many feuds in my life to wish to start another one, if I offended you, please u2u and we can resolve the issue. The original question poised for this thread has been answered**

[edit on 26-7-2005 by Tassadar]



posted on Jul, 26 2005 @ 11:40 AM
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Welcome back BTW!



posted on Feb, 13 2008 @ 08:47 AM
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Tassadar, I think the forum SHOULD exist, but that will probably be the only place where we will disagree. I say, if the enemy wants to make another battleground to carry on the fight, let them. We will follow them there, and bring the truth to their door steps. Aside from that, i think you are correct in your creation arguments.

Riley, you are *snip*. You never offer proof for your arguments, and resort to attacking the person who made the comments rather than their arguments. Before you accuse me of doing the same, i WILL offer proof for my view point.
1: Where are the "evolutionary missing links?" The evolution tree is always shown as a consistent line. If it actually represented the data they have, the "tree of evolution" would be a few scattered dots with huge gaps between them.
2: Creation science makes more sense than evolution. Beings CAN NOT turn into other beings. It is impossible.

Show me proof and we can talk.

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[edit on 13-2-2008 by 12m8keall2c]



posted on Feb, 13 2008 @ 09:36 AM
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reply to post by Crusader of Truth
 

You just abused me.. calling me "liberal fool" etc. over a discussion that took place in 2005. Did you just dig this up just to have a go at me or what? Apparently you only registered on the 12th of this month yet you seem to have a grudge..



posted on Feb, 17 2008 @ 03:00 AM
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Originally posted by Crusader of Truth
1: Where are the "evolutionary missing links?" The evolution tree is always shown as a consistent line. If it actually represented the data they have, the "tree of evolution" would be a few scattered dots with huge gaps between them.


There are going to be a lot of gaps, it's unavoidable. The formation of fossils requires a comparatively strict set of conditions to be present at the time of a creature's demise. They are few and far between, if the incomprehensible number of creatures that have ever lived and died is taken into account. Not everyone gets to be mineralized, it's just that simple.

As for the diagrams of the evolutionary tree being represented as a solid line...you can't be serious, can you? If that's all it takes to invalidate the theory, then you may as well throw out every kind of statistical, financial, or scientific chart you can get your hands on, because analyzing an information set and extracting a trend from the findings is one of the most basic functions a chart performs. If that's an issue to you, you have a lot more to worry about in the modern western world than scientists saying reptiles evolved into birds.



2: Creation science makes more sense than evolution. Beings CAN NOT turn into other beings. It is impossible.


That sounds an awful lot like an opinion to me. Tell me why can't it happen, then we can talk.



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